Talk:11th Milestone, Isle of Man

11th Milestone/TT Course Template Box
This point on the Snaefell mountain course or Mountain Course is preceed by the Cronk-y-Voddy and the next following point on the course is Handleys Corner. The title of the course is Snaefell Mountain Course or Mountain Course rather than Isle of Man TT Course as there has been more than one 'course' and also the Tourist Trophy racing on the Isle of Man for cars predates the races for motor-cycles.

This article refers to a distinctive S-Bend on the Snaefell Mountain Course on the boundary of the German/Michael Parishes on the Castletown to Ramsey primary A3 Road in the Isle of Man. The present photo of TT Mountain Course Marker Board shown is not at the site of the 11th Milestone and is opposite Cronk Bane Farm. As the article states the present 11th Milestone marker post or 11th Milestone is presently sited at Cronk-y-Voddy. The previous position of this marker post was sited some distance from the current position of the marker board and before the S-bend. The Garrow type metal milestone is actually the 13th milestone on the A2 Road and it appears that all milestones are numbered running from south to north as Castletown was the old capital of the the Isle of Man. The 13th milestone is on the exit of the S-bend and just beyond this is the Michael parish boundary and also a granite 13th milestone road marker. Also from research, I belive the fatal accident to Ben Drinkwater occured between Cronk Bane farm and the old postion of the 11th milestone marker and before the S-bend.

Also the position on the map is also inaccurate. Perhaps you would like to correct this as with other points on the Snaefell mountain course and use a better map that already exsists. Would someone alter the title of the Template Box as I have been unable to do so. (11thmilestone (talk) 12:41, 19 January 2008 (UTC))


 * If there are particular facts that you feel are inaccurate, then you should correct them. However, large-scale reversion of unrelated changes is vandalism, and you should desist from such actions.


 * Wikipedia's Manual of Style says that the most common name should be used to refer to things: the TT Course is vastly, vastly more regularly referred to as the 'TT Course' - it's the current one, even though there were obviously other incarnations at earlier times. 'Snaefell Mountain Course' is a much more niche term. Mauls (talk) 21:51, 19 January 2008 (UTC)


 * The Isle of Man Centenary TT - ACU/MMCC Official Race Guide on page 67 refers to a map of the circuit and it decribed as the "Mountain Course" and the same publication refers to practice on the "Mountain Course." Also, the Race Guide for the 1972 Isle of Man TT Races descibes the results for the Isle of Man TT Races 1907-1910 as the "Short Course" and the TT races 1911 ownwards as the "Mountain Course."  The current term is "Mountain Course" and refers to the Isle of Man TT Races and also the Manx Grand Prix which shares the same circuit.  To describe the term "Snaefell Mountain Course" or "Mountain Course" as an obsolete term or 'niche term' would be incorrect and perhaps you should provided documentary evidence to your assertions inline with Wikiedia policy and aslo be careful of incorrect descriptions about the Isle of Man TT Races in either media, maps or other doucmentary evidence.


 * It is perhaps helpful for the reader of the article(s) to understand the difference between the Isle of Man TT Races as an event and also the "TT Course," as you refer to it, as a race circuit which is also used by the Manx Grand Prix as a seperate event. As the Wikipedia article Snaefell Mountain Course is a technical description of the course and the other documented course names such as Guthrie's Memorial, 11th Milestone and Handley's Corner etc, can be seen to be aslo technical description in accordance with Wikipedia policy WP:TITLE, the most common name used be used for the actual title of the article, with more technically exact names used at the start.  In this case then the article Snaefell Mountain Course the intial description should be "Snaefell Mountain Course" instead of "(Snaefell) Mountain Course."


 * Despite the assertion, "the most common name for the course, by a long margin, is 'TT Course'...." it now appears that there is a policy to change all references to "Mountain Course" to "Snaefell Mountain Course" a term previously described as incorrect or a little used 'niche term.' Large-scale reversion of unrelated changes is vandalism, and you should desist from such actions.  It is also unhelpful to make changes of this type as it is makes it difficult to edit articles about the Isle of Man TT Races or start new articles about the ".... other incarnations at earlier times..." If there is a random policy to change description to "Snaefell Mountain Course,"  again, perhaps you should provided documentary evidence to your assertions inline with Wikiedia policy and aslo be careful of incorrect descriptions of the the Isle of Man TT Races or  Manx Grand Prix in either media, maps or other doucmentary evidence.  (Agljones (talk) 13:41, 24 January 2008 (UTC))

Dead link
During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!


 * https://www.iomtt.com/TT-2009/Circuit-Guide/Competitors/BlackDub-HandleysCorner.aspx
 * In Handley's Corner on 2011-03-22 20:22:03, 404 Not Found
 * In 11th Milestone on 2011-05-23 02:22:58, 404 Not Found
 * In 11th Milestone on 2011-06-01 03:12:36, 404 Not Found

--JeffGBot (talk) 03:13, 1 June 2011 (UTC)

Dead link 2
During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!


 * https://www.iomtt.com/TT-2009/Circuit-Guide/Spectators/11th%20Milestone%20to%20Rhencullen.aspx
 * In Handley's Corner on 2011-03-22 20:22:03, 404 Not Found
 * In 11th Milestone on 2011-05-23 02:23:05, 404 Not Found
 * In 11th Milestone on 2011-06-01 03:13:07, 404 Not Found

--JeffGBot (talk) 03:13, 1 June 2011 (UTC)

Dead link 3
During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!


 * http://www.iomtt.com/TT-2009/Circuit-Guide.aspx
 * In Doran's Bend on 2011-03-17 14:40:30, 404 Not Found
 * In Glen Duff on 2011-03-22 07:09:54, 404 Not Found
 * In Gob-ny-Geay on 2011-03-22 08:33:54, 404 Not Found
 * In Gorse Lea on 2011-03-22 10:09:25, 404 Not Found
 * In Greeba Bridge on 2011-03-22 12:54:02, 404 Not Found
 * In Guthrie's Memorial on 2011-03-22 16:11:28, 404 Not Found
 * In Handley's Corner on 2011-03-22 20:22:01, 404 Not Found
 * In Hillberry Corner on 2011-03-29 06:18:17, 404 Not Found
 * In 11th Milestone on 2011-05-23 02:22:46, 404 Not Found
 * In 11th Milestone on 2011-06-01 03:13:09, 404 Not Found

--JeffGBot (talk) 03:13, 1 June 2011 (UTC)

Pic of 11th or 13th?
Why is the pic labelled in caption and in commons as the 13th milestone, when this article is about the 11th? The filename uses 11th: 025_11thmilestone.jpg". Which is it?  It is 12.5 miles from Ramsey, per what i can read from the pic. -- do  ncr  am  11:31, 24 February 2015 (UTC)

The photo is of a Garrow type of metal milestone which is the 13th Milestone on the A2 Castletown to Ramsey Road. It is situated at Drinkwaters Bend (or 11th Milestone) on the Snaefell Mountain Course.

agljones(talk) 21:37, 24 February 2015 (UTC)