Talk:2011 Iran–Iraq cross-border raids/Archives/2011/November

Previous incursion
Seems Iran made an incursion in early 2010 as well .Greyshark09 (talk) 17:11, 15 September 2011 (UTC)

Iranian victory and NPOV
Kermanshani, i think this is too early to state "Iranian victory" and "end of conflict". For now, we only have unofficial Iranian sources for that claim, while nothing in the world media. For your attention - i marked "verification" for non-reliable sources (don't say to me blogs are find - this is violation of WP:RS), and marked citation needed for notable events, where no source is provided.Greyshark09 (talk) 17:25, 6 October 2011 (UTC)

There was no iranian victory, Iran failed to achive its intended target of wiping out the PJAK. PJAK declared a ceasefire only because as a gesture of goodwill toward the KRG, because the iranian army shelled civilian areas and PJAK wanted to avoid further civilian losses. The iranian media, may claim that there was a uniteral ceasefire and that Iran did not obey, but that is not the case, since there is this ceasefire which both agreed upon, regular iranian artillery attacks have ceased. How can someone assume, that after loosing several high ranking comanders, General Azemi and General Azemi, that Iran achieved victory. They took heavy casualties

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IooN6X_LNso here you can the see death corpses of at least 12 iranian soldiers, which Iran did not acknowledge. Neither their sources nor their claims are reliable.

What we can see, is that the PJAK is intact and there are no more attacks from both sides, while we have proof of unacknowleged iranian kia. They took far heavier casualties then mantained officially  — Preceding unsigned comment added by 178.1.223.235 (talk) 20:24, 20 October 2011 (UTC)

Iran's target was to end PJAK attacks and expel PJAK fighters from it's territory. This completely succeded. We can dispute the casualty figures (although if PJAK casualties were really light and Iranian casualties hheavy, they wouldn't be giving up), but what we can not dispute is that PJAK ended it's argmed struggle without any concessions from the Iranian side. This clear fact proves the operation was succesfull and thus an Iranian victory. BTW, the side which retreats after/during the fight, which loses territory, is usualy the one we can safely say has lost.Kermanshahi (talk) 21:50, 29 October 2011 (UTC)
 * I have seen some Iranian sources on "PJAK" surrender, none Kurdish sources saying that. PJAK website is empty of any news in this regard. Iraqi Kurdistan sources are quiet, so are mainstream world media, how come?Greyshark09 (talk) 22:11, 29 October 2011 (UTC)

Murat Karayilan said himself he had deported all PJAK fighters from the border and as you may have noticed, there has not been a single attack since.Kermanshahi (talk) 01:16, 11 November 2011 (UTC)