Talk:AK-12

Rifle Type
Edited its description from assault rifle to assault or battle rifle, since it fires 7.62x51 mm — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.223.87.166 (talk) 19:10, 15 August 2012 (UTC)

Images
Here are some pictures of this thing, if someone with knowledge on how to use Wiki wants to post them.

These are the prototypes, top one with a 5.45mm 60-rounder and the bottom with a standard 30-rounder of 7.62mm and some sort of wierd bipod: http://cdn1.thefirearmsblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/2654328-tfb.jpg http://cdn1.thefirearmsblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/05/tmp_dropzone_6f_6748799800_tfb-tfb.jpg

These are the production spec'd 200s: http://img525.imageshack.us/img525/1485/4jnjfcjyb.jpg http://img27.imageshack.us/img27/1716/3357331.jpg http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/6531/23813568.jpg

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more images

http://cdn5.thefirearmsblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/2654016-tfb-tm.jpg http://cdn5.thefirearmsblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/2654020-tfb-tm.jpg http://cdn5.thefirearmsblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/2654032-tfb-tm.jpg http://cdn5.thefirearmsblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/2654030-tfb-tm.jpg http://cdn5.thefirearmsblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/2654018-tfb-tm.jpg http://cdn5.thefirearmsblog.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/2654028-tfb-tm.jpg http://t3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTBIU1uhD10WkVdKG6qGqLFron2vnkFO42It2E_GDgq0QrCWAsU http://www.gun-world.net/russain/kalash/ak100/newak37.jpg —Preceding unsigned comment added by 125.186.150.152 (talk) 08:11, 2 January 2011 (UTC) here are other pics that shows the full picture ok the AK-200 http://ttvnol.com/quansu/1245879

Rate of Fire
Anyt reliable sources for the 200's Rate of fire? Also, this article (and weirdly, the discussion article), could use some clean-up. I took the liberty of at least adding a title to the image discussion.71.196.147.201 (talk) 13:52, 21 March 2011 (UTC)

Effective range
AK-200s range is 1000m source is Bahasa Indonesian wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AK-200 — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.49.73.210 (talk) 14:32, 27 May 2011 (UTC)
 * Wikipedia articles cannot use other Wikipedia articles as sources. The AK-200's effective range most definitely is not 1000 meters. Do not keep changing the number unless you can cite a reliable source that agrees with your change. ROG5728 (talk) 03:18, 2 June 2011 (UTC)


 * 800 meters? Really? This is such BS. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 104.228.177.226 (talk) 04:16, 27 April 2015 (UTC)


 * Given that the table is copied from Russian Wikipedia, it makes sense to use the same data. There is no citation to a reliable source for the ranges.  It uses the same ammunition as the M16, so unless it had a very much longer barrel (which it does not) it will have a similar effective range.--  Toddy1 (talk) 05:42, 27 April 2015 (UTC)

Weight Citation
Could someone with better knowledge of HTML cite the weight of the 200? The link is http://en.rian.ru/mlitary_news/20100525/159151188.html — Preceding unsigned comment added by PotM (talk • contribs) 13:27, 3 September 2011 (UTC)

New Name
It appears RIA NOVOSTI that the AK-200 is now called the AK-12. If confirmed, this page should be moved. 5minutes (talk) 19:00, 26 January 2012 (UTC)

Three options after "safe"
How can this thing have semi-automatic (1), burst (3) and full auto? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 108.67.162.18 (talk) 02:48, 9 April 2012 (UTC)

Because it is designed that way. The AN-94 has semi, 2 round burst, and full auto. It all has to do with the trigger mechanism. 24.109.131.161 (talk) 00:43, 18 May 2012 (UTC)

While uncommon in US weapons, a Burst + Auto function is actually not that much more difficult to manufacture than a bust. A famous example of a weapon with this feature would be the SIG 550 family. It's ergonomically difficult to operate in a lot of cases, but can be situationally useful. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.91.247.81 (talk) 19:11, 9 July 2012 (UTC)

Deleted User section
"Customers for the rifle will probably be countries in Africa, Asia, the Middle East, and South America. It will probably enter service with the Russian army in 2013-2014."

Probably, probably...is not good enough. The AK-12 is still in development and is not even in the Izhmash catalog. We have no idea what the final version will look like, much less who will to buy it.

Therefore, I have deleted the User section…once a country actually buys it and actually begins to use it…I will restore the User section. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.22.156.40 (talk) 05:09, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

I have some very important notes about this article!
- There was no such thing as an "AK-200". So called "AK-200" was nothing more than fake term propagated by Russian media. You can find out the negation of the "AK-200"'s existing provided by Izhmash and (AFAIR) in the interview with AK-12's Chief Designer. I can provide links.

- There are some important AK-12's features which are not mentioned in the article: 1) Bolt Hold Open Mechanism with the BHO release button . It should work with a newly designed magazines. 2) Redesigned bolt group and trigger mechanism (which are not identical to the parts of the "classic" Kalashnikov's series) to improve accuracy. 3) Absolutely new dust cover with a stable fixation.

- "The AK-12 field stripped and compared to the AK-74" picture is nothing more than speculation (drawing)! The internal parts of the AK-12 were not shown yet. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 188.134.11.29 (talk) 09:29, 16 November 2012 (UTC)

Cartridges
It would seem unusual if this was not chambered in 7.62x54R but would be available in 7.62x51 NATO. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Barleyman74 (talk • contribs) 09:42, 18 September 2013 (UTC)
 * Why? If a rifle is aimed at the export market chambering it for the 7.62x51mm makes a lot more sense than chambering it for the 7.62x54R. Thomas.W   talk to me  10:38, 18 September 2013 (UTC)
 * It's aimed to be the standard Russian army service rifle replacing the ageing AK-74. So it'd seem rather odd if it would not come with a variant to use their standard sniper rifle and LMG ammo. A sniper variant is actually explicitly mentioned. Perhaps Russian army is going to phase out 7.62x54R and introduce 7.62x51 NATO as standard issue.--Barleyman74 (talk) 13:31, 18 September 2013 (UTC)
 * The standard Russian service rifle cartridge is the 5.45x39mm, not the 7.62x54R. So unless they intend to replace the SVD Dragunov with a version of the AK-12 there's no reason for them to chamber the AK-12 for the 7.62x54R. There's also a difference in length between the 7.62x51mm and the 7.62x54R, with the 7.62x51mm being shorter. The 7.62x54R is also a rimmed cartridge, so it's much easier to fit a 7.62x51mm into a rifle design than to fit a 7.62x54R. Thomas.W   talk to me  13:40, 18 September 2013 (UTC)

Variants
Do we have a source for the listed "variants"? That section was removed before for not having any valid sources, why is it back up without any valid sources? The two citations listed a couple sentences after the variants are listed don't make any references to variants beyond the already confirmed 5.45 version and 7.62 version. Gamerdog6482 (talk)

AK-12 accepted
Janes reports that the AK-12 has now been accepted as the 5.45mm rifle for the Ratnik programme. See: http://www.janes.com/article/48463/russia-selects-new-assault-rifles Acorn897 (talk) 16:25, 4 February 2015 (UTC)

Link to serbian M21 ?
Hi there - what about putting a link to the serbian M21 which resembles some similarities in design at least...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zastava_M21

If i am not mistaken, then the east-germans did the for first the first time a design of the AK family which looked like these two rifles mentioned above ?

Just type Wieger in google and check out te pictures

— Preceding unsigned comment added by 92.217.57.14 (talk) 03:44, 27 February 2015 (UTC)

Where should this go?
I am very unsure of where the AK-12's 2016 version (3rd & 4th pics) should go. I say this because, whilst it's named "AK-12", it appears to be a further evolution of the AK-74M universal upgrade kit seen here and here. This suggests that the "AK-12" name has been "transferred" to the new(?) design.

Also, where should the AK-15 (5th pic), RPK-16 and SVK go? Personally, I would put the AK-15 wherever the 2016 AK-12 ends up, or possibly on AK-103, if the new AK-12 goes on AK-74. I would assume the RPK-16 would go on RPK. Does the SVK deserve its own article, because in its current (prototype) form, it's (at least externally) very different? If not, should it go where the 2016 AK-12 goes, or should it go on Dragunov sniper rifle?

Lastly, is the MA compact assault rifle notable enough to deserve its own page, or should we wait until it is adopted, if it is?

Thanks, RadiculousJ (talk) 12:58, 18 September 2016 (UTC)

The "old" AK-12 was based on the AK-200 prototype, whilst the "new" AK-12 2016 version is based on the AK-400 prototype, which has more in common than the AK-200 prototype with the AK-74M, however enough in difference for it to be considered a different model; so no, it should not be moved. Also the RPK-16 is essentially a mega-version of the AK-12, so it shouldn't be either. The SVK isn't in this article, and neither is the MA compact AR; go to their respective articles. AA Quantum (talk) 15:50, 27 April 2017 (UTC)

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New AK-12 pic (3rd)
I have a different picture close up without the camo of the AK-400 based AK-12 from a different website but I don't know how to put it there without downloading it. Does anyone know how?

AA Quantum (talk) 13:01, 27 April 2017 (UTC)

Oh well, I don't think it was copyrighted, so I put it there. AA Quantum (talk) 01:55, 28 April 2017 (UTC)

New Variants.
Someone add the variants of the AK-12 and the AK-15: the AK-12K and the AK-15K, the carbine versions of these assault rifles.

Josephua (talk) 05:53, 5 November 2017 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the. Community Tech bot (talk) 18:36, 23 June 2018 (UTC)
 * АК-12 и АК-15.jpg

AK-200 and AK-400
While I'm not sure if it's an RS [//nationalinterest.org/blog/buzz/strange-story-ak-12-rifle-32852] (it's a blog although I don't know if the author qualifies as a subject matter expert) but even if not, it makes me wonder if our article is correct. While it agrees with the AK-400 claim, it suggests the AK-200 is something easily entirely. Not the prototype for the older AK-12 which was a clean state design, but rather a civilian gun with some of the modifications for the new AK-12. Someone above claims AK-200 is a Russian media invented term. Separately, since both that source and our article seem to agree that the final AK-12 is mostly unrelated to the old AK-12, I wonder if we should handle the designed date better. It seems to me saying it was designed in 2011, when the actual rifle now called an AK-12 was not based on something in 2011 but something later, is a little misleading. In fact, it seems to me a single year is probably misleading since it doesn't sound (as you would expect) that either version was designed in a single year. Nil Einne (talk) 20:15, 15 November 2018 (UTC)

Commons files used on this page have been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons files used on this page have been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussions at the nomination pages linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 18:06, 8 March 2019 (UTC)
 * AK12 (4).jpg (discussion)
 * AK12 (5).jpg (discussion)
 * AK12 (7).jpg (discussion)

Commons files used on this page have been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons files used on this page have been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 23:22, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
 * AK-12 final.jpg
 * AK-200.jpg