Talk:Acid ash hypothesis

Essay tag
I've removed the essay tag because there's nothing in this that reads like a personal reflection. If anyone disputes this, please explain. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants  Tell me all about it.  16:32, 31 August 2017 (UTC)

Ditto for the link tag; I count 17 wikilinks in this article. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants  Tell me all about it.  16:36, 31 August 2017 (UTC)

Copy-edit tag & neutral phrasing
Hi MPants, you seem to be working on this page at the moment so I thought I'd suggest my edit to you rather than make it myself: The copy-edit tag should be removed, and perhaps replaced by a tag for links leading to this page. The only writing issue I can see is that, in the main section, "resulting in the fad diet known as the Alkaline diet" should be reworded in a more neutral way. I suggest: "...in the lay community, and had been used to support Alkaline diets." Marga at IWAP (talk) 09:01, 1 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Thanks for that. I think I will take your suggestion. Someone seemed to tag-bomb the page right after it was created, the other two tag they added (essay and links out) were clearly inappropriate, so I removed those. But grammar can be somewhat subjective, so I left that one up. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants   Tell me all about it.  12:50, 1 September 2017 (UTC)

fringe
As far as I can tell this is a "legitimate fringe" hypothesis in that it's a real science, but with a very low level of acceptance. I think the article needs to be clear on that, but I'm having trouble finding sources (maybe I'm wrong, but most of the primary papers I find are pretty negative of it). , perhaps you may have some insight into this. I've also alerted to this page, and he is also good at digging up MEDRS sources. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants  Tell me all about it.  12:58, 1 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Would need to research matters. Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 12:59, 1 September 2017 (UTC)

Potentially useful info and references
I would like to participate in working on the article, but have Conflict Of Interest (client product). Below some thoughts and references that may be useful. David notMD (talk) 15:23, 1 September 2017 (UTC)
 * Not being an expert in biochemistry, I'm unable to quickly evaluate this information. Of course, we cannot include original research, even when that research is based on information within reliable sources. I do agree that this article could stand to be expanded somewhat. Some of the references you gave could be useful.
 * Thank you, by the way, for disclosing your COI on this. It is refreshing to see an editor approach a subject with an immediate exercise in honesty. Note that a COI should not stop you from engaging here, but rather should encourage you to seek consensus for any changes to the article, and to request that another editor make such changes when the consensus emerges. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants   Tell me all about it.  15:56, 1 September 2017 (UTC)

Information
The term 'pH' is a measure of hydrogen ion (H+) concentration. Neutral pH is defined as 7.0. Pure water has a neutral pH. Values below 7.0 are acidic. Values above 7.0 are alkaline or basic. Urine usually has a pH of 6.0; black coffee, 5.0; stomach acid, 1.0 to 3.0. The scale is not linear - something with a pH of 5.0 is ten times more acidic than something else with a pH of 6.0.

In good health, the acid:base balance of the plasma component of blood, referred to as its pH value is, is tightly managed to stay within the range of 7.35 to 7.45, making it slightly alkaline (the opposite of acidic). There is a good exchange between blood and tissues, so plasma values are indicative of the entire body's status. Plasma pH is tightly regulated. If there is an excess of acid the involuntary breathing response is to increase the breathing rate, and by this, exhale carbon dioxide. Low CO2 in the blood causes the excess H+ to combine with HCO-3 to form H2CO3 and from that to CO2 and H2O. Thus, breathing faster or deeper breaths gets rid of acid!

The kidneys also compensate for plasma that is too acidic or too basic. For acidosis, excretion of ammonium is increased, resulting in acidic (low pH) urine. For alkalosis, excretion of bicarbonate (HCO-3) is increased, resulting in alkaline (high pH) urine. This compensation system is slower to adapt than changing breath rate, i.e., it takes days, but has a greater reserve capacity than just change of breathing. The kidneys' capacity to excrete excess acid declines with age, and is also decreased if kidney disease is present. In theory, slightly alkaline urine signifies a slight excess of alkaline compounds throughout the body.

Plasma that has a pH below 7.35 is too acidic, resulting in a condition called acidosis. Plasma pH is measured as part of testing called arterial blood gases. Common causes for acidic plasma: A) retention of carbon dioxide (for example: chronic obstructive lung disease), B) loss of bicarbonate in feces (for example: severe diarrhea) C) consumption of too much acid from food. A diet high in animal-derived protein and low in carbohydrates will be acidic.

In theory, symptoms associated with acute acidosis include: Confusion, fatigue, Lethargy, Shortness of breath, Sleepiness, Arrhythmia In theory, consequences of chronic acidosis include: Muscle breakdown, Bone damage, Inflammation, Kidney damage, Increased risk of death

THE PROBLEM, of course, is that none of these symptoms are specific to acidosis! And healthy people always get rid of excess acid by breathing and urinating. And acidic urine is a sign that the body is succeeding in getting rid of acid - it is NOT necessarily a biomarker of illness or risk of illness.

Bruno CM, Valenti M. Acid-base disorders in patients with chronic obstructive pulmonary disease: a pathophysiological review. J Biomed Biotechnol2012;2012:915150.
 * REFERENCES (some already used in the article)

Kraut JA, Madias NE. Consequences and therapy of the metabolic acidosis of chronic kidney disease. Pediatr Nephrol 2011;26(1):19-28.

Kraut JA, Madias NE. Metabolic acidosis: pathophysiology, diagnosis and management. Nat Rev Nephrol 2010;6(5):274-285.

Yaqoob MM. Acidosis and progression of chronic kidney disease. Curr Opin Nephrol Hypertens 2010;19(5):489-492.

Remer T. Influence of diet on acid-base balance. Semin Dial 2000;13(4):221-226.

Schwalfenberg GK. The alkaline diet: is there evidence that an alkaline pH diet benefits health? J Environ Public Health 2012;2012:727630.

Frassetto L, Morris RC Jr, et al. Diet, evolution and aging--the pathophysiologic effects of the post-agricultural inversion of the potassium-to-sodium and base-to-chloride ratios in the human diet. Eur J Nutr 2001;40(5):200-213.

Fenton TR, Lyon AW. Milk and acid-base balance: proposed hypothesis versus scientific evidence. J Am Coll Nutr. 2011 Oct;30(5 Suppl 1):471S-475S.

Fenton TR, Tough SC, et al. Causal assessment of dietary acid load and bone disease: a systematic review & meta-analysis applying Hill's epidemiologic criteria for causality. Nutr J. 2011;10:41.

Fenton TR, Eliasziw M, et al. Low urine pH and acid excretion do not predict bone fractures or the loss of bone mineral density: a prospective cohort study. BMC Musculoskelet Disord. 2010;11:88.

Fenton TR, Lyon AW, et al. Meta-analysis of the effect of the acid-ash hypothesis of osteoporosis on calcium balance. J Bone Miner Res. 2009;24(11):1835-40.

Bonjour JP. Nutritional disturbance in acid-base balance and osteoporosis: a hypothesis that disregards the essential homeostatic role of the kidney. Br J Nutr 2013;110:1168-77.

Kanbara A, Miura Y, Hyogo H, Chayama K, Seyama I. Effect of urine pH changed by dietary intervention on uric acid clearance mechanism of pH-dependent excretion of urinary uric acid. Nutr J 2012;11:39.

So who can please explain to a clearer understanding the Henderson-Hasselbalch equation
ASAP because I am in high school the 9th grade thx Shadey bella (talk) 21:02, 2 February 2018 (UTC)
 * You would do better to ask this sort of question at the Reference desk. These article talk pages are reserved for discussing changes to the article, and are not a general forum for discussion about the subject.
 * However, since you are new I don't mind humoring you: I can't explain it because I'm not an expert in biochemistry, but we have an article on it. See Henderson–Hasselbalch equation. ᛗᛁᛟᛚᚾᛁᚱPants   Tell me all about it.  21:13, 2 February 2018 (UTC)

Addition of Open Access Source
I am a co-author of the Lambert paper referenced. I have added an Open Access source of the paper--our 'authors accepted' version of the paper that is available through the University of Leed's (my institution) repository; called the White Rose Repository. --JBernadetteMoore (talk) 10:50, 1 October 2019 (UTC)