Talk:5Rhythms

Dead link
I corrected the date accordingly with info in already cited article from the Independent on Sunday. Unfortunately I couldn't find the article on the Independent webpage and the link provided is dead. I found the first part of the article here, unfortunately the full text is available only with subscription. --Dia^ (talk) 08:42, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

Combine with Gabrielle Roth article?
Right now you have a Gabrielle Roth article which barely mentions the 5Rhythms (clearly the bedrock of almost all of of her work) and a 5Rhythms article which is high on assertions and low on citations. I think it makes sense to add a 5Rhythms section to the Gabrielle Roth page and redirect 5Rhythms to Gabrielle Roth's page - 5rhythms.com redirects to gabrielleroth.com after all. Ultimately 5Rhythms is a form of conscious ecstatic dance; there are others. Whilst 5Rhythms may be the most famous, there isn't really much in the way of NPOV literature on the subject so it would be difficult to write a good wikipedia entry. As is you have biased statements like 'Insight and understanding of the ego is delivered through the psyche map, "Mirrors".' and "While the practice is greatly transformative and can be deeply therapeutic" Maloot (talk) 10:57, 28 January 2012 (UTC)


 * I dont really see the need for a merge. The fact that 5rhythms.com redirects to gabrielleroth.com does not indicate that the two are synonymous. While the is not enough literature to suport a featured article, there is enough to show notability, and enough to verify most of what is in this article. For the most part we are just trying to describe the system and not make claims for any effects.--Salix (talk): 14:31, 28 January 2012 (UTC)


 * Fair enough - the Gabrielle Roth entry remains poor, but I think the 5Rhythms article is beginning to look quite a bit better. I think it could get better still. Claims regarding being actively supported by Michael Murphy and Dick Price should be considered carefully. Maloot (talk) 17:52, 29 January 2012 (UTC)


 * More changes. It should be noted that Gestalt therapy is not Gestalt psychology; the article on the latter strongly emphasises this. I think the text regarding the Moving Center schools could be edited further. There is no school one can enrol at in any recognised sense of the word. They give classes and workshops like all the other certified 5Rhythms teachers. They also do the teacher training and almost all of the Cycles and Mirrors workshops. Perhaps that is what should be mentioned here.Maloot (talk) 16:51, 31 January 2012 (UTC)

I have made interim edits to the page. For example, the reason why I deleted the reference to the member teachers is that not all currently practising 5Rhythms teachers are currently registered with the 5Rhythms Teachers Association. I have added specific information regarding the patent claim of Gabrielle Ansell née Roth - '5Rhythms' and 'The Moving Center' are claimed global trademarks, but they are only, as far as one can easily tell, registered in the USA. Maloot (talk) 12:01, 28 January 2012 (UTC)

Contested deletion
This page should not be speedily deleted because. Enough sources to show notability. --Salix (talk): 14:59, 8 March 2012 (UTC)

Almost 5 years on, it's continuing notability might be called into question. It could be pretty easily merged into the Gabrielle Roth article without a loss of significant content. Maloot (talk) 23:25, 16 October 2016 (UTC)

Historical record of Moving Center schools
The Moving Center Schools were an important part of Roth's work and have now been closed. That doesn't mean we should not mention them (once notable, always notable). The former text read


 * "Roth founded The Moving Center Schools in 1977 to train and develop certified teachers; there are currently two such schools, one in New York where Roth and her son Jonathan Horan are based, and the other in California operated by Kathy Altman and Lori Saltzman, with Andrea Juhan exploring psychological aspects with her Open Floor, which itself is now also taught by other practitioners. "

We should probably update this (getting rid of 'currently' etc) and find other references for it, setting the school work in the context of her life. Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:32, 15 August 2013 (UTC)

I'm not sure exactly what you mean. 'Moving Center NYC' has essentially become '5 Rhythms Global', with 'Moving Center' still very much operating out of California. However, the latter school does not appear to be involved with the latest teacher training and there now appears to be around 100 teachers considered to be fully accredited by 5rhythms.com (down from around 240 a few months ago), with Kathy Altman, Lori Saltzman and Andrea Juhan not on the list. This implies a schism of some kind. Maloot (talk) 23:17, 30 August 2013 (UTC)


 * My meaning: 1) we should avoid words like "currently", "is now..." as these quickly go out of date. 2) We should write and cite a basic history - of Moving Center NYC and California, then 5 Rhythms Global, etc, with dates, not just try to paint a "current" picture of what is happening. I.e. since we know there were 240 teachers in 2012, that is a fact which, once notable, is always notable, we should not update it but may add (if you have citations for such) that now something has happened. Hope that's clear. Chiswick Chap (talk) 09:47, 31 August 2013 (UTC)

No issue with any of that: http://www.5rhythms.com/TeacherSearch.php?Srch=All is the current list of 'accredited' 5R teachers. It was 99 a few days ago, so might continue to creep up depending on exactly what is going on here. The list of 5RG staff is here: http://www.5rhythms.com/who-we-are/5rhythms-global/ Maloot (talk) 18:39, 31 August 2013 (UTC)
 * The main problem with this article has always been sourcing. It pretty hard to find non primary sources for much of it and I'm doubtful there are any reliable sources documenting any internal conflicts. It might be possible to have some earlier list of teachers through archive sites but inferring anything other than the number have changed would be WP:OR.--Salix (talk): 19:09, 31 August 2013 (UTC)

There's been a few dodgy edits with some uncareful, possibly politicised, wording (e.g. Juhan, Altman and Saltzmann 'abandoning' 5Rhythms) coming from editors with names like 'bemoved' (Jonathan Horan's partner also seems to have an editing history, but nothing particularly egregious). The bit about Jonathan Horan being the honored successor was particularly choice though. That's been cleaned up; people can get the Dear Leader stuff from the website if they want it. I've taken out some of the stuff about Open Floor Encounter because I don't think it has anything to really add to anyone's basic understanding of the 5Rhythms; same with the details about teacher training. Andrea Juhan's thesis has not been included on the revamped Open Floor website, so I've removed the links (though added a reference to a WorldCat entry) - if we can find an alternative legal link, that would be useful. Maloot (talk) 22:03, 16 October 2016 (UTC)

External links modified
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more basic information needed about "the practice"
i didn't find much information about what is really happening in a "wave". being a complete stranger to the subject i would like to know: is there any music? what kind of music? is the dance alone, in pairs, in groups? is the dance completely free, or are there given movements? what does a teacher do? instruct the movement? instruct the meditation? how many participants are needed? can one practice 5rhythms alone at home? is there any special equipment, clothing, ...

thanks to all editors for the information i got, anyway. hope i got everything right (being a wikipedia-dummie, and a not-english-speaker :-) --213.147.160.154 (talk) 11:57, 16 October 2016 (UTC) gerda_badischl

External links modified
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"Open Floor" listed at Redirects for discussion
The redirect [//en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Open_Floor&redirect=no Open Floor] has been listed at redirects for discussion to determine whether its use and function meets the redirect guidelines. Readers of this page are welcome to comment on this redirect at  until a consensus is reached. Utopes (talk / cont) 01:34, 19 April 2024 (UTC)