Talk:ABC (band)

Female member
Does anybody know who was the girl drummer who appeared on the "Be Near Me" video and (in cartoon form) the "(How to Be A) Millionaire" video? AnonMoos 02:58, 6 December 2005 (UTC)


 * It was the group's auxiliary percussionist/backup singer, Fiona Russell Powell. She portrayed the fictitious supermodel "Eden" on the How to Be a ... Zillionaire! album, the source album of the songs "Be Near Me" and "(How to be a) Millionaire". Sk'py Skwrrrl 14:58, 15 January 2006 (UTC)


 * I think "auxiliary percussionist/backup singer" is overdoing it a bit. It's been fairly well documented that both she and David Yarritu were strictly there for the band "image" of the time. It is doubtful in the extreme that either of them participated in any way on any actual recordings, with the possible exception of the track "A to Z" (and even on that, "Eden" sounds suspiciously like a speeded-up Martin Fry.)


 * LOL. I actually went into Sound Forge to see if that was Martin Fry doing the Eden section of "A to Z". Pitch-shifting with or without retaining the source duration makes it clear that it is indeed a female voice, presumably Russell-Powell's. But the very thought of Fry saying "kiss my snatch" was hilarious. 75.66.145.31 (talk) 17:27, 17 July 2010 (UTC)


 * Yes, lulz 173.57.61.233 (talk) 05:52, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

Videos
In my opinion the "The Look of Love" video is classic -- not sure whether I should add something about it, since it would be my purely personal opinion... AnonMoos 02:58, 6 December 2005 (UTC)

"The Look of Love" video I thought was always quite shoddy, "Poison Arrow", "Be Near Me", "All of My Heart" were much better. You could add somethings about the longform video album/film Mantrap, think it was one of the very first projects like this DJ HEAVEN 09:32, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

David Palmer
The "David Palmer" disambiguation page linked to in the "Members" section of this article doesn't appear to reference the group's David Palmer. Unless, of course, I'm wrong. Catbar (Brian Rock) 04:23, 16 July 2006 (UTC)

"Members"
It seems someone has confused members with session players in the info box here. If the band has listed the members on their releases, then this should be the source used, if someone failed to be listed as a member by the band themselves, then it is safe to say they were only session players.--Tednor 12:57, 16 December 2006 (UTC)

All the albums are fully credited, including session players, and there's no mention at all of Alan Laramee Taylor. I've seen a fan site claiming he played bass in 1982 and again from 1985-7, but Mark Lickley, Brad Lang and Robert Clark are officially credited for these periods.

Andy Newmark and Alan Spenner are a bit trickier. They are credited on Beauty Stab as "assisted by" rather than full band members, but they appeared in the video for That was Then But This Is Now and Martin Fry has said he wanted to tour with them. On balance, though, they would seem to be session players. Stufarq 11:02, 2 September 2008 (UTC)

The article states that for Lexicon of Love "The album is notable for its...overall musicality (tightly bound by funk basslines and Palmer's steady drumming)..." then states that Palmer replaced David Robinson AFTER the release of the album. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.161.162.35 (talk) 16:53, 18 November 2008 (UTC)

No, it clearly states that Robinson left after the release of "Tears Are Not Enough". Stufarq 11:02, 24 November 2008 (UTC)

I've edited the dates for David Palmer. The Lexicon tour lasted into 1983 (as mentioned in the Curiosities section) and he played on the Zillionaire album (check the credits) and appears in the "Ocean Blue" video, having recorded a new drum track for the single remix. Stufarq 22:58, 31 March 2009 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Sl beauty.jpg
Image:Sl beauty.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

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BetacommandBot (talk) 05:36, 24 January 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Zillionaireversion2.jpg
Image:Zillionaireversion2.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to insure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 03:25, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

Fiona Russell Powell and Vice Versa
Fiona Russell Powell's comments on Fry replacing her in Vice Versa are, at best, inaccurate - as is the biographical information on Vice Versa.

The official ABC/Martin Fry site's information on Vice Versa is no longer on the site but some of the archived pages can be tracked down, including a contemporary interview by Andrew Darlington, although publication information is not given. Further information can be found at Stephen Singleton's Myspace page (no link provided because Myspace links are prohibited; but it is easily searchable), the Discogs pages on Vice Versa, the Music4 EP and Neutron records and the Sheffield Vision site.

The substantiated story is that Vice Versa originally consisted of Mark White (vocals, synthesizers, guitar - although he appears not to have used guitar until the Stilyagi single), Stephen Singleton (synthesizers, saxophone) and David Sydenham (synthesizers), who was a school friend of Singleton's. Note that White was the original vocalist, not Sydenham. I also have a photocopy of an advert for concerts supporting Wire on Monday 4th September at Doncaster Outlook, Sunday 8th October at Sheffield's Big Tree and on Tuesday 10th October at Manchester's Band on the Wall crediting this line-up. Unfortunately no year is given. The photocopy was obtained, among several others, from Stephen Singleton. Although Singleton's MySpace states that the band's first live appearance was supporting Wire at Doncaster Outlook, the 4th September date can not be the same one as Discogs mentions a July 1978 date supporting The Human League. Either that or Singleton's memory is wrong, as some (admittedly less reliable, blog-type) sources claim that the Human League date was the band's first.

Exactly when Sydenham left is unclear. Singleton says he formed Neutron Records with White, not mentioning Sydenham; but Discogs credits all three on Music4, which was released on Neutron. Perhaps he was still in the band but not a partner in the label or left before the EP was released. Singleton claims to have met Fry in 1980, but Discogs says he arrived "a couple of months" after the September 1979 release of Music4. The latter seems more accurate as he is credited on the "correspondence card" that came with the 1980 The First Fifteen minutes EP, which was recorded and manufactured in 1979 according to the vinyl's label.

The story of Fry joining after interviewing the band for his fanzine is agreed by all sources but, as Darlington's interview confirms, he initially played percussion and synthesizers. In an interview on UK TV's This Morning on 30th April 2008, Fry says that "one guy had left, they were a trio, and they needed another guy. It was good timing, so I showed up and they let me join that night," and again says that he initially played synthesizer. Both Sheffield Vision and a 2006 interview with Fry agree that he switched to vocals after he had jammed in a Rotterdam studio during a Dutch tour. Another accounthas these events taking place during the rerecording of the Stilyagi single, and it is likely that the two happened at the same time. (I remember also reading a version where Fry was asked to sing a guide vocal while White overdubbed his guitar part. Unfortunately I can not remember where this account came from but it does not contradict the others as such and may also be true.)

All of this casts serious doubt on Powell's story. Fry did not join the band as singer but as musician. As, by her own admission, Powell could not play any instrument, Fry can not have been a last minute replacement for her and nor could Sydenham, had she confused the personnel. The only role she could potentially have played in Vice Versa was vocalist, but as they were never without one and Fry did not become vocalist until long after joining, this can not be the case either. Her exact connection to the band remains unclear. Stufarq 23:28, 31 August 2008 (UTC)

Merge from Vice Versa (band)
I've done what I can with sourcing on Vice Versa (band), but there isn't really enough to justify a separate article. Vice Versa were, however, an important part of the early history of ABC, so I propose that the content be merged here. Any thoughts?--Michig (talk) 10:46, 15 February 2009 (UTC)

Agreed. Tried to find out some more about Vice Versa (band) too but not much joy. Merge I think :-) --Dylanfromthenorth (talk) 13:22, 17 March 2009 (UTC)
 * Agree - Merge. Gwladys24 (talk) 16:33, 13 April 2010 (UTC)

I disagree as I would rather have separation, plus there would have to be a redirect. --DazB (talk) 11:48, 19 October 2009 (UTC)


 * Totally agree, and I do not understand why this was not done a long time ago.


 * Derek R Bullamore (talk) 21:35, 22 June 2010 (UTC)

Although not unanimous, consensus is for merging. I've added this to my todo list, but if anyone else wants to do it please feel free. Thanks.--Michig (talk) 20:49, 2 July 2010 (UTC)


 * Disagree. There are considerable differences in what roles the different musicians played in the two groups (for example, Martin Fry, by most sources, was originally enlisted not as a vocalist, but as a musician), as well as disparities between the music they were creating and their image styling.  Plus, referencing the Martin Fry/ABC official site, the site clearly identifies Vice Versa as a "side project", along with several other acts Fry has been involved with.  I agree that the group is an important part of ABC history, but as this page states, "Martin started to improvise on vocals and everybody was surprised by the quality of his voice. They decided to make him the lead singer instead of Mark White and spent about a year writing new songs, thinking of a new name and concept."  New songs, a new name, a new concept, and a noteworthy change of vocalist would indicate to me that it was not so much evolution as complete reinvention.  To me, that seems sufficient argument for keeping the two articles separate, but with a "see also". 75.66.145.31 (talk) 05:10, 7 July 2010 (UTC)


 * Agreed, I should agree to merge Vice Versa into ABC, not many sources, and its just an boring article of Vice Versa. It should be merged as a section prior before its deleted of Wikipedia. And yes, I want Vice Versa to be merged in early history of ABC. Agree? Yes or No?
 * FSXTheGreat (talk) 11:56, 9 July 2010 (UTC)

Name ABC
Was it ever spelt with 3 stars like the article suggests? I thought the three stars were just part of the logo on albums etc --Dylanfromthenorth (talk) 13:26, 17 March 2009 (UTC)


 * I doubt it—I think it's just a long-favored graphic design standard for the group that started with "Lexicon". You can't "spell" anything in the Latin alphabet without using the 26 letters (plus diacritics, ligatures, digraphs/trigraphs, etcetera).  A star doesn't qualify as a letter, so while it is uniformly used with the group's name in logomarks, the proper spelling is quite simply the first three letters of the Latin alphabet.  :-)  75.66.145.31 (talk) 05:25, 7 July 2010 (UTC)

New Wave??
You're havin' a laugh! Gwladys24 (talk) 16:31, 13 April 2010 (UTC)


 * Of course, you're right. To those of us from the UK 'new wave' has a very restricted meaning that certainly doesn't include ABC but to Americans (who dominate Wikipedia) 'new wave' is a catch-all term they use for a ton of 80s pop music, especially from Britain. Vauxhall1964 (talk) 17:24, 6 January 2011 (UTC)

New Romantic
I deleted the unsourced claim that ABC 'were pigeon-holed as part of the New Romantic movement'. ABC were simply not New Romantics, a genre that was as good as dead by the launch of their first album. See the talk page for 'New Romantics' to see the consensus that ABC weren't such a band. Vauxhall1964 (talk) 17:31, 6 January 2011 (UTC)
 * It's simply not true that ABC were not New romantic. Their music and fashion style on Lexicon of Love (their best album however), were basically the very definition of the term New romantic, and it is simply unfair omitting that fact! — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.154.144.21 (talk) 03:50, 4 January 2015 (UTC)
 * The "New Romantic" movement was a fashion movement, not a music genre. And no, the band's fashion style during their first album was not New Romantic in style. ABC themselves have always stated they were never new romantics, which Fry reiterated in this interview: 88.104.29.170 (talk) 01:49, 12 January 2015 (UTC)

Big advance
More detail could be added about how ABC was given the largest advance of any band in music history (according to The Face magazine, I seem to recall at the time) and that their producer Trevor "The Buggle" Horn said that their songs were so good that they didn't need his high-priced services which he was happy to provide nonetheless. Somebody add detail to this please, as I just have my foggy old memory to rely on. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 184.162.161.187 (talk) 23:05, 8 May 2012 (UTC)
 * Aren't you confusing ABC with Sigue Sigue Sputnik now? The Seventh Taylor (talk) 16:52, 9 May 2012 (UTC)

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