Help talk:Score/Archive 1

Xtag
gives score which links to this help page. --  Gadget850talk 18:06, 24 April 2013 (UTC)

Right "a"

 * How do I get the "second" a, if I write:

I get this: But if I write: I get (its this a I want to have at the beginning): Christian75 (talk) 11:12, 27 April 2013 (UTC)
 * You could either specify the explicit octave for a' or change the relative anchor: gives   and  gives also  . -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 11:51, 27 April 2013 (UTC)

Size
Is there a way to control the size of the score? Generally, I think it's too big by at least 30%. Compare Alle Jahre wieder in this version using MusicScore with this version using


 * That usually works, but not here - maybe due to security reasons?? (submitted as question at mediawiki) --KlausFoehl (talk) 18:56, 29 April 2013 (UTC)

Formatting the examples
This looks great, but the current format for showing the markup in the examples doesn't really work. You're using some special tag, and it breaks the pagewrapping and also doesn't clearly show use of ' (because they get treated as marking italics and bolding). It would be clearer to use the plain  tags around it.

Is there a good reason why the special tags were being used instead? 86.161.209.128 (talk) 19:55, 28 April 2013 (UTC)
 * I just took the use of the template tag as I found it on the page. I think it displays almost all wikicode properly, except the pipe character. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 03:15, 29 April 2013 (UTC)
 * But it messed up the multiple apostrophes, interpreting them as italics. -- Ypnypn (talk) 03:23, 29 April 2013 (UTC)
 * You're right, I see it now. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 03:31, 29 April 2013 (UTC)


 * That's much better. But what's the advantage of using the tag template, rather than nowiki? What does it do? If you use nowiki, you'd just write out exactly what coding you use, and it displays it exactly (so you wouldn't need the pipe work-arounds). Is breaking the pagewrapping an advantage? 86.161.209.128 (talk) 06:40, 29 April 2013 (UTC)
 * Give me a bit and I will do a vertical version of markup. --  Gadget850talk 09:39, 29 April 2013 (UTC)

Here is a preliminary example:

--  Gadget850talk 20:50, 29 April 2013 (UTC)

Verses and stanzas, ties and slurs, and other great info
New updates ... daily!

Verses and stanzas
If I type: I get:

Ties and slurs
†

Repeats
Coming soon! — Preceding unsigned comment added by QM400032 (talk • contribs) 02:36, 25 May 2013 (UTC)

Error messages
I pulled the error list from the code:

If we create help for these, we can edit the interface pages to link. --  Gadget850talk 00:21, 4 June 2013 (UTC)

Copyrights
How does copyright law apply to the use of musical scores in Wikipedia? —Wavelength (talk) 22:37, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * See Lyrics and poetry. --  Gadget850talk 23:20, 3 August 2013 (UTC)
 * Thank you. That page can be listed under "See also" on "Help:Score".
 * —Wavelength (talk) 23:48, 3 August 2013 (UTC)

Score and pdf
Hello, it looks like score cannot be rendered to pdf, only the source code will be printed.--Sinuhe20 (talk) 21:09, 4 April 2014 (UTC)
 * Filed a bug. -- Glaisher  [talk]  09:23, 6 April 2014 (UTC)

Suggest interactive transpose function
Really nice tool.

On various sheet music and chord sites, there are typically two buttons: Transpose up, and transpose down. I suggest that the score viewer should have that as well, to allow the user to choose what key to show (and play).

I also have a question: I added chords to a song using "\chords", but when I added the lilypond "\transpose" keyword, the chords did not change key, only the sheet music. Is there a solution to this? Mange01 (talk) 16:04, 27 February 2016 (UTC)


 * Like this:
 * YewBowman (talk) 12:01, 28 February 2016 (UTC)
 * YewBowman (talk) 12:01, 28 February 2016 (UTC)

Available instruments
Hello! Which are the available instruments for MIDI reproduction? It seems that only piano and violin are installed. -Theklan (talk) 13:48, 24 March 2017 (UTC)


 * Vater unser im Himmelreich successfully uses "english horn". I tested some other options from http://lilypond.org/doc/v2.14/Documentation/notation/midi-instruments – with mixed results. The "trombone" and "church organ" and "tubular bells" and "timpani" and "voice oohs" also worked for me. The "banjo" and "bagpipe" and "choir aahs" did not. Your mileage may vary... Patrug (talk) 10:11, 6 April 2017 (UTC)


 * I've noted that some pieces of documentation are wrong. As Vater unser im Himmelreich works with \set Staff.midiInstrument = "english horn" documentation says that the correct way is \set Staff.midiInstrument = #"bassoon", with a # before the instrument. Some instruments work like this, some other not. -Theklan (talk) 10:48, 6 April 2017 (UTC)


 * Curious indeed. I just added a sentence to Help:Score, summarizing these observations and encouraging some trial & error. Hope this helps. —Patrug (talk) 06:11, 7 April 2017 (UTC)

Size (again)
or, Did you ever find a way to make the score smaller? By a quarter or third would be an ideal one, but any shrinkage would be welcome. Cheers - SchroCat (talk) 09:50, 30 July 2016 (UTC)
 * Thanks for the ping. No, I haven't, but I have haven't tried either – it's too hard and there are more important things in RL and WP I'd like to concentrate on. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 10:03, 30 July 2016 (UTC)
 * I just came tantalizingly close to solving this. At "Lasst uns erfreuen", I put a \layout command that created a nice compact version of the score, following the LilyPond documentation. Unfortunately, it went on to print an unmodified copy of the score below the compact one, so for now I left the \layout command as a comment in the markup. Maybe I'm overlooking something in the syntax, or maybe WP is translating something incorrectly? Feel free to try some sandbox experiments. If anyone can figure out how to suppress the unwanted second copy, then we'll have the re-sizing problem at least partially solved. —Patrug (talk) 09:46, 6 April 2017 (UTC)

OK, here's a workaround. It seems the Score extension normally defaults to a simplified implementation of LilyPond, which does not fully conform to LilyPond's documentation manual, and which misinterprets the layout code:

to produce the unwanted double score that I described above:

The workaround is to invoke the Score extension with attribute raw="1", which then correctly interprets the full markup according to LilyPond's documentation:

to produce the desired result:

Sinuhe20/Spielwiese has some good examples using raw="1", but this important attribute isn't really discussed at Help:Score or Extension:Score. I'll try to add a couple of explanatory sentences to these pages, where editors of English Wikipedia are more likely to look. —Patrug (talk) 12:24, 8 April 2017 (UTC)


 * In January there was a discussion about using curved triplets brackets rather than square ones. The thread started here:   Hans Aikema investigated the problem and found that Wiki "embeds the lilypond in a template of its own".  He further dug out the use of raw="1" to defeat this problem.  Martin of Sheffield (talk) 19:21, 8 April 2017 (UTC)


 * Thanks Martin, this is helpful confirmation that raw="1" (and random "#" signs!) are frequent workarounds for Wikipedia's limited LilyPond implementation. This week I'll definitely add some explanatory notes to Help:Score, and maybe also to mw:Extension:Score itself. —Patrug (talk) 08:46, 9 April 2017 (UTC)

List of examples
Often the best way to learn is often by example, so it would be useful to list a few articles with different types of score so that editors could inspect how they were generated. My shortlist is mostly those that I created:


 * Violin Concerto No. 5 (Mozart), accents and chords
 * Bugeilio'r Gwenith Gwyn, simple melody with words
 * Gwahoddiad, melody with two sets of words, to the side of the main text
 * Cwm Rhondda, hymn tune: four part harmony with words

Suggestions would be welcomed. Is there any way to list all the pages that use the score extension? There is Category:Pages with score rendering errors, but I can't see anything like Category:Pages with scores. Could this be generated automatically? Or is it possible to construct a Google search to find these pages? Verbcatcher (talk) 17:06, 7 April 2017 (UTC) What happened? -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 05:34, 16 August 2018 (UTC)
 * The page overleaf shows under Help:Score a special page exactly for this purpose: Special:PagesWithProp/score. That would even be more helpful if it could be restricted to article space, but I don't know how to do that. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 22:43, 7 April 2017 (UTC)
 * I see it now, Special:PagesWithProp/score, thanks. I will explore it for more examples, as I say above, I propose to add a curated list of few pages that illustrate how do various things, such as multiple staves and multiple line of text. I will try to find some useful examples. Verbcatcher (talk) 01:27, 8 April 2017 (UTC)
 * Sinuhe20/Spielwiese also has a good collection of examples, which are reasonably clear even for those of us who don't read German. —Patrug (talk) 12:24, 8 April 2017 (UTC)
 * That is useful resource, and one that I would have found helpful when I was struggling with the syntax. However, I am reluctant to link to a user page because its content may be very dynamic and have less oversight than articles.
 * I find that de:Special:PagesWithProp/score lists the articles with scores in German Wikipedia, other language prefixes also work. Do all Wikipedia language editions use the same implementation of is no longer working:


 * I think  is working, but a change in formatting is obscuring it.  I've looked at previous good examples and the same behaviour is visible.  I also note that on a refresh or edit the sound bar comes up, then disappears.  The actual line in question is rendered as:

is no longer working:     
 * This looks OK, and the fact that the audio bar flashes up is why I suspect something else. HTH, Martin of Sheffield (talk) 10:48, 16 August 2018 (UTC)
 * Thank you for providing the HTML code. However, it doesn't help. What are the classes "mediaContainer", "kskin"? Why does it say controls="" ? According to https://www.w3schools.com/tags/tag_audio.asp, that doesn't look right. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 12:34, 16 August 2018 (UTC)
 * It's now working again. I wish those experimenting with this feature and occasionally breaking it would let us know. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 10:28, 31 August 2018 (UTC)

Is ABC Still supported?
I wanted to add an example to the backdoor progression page, and I don't know lilypond, and poring through the documentation takes time (and much as lily is great and versatile and all, it's not exactly the shallowest of learning curves and from past experiences of using it it takes me a while to even get off the ground). Since ABC is quick and intuitive, when I saw that it was supported here, I thought I'd use that rather than downloading musescore, taking a screenshot, and uploading an image.

here is the code I used:

and here is how it renders

The clef, note duration, and time signature are missing (displaying as their defaults; treble, common time, and 8ths, respectively._

Here's a link to render ABC in the browser so you can see for yourself: https://abcjs.net/abcjs-editor.html

While trying to find the problem, I couldn't find anything on the wikipedia help about the ABC implementation. Is this depreciated?

Tomatoswoop (talk) 03:13, 4 September 2018 (UTC)


 * As you can see, it's rendering, so it's not deprecated, and mw:Extension:Score and its talk page don't call it that either. However, according to mw:Extension:ABC, it's been unmaintained for a long time (marked in January 2013). I have never used ABC, so I can't help you with the syntax. Maybe you can find the answer at http://www.lesession.co.uk/abc/abc_notation.htm — After 2 minutes, I found that one change to your input takes care of note lengths. I have no idea why it shows common time and not 4/4. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 06:12, 4 September 2018 (UTC)

Preference
Has there been a discussion anywhere about whether there is a preference to use versus images (.jpg, .svg) to represent musical samples in articles? WikiDan61 ChatMe!ReadMe!! 15:05, 11 February 2019 (UTC)
 * I would expect it to be a matter of editorial judgement. If you are wanting to publish the opening page of Beethoven's 9th then I suspect an image would be more appropriate.  If you are wanting to make a simple melody available than can be manipulated by the user and played, then a score is the right way to go.  If comparing pieces then using the built in midi gives a clean (if antispetic) line, if you are referring to a great performance of the past then an Ogg Vorbis sound file would be appropriate. Martin of Sheffield (talk) 15:27, 11 February 2019 (UTC)

Player cutting off notes
When you use vorbis = "1", the player cuts into notes below the staff. See for instance, C major. Anyone know a fix for this? Squandermania (talk) 03:42, 18 October 2018 (UTC)
 * I second this. Player is several pixels higher than score image, but it shows ok in mobile version. Seems like problem with css, I'll ask on WP:TECHPUMP. --M5 (talk) 21:55, 15 February 2019 (UTC)


 * I'm also seeing this. It appears that a workaround is to add an empty lyrics line. I had to put a hyphen in the lyrics, but this is not displayed. Put \addlyrics { - } before . Verbcatcher (talk) 00:16, 16 February 2019 (UTC)


 * Without lyrics


 * With empty lyrics


 * Verbcatcher (talk) 00:18, 16 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Brilliant. Thank you very much. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 07:06, 16 February 2019 (UTC)
 * The problem with this workaround that it renders "-" on the bottom of the score and it shows e.g. on mobile version. Also it will show again when (hopefully) the bug will be resolved. --M5 (talk) 10:22, 16 February 2019 (UTC)
 * See T216305. --M5 (talk) 10:22, 16 February 2019 (UTC)

Image size
Something is wrong. Sometimes the notes are placed within a complete page with much whitespace around.

Correct (first example from this help page):

Defective (I only changed the last note):

What could cause such an effect? --Rodomonte (talk) 18:25, 16 March 2019 (UTC)


 * Problem confirmed on Firefox running under Linux, so not our friend the IOS issue. I also tried introducing vobis=1, a tempo mark and a key signature, but the effect of changing the e to an f is the same. Martin of Sheffield (talk) 19:56, 16 March 2019 (UTC)


 * I have the impression that all existing scores still work, even in a new article, but all the new ones fail. Perhaps the rendering is completely broken, but there is some kind of cache from which the old scores are still loaded. --Rodomonte (talk) 20:18, 16 March 2019 (UTC)
 * I've encountered this problem in the last few days as well. Squandermania (talk) 12:10, 17 March 2019 (UTC)
 * This has now been raised at T218535. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 11:54, 18 March 2019 (UTC)
 * phab:T218535 has now been marked as resolved. I don't know how to regenerate a Lilypond .PNG at Wikimedia, in this case, so I simply added a final (unnecessary) bar line,

and it displays fine now. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 13:53, 30 March 2019 (UTC)

Microtonal music
I've tried the snippet located on LilyPond's documentation (copied below) to write microtonal music but the code doesn't compile.

Is this because the  statement doesn't work? χchi (talk) 19:13, 28 February 2018 (UTC)


 * I would be very surprised if it did. Where will the Wikipedia server being including the file from?  Remember that your browser is just displaying the page, the server is building it - how else would I for example see it?  Martin of Sheffield (talk) 20:10, 28 February 2018 (UTC)
 * Right, that's what I thought. So is there a way to get this library's functionalities to work within the Score extension? χchi (talk) 22:49, 28 February 2018 (UTC)


 * I expect you'll have to include the file yourself. There is another point to be aware of though, the documentation only refers to 2.14 whereas your microtonal example is from 2.19.81.  It might work, but then again it may complain the version is too low.  Good luck!  Martin of Sheffield (talk) 22:55, 28 February 2018 (UTC)

Is it possible to include makam.ly on the server? --kupirijo (talk) 21:23, 11 May 2019 (UTC)

Version?
Which version of LilyPond is used as the backend of the Score extension on Wikipedia? The are syntax changes that break compatibility between, for example, v2.12 and v2.16. Sammo (now Burkenyo) (talk) 23:13, 14 April 2014 (UTC)
 * (I think you're the Sammo that wrote above) I asked this question at Village pump (technical)/Archive 137 and it seems that it uses Lilypond 2.14. I added this information to Help:Score. Fern 24 (talk) 13:29, 22 June 2015 (UTC)

Extension:Score 0.2 (2013-04-23) suggests that it is working with 1.18+. Are there any plans to move to using later versions? Martin of Sheffield (talk) 22:04, 26 June 2016 (UTC)
 * Special:Version displays the LilyPond version. I updated the version here and mw:Extension:Score mentions Software:Version. Skierpage (talk) 00:10, 25 May 2020 (UTC)

Known Browser/iOS issues?
Hello from the Teahouse, where an issue was raised today (see here) about music scores not displaying a playbar using an iPad, and thus being unable to play the notation. I can confirm that on my own iPhone with default Safari browser I do not see any playbar either, so can't play the music, whereas I have no problem displaying or playing them on a Windows PC with Chrome.

If there are known browser or iOS compatibility issues, the Help:Score page could really benefit from an additional section explaining what these may be, and how to resolve them if at all possible. Pinging who previously commented on issues of the player not functioning. Many thanks, Nick Moyes (talk) 10:41, 8 March 2019 (UTC) (Teahouse Host)


 * Thanks for the compliment! I'll reply at the Teahouse. Martin of Sheffield (talk) 11:03, 8 March 2019 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your response at WP:TH. Having subsequently asked at WP:VPT, it looks like the .ogg/iOS incompatibility issue is known about and might one day be addressed. See this Phabricator ticket from 2014. Nick Moyes (talk) 15:36, 8 March 2019 (UTC)
 * Task is about, in part, iOS not supporting certain media formats including OGG audio. But that task has a comment from 2018 "Audio should work now (using MP3 transcodes)". If a   wikilink to media, for example happy birthday.ogg, works in iOS, then the problem with the Score extension on iOS would seem to be the more specific task, "Ogg Vorbis audio from the Score extension is not transcoded to MP3 on iOS." Skierpage (talk) 00:28, 25 May 2020 (UTC)

Obsolete and deprecated score attributes, including override_midi, override_audio, override_ogg
Hi. I noticed changes in MIDI support, including the big one that since 2019 mw:Extension:TimedMediaHandler handles MIDI files, then got sidetracked into documenting them.
 * has been obsolete for a while, every score image now has a JavaScript popup offering download of the Lilypond and MIDI files. I'm not sure what happens if the Score extension doesn't produce a MIDI file (if this is even possible).
 * is deprecated, use  instead. As I understand it, the Score extension supports generating an MP3 file with the Lame encoder (unused I think on Wikipedia sites), and it may be that when the Score extension hands off audio generation to the TimedMediaHandler extension (more below), TMH will generate a .MP3 on iOS. So   is more accurate and less technical. I don't see any plan to remove   attribute, and based on unscientific search for   there are hundreds of pages on English Wikipedia with the deprecated attribute. Also, I'm not sure that the VisualEditor support for the   tag knows/prefers the   attribute.
 * and  are deprecated. More on these below.

Per mw:Project:Tech News/2019
 * * MIDI files can soon be played without the Score extension. You can then add them with . Later   and   will stop working. Instead you will need to add the MIDI file below the music score.

That task is, "Move MIDI to audio conversion from Score into TimedMediaHandler." The Score extension already relies on TMH to provide an audio player, so if I understand correctly, it's less code and bugs for it to hand off generating the audio file for the player to TMH. Once that happens,  and   won't work. Pages using these are already flagged in Category:Pages using deprecated score attributes.

As the Tech News item hints, putting a wikilink like  or   underneath the score tag will create a player that looks the same, so that's the workaround. It seems to me some functionality may be lost, e.g. the MIDI file in the JavaScript popup for the score image won't be the improved MIDI file. On the Score extension's talk page, User:Michael Bednarek commented:
 * The generation of MIDI files may have improved, but I think the override is mostly done with .ogg files. These could be sound files from actual performances, or from MIDI files that editors have created in their own environment with Soundfonts or similar which most likely generates better sound than this extension. Then there are cases where LilyPond doesn't produce certain ornaments at all.

Searching for  finds 50 pages on en-wiki with override_midi, 7 with override_audio, and  18 with override_ogg.

I hope this helps. -- Skierpage (talk) 02:21, 25 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Thank you for your explanation, but the essence of this change is to remove functionality. The documented method at mw:Extension:Score ("you can add a [[File:name.mid]] wikilink after the score tag.") doesn't seem to work. A  using a filename:
 * What we hear is the imperfectly generated MIDI sound, where the old method sounded the replacement file:
 * The alternative of placing the sound file manually below the score or somewhere else in the article is hardly satisfactory. Can you point to any example where the non-deprecated method using … works? -- [[User:Michael Bednarek (talk) 02:57, 25 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Your example  put the wikilink inside the score tag, and you don't want the   attribute if you're going to provide a better audio file. If you put it after the closing tag, it works, e.g.: [[File:La tartine de beurre first 8.ogg]] (Lovely piano BTW) -- Skierpage (talk) 10:44, 25 May 2020 (UTC)
 * The alternative of placing the sound file manually below the score or somewhere else in the article is hardly satisfactory. Can you point to any example where the non-deprecated method using … works? -- [[User:Michael Bednarek (talk) 02:57, 25 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Your example  put the wikilink inside the score tag, and you don't want the   attribute if you're going to provide a better audio file. If you put it after the closing tag, it works, e.g.: [[File:La tartine de beurre first 8.ogg]] (Lovely piano BTW) -- Skierpage (talk) 10:44, 25 May 2020 (UTC)


 * Emphatically: Do not remove – As someobody else who has used this a few times, I certainly think that it should be kept. The reason it's used so little is because:
 * a) editors are generally not familiar with lilypond
 * b) there are relatively few examples so far where there are currently acceptable midi/audio files in place of the default output (the default audio can by itself be quite tolerable - see wikisource:The Army and Navy Hymnal for plenty of such examples)) - or at least relatively few where an editor that is familiar enough with lilypond (see point a) has found one... (see for example this, or this).
 * c) because something is used "relatively rarely" (see the numbers I bring up below) doesn't mean it should be removed...
 * I assume the cases where it is a midi file have similar explanations (ornementation can be approximated rather well, if not perfectly; or maybe additional instruments not present in the sheet music for simplicity reasons...). For the record, I made searches for  (599 in article space; searching in all namespaces yields 711 but I assume most of these are examples on talk pages/tp archives, documentation, sandboxes...));   (17) ... Quick math (just on en-wiki): 50+7+18 / 599+17+50+7+18 = 75 / 691 = 11% of cases).
 * This, if anything, proves my point that few editors are familiar with lilypond. I hardly find that justification for removing a useful feature (using the "override_audio"/"override_midi" parameters seems also clearer and more intuitive syntax). Additionally, this extension is surely used on other wikis (it's used a Wikisource, too, where I have employed the override option at least once). Thanks, RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 03:36, 25 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Please note I'm just a messenger. I figured editors might have overlooked the Tech News item, so it was worth documenting the deprecation in various places and highlighting here, though it seems what I wrote is unclear for which I apologize. Anyway, I'm no expert but I don't understand what you're saying. If someone doesn't know LilyPond syntax then how are they using the Score extension? They'll continue to insert a wiki link to the audio file, as on e.g. The Army and Navy Hymnal/Hymns/Our God, Our Help in Ages Past (which doesn't use the score tag). Maybe you're confused by the Tech News item I quoted, which says "Instead you will need to add the MIDI file below the music score" without explicitly saying you can instead add an audio file (I improved my opening talk comment above to say this). I took Eternal Father, Strong to Save and swapped its  attribute with a File:better audio file wikilink underneath on my Sandbox page, check it out; the before and after look identical. Does that help? Feel free to make changes. Also I don't know if the relevant developers hang out on this page, if they don't then saying "do not remove" here isn't going to reach the right people. You can mention your concerns on the Phabricator task, but I suggest linking to a clear example of your problem. Cheers. Skierpage (talk) 10:44, 25 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Thank you very much for efforts to clarify this matter. After looking at your sandbox, I now believe there is no loss of functionality. But changing current instances of override to the new format is probably not suited to an automated replacement. Cheers, Michael Bednarek (talk) 11:16, 25 May 2020 (UTC)
 * Thanks. Regarding "editors are generally not familiar with lilypond", I meant to say that not all editors who write lilypond are familiar with some of it's features and even then they might not be familiar with the specifics of it's implementation on wikipedia and related projects (override_audio &c. fall under that - I personally discovered them only by accident when looking through the documentation for something else). Just for clarification, the pages at Wikisource actually are transcluded, see eg. The Army and Navy Hymnal/Hymns/Our God, Our Help in Ages Past is a transclusion of wikisource:Page:The Army and Navy Hymnal.djvu/32. Anyway I still stand by my statement that the parameters are a clearer syntax. Cheers, RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 14:07, 25 May 2020 (UTC)

Broken
At this moment,  is completely broken – it doesn't render anything, instead it displays the source code. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 14:02, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
 * It's working at The Cullercoats Fish Lass. And in user space  Martin of Sheffield (talk) 14:19, 21 October 2018 (UTC)


 * I'm not seeing a problem either. Maybe check the syntax of your code. Squandermania (talk) 15:14, 21 October 2018 (UTC)
 * Those two aren't working for me either. Every occurrence of
 * I also noted that quite a few old scores that used to work no longer do. There's a remarkable absence of any action at T257066 – see below at . Old scores that had been cached continued to work until recently. Most still do, but some don't. I don't know why. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 10:14, 18 October 2020 (UTC)

Scores are working now?
Shouldn't Help:Score be updated? Right now it says that score has been disabled, but that's not the case. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.173.218.150 (talk) 23:06, 22 December 2020 (UTC)
 * They're still broken. Just now I went to The Cullercoats Fish Lass and uncommented vorbis=1.  The score disappeared and the infamous message "Musical scores are temporarily disabled." reappeared in preview.   Martin of Sheffield (talk) 23:48, 22 December 2020 (UTC)
 * I was not aware of the vorbis=1 workaround. I presume a bot recently went through and made a bulk change. Any article I've seen with a score is working. Presumably all vorbis — Preceding unsigned comment added by 73.173.218.150 (talk) 00:40, 23 December 2020 (UTC)
 * On WP, it depends on the English used,.
 * It seems like a really good argument against LiiyPonD, rather than images and sound files which can' handle tuning Hyacinth (talk) 16:03, 1 February 2021 (UTC)

Error message
Has anyone received the "Musical scores are temporarily disabled." message? I am able to copy and paste scores from here and they are rendered fine, but as soon as I change one note I get this message. Is this something new? Pigby2 (talk) 12:36, 17 August 2020 (UTC)
 * LilyPond and has been turned off and on several times since at least 4 July 2020; see T257066. There seems to be some concern, the details of which are not disclosed, that LilyPond in a certain configuration is a security problem. It's a very annoying situation, and it doesn't seem to get a lot of attention fixing it. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 13:50, 17 August 2020 (UTC)
 * Going off this link ( https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/lilypond-devel/2020-10/msg00096.html ) they don't seem at all bothered about fixing it. Someone with clout is needed as that link reeks of "It's not my problem". 164.39.195.26 (talk) 11:54, 24 November 2020 (UTC)
 * Thank you!Pigby2 (talk) 16:54, 17 August 2020 (UTC)
 * If the issue is questionable security, might it be reasonable to instead rely on an easier-to-secure format like MusicXML? Or to look into a way of maybe offering it as an option?  It's more verbose, but it was built for the particular purpose of music interchange, and it supports about everything you could ever want to. 24.128.20.42 (talk) 03:45, 30 October 2020 (UTC)

That is so annoying ——羊羊32521 (talk) 04:29, 22 August 2020 (UTC)


 * I've just hit it trying to improve the tempo of a piece. It appears that the original score is cached somewhere, but as soon as you make a change the error appears.  It's one of the great things about a computerised encyclopedia; you can hear snippets and melodies which particularly assist those who can't read scores. Martin of Sheffield (talk) 12:40, 6 October 2020 (UTC)

I'm getting this message right now, 20th October 2020 --Tomatoswoop (talk) 18:54, 20 October 2020 (UTC)


 * More details: on this page Quarter_tone the three scores at the top of the article are visible, but the two at the bottom show the error message: (screenshots: [1] [2]) --Tomatoswoop (talk) 19:13, 20 October 2020 (UTC)


 * Note that the visible scores begin with " ''

It's a very simple change and it would be a bit more helpful for editors so they don't have to hunt around Wikipedia looking for an explanation, and the temporary fix. Thank you. Cnbrb (talk) 17:04, 8 December 2020 (UTC)


 * Most, or many, examples already have MIDI files in the commons, which have been steadily removed by, primarily, Squandermania (it would be a shame to create MIDI files for almost all music examples, have them removed and replaced by . Commenting that way has the same effect and will be easier to revert once full functionality has been restored. As for a bot doing the same thing: I don't think this will work in every case, so an automatic complete replacement will create many unnecessary edits without any benefit. I, too, change the "vorbis" bit, but only if a preview confirms that it works. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 13:24, 1 January 2021 (UTC)
 * is deprecated, use  instead. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Help:Score Grimes2 (talk) 11:26, 4 January 2021 (UTC)

{{talk quote|" or simply put it via [[File:… under the score. That's what I did at [[Peter and the Wolf]]. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 01:28, 15 June 2021 (UTC)
 * I think that information on Wikipedia should be easy to access, and not as difficult as possible for readers to access. If we purport to have an article about, say, the major chord, then I think an audio example is preferable to silence. Having no audio example would be akin to the article red not containing any images of red or red things. Hyacinth (talk) 17:21, 20 June 2021 (UTC)
 * {{ping|Hyacinth}} I don't think anybody disagrees with that. Problem is, the underlying issue it is not something which I or anybody I know here can easily fix (I only have very limited computer programming skills). If you can, feel free to go ahead at the relevant phab ticket. Otherwise you're preaching to the choir. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 17:59, 20 June 2021 (UTC)
 * Editors have invested a lot of time and work into switching from pictures of musical scores, replacing them with Lilypond code, which promptly broke. Hyacinth (talk) 20:19, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

Workaround solutions
I found this today, the output could be used to render partitions? https://github.com/LingDong-/legumes Popolon (talk) 12:54, 19 June 2021 (UTC)
 * The other possibility (just noting) is just to make the score using lillypond (or any other score-writing program of your choice) off-wiki and upload it as an image. Alternatively, depending on the availability of the work in question, if you have some minor image editing skills, you can likely take the scans from IMSLP and adjust as necessary. RandomCanadian (talk / contribs) 18:04, 20 June 2021 (UTC)
 * It would not be a fun dance to have all image files removed and replaced with code, then replacing all the code with images, and then replacing the image files with coding again. Hyacinth (talk) 20:30, 25 June 2021 (UTC)

Roman numeral analysis
Is Roman numeral analysis possible using to , but got an error message relating to a \midi block, so more work will be needed. Verbcatcher (talk) 08:24, 23 August 2021 (UTC)
 * I've now used the raw bit that you're pointing out, and I did some more reading about tweaking stuff and I've managed to get the version in the article to read exactly 100% as it should.
 * About the MIDI issue, I tried millions of things in the test site to get it to work, even pasting whole examples from the manual, and no :( Dr. Vogel (talk) 10:17, 23 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Try adding a /layout block with indent:


 * although I would prefer "Horn in F", but more importantly, the transposition is still unsolved. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 10:53, 23 August 2021 (UTC)
 * I added \transposition f to the above; which works as expected. -- Michael Bednarek (talk) 11:07, 23 August 2021 (UTC)
 * Magic! Thanks very much! Dr. Vogel (talk) 11:45, 23 August 2021 (UTC)