Talk:Ace Gutowsky

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 * Added archive http://www.webcitation.org/6Kr0Xep5i?url=http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/det/1960.htm to http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/det/1960.htm
 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20141021163618/http://www.acbl.org/nabc/2013/03/bulletins/db3.pdf to http://www.acbl.org/nabc/2013/03/bulletins/db3.pdf
 * Added archive http://www.webcitation.org/6Kr0Xep5i?url=http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/det/1960.htm to http://www.pro-football-reference.com/teams/det/1960.htm

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Leroy Gutowsky was not born in Russia
I'm afraid that all the stuff in the article about Leroy Gutowsky being born in Russia is wrong, and the result of confusing Leroy (Ace) Gutowsky with his father, Assaph (Ace) Gutowsky, a famous oil wildcatter. It was the father, Ace Gutowsky pere who came from Russia in 1902. Ace Gutowsky fils was born in Oklahoma. I will be changing the article and providing documentation. Plazak (talk) 01:10, 5 August 2017 (UTC)

Well, I underestimated the widespread nature of the error. Newspaper articles and websites seem unanimous in saying that Leroy was born in Russia. But if you look at the basic documents (census sheets, naturalization documents for Assaph, Leroy's Army enlistment document) available on the Family Search website, it becomes clear that Leroy was born in Oklahoma, and that his Russian birth is a complete myth, no doubt based on confusion with his father, who was also known as Ace Gutowsky. But this seems too much like original research for me to add the paragraph below to the article. Thoughts? Plazak (talk) 18:26, 5 August 2017 (UTC)


 * Leroy Gutowsky’s father was famous oil wildcatter Assaph Gutowsky. They were both commonly known as “Ace” Gutowsky. Assaph “Ace” Gutowsky was born in the Ukraine, then part of the Russian Empire in 1886, and came to the United States in 1902. Many newspaper and other sources also give the birthplace of Leroy “Ace” Gutowsky (born 1909) as “Russia,” or “Russian empire.” However, US Census data (1920 and 1940), as well as Leroy Gutowsky’s Army enlistment record, relate that he was born in Oklahoma, and that his mother was born in Minnesota.

Rushing record
The claim that he broke Cliff Battles' rushing record is an interesting one. What a Game They Played says Gutowski broke it at 3,399, but PFR says Gutowski only had 3,279 in his career. But even with this higher total, it still doesn't eclipse Battles' total of 3,511. The PFHOF doesn't have Gutowsky in its list of historical rushing record holders. What exactly do the NYT and LAT sources in the article say? Lizard (talk) 17:08, 28 October 2017 (UTC)
 * I don't have a NYT subscription any longer, but I added a link to the Los Angeles Times article. Also, there was pretty wide reportage on Gutowsky breaking Battles' record at the time.  Pretty much every newspaper in the country ran the story.  See, e.g., here, here, here, here. It is odd that Pro-Football-Reference.com reflects different figures that were apparently being compiled at the time. Cbl62 (talk) 18:07, 28 October 2017 (UTC)