Talk:1953 FA Cup final

Name
Surely The Matthews Final would be a better name. Slumgum | yap | stalk | 20:36, 15 May 2006 (UTC)
 * On consideration, I'm moving the page to FA Cup Final 1953 to match all other FA Cup Final names. Many Finals have nicknames. Slumgum | yap | stalk | 20:56, 15 May 2006 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:1953 FA Cup Final ticket.jpg
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BetacommandBot 08:21, 27 October 2007 (UTC)

Expanded
I've expanded the article with sources. However, there appears to be two players credited for Bolton's second goal and I don't know which one is correct? Both Bobby Langton and Willie Moir are credited. Anynone know which name is correct? ♦Tangerines♦ · Talk 21:19, 25 September 2008 (UTC)

During the match, Wolstenhome commentates that the BBC had just asked the Blackpool dressing room for confirmation of the scorer of this goal. He reports back that Blackpool have Moir as the scorer. However, repeated playing of the DVD of the game seems to show that Moir is being highly fanciful in claiming to have re-directed the path or trajectory of the Langton floated ball.

Who scored? The above just needs stating in the article, no?

90.203.95.60 (talk) 17:03, 2 March 2010 (UTC)

Comment on alleged hat trick and Matthews Final
Re the Mortensen hat-trick

Stan Mortensen did NOT score a hat-trick on this day - this is a myth created by journalists after the event. As Kenneth Wolstenhome's match commentary testifies several times, the first Blackpool goal was an own goal scored by Harold Hassell, the play intercepting SM's shot and directing the ball into the opposite corner than intended. Indeed, Bolton keeper, diving in time and in line with the original direction of the strike would almost certainly have parried the ball or even caught it.

Though obviously a matter of speculation, the current disputed goals committee would, for me, judge such a goal if scored now to be an own goal.

Secondly, wikipedia surely should just state factually. Fact: the 1953 Cup Final became very quickly dubbed by the press as 'The Matthews Final.' Opinion: 'Stanley Matthews was the man of the match, made the difference between the two sides, etc, etc.' Another opinion: 'Ernie Taylor was at least if not more important in explaining Blackpool's victory, playing brilliantly at inside-right throughout.' Another opinion: 'Bolton may well have held on to win had referee Griffiths not awarded a free kick from which SM equalised that on repeated inspection on the DVD of the game seems clearly to have been made because of a purely imaginary offence.' Another opinion:'We might more accurately re-name the final of 1953, "The Crocks Final" or "The Final of Injuries." Bolton finished the game with one player incapacitated (Bell, from the 16th minute) and four suffering clearly from the effects of injurious incidents during the latter stages of the game (particularly Lofthouse and Banks, but also Barrass).

So can we please try to sustain Wikipedia as a repository of fact, not as a repository of re-gurgitated press-created myth.

I cite the DVD of the game as my source for the above.

90.203.95.60 (talk) 17:00, 2 March 2010 (UTC)


 * While you are correct in your assessment that the first goal in this final was given by commentator, Kenneth Wolstenholme as a Harold Hassall own goal and that indeed was by modern judgement a Harold Hassall own goal, there are two key points that mean that the accreditation of this as part of a hat-trick should remain. 1.Kenneth Wolstenholme was not the person who decided the official credit for each goal. That role was conducted by the referee and he gave the credit for the first goal to Mortensen, no doubt to the relief of Hassall. 2. There was no dubious goals panel as there is today. In the modern game this would indeed have been ruled as an own goal as Mortensen's shot would not have gone into the goal if left unimpeded. In 1953 however such statistics were much more relaxed and nobody was concerned with the statistical analysis so required of the modern game. Most newspapers ran with a hat-trick, the FA ran with a hat-trick and fifty years of post game history and publications say hat-trick. That the ball took a wicked deflection of Hassall is a sub detail. You can by all means add a note to state that in the modern era it would not be credited as a hat-trick due to the first goal deflection but onle as long as you can find a reliable publication that also points this out. Wikipedia however is a publisher of facts as they stand, right or wrong and not a place for unique research. Until such time as the FA say different in print, it remains a hat-trick Captainbeecher (talk) 11:33, 19 January 2015 (UTC)

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Move discussion in progress
There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:1872 FA Cup Final which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 18:34, 5 January 2023 (UTC)