Talk:2015 Mina stampede

Crowd Crush
I'm sure this has been discussed before but shouldn't the title of this page be "2015 Mina Crowd Crush" or "2015 Mina Crowd Crush / Stampede" / "2015 Mina Crowd Crush and Stampede"

66.171.110.231 (talk) 16:41, 3 November 2022 (UTC)


 * Agreed. If there is any argument why the probable misnomer should be retained (e.g. evidence that it *was* an actual "stampede" and not a typical crowd crush), then please summarize it. I don't see evidence in the article itself.  It's described as an intersection and density problem.  If no arguments/evidence can be provided after some time, then someone should just boldly improve the title. There are also currently 141 casual instances of the word "stampede" in the article, depicting people like wild animals rather than the emphasis being on responsible crowd management where it should probably be. Consider a global search & replace with the word 'crush' or something similar (but not inside quotes obviously). DKEdwards (talk) 17:53, 22 December 2022 (UTC)
 * This was discussed before, in late 2015 and 2016. I advocated strongly to eliminate the use of the word "stampede" in the title for the same reasons, but after a long and thoroughly debated process, with strong opinions on both sides, no consensus was reached; therefore, the closer determined the article should remain as it was, and that since the source material used the word, WP should also use the word. I think that's dead wrong, but an awful lot of people were involved in that decision. A section in the article discusses the issue, which is a small concession.
 * One additional item to consider, if you think we should reopen this highly divisive issue, is the extremely racist nature of WP's historical use of the word "stampede." (Racist in effect, not in intent.) I conducted an in-depth analysis using statistical methods, and I found:
 * 1) not one single predominately white event was called a stampede,
 * 2) 73% of predominately non-white events were called stampedes,
 * 3) 5% of events in the US and Europe were called stampedes (in the US, these were predominately non-white events), and
 * 4) 74% of events that happened elsewhere were called stampedes.
 * This analysis included the 92 articles that were listed on the page List of human stampedes as of October 9, 2015. (Note that list itself referred to stampedes, though today it is titled "List of fatal crowd crushes, and it has obviously grown since my analysis. I think opinions are changing.) I do not suggest that WP or any editors had racist intentions, and some of the articles included in my analysis have since been modified to use different terminology. The reason for this racial bias appears to be systemic racism in the reporting of these events in the English language media, and I think that's an appalling excuse for us to continue the practice here on WP.
 * I think an argument can be made now, after the explosion of the BLM movement around the world, that society has changed in important ways concerning race relations, and it might be justified to take this up again. Dcs002 (talk) 00:20, 17 January 2023 (UTC)
 * BTW, I think this is where the discussion started.
 * Here's a link to the request for move to a different name.
 * Here is the RfC discussion in WP Words to watch. It's long, and I kinda dominated it, but I wasn't alone. I think people were generally thoughtful, and the opposing side had some very good points. I strongly disagree with them, but I cannot dismiss them. Dcs002 (talk) 02:26, 17 January 2023 (UTC)