Talk:2006 FIFA World Cup disciplinary record

Two yellows versus straight red
Should this list distinguish between players sent off for two yellow cards in a match (at which point, they are also shown a red card), and those who receive red cards for other reasons? Three players are listed having one red and two yellows; in all three cases the red was received for the second yellow. I'll make the change, please revert if you think it inapporpriate --EngineerScotty 21:18, 15 June 2006 (UTC)

Sounds right. A distinction should be made. Johno000 11:44, 16 June 2006 (UTC)


 * Somebody reverted the recent change; I've put it back pending further discussion here. --EngineerScotty 01:36, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

Such a distinction is never made in any official football statistics, and there is no apparent reason why Wiki should attempt to list information that no official body else considers relevant. Kevin McE 01:42, 17 June 2006 (UTC)

I could see it relevant if a table were done of cards by referees, where it would be more showing of the referee's tendancy toward straight reds. (In fact, I have seen this in at least one referee's article, with his tournament discipline history.) By player or team, I'm not sure it's particularly telling. (It would also be relevant under, say, US high school rules, where in-game and discipline consequences are different for a "soft red" v. a "hard red", but that's another matter entirely.) I think the table as it is, showing how players received red cards, is suitable. —C.Fred (talk) 00:02, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

It's a case of why not? What's the point in not recording the facts when we can do so? --Scarfo 00:18, 18 June 2006 (UTC)

Should there be detail with the refs regarding who gave out 2nd yellows to specific players, resulting in suspensions (tho they were not sent off in that match). Also, is André from Iran a special case? Why doesn't he have two suspensions? He got a 2nd yellow as his first yellow in a match and also got his third yellow (second for the match) and was sent off with a red card. Is he just suspended for one game or two? Paul C/T+ 21:32, 19 June 2006 (UTC)
 * I would be opposed to highlighting the fact that a ref showed a card to a player who carried one over from a previous match: refs should act "blind" to any pressure of their decision causing future suspensions, and indicating that they have issued a card that triggers a suspension infers that there was a decision to cause such. I have no documentation to prove it, but I very much doubt that André is due for a 2 game suspension for 3 yellow cards.  If he had been booked, and subsequently shown a straight red in the second match, having been booked in the first, then that may have been the case.  Kevin McE 23:45, 19 June 2006 (UTC)


 * First, I agree with Kevin McE, about not showing the players suspended by second yellows; he stated the case very nicely. Second, as I understand it, getting a second yellow in the round leads to a suspension from the next game of the 2006 World Cup, and getting a straight red leads to a suspension from the team's next international game, including the 2006 World Cup. So, two yellows, making a second and third yellow of the round, would only be a one-game suspension. However, a yellow-straight red combination would likely yield a two-game suspension, though I wouldn't be surprised if the discipline committee has discretion under the Law of penalizing only the most major of two offenses and making it a one-game suspension. —C.Fred (talk) 00:00, 20 June 2006 (UTC)

By individual
The current system is very misleading: a player getting two yellows in one match (and hence a red) is marked as having a worse disciplinary record than a player getting one yellow and one straight red for a more serious foul. Why not split the red card column into two, titled "Straight red" and "2nd yellow", both marked ? Udzu 10:48, 11 July 2006 (UTC)

Third yellow
The third yellow issue should be explained. Afonso Silva 17:32, 24 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I didn't see it (I have the game recorded but haven't watched it yet), but I think the summary in the article has it covered: the referee showed him the yellow three times, but only two made the FIFA match report. How much further is there to expand on it? If anything, we just need to link to the match summary or the Wikinews article on the match. —C.Fred (talk) 18:33, 24 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I think the article should present it as an awkward situation. Showing 3 yellow cards to the same player in the same match is a giant error. Afonso Silva 19:54, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

Mastroeni
If i'm not mistaken, Mastroeni will only miss the first TWO Gold Cup games, not 3, as his announced suspension was 3 games including the last group stage game. Just as De Rossi is suspended for 4 including the last group stage game. Otherwise that would mean Mastroeni was banned for 4 games, not 3. Batman2005 21:26, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

You are correct. De Rossi is eligible to play the final match, if Italy reaches it. Afonso Silva 21:49, 24 June 2006 (UTC)

Games played
Should the 'by team' table also include the number of games played by each team? Teams that play more games are inevitably going to pick up more cards in the current refereeing climate. -81.79.188.209 08:24, 26 June 2006 (UTC)

Heinze
Heinze, from Argentina, got a yellow card before the knockout stages and one after. This page says that he's going to miss the next match (Germany), but I think it's wrong. Yellow cards from *before* the knockout stages are supposed to be pardoned, aren't they? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 200.89.185.29 (talk • contribs)
 * You're right, it doesn't make sense. I removed mentions of Heinze's suspension. Ytny 14:07, 27 June 2006 (UTC)

Totals
It would be nice if there was a section for totals. EG -

Yellows Issued = * Reds Issued = *

Especially since this world cup holds the following records... Most Red cards issues in a single world cup match (Portugal v Holland) Equal most yellow cards issued in a single world cup match (Portugal v Holland) Most Red cards in a world cup tournament. First time a player recieved 3 yelow cards in a world vup tournament

However, it would need qualifying that 2nd Yellow cards are counted as are the Red card that results. I'm not sure if the 3rd yellow /red card (referee mistake) counts as a card or not.
 * It does not. The verification document for this data is the FIFA match reports, and according to that he was shown 2 red cards.  Kevin McE 15:10, 2 July 2006 (UTC)

Tables
What would thoughts be on moving the "By Referee" table to either the first or second table? I think it breaks up the flow that should exist in between the by player table and the additional discipline table. I also think it's definitely a more important reference than by player, and possibly even a more important one than by team. Vickser 23:29, 3 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I think it makes sense to have "by team" and "by player" neighbouring each other. Whether the "by ref" table is before or after the other 2 is of little difference to me.  Kevin McE 00:48, 4 July 2006 (UTC)
 * I just switched "by referee" to the top table. Also, I got a size notice about the article length.  Anyone have any ideas as to how we can clean that up? Vickser 18:03, 4 July 2006 (UTC)

Wayne Rooney
Should be addded to the additional discipline. Source: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2006/soccer/specials/world_cup/2006/07/08/rooney.discipline.ap/index.html tdwuhs

I think it should. The discipline is as a result of his red card in the tournament. Kingjeff 01:18, 9 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Done.Ytny 01:50, 9 July 2006 (UTC)

Dead link
During several automated bot runs the following external link was found to be unavailable. Please check if the link is in fact down and fix or remove it in that case!


 * http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=worldFootballNews&storyID=2006-07-08T144235Z_01_L08917618_RTRIDST_0_SPORT-SOCCER-WORLD-ROONEY-UPDATE-1.XML
 * In 2006 FIFA World Cup disciplinary record on 2011-05-26 02:02:00, Socket Error: 'A connection attempt failed because the connected party did not properly respond after a period of time, or established connection failed because connected host has failed to respond'
 * In 2006 FIFA World Cup disciplinary record on 2011-06-13 17:29:39, Socket Error: 'A connection attempt failed because the connected party did not properly respond after a period of time, or established connection failed because connected host has failed to respond'

--JeffGBot (talk) 17:30, 13 June 2011 (UTC)