Talk:2011–2012 Kurdish protests in Turkey

MENA protests page
Can someone also put a link of this page on the map on the MENA protests page and add it under the title 'other regional incident or just add ot to 'other countries affected? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.176.24.60 (talk) 15:14, 21 April 2011 (UTC) Find a source please which show these protests on the map on the MENA protests, outside of Wikipedia. Kavas (talk) 16:53, 22 April 2011 (UTC)

Bad article
The protest is about the next election. Kurdish protests are very common in Turkey, and I did not see any source that list these protests on the map of the MENA protests. Kavas (talk) 16:53, 22 April 2011 (UTC)

Second problem is that the article does not give details of April protests. Kavas (talk) 12:54, 26 April 2011 (UTC)
 * This article was a complete mess, so there are many things missings or unverified (this is the reason i tagged it for original research). It was an orphan article until recently, and will draw more attention when added to "Kurds in Turkey", "History of Turkey" and other pages. I'll work on this.Greyshark09 (talk) 15:34, 26 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Thanks. In accordance with Wikipedia rules, I want all editors in to keep Turkish spellings like Demirtaş, Kışanak, etc. in article. Some people write these Turkish names (people are Kurdish but names are Turkish) without Turkish spellings. For example, they write Kisanak. Kavas (talk) 17:53, 26 April 2011 (UTC)
 * I agree. It's a bit of a pain but I think it's the right thing to do, and it's far more accurate. -Kudzu1 (talk) 12:22, 27 April 2011 (UTC)

I have rewritten this article to Wikipedia standards
Please remember that Wikipedia's policies must be followed when making edits. Prior to the rewrite, this article was riddled with WP:NPOV and WP:ORIGINAL violations. This is an encyclopedia, not an activism website, and although many of us have strong feelings about this protest and other events, we have to maintain a neutral, objective tone drawing on verifiable fact and WP:RS. I look forward to working with you all. -Kudzu1 (talk) 00:37, 27 April 2011 (UTC)

Imprisonment of Turkish journalists for writing against the recent goverment violence
Please expand on the constant imprisonment of journalists in abandoned rural prisons in Turkey for writing against the recent goverment actions.
 * Find WP:RS that discuss this issue and I'll add it to the article. -Kudzu1 (talk) 11:02, 27 April 2011 (UTC)

There is Censorship of Youtube in Turkey so many protesters cannot download the massacre happening in the biggest cities
I have added a section to address the issue of Internet censorship in Turkey. -Kudzu1 (talk) 11:17, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
 * No, there is not Censorship of Youtube in Turkey as I, a man living in Turkey can open youtube. Read "youtube açıldı" "Youtube has been opened" http://yenisafak.com.tr/Gundem/?i=285777&t=31.10.2010 Kavas (talk) 22:52, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
 * You are certain that certain keywords are not censored? Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie Say Shalom! 00:34, 30 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Certain keywords and domain names are censored. But I'm not sure how relevant it is to this section. -Kudzu1 (talk) 03:11, 30 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Idk, they might be if they are relevant to these protests and the keyword and site bans have been documented as being a recent occurence rather than a long-time practice. By an RS of course. We can't have personal observations. Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie Say Shalom! 03:19, 30 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Domain names? This is not relevant. Recently, Turkey has blocked several domain names. http://www.bianet.org/english/freedom-of-expression/129626-138-words-banned-from-the-internet

Adrianne, Animal, Hayvan ('Animal'), Baldiz (sister-in-law'), Beat, Buyutucu ('enlarger'), Ciplak ('nude'), Citir ('crispy'), Escort, Etek ('skirt'), Fire, Girl, Ateşli ('passionate'), Gey ('gay'), Gay, Gizli ('confidential'), Haydar, Hikaye, Homemade, Hot, İtiraf ('confession'), Liseli ('high school student'), Nefes ('breath'), Nubile, Partner, Pic, Sarisin ('blond'), Sicak ('hot'), Sisman ('overweight'), Teen, Yasak ('forbidden'), Yerli ('local'), Yetiskin ('adult'), etc. According to the notification of TİB, domain names containing the words on the list will neither be assigned nor used and access to the existing ones will be suspended. Kavas (talk) 13:23, 30 April 2011 (UTC)
 * I agree, it seems mostly aimed at curbing internet pornography and spam. -Kudzu1 (talk) 13:40, 30 April 2011 (UTC)
 * @Kavas: It is not relevant? O_O Do you mean the specific domain names blocked are not relevant or having domain names blocked is not relevant (that's how I read your statement)? If they were domains that would potentially be used by the Kurdish Worker's Party and their supporters, etc. and they were blocked, then it would indeed be relevant to the issue of censorship. So I assume you mean the ones currently blocked are not related then, yes? I agree with Kudzu's assessment. These are most likely related to some decency laws and are not related to the Kurdish protests. Are any words, that could relate to the protests, blocked on Turkish YouTube that can be verified? Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie Say Shalom! 20:10, 30 April 2011 (UTC)
 * There is absolutely no cencorship on protests in Turkey. Besides those words above have not been blocked yet. Blocking against spam & child pornography was expected to start on late august but it has been postponed. Also these protests has nothing to do with the Arab Spring. Kurds have been rioting and looting for tens of years. It's nothing new. Just today Kurds have killed 8 Turkish military personel and yesterday they started two forest fires in Çeşme. This afternoon Kurdish leader Murat Karayılan has written a letter to Turkish PM threathening to climb up violence. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.167.192.22 (talk) 18:33, 17 August 2011 (UTC)

Rename the article to "Kurdish uprising 2011"
This name would definetely describe the situation now taking place in Turkey as it is not just a protest what is happening right now! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.228.183.50 (talk) 14:57, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
 * If you can find a preponderance of WP:RS, such as scholarly articles and credible news reports (i.e. not just Firat News Agency or Zaman, which are worth reporting but are not completely reliable due to heavy bias), that refer to this as an uprising, I would support moving the article. Right now, the consistent term used seems to be "protests". -Kudzu1 (talk) 15:38, 27 April 2011 (UTC)

Here is a website of Kurdish Europeans calling it a Kurdish uprising "http://www.kurdish-info.eu/News-sid-Kurdish-uprising-in-Turkey-2011-16598.html". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.228.183.50 (talk) 16:03, 27 April 2011 (UTC)


 * Heya Kudzu, you got reinforcements. =p I think the name should be decided by WP:COMMON. How many non-Turkish sources do we have talking about it? Or sources that do not have some portion of Kurdistan in them? (No Syria, no Iraq, no Turkey and certainly no Iran). Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie Say Shalom! 06:13, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Hardly any, actually. And even most of the Turkish and Armenian agencies haven't been comprehensive. Refs are in the immediately preceding version of this page (if you look in the History); this is an older version of the page that User:Butterfly2011 reverted us to before being blocked. -Kudzu1 (talk) 06:48, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Wonderful, so I guess that's out the window for now. Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie Say Shalom! 07:21, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

Rewrite protests are ongoing and where not terminated in 21st of April. Also casualties are over 4 and are definetely not 1!!
Someone Turkish has erased the timeline of protests and wrote that protests have ended in order to limit the impact of a major possible uprising. Please rewrite also and correct casualties are not 1 but 4! Someone incorrectly changed it.
 * Fixed. User:Butterfly2011 did a blanket replace of the article reverting it to a version from several days ago and didn't provide any rationale as to why. I'm actually going to request protection for this article due to vandalism such as that. I would also admonish you to assume WP:GOODFAITH; not everyone Turkish opposes these protests, not everyone Kurdish supports them, and the vast majority of Wikipedians are in fact neither Turkish nor Kurdish. -Kudzu1 (talk) 15:36, 27 April 2011 (UTC)


 * Strong support: I fully support you. You are right, article needs protection from conservatives who would not like to see a change in undemocratic Turkish political system. Thank you. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 87.228.183.50 (talk) 16:01, 27 April 2011 (UTC)
 * What this article needs is for everyone to make sure they do not make POV edits of any kind unless they are quoting so-and-so's reaction etc. We need to put aside our biases to help make this a good article. I will say right now though that I am very pro-Kurdish and wish them to have an independent nation asap. I will not let that get in the way of my editing though. Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie Say Shalom! 06:22, 29 April 2011 (UTC)

So is it 4 or 1 mortal casualties?Greyshark09 (talk) 19:56, 30 April 2011 (UTC)
 * I've seen conflicting reports as to what happened in Maras, and Kavas wants us to go with the official government explanation, which is that they were PKK terrorists and not demonstrators. -Kudzu1 (talk) 20:02, 30 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Well we just put both then I guess. Make sure to put though that the terrorist bit is a claim by the gov and the origin of the other as well. I am not sure how we'd go about verifying these tbh. Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie Say Shalom! 20:10, 30 April 2011 (UTC)

We need to add photos to the article of the demonstrations
It is necessary that however has a picture must provide it in order to make a better quality article. Please upload and add a picture to give a vivid picture of what is happening right now in Turkey!
 * If anyone can find a photograph that is fair use (most Creative Commons licenses) or in the public domain, or better yet upload a photograph they have taken themselves, that would be great. I looked earlier on Flickr and couldn't find anything that was verifiable. -Kudzu1 (talk) 10:04, 28 April 2011 (UTC)

Recent vandalism
I had hoped that placing this article under semi-protection would stop some of the egregious vandalism to this page, including blanket reverts and unauthorized moves. It appears I was wrong. I'm going to ask for your vigilance - the vigilance of the silent majority of people who care about Wikipedia being of a high quality - in combating this vandalism if it continues. If somebody makes an edit, or a series of edits, that are vandalism (not adding new information with citations, but taking out content with no explanation as to why), please revert the page back to its previous state. And if you're one of the people who is vandalizing the page - User:Butterfly2011 and User:Randam, for your consideration - please stop, out of respect for the community. Thanks. -Kudzu1 (talk) 22:40, 28 April 2011 (UTC)
 * And just a quick note for new editors here that you can revert an edit by clicking on "History" (next to "Edit this page" at the top of the screen) and clicking the "undo" link on the right-hand side of the edit in question. Please only do this for edits that you believe are vandalism or edits that require further discussion on this Talk page before being implemented. Cheers. -Kudzu1 (talk) 00:28, 29 April 2011 (UTC)
 * My intention was not vandalism. I made the topic wider by including the rest of the protests, because they are the continuance of a long series of protests. Randam (talk) 15:28, 5 May 2011 (UTC)
 * That's not what this page is for. See: Kurdish rebellions and Serhildan. This page refers only to the protests that began in late March of this year as part of an initiative pushed by Kurdish political parties. -Kudzu1 (talk) 00:43, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

International reaction
How can one add the part about the protest in the United States Kurdish (March 24, 2010 ), while the article states that the 2011 Kurdish protests started on March 24, 2011. By the way, the girl in question has been released few months ago. The Turkish Parliament passed a bill on July 2010. http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/n.php?n=hope-for-stone-throwing-children-2010-06-23 Randam (talk) 15:29, 5 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Well clearly one is wrong and needs the year corrected. =p Sir William Matthew Flinders Petrie Say Shalom! 15:50, 5 May 2011 (UTC)
 * That was left over from the old version of this article. I didn't notice the date when I was rewriting. Good catch. It's gone now. -Kudzu1 (talk) 00:42, 6 May 2011 (UTC)

Website filtering?
What does the article mean that the Azadiya Welat website is subject to filtering? I live in Turkey and I can see their home page. Perhaps the whole sentence should be removed as out of date. Or can anyone explain? Jzlcdh (talk) 19:29, 14 June 2011 (UTC)
 * The article is vague, but I believe it means that website is not accessible from places like internet cafes and public internet hotspots. -Kudzu1 (talk) 21:45, 14 June 2011 (UTC)

Death toll edit war
I've helpfully set up a thread for Kavas and Kermanshahi to hash out their differences over whether two or three people have died as a result of these protests. Discuss. -Kudzu1 (talk) 20:23, 20 July 2011 (UTC)
 * The source he adds never mentions anti-Hydroelectric Power Plants protests in Hopa (http://www.todayszaman.com/newsDetail_getNewsById.action?load=detay&newsId=249043&link=249043) as part of 2011 Kurdish protests in Turkey. The source only says Selahatin Demirtaş condemned the killing of Metin Lokumcu. I don't think he even read the source or know where Hopa is or what's the motive behind the protests. Kavas (talk) 20:34, 20 July 2011 (UTC)

"Ongoing"?
The last incident covered on this page took place last August. I wonder, actually, whether this series of protests is notable enough to warrant its own page, or whether it might not best be merged into the Serhildan page. -Kudzu1 (talk) 20:31, 1 January 2012 (UTC)

There is too much information on this page to be merged into Serhildan. In fact, more notable protests within the Serhildan need to get their own page so we can expand information about them.Kermanshahi (talk)

Merge

 * I think this article should be merged to Serhildan. This can't be its own article and also content needs a review. It isn't up-to-date and unbiased.-- Reality 15:58, 9 September 2012 (UTC)


 * Oppose: There is no room for this to be merged into Serhildan. In fact, more of that article needs to be broken down in different articles for the seperate protest periods. I however, think that this article should be re-named 2011-2012 Kurdish protests in Turkey and cover the entire BDP protest movement of sit-ins and demonstrations that has been going on since then.Kermanshahi (talk) 17:38, 4 November 2012 (UTC)

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