Talk:Aaliyah/Archive 2

Details of her death?
There is virtually no mention of her death in this article. Even the birth date area doesn't contain information about her death. 128.195.75.51 01:33, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

Did she really marry R Kelly?
I thought this was just a joke? Can anyone show a link that proves this? The Mayor 20:36, 7 April 2006 (UTC)

Ok well can any body actually prove it or not if so givez me a holla at rEcKoNiSe_Me@hotmail.com thanxz

She was married to him according to the marriage certificate but this marriage was hardly legal as she lied about her age on the certificate

NO SHE DID NOT MARRY HIM!!!!!! KJ —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.168.75.229 (talk) 20:13, 23 February 2008 (UTC)

The Matrix
It says something about her being in the Second and Third matrix movies... But doesn't mention that at all anywhere in the actual article, nor what part she played. I'm going to delete that, as I see no need for it. Otherwise, It's a bit sloppy. 216.250.13.84 18:53, 7 July 2006 (UTC)

See here, which lists all of her could-have-been film credits - including both of the later Matrix films. The only reason she wasn't in the Matrix movies was apparently due to fact that, well, she died.

A6
When did she hit an A6

point of view
does any one else think that the article fails to demonstrate a nutural point of view? There seems to be an awful lot of adjectives rather than fact. i've tweaked the article slightly i trust everyone is ok with this.

I Think so as well, I am a big fan but someone needs to re-do this whole article all over again and make it better.

''' I totally agree. As it stands it's a disgrace to her memory, it's like a bunch of facts, triva and opinions thrown together to recreate who she was - it's really poorly done. ''' 124.182.118.132 20:04, 30 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I have tried to remove a lot of the stuff that shouldn't be in it. John Hayestalk 14:14, 8 July 2007 (UTC)
 * I've made a change in one of the sections that required a citation. It turns out that the sentence was not neutral, thus I removed it. This may qualify it to be placed out of Citation needed status for the entire article Ishmael Rufus (talk) 18:01, 7 December 2007 (UTC)

Question moved from article page
Why was she in a hurry to get back to Florida? Her pilot had a questionble record. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 72.229.141.10 (talk • contribs).


 * That statement and that question are two very different issues, actually. First - I'm guessing that the record company (or whoever) did not not realize that the pilot was so questionable; after all, he misreported his flight training to get his jobs, and the job he was fired from he was only fired from a few hours before the flight commenced, which they very easily could not have found out about in time. It basically sounds like he may have just lied like a rug for most of his career as a pilot, really - I'm guessing he made no exceptions when it came to doing so to clients. Also, contrary to initial reports, Aaliyah and her fellow passengers were apparently NOT informed of any potential issues with the bagged being overweight, which contributed to the crash.


 * As for "why was she in a hurry to get back", she was apparently very busy at the time, it was probably just a scheduling thing. You'll find that while an artist may sometimes have a lot of sway about their schedules, though, they usually are NOT the ones who make their own travel arrangements, so Aaliyah wouldn't have been the one who took care of that, let alone chose the pilot. And she certainly might not have realized anything about the luggage being too much weight for the plane to take, something nobody informed the passengers of, despite the fact that judging from quotes that came afterward, there's no way any sane pilot would allow that much luggage weight to be taken on at the same time as that many passengers. - (User:Runa27, not logged in)

YouTube links
This article is one of thousands on Wikipedia that have a link to YouTube in it. Based on the External links policy, most of these should probably be removed. I'm putting this message here, on this talk page, to request the regular editors take a look at the link and make sure it doesn't violate policy. In short: 1. 99% of the time YouTube should not be used as a source. 2. We must not link to material that violates someones copyright. If you are not sure if the link on this article should be removed, feel free to ask me on my talk page and I'll review it personally. Thanks. ---J.S (t|c) 07:16, 7 November 2006 (UTC)

Posthumous UK #1
Contrary to this article, I thought the first artist to achieve a posthumous UK #1 single was Buddy Holly in 1959 with "It Doesn't Matter Anymore". Can anyone confirm this? 192.91.191.29 11:05, 7 November 2006 (UTC)


 * Confirmed.

That is no fair my cousin loved aleyah and look what happend. Iv'e got neve.

'Fair use' of album covers
The album cover fair use template clearly states,
 * "This image is of a cover of an audio recording, and the copyright for it is most likely owned by either the publisher of the album or the artist(s) which produced the recording or cover artwork in question. It is believed that the use of low-resolution images of such covers
 * solely to illustrate the audio recording in question,
 * on the English-language Wikipedia, hosted on servers in the United States by the non-profit Wikimedia Foundation, qualifies as fair use under United States copyright law.
 * Any other uses of this image, on Wikipedia or elsewhere, may be copyright infringement. See Wikipedia:Fair use for more information."

'Fair use' of album covers does not extend to use of such images to identify a performer or illustrate an article about a performer. For more information on 'fair use', please see the policy at Fair use. -- Donald Albury 18:34, 29 December 2006 (UTC)

Unsourced statements - stick to the facts please.
There are a number of unsourced statements tagged as citation needed. Some of these are worded as subjective statements, which have no place in an objective encyclopedia. Even worse, there are subjective statements written as if they are objective facts. Please find sources and reword as appropriate, or remove the statements which cannot be sourced. - Stephanie Daugherty (Triona) - Talk - Comment - 15:16, 17 February 2007 (UTC)

Singles Chart Positions
I highly doubt that Try Again reached #1 in every country, could someone please try to find her real chart data? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 69.157.184.66 (talk) 14:27, 25 February 2007 (UTC).

Excess image
What can we do with this image? QuasyBoy 15:30, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

Not True
aaliyah did not reach number 1 in the uk 4 or 5 times - FACT, she reached number 1 with more than a woman and thats it!!!! sum1 fix it??? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 82.40.19.24 (talk • contribs).
 * Thank you for your suggestion! When you feel an article needs improvement, please feel free to make those changes. Wikipedia is a wiki, so anyone can edit almost any article by simply following the  link at the top. You don't even need to log in (although there are many reasons why you might want to).  The Wikipedia community encourages you to be bold in updating pages. Don't worry too much about making honest mistakes — they're likely to be found and corrected quickly. If you're not sure how editing works, check out how to edit a page, or use the sandbox to try out your editing skills.  New contributors are always welcome.  --ElKevbo 17:20, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

Fixed this in accordance with. However, various other information from the same table looks suspicious in my opinion. Cloudz679 04:01, 10 March 2007 (UTC)

Damon Dash
Why doesn't this page say anything about Aaliyah's relationship with Damon Dash? According to Dash's page here at Wikipedia he was engaged to her until her death. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 15.203.137.72 (talk) 07:15, 10 April 2007 (UTC).

First Posthumous Number 1 in UK?
I removed the sentence that stated this. Seven people had done it prior to Aaliyah: Buddy Holly (1959), Jim Reeves (1966), Jimi Hendrix (1970), Elvis Presley (1977), John Lennon (3 times in 1980-81), Jackie Wilson (1986), Freddie Mercury (with Queen 1991 and solo 1993).

Trivia section
I removed the quotes section that was added without an edit summary. The trivia section is overloaded with information that doesn't seem too encyclopedic. Some of it is just a repeat of information already in the article. Is it possible to trim it down or eliminate it. Seeking a concensus.--John Lake 18:29, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

The Aaliyah Article
The Article of the beloved Aaliyah should be left up to AALIYAH.COM because there is too much vandalizing and false rumors, statements, etc. She is The Queen of Urban Pop and The Princess of Hip-Hop Soul. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 141.155.140.150 (talk) 00:46, 17 June, 2007
 * Any article on Wikipedia can be edited by anyone. You cannot restrict access to that website only. There are established practices on how to combat vandalism. John Hayestalk 12:41, 20 June 2007 (UTC)

'''The whole article needs to be rewritten. As it stands, it's messy and poorly written. The entry should be written like a timeline i.e Birth, Rise to fame, Marriage, Music releases, death; like a time line. I have to say this is one of the hardest-to-follow entries I've read. There is dismal mention of her actual death, her marriage or her life. Most of the page is consumed by every tiny detail about her albums/singles - it's excessive and not necessary. There doesn't need to be a picture of every album or single either. ''' 124.182.118.132 19:59, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

Lyrical Dedications
I think it's important to note that there has been many a lyrical dedication to Aaliyah but why the need to list every artist and every lyric about her? Personally I find that it makes the article look messy. Does anyone have any suggestions about how to shorten it, or better yet completely re-edit that section? 124.182.118.132 19:48, 2 July 2007 (UTC)
 * I would suggest to completely remove it. None of these are sourced, this can never be a complete list, and really isn't encylopeadic, or relevant to an article on Aaliyah. One line in another section to note that there had been lyrical dedications would do John Hayestalk 12:22, 6 July 2007 (UTC)
 * As no-one has objected tou our suggestion I will remove it. John Hayestalk 13:55, 8 July 2007 (UTC)

I don't see the problem with adding a "Fans" section
When her fans meant so much to her and everybody keeps on reverting the changes I have made. This is Aaliyah's page not yours. I am adding these facts I got from her official website but people keep reverting them. She loved her fans and they should be recognized. From the information I have, Krystal R. G. Is her biggest fan. I love Aaliyah also and would like to respect her by telling the truth. People keep deleting it like I am lying. Watch some of her YouTube videos or go on her official website and you will see. I don't think its fair that you all keep fighting the "Fans" like its the plague. She considers us her extended family. If this page isn't going to represent AALIYAH, it should be deleted. I'm going to fight until it does!!!! Have a nice day —Preceding unsigned comment added by Aaliyahsnumber1fan (talk • contribs) 12:34, July 15, 2007
 * Please review the core policies that guide and govern articles and content in this encyclopedia, particularly verifiability, neutral point of view, and our prohibition against original research. Your additions seem, to me, to violate all three of those policies.  Please remember that this is an encyclopedia article, not a fan page.
 * In addition, please remember to add new comments to the bottom of Talk pages and sign your posts. --ElKevbo 16:45, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

I understand all that but if you were a HARDCORE fan of Aaliyah, then you would know how much she loved her fans and how much we meant to her. If you are going to have and article on Aaliyah about her life and times, then ALL of her should be included. There is no excuse. I have proof that Krystal is her biggest fan. There is a link on Aaliyah's official website. Aaliyah would have wanted her fans to be in this article. I know that this is not a fan page but once again if you are going to make an article on Aaliyah her fans must be included. Whether you think it is proper or not, the fact is, Aaliyah would not have been famous without the support of her fans. So when you keep skipping over the fact that her fans were a key factor in her success, you are not telling the whole story. A part of the reason her name is still around is her fans.

Have a nice day (Aaliyahsnumber1fan 17:46, 15 July 2007 (UTC))
 * On Wikipedia we don't write for a "HARDCORE fan of Aaliyah", but for people who, we have to assume, know nothing about the subject and want to learn about it. John Hayestalk 19:46, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

That has been made obvious by the number of reverts...haha...=)...cool

(Aaliyahsnumber1fan 17:36, 16 July 2007 (UTC))

This is wikipedia, not imaaliyahsbiggestfan4ever. I'm quoting you when you say "this is Aaliyah's page not yours", it is and as such it is not a fansite. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 139.168.208.246 (talk) 16:08, July 19, 2007

Thanks for quoting me but now I'm going to quote myself: "That has been made obvious by the number of reverts...haha...=)...cool"

"it is and as such it is not a fansite." Never said it was, I just made a suggestion for a fans section and not a fan article so that comment was not needed. If I thought it was a fansite I would have made and article called "Aaliyah's Fans" but I never did that.

"This is wikipedia, not imaaliyahsbiggestfan4ever."

Oops, my mistake. You see I can't read so I didn't know that. Thanks for pointing that out "Anonymous" O_o. Anyway, I know that and its been mentioned before, why did you feel the need to mention it again? [oneLOVE]

(Aaliyahsnumber1fan 11:42, 2 September 2007 (UTC))

Discography and Music
The 'Music Section' is scattered with information that is already contained within the Discography lower down on the page. Does anyone think the articles presentation would appear neater if all the random numbers were removed from the 'Music' section but remained in the 'Discography'? Perhaps in the Music section it could be noted that certain songs became number one, but I feel it's unecesary for there to be so many numbers within those sections when it's clearly listed in the 'Discography'. Myoutbackshed 20:49, 20 July 2007 (UTC)
 * Yes, I agree. John Hayestalk 17:20, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

Personal life
What about the marriage to R. Kelly ? Other relationships ? -- Beardo 04:43, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

Great point.

Even when the 'alleged' relationship with R.Kelly is put into the wikipedia entry, Aaliyah's fans (who are clearly not demonstrating a NPOV) delete the entry. There have been many occasions where the information was sourced - but yet it was still deleted. Go figure. A point has also been raised that Aaliyah was engaged up until her death, yet no mention of that either! Myoutbackshed 17:09, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

Name etymology--sources please
Can we get some source on her name's etymology for the article? If Aaliyah said that her name was of Arabic origin, in which interview was it? Robert K S 17:22, 31 August 2007 (UTC)
 * There have been countless times when Aaliyah mentioned that her name is of Arabic orgin. There is an interview on her "I Care 4 U" special edition DVD where she says it. You can look up the name "Aaliyah" or "Aliyah" on GOOGLE and it will show you that her name is of Arabic orgin. You could even go to Ask.com and find that out. (Aaliyahsnumber1fan 11:28, 2 September 2007 (UTC)) [P E A C E out]
 * That is WP:OR we need a properly cited source. John Hayestalk 12:25, 2 September 2007 (UTC)

So common knowledge..learn to use Google! It's really not that hard! —Preceding unsigned comment added by Raaliyahent01 (talk • contribs) 05:56, 17 February 2008 (UTC)

i think thet ppl should put how she died in here!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.170.12.106 (talk) 23:35, 10 September 2007 (UTC)

NavBox
Should it be change to suit the new standard one. Caribbean1 13:55, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

"Designed to fly over their rated weight limit?"
Tagged this statement: "Planes are designed to fly significantly over their rated weight limit..." Then why is it called a "limit"? The NTSB report that is cited states that "...the total gross weight of the airplane was substantially exceeded." This appears to be a contributing factor to the crash, not something that is allowable. The other factor, as the article states, is that "... the center of gravity was significantly outside the flight envelope past the aft center of gravity." I. e., weight too far to the rear. If there is not a source for the statement about planes being designed to fly above their rated weight limit, that part should be removed and changed to reflect the report. I'm waiting to make that change in case the editor who made this statement has some support for it. Unimaginative Username 04:51, 16 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Changed. Unimaginative Username (talk) 01:44, 20 November 2007 (UTC)

Death
Question, if I may - the article, under "Death" states that:

"She died at 6:50 PM and was also born at 6:50 PM"

Aaliyah death Cleared up?
I fixed the death section the thing is it is unclear weather the plane took of at 6:45 or 6:50 this is odd because since she died at 6:50 how can the plane rise 70m up and fall in a minute? It might of happened but it is still unclear. I find it shocking and wierd that she died the same time she was born....Also I have herd that she didnt die of her injuries but of severe shock. Is any truth to this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Soulja nyn3 (talk • contribs) 22:33, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

The "official" time is 6:59 p.m. (Bahamian time) Check out Aaliyah.com it is in the opening sentence. (9:54 pm)