Portal talk:Anarchism/Archive 1

layout
Wot no discussion? Wow.

Anyway, I think that the thing on the right with the rioters is pushing text to the right. I think that that needs to be fixed. But I don't know how. --AFA 08:18, 30 March 2006 (UTC)

Wouldn't White text on a black background be more appropriate than black on red? 72.1.206.188 17:17, 3 May 2006 (UTC)
 * What would make you think that? I mean, it might look less weird, but in terms of appropriateness, black and red are the traditional colors of anarchism, sooo...The Ungovernable Force 04:28, 4 May 2006 (UTC)

Black Cat v. Red Star
Isn't the Red Star (on a black flag) a more common symbol than "the Black Cat" in Anarchism (that is, various national anarchist movements throughout history)? If I am correct, it should replace the black cat as the symbol on Portal:Politics. --(Mingus ah um 03:40, 4 July 2006 (UTC))
 * Eh, the black flag with red star isn't explicitly an anarchist symbol from what I know. If you replace the cat, do it with a red and black flag (split down the diagonal) or circle-a (I'd prefer red and black flag). The Ungovernable Force 04:35, 4 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I thought red/black was specifically concerning anarcho-syndicalism, and not anarchism in general. Perhaps the (A) is more universal? Two-Bit Sprite 15:15, 4 August 2006 (UTC)
 * The black flag or circle-A are most appropriate, I think. Aufheben 17:59, 18 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I have replaced the black cat with a black flag, as it is neutral, more historic, and most representative of the fundamental opposition to the importance of symbols. Marc Mywords 02:02, 26 January 2007 (UTC)
 * From what I've read black flag was used very often by anarchists but also was a general symbol of insurrection and revolt. Kanibalos 13:35, 22 July 2007 (UTC)

Update and more...
I've made some changes to the portal, including


 * Changed the color scheme to be more eye-friendly
 * Removed anarchism wikiprojects as it doesn't seem to exist anymore???
 * Added some news
 * Added to Things you can do
 * New selected article
 * New selected picture

If you would like to be a maintainer of this portal, please add yourself to Wikipedia:Portal/Directory under the Anarchism Portal.

Marc Mywords 03:59, 26 January 2007 (UTC)

Absence of the Anarchy philosphy in the portal
Articles regarding the anarcho-capitalistic type of anarchism isn't navigable through the portal. The portal is very POVed at the moment! Lord Metroid 13:15, 6 February 2007 (UTC)
 * I disagree with you. Anarcho-Capitalism is not Anarchism, as it is not against all hierarchies. The defenition of the word Anarchy is "without hierarchy". Get over it.  Vert e t Noir talk 11:13, 10 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Ditto. "Anarcho-capitalism" isn't Anarchism. Aufheben 18:31, 16 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I think you should study the etymology of anarchy. Anarchy is made up of two words. First word is an- which has the function of "negation" much like non- and the second part of the word is -archy which is of greek heritage from the word archos meaning rulers. Hence anarchy just like atheism which means 'godless' and/or 'non-theists'(theist heriting from the greek word theos meaning god) anarchy means 'rulerless' and/or 'without rulers'. An anarcho-capitalistic society is without rulers to decide over what people to do in anyway including what to do with their property. Even as trade exists because trade is a volountery act between two or more individuals and it takes in regard to the human nature brought forward by evolution the need to own various property for himself, the desire to aquire new property and advance themselves and by doing so advancing the whole welfare of the society. So don't come here and hijack words like you own them! Bend them to mean other things and make it totally impossible to communicate ideas because you spread maldefinitions. Lord Metroid 21:00, 5 March 2007 (UTC)
 * Furthermore I would like to add that several notable scholars of even not anarcho-capitalists themselves agrees that anarcho-capitalism is a type of individual anarchy. Let's not make this talk-section about if it is or not a form of anarchy. But rather let the viewer decide by his own research. The portal system exists for viewers of wikipedia to have an easy access to articles in a specific topic. It is not up to us to decide what anarchy is or isn't. Lord Metroid 23:02, 5 March 2007 (UTC)


 * There's a tremendous number of sources that say anarcho-capitalism is one of the many types of anarchism. There are an extreme few sources that say it's not (and they happen to be anarcho-communists). The conensus opinion among sources is that it is anarchism. It doesn't matter what any of our personal opinions are on whether it is or not. The sources speak for themselves and they're what count on Wikipedia. To delete anarcho-capitalism as not being anarchism is to POV push against the weight of the sources.Anarcho-capitalism 02:15, 6 March 2007 (UTC)


 * You forget that anarchism talks about class conscience and capitalism considered a "bourgeois thing", therefore theoritically can not be of anarchist philosophy and even more is something to destroy . For example see The Capitalist system by Bakunin . Anarchocapitalism and Anarchofasism do belong inmho in the portal but like a "heresy"  or political beliefs derived from but not part of Anarchism . Kanibalos 13:51, 22 July 2007 (UTC)


 * The fact that someone calls a political ideology "anarcho-something" doesn't make it anarchist. Capitalism is based on the premise of individual ownership of the means of production.  That's what capital IS, the ability to purchase the labour of others.  If the means of production can be owned by individuals, given that there is a finite amount of resources, then those who are left without access to  the means of production become the working class while those who control the means of production become the owning class.  The existence of classes is antithetical to anarchism.  The problem is that people who talk about so-called anarcho-capitalism always misuse either one or the other word: either they don't really mean anarchist or they don't really mean capitalist.  One can't be both.  To quote Malatesta, "Individualism is, in theory, a kind of Anarchy without cooperation. It is therefore no better than a lie, because liberty is not possible without Solidarity, without cooperation. The criticism which Individualists pass on government is merely the wish to deprive it of certain functions, to hand them over virtually to the capitalists. But it cannot attack those repressive functions which form the essence of government, for without an armed force the proprietary system could not be upheld." SmashTheState 18:40, 28 October 2007 (UTC)

Related Portals
This seems more to be the portal of "anarcho-communism" than simply the "anarchist" portal. I mean, I can understand how "organized labor" is historically a big issue with anarchism, even if you do not support it as an anarchist. But what is the basis for considering "communism" one of the four related portals to anarchism? How about the "liberalism" portal, for those who are more part of the individualist branch of anarchism? I don't think this section is balanced at all. Leftism in anarchism is not representative of this ideology as a whole.Maziotis 13:32, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

Liberalism isn't an anti-authoritarian movement. Communism has always had the abolition of governments and the state as its end goal and it is only the tactics used by so called 'marxists' that made 'communist countries' into totalitarian nightmares. Plus, the mainstream of the anarchist movement historically has been based in class struggle and socialism. Individualists have made negligible impact upon the wider world unlike the anarchists and anarchist inspired actions of people like the IWW, CNT, Situationist International and other such groups. Chris 23:05, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Chris, Situationist International is not an anarchist team and in fact they tend to criticize anarchists a  lot. Individualists have  made a large impact  (historically)  through terrorism. Solidarity,Kanibalos 23:14, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Updates?
It doesn't really seem like anybody is updating this portal these days. How has it worked in the past? I've got something that when finished, I think would be good for the featured article. Where is everyone? Murderbike 22:32, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Haymarket was up way too long. The Molinari article has been up sometimes, exept when POV warriors delete it. I'd say we're about ready for a new one. I would suggest a new one every month. PhilLiberty 22:14, 26 September 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree that the anarchy portal is way too casualy updated. Not at all a professionally way to run things. POV can not be escaped only weighted, I propose we post an article on a different subject associated with a different kind of anarchy each month and feed the list of anarchistic ideas and characters one at a time. Lord Metroid 23:43, 26 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Unless anyone thinks that David Graeber hasn't been up long enough in the featured article, I'll add Anarchism in Cuba to the template in the next day or two. Murderbike 05:07, 4 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Good idea... Lord Metroid (talk) 13:16, 5 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Alright, two votes, that's consensus! I've changed it, if anyone wants to change it, feel free, this is anarchy! Murderbike (talk) 03:42, 7 December 2007 (UTC)
 * WIKIPEDIA IS NOT ANARCHY!. Alas, Skomorokh  incite 09:31, 8 December 2007 (UTC)
 * Maybe to stop from rushing through all of the featured and good articles we've got, we shouldn't be updating the portal every month. Perhaps just every two months?  I know there is a certain standard to portals, and some can be expected to update every month, but I don't feel that we really have the content level up yet.  Maybe we could compensate for that by working on an automated anniversary and quote calender, so at least that would have something constantly updating?  I've already been updating the anniversary calender over here.--Cast (talk) 08:57, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

(outdent) Does anybody keep a list of the articles that have been featured on the Portal? It would probably be a good idea. First, it will help avoid duplications. Also, it can help ensure that different anarchist philosophies are represented. — Malik Shabazz (talk · contribs) 03:29, 29 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Yeah, I cooked up a category for it a week or two ago: Category:Anarchism portal selected articles. There's also a corresponding talkpage template, Anarcho-article, which automatically populates it. Skomorokh  confer 03:52, 29 January 2008 (UTC)