Talk:Advanced Placement

comparison to other similar programs
Shouldn't there be a comparison with other similar programs, like International Baccalaureate - which is more widely offered internationally? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 104.246.134.118 (talk) 22:32, 24 March 2019 (UTC)

NPOV
needs a neutral point of view as this article is almost an advertisement.

Agreed. What is a "trained Reader" what is a "chief Reader"? No where is it mentioned that these are, apparently, themselves teachers of AP courses! How is the conflict of interest handled for AP teachers in a school grading each other's students' exams?

As for the AP teachers, how are they rewarded for 5, 4, 3 students? How do these rewards vary by state, county (in the US), or internationally? Why has this been kept secret for so long?

What credentials are necessary to be a "trained Reader"? How are they recruited? How is the Chief Reader recruited? Also, who assigns teachers to teach AP classes, College Board or the local high school principal, or the local Board of Education? How much are they paid, or do they donate their time for training and grading? What other rewards or incentives are operative?

In regards to the "trained reader" and "chief reader", teachers are not allowed to fill this role. According to some of the AP literature I've read, teachers are not allowed to be anywhere near the testing site. Also, as I have taken AP exams (as a student) for the past three years, I can state from personal experience that a teacher has never administered the exam. Generally, several people from the local board of education attend trainings to become certified readers.

As for who recruits the teachers to teach the AP courses, it is often the teacher who volunteers. Occasionally, the principal or board of education will request that a teacher teach the AP course—but this is rare (in my experience). They recieve no bonus for teaching the course, other than the satisfaction of students passing or the disappointment of students failing. Also, the teacher's performance dictates their chances of teaching a future AP course. Some school boards will pay for the AP training, but some don't. Jf1357 (talk) 23:33, 21 July 2011 (UTC)

This is Sparta
I think that the This Is Sparta thing should be included. It's a part of the history, and many thousands of people took part in it. —Preceding unsigned


 * UnsignedIP -->

Agreed. I'll add it. --98.217.61.141 (talk) 04:31, 21 February 2009 (UTC)

UPDATE:  Hey! It's 2019, and it seems that this was removed for some reason. I was going to add it, but there isn't a section for it. Perhaps it could be something like "In Popular Culture?" And in case anyone was wondering, here's a link (cached, orginal seems to have gone down) going over the details of this incident or viral meme or whatever: https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:pTV8fJJuYDEJ:https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/this-is-sparta-300_us_58c05eaae4b0ed718269740b+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=in

User:Cool12y

Perhaps a rework, for a bit?
I would like to rework this article a bit--as a high school student, I'm pretty familiar with the program and feel that the current article could use a little cleaning-up. Good idea, bad idea?

Lemme know.

--c koski 0 2 29:20, 23 Aug 2005, EDT


 * Go for it, IMO this article needs major work. The list of courses also needs to be brought up to date.

--Gpyoung talk 02:23, 1 September 2005 (UTC)

Tlaktan

 * Chinese Language

Chinese was recently added. --Tlaktan 05:00, 5 May 2005 (UTC)

Unclear Passage
Under "AP Scholar Designations" there is a passage reading: ''"All AP exams taken" refers to all AP exams taken in any year. It is not restricted to the year the award is issued in.'' Does this mean that the award is issued to students that, say, took two AP classes in their Junior year, one in their Senior year and were given the award in their Senior year; or to students who took three in their Junior year and were given the award in their Senior year?

APs not AP's
It is incorrect grammar to write of plural exams as "AP's". The  construction is for indicating a noun's possession, such as "Harvard's students". Correct usage is "APs". See the book, 'Fowler's Modern English Usage.' ISBN: 0198610211 Dogru144 14:51, 28 August 2006 (UTC)
 * (Except for "its" (it's = it is) ; )   -lifeform (talk) 00:59, 11 October 2014 (UTC)

courses and scores
If you take 2 AP courses in your junior year and 1 in your senior year, you will receive the award if your scores are high enough. You also will receive the reward if you take all 3 AP courses in your junior year. This is not the problem, though, that the statement was addressing. It was addressing the problem of a student who takes maybe 3 AP classes junior year and receives all 1s. Then, takes 3 more senior year and receives all 4s. Since their average is only a 2.5, they can not receive the award. --chocolateluvr88 11:08, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

I'm not sure where to put this, but the comment about bell curves in the article is inaccurate. At least as far as the AP Calculus exam goes, it's not so much that the AP scores are scored to compare students across the nation with each other, but more that the grades on the exam are comparable from one year to the next. So the idea is that a student who scores a 5 during one year is very likely to score a 5 on any other version of the exam. 67.183.171.245 (talk) 01:10, 20 February 2008 (UTC)MathGuy

In response to the bell curve claim, it is true that the AP exams are normed to an approximately bell-shaped curve. According to a textbook published by the AP Academy (I think that's its name) for AP Statistics students, it outlines the process used to score the AP exams—a process that results in a normal distribution of scores Jf1357 (talk) 23:37, 21 July 2011 (UTC)

Cost?
I'd like to add a bit about the exorbitant fees charged by ETS/TCB for the tests. Grumbling over the $82/test cost has gotten quite loud lately, with some schools considering decertifying AP classes in protest of the fees. Thoughts? Rusty 23:31, 9 March 2006 (UTC)
 * My school had us bring the $82 checks, a week later they gave them back and had us bring in $22. They said something big was happening with the A.P. association or something, but would not tell us more. I'm guessing it was the school or state reembursing the students taking the test, but you never know?

Um, has anyone seen the very last link? There is some innappropriate material, that must be removed or re-linked. We needs some admins to lock this up soon because im sure there is going to be more vandolism. Also, the link to the Computer Science A test needs to be removed. (No article)

after reading the article I can only think 'So What!?!'
The percentage of AP students that receive college credit, and AP Scholar recognition (even per category) would answer my question (see headline). I hope I remember to look for this info some time. Then, I'll add it myself. If you know or are bored...

Page Blanking
Recently I noticed that many pages about the individual APs were blanked and therefore nonexistent. Is there something going on here? Physicq210 00:59, 17 May 2006 (UTC)

I feel like someone need to add specific scores to score 1-5 scales on the test.

Examplify: 50+ Correct on Multiple choice and at least 7 on essay to score 5 on World History. 30+ correct on multiple choice and at least 6 on essay to score 3 or above.

etc...

That would help a LOT!


 * It's not that specific. --Zagsa 00:07, 1 July 2006 (UTC)
 * It's so definitely not specific and varies each year for each exam. It's supposed to be a bit of a bell curve, but not completely. My AP World teacher is an AP test grader and she explained it. It's quite complicated, and isn't likely to be the same from year to year, even for the same test. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.32.90.247 (talk) 23:08, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

Notable Alumni?
I just removed this text from the page that was inserted into the middle of the International Diploma section:

Judd Apatow Alan Blinder- Economist Elaine Chao - 24th U.S. Secretary of Labor Brenda Howard Idina Menzel- Actress Adam Pascal- Actor Natalie Portman-Actress Sibel Ergener- Actress Meg Wolitzer-Novelist Ed Newman- NFL Player Michael Isikoff- Newsweek journalist George Drakoulias- Music Producer Bryan Koniecko- Professional tennis player Jared Binder

I didn't see any source cited and from the text it wasn't clear what these people were alumni of. Are these simply famous people that have taken AP tests? A complete list of notable people who took AP exams would probably be 1,000s of lines long and I don't think it's really that interesting for this article... &mdash;Jnk [ talk ] 13:27, 27 May 2006 (UTC)
 * Agreed. -SocratesJedi | Talk 20:38, 28 May 2006 (UTC)

AP template stub
How do you guys like my AP template stub? ^o^ 20:04, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

It's nice, but it seems ironic that the main page of the AP program is a stub itself. --Physicq210 23:28, 1 June 2006 (UTC)

It would not have been a stub had most of the material been delated during June, which I believe was done to clean up the page but went way too far. User:Lord_Hawk 17:28, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

Is it still I stub? Doesn't seem to be so to me. --Wslack 01:51, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

Updating
There's some good information at collegeboard that really helps to update the pages. I've updated French Language so far. --Zagsa 00:47, 1 July 2006 (UTC)


 * That's mostly where all I get my information from. --GoOdCoNtEnT 03:33, 10 July 2006 (UTC)

Grade Point Average incentive
Students taking Advanced Placement classes receive an extra grade point in the calculation of their grade point averages (GPA's). A GPA is the average of all grades a student has had over a certain number of classes. Historically, GPA's used the following numerical values: A = 4.0, A- = 3.7, B + = 3.3, B = 3.0, and so on down to F = 0.0. Thus, a student receiving all A's in high school, using this value system, would have a 4.0 high school GPA.

Advanced Placement classes add an extra 1.0 to each value, so that an A is worth 5.0, a B is worth 4.0, and so on. Presumably, the reasoning behind this was to reflect the increased difficult of Advanced Placement courses as compared to regular courses. For example, a student who could easily obtain an A (4.0) in a regular math class, might only obtain B (3.0) in a college level Advanced Placement Calculus class. This student could be the brightest at his or her school, but could end up with a mediocre GPA because of taking numerous Advanced Placement courses. The lower GPA could have implications for college admissions. Thus, bright students could be deterred from attempting to take Advanced Placement courses without a GPA incentive.

The GPA incentive has altered what the highest attainable GPA is for a high school graduate. Before GPA incentives were introduced, a 4.0 GPA was the highest attainable GPA for any high school graduate, reflecting straight A's in all high school classes. With GPA incentives, students receiving some B's or even C's could still graduate with a GPA over 4.0 if they have taken enough classes with GPA incentives.

The GPA incentive also creates a disincentive for students to take non-Advanced Placement courses, which may have an effect as more Advanced Placement courses are offered which are elective in nature. Due to GPA incentives, the determination of who is class valedictorian (highest GPA) or class salutorian (second highest GPA) will depend more than ever on class selection. Students who want any realistic chance at being declared valedictorian or salutorian must take a competitive number of Advanced Placement courses. Presumably, the net effect is that top students will display less diversity in their selection of elective courses, tending rather to cluster around those electives that offer GPA incentives.

Another impact of GPA incentives is that there is no longer any objective "highest attainable GPA" for a high school graduate. The highest possible GPA at any particular high school now depends on exactly how many non-redundant Advanced Placement courses that high school offers (redundant Advanced Placement courses are those that, for whatever reason, cannot both be taken by the same student). The most affluent high schools could offer over a dozen Advanced Placement courses, leading to GPA's for graduating seniors in excess of 4.5. However, high schools with more limited resources might offer a handful or less Advanced Placement courses. Some high schools may offer none at all. The result is that college admissions personnel must weigh an incoming student's GPA in light of the number of Advanced Placement courses offered by that student's high school, in order to avoid having an admissions system even more biased in favor of affluent high schools.

Somewhat illusrative of the societal factors that deter the proliferation of Advanced Placement courses in poorer schools, the 1988 film Stand and Deliver, starring Edward James Olmos and based on a true story, portrays an inner city math teacher who introduces an Advanced Placement calculus class to his students.


 * This isn't the case at every school. My school does not have weighted grades, thus earning an A in an AP class is the same as earning an A in a regular class.  Our GPA can not go any higher than 4.0.  The incentive comes in when you're applying for colleges and they see that you have taken AP, honors, and college courses, yet have still retained a high GPA, whereas they will frown on those who have not tried to take AP courses. Chickenflicker---♣ 15:25, 5 February 2007 (UTC)


 * I concur with Chickenflicker. Grade calculation differs from school to school. We don't get AP grade incentives, nor do we use the 4.0 GPA scale. Bluefruitbowl 20:02, 4 May 2007 (UTC)

Social Implications
Highly motivated, highly driven, highly compensated parents want their children to "succeed." Success is measured by making lots of money. Making lots of money generally implies advanced degrees from prestigious universities. Admissions to those places means being able to pay for tuition, room, board, and books, should the relatively minor detail of admission be disposed of. Admission to prestigious universities is generally restricted to "highly qualified" individuals, meaning those students who have already demonstrated an ability to take and pass examinations with astounding marks. Successful kids of successful parents must take Advanced Placement courses in High School so as to demonstrate to admissions committees their "love of learning." Actually, love of learning has nothing to do with it. The Advanced Placement courses go hand in hand with calculated participation in sports and community outreach programs that demonstrate some rich sixteen-year-old kid has the chops of a 40-year-old Republican lawyer insofaras perceptions are manipulated as a means to an end. Corruption is as corruption does. Let's paint a pretty picture. It may be clown art or felt Elvis, but it gets the job done. 70.108.163.128 14:07, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

The foregoing is some of the most poorly written sophomoric nonsense I have read in a long time. 74.105.162.62 (talk) 11:45, 2 February 2010 (UTC)kolef8874.105.162.62 (talk) 11:45, 2 February 2010 (UTC)


 * Well said. Paul Haymon 06:36, 7 September 2006 (UTC)
 * So why is something like this not in the article? I am against AP for a plethora of reasons and was expecting to find the for/against AP debate here, but it was not - did the College Board edit it out or something?


 * You people have to much time making up nonsense about an educational program. All the AP does is give you dual credit so you won't need to take a class in college that you already learned in high school. (12.218.46.67 03:37, 25 February 2007 (UTC))


 * I think we should mention that some schools add a point or two to you GPA (I say "ot two" because my school adds 1 point for honors classes and 2 points for AP classes, so I can get a maximum of a 6.0 GPA if I took all AP classes and a 5.0 if I took all honors classes)--Cadet hastings 15:01, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I agree with what 70.108.163.128 said on some points, and I see where s/he is coming from on the points I don't agree with. Still, I don't think we should put this in the article until a reliable 3rd party pro-con argument source is found (maybe OpposingViewpoints or something). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.32.90.247 (talk) 23:13, 16 April 2010 (UTC)

Merge Advanced Placement Scholar Awards into this article
A merger has been proposed to merge the article named above with this article. I think it would be beneficial as the one article by itself does not have enough content to warrant its own article. Any suggestions? --Willy No1lakersfan (Talk - Contribs) 13:16, 22 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Actually, we already have an article regarding AP awards: Advanced Placement Awards. You might want to merge it with that, or have the newer article speedily deleted as a duplicate. --210 physicq  ( c ) 17:41, 22 October 2006 (UTC)

More information needed
The article should answer the following questions:


 * Are AP courses taken during the last two years of high school or only during the final year?
 * Up to how many AP courses can be taken during a semester/school year?
 * What is the reputation, extent of recognition amongst universities, and academic rigour of the AP Program compared to the IB Diploma Programme, the French Baccalauréat, the Italian Maturitá, the Swiss Maturité, the German Abitur, and the British A-Levels?

-- WGee 07:14, 2 January 2007 (UTC)


 * AP courses can be taken any year of high school, and you can take as many as you want. One problem is that the exam schedule at the end of the year often schedules two exams to be taken at one time, and I'm pretty sure you can't take the exam at a different time than is scheduled. Chickenflicker---♣ 15:28, 5 February 2007 (UTC)

It is possible to take any combination of AP tests, there is an alternative day to take the "B" test (uasually about two weeks later) of any AP test for those who may have scheduling conflicts with other AP test or else or unable to take the "A" form on the regular exam date. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.197.82.143 (talk) 03:58, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

What about the AP Audit which may get rid of AP courses at High schools, or reduce them to nothing more than Advanced (course)?

As the AP article seems short compared to that of other tests of similarity like IB, A-Levels, and the such required for graduation in some places. I believe that more can indeed be added to this article. --71.106.235.51 23:22, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Advanced Placement Program vs. the International Baccalaureate
I just found a very interesting comparison of the AP and the IB programs. I think we should include these points and maybe organize them into a table (which I sadly cannot do). Please give your opinions. Thanks, (Eddie 03:50, 25 February 2007 (UTC))


 * Quentin Maire has out a new book that compares AP with IB, and their origins in terms of an overarching credential market theory --- if you are really interested in this topic. https://www.vu.edu.au/contact-us/quentin-maire
 * Regards! 50.4.132.185 (talk) 03:10, 20 January 2023 (UTC)

Advanced Placement Program vs. International Baccalaureate


 * Students can build up an AP profile over the course of several years. vs. Student are restricted to completing the IB diploma program during the final two years of school.
 * Students sit examinations as they complete the respective course. vs. Student write all examinations at the completion of the second year of the program.


 * Students can sample a wide variety of advanced courses. vs. Students must enroll in six two year courses, excluding other possible interests.


 * Each course combines breadth and depth in treating the subject. vs. Each course emphasizes depth of treatment, not breadth.


 * The flexibility of the AP program allows for additional boarding-school demands on student time. vs. The inflexibility of the IB program does not allow, or comes into conflict with, some boarding-school requirements.


 * Entrance to German universities requires 4 examinations in year-long AP subjects, one of which must be mathematics or science. vs. German universities require the entire IB diploma program plus four years of a second foreign language.


 * Austrian universities require 4 AP examinations in year-long subjects, one of which must be calculus. vs. Austrian universities require the entire IB diploma program.

--- New comment: To me this shows a clear bias in favor of the AP program. Could we make it more balanced? -SocratesJedi | Talk 08:18, 25 February 2007 (UTC)
 * British universities require three AP examinations. vs. British universities require the entire IB diploma program.


 * I agree about the bias; however, as far as I'm concerned, the information is correct. (Eddie 22:04, 25 February 2007 (UTC))


 * Unfortunately, the info is not correct. It states a fundamental misunderstanding of the Diploma Programme. Ther comparison is flawed on numerous levels including (but not exhausted by) the length of the IBD "course", the IBD emphasisises both intellectual rigour and breadth, (the borading school issue is irrelevant), entrance requirements are not correct to Universities nor are they fixed, British Universites do take students who have not fulfilled the entire Diploma. It misses the whole relevance of equivalencies, the grades/marks which must be obtained, CAS, World Lit, Extended Essay etc. A pointless comparison in many respects.


 * Can I add, BTW, that the opening remark of this article, "the Advanced Placement Program, commonly known as Advanced Placement, or AP, is a United States and Canada-based program that offers high school students the opportunity to receive university credit for their work during high school, as well as a standard measure of achievement in a particular course... " is incorrect in that it does not offer university credit in the vast majority non-US/Canadian Universities outside the US and Canada. In the UK, for example, successfully completeing the required number of APs with grades and after interviews, a successfully placed student will simply end up with no advanced placement on a "standard" 3 years hono(u)rs university degree. Candy 10:13, 1 April 2007 (UTC)


 * It's funny how easily these could be re-written to favor IB or at least be balanced. For example the perceived "benefit" of AP in that "Students can sample a wide variety of advanced courses. vs. Students must enroll in six two year courses, excluding other possible interests." is often seen as its drawback, as it means that IB students must be competent in every subject, while AP students are allowed to focus only on the subjects they are good at and ignore the others - and thus IB promotes being well-rounded while AP promotes "specializing" in a handful of subjects.

In addition, the stuff about inflexibility of time is untrue. The IB program is only inflexible in that it requires more work and the IB subjects are typically more demanding than their AP equivalents, but students and schools can easily squeeze in other activities with good time management. As an IB Diploma student I am able to take music lessons once a week, belong to multiple clubs at school and an orchestra outside of school, and still get decent grades. In addition, the CAS program requires that students have extracurricular interests. This list makes it seem as though IB students have to give up all their other interests in order to pursue the diploma, which is not true. Other aspects which are untrue: students are allowed to take IB courses before they reach their last two years of high school, and all exams are written at the end of each two-year course regardless of when the student took it. And the depth vs. breadth thing is debatable - my mom is an AP teacher and she says depth is not emphasized at all in AP. That's merely an opinion, you can't state that as fact. However I have been proposing that a discussion of the IB vs. AP debate be included on both this article and the International Baccalaureate one (as I think it is rather relevant, much more so than the attempts on the IB page to represent the fringe belief that IB is "un-American"), and so it would be good if someone could amend that list so it shoulds both the benefits and drawbacks of both programs and isn't slanted toward one or the other. Beggarsbanquet (talk) 09:11, 20 March 2008 (UTC)

Unclear Statement
Can someone clarify the statement under History, it seems we have a crimp in the time/space continuum (sp?): Until the 2005 ... $83 per set. (The exams rose in price, one dollar from $82 in 2006. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Linkinpark342 (talk • contribs) 02:08, 4 May 2007 (UTC).

Non Profit???
The Wikipedia article for College Board lists it as a for-profit company, but this article refers to it as non-profit. Anyone know which is right? --Phantom784 18:18, 5 May 2007 (UTC)
 * I thought that was wrong as well. I am going to change it to say that they are for profit and when someone has a source saying that they are not for profit you can revert it. I also plan on making some changes to the article. I'm not really good with wiki code so I may ask for some help when posting sources or formating and such--Cadet hastings 15:06, 16 May 2007 (UTC)


 * The college board article was just temporarily vandalized. The college board is totally not-for-profit.   --JayHenry 17:29, 16 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Well I know that the company that actually makes (not adminsters) the SAT is a for profit organization--Cadet hastings 13:02, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Cost
Recognizing that the $83 cost could be an impediment to students of limited means, a number of states and municipalities independent of the College Board have partially or fully subsidized the cost. For example, the Los Angeles Unified School District currently allows Advanced Placement students who enroll in the free school lunch program to take AP exams at the cost of $5.

Does anyone know of a reasonable explanation why a school might charge more than $83? At mine it was $90 or $95. — Emiellaiendiay 00:54, 27 June 2007 (UTC)


 * So I read the article more carefully and realized it included a reason: some schools raise the fee to cover proctor fees, it said, although uncited. — Emiellaiendiay 00:57, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

Scores Arriving By Mail
Is this really necessary? Can the article just mention this and link to the actual results? Do we really need to see them here? Also, how are these findings "startling?" They look utterly ordinary to me. Niffweed17, Destroyer of Chickens 20:36, 16 July 2007 (UTC)
 * I wonder if the data should be given any weight at all. It was the result of a discussion board survey. A great place to talk about the AP sure, but hardly the place to gather this kind of data. Many people in that very thread questioned the accuracy. I'm going to be bold and remove them.--YbborTalk 03:03, 17 July 2007 (UTC)

Cost again
The list of school districts that pay for students' tests may well not deserve inclusion in the article anyway. But as it is, it is inaccurate by omission of the list of states (five or six at the moment) that pay for their students' tests. To rectify it I have changed "Little Rock School District" to "the State of Arkansas." Every student in every public high school in Arkansas that takes an AP class will have the exam fee paid, and this is by the state's order (or more specifically the state supreme court). As an infrequent Wikipedian, my recommendation is to move the list to a separate article like "List of places that enitrely subsidize the cost of an AP test." It may not meet the bar for being encyclopedic information, but it is useful information and there are far sillier lists. 206.255.186.237 02:07, 9 September 2007 (UTC)
 * A user just removed the entire list. Inevitable, yes, but it would be nice to use something more specific/less redundant than "some". Any ideas? (see User:Tony1/How_to_satisfy_Criterion_1a) --Hebisddave 14:42, 1 October 2007 (UTC)

What's the purpose of it?
This article should somewhere explain the purpose of AP, for those not familiar with US high schools. "College level courses" seems to indicate courses at college level, but as high school is the step before college/university in the US, it doesn't make much sense offering such courses already in high school.

Or is it possibly advanced courses that may put US high school graduates on the same level as pre-university students in Europe, and thus enable them to apply for places at European universities? Some of the text as well as some of the comments on this talk page seem to indicate that.

Whatever the purpose, it needs to be explained in the beginning of the article. Thomas Blomberg (talk) 18:15, 18 September 2008 (UTC)


 * In addition to what Thomas Blomberg just mentioned, this article neglects to mention one thing: many colleges and universities have since barred AP classes towards counting on a student's transcript as "college equivalent". In reality, students will end up with a shorter (therefore useless) or longer course load either way in college, as many private and Ivy League colleges have since ruled out AP classes. I have no idea why it is not mentioned here, nor why the CollegeBoard keeps offering it toward American teenagers. 75.4.228.168 (talk) 03:38, 25 January 2010 (UTC)


 * However, it is also becoming common for states to force any public university to take AP credit. For instance, it is legally required in the state of Kentucky, for any public university to grant full credit for a score of 3 or above on any AP exam. Private schools are allowed to make their own rule about it. However, most private universities (in Kentucky) grant elective credit for the exams, but require a higher score (sometimes as high as a 5 in certain subjects at one private university in my area). Jf1357 (talk) 23:44, 21 July 2011 (UTC)

Bell-curve grading
I have added a dubious to this line. It has not been sourced, and from poking around at Google I am unconvinced that rank-based grading is universal for all AP courses. Any input on this is welcome. Sjakkalle (Check!)  10:17, 7 January 2009 (UTC)

I think the bell-curve sentence should be taken out. It doesn't make sense given the preceding paragraph, and the T charts given show little consistency between subjects or years.Aznfanatic (talk) 05:05, 22 April 2009 (UTC)


 * The grading is semi-bell-curved, in that the graders try to keep the distribution line vaguely like a bell-curve, but they don't completely grade on a curve. The percentage distribution of 1s, 2s, 3s, 4s and 5s changes every year, partly based on how many multiple choice questions correctly answered (as well as the guessing penalty--which is a complicated thing; I don't think I can properly explain it), partly based on the essay grade, and then partly based on total achievement on the test in comparison to the other test-takers. For example, say a large percent of people in Year A do really well on the test (not talking grade, talking about essay and multiple choice raw scores), fewer of the people who do well will get 5s. But if the people taking the test in Year B generally have bad raw scores, some of the people who did really bad on the test still might get 4s or 5s. My teacher, who's an AP grader, explained this to me.

must you be in high school?
this isn't exactly a proper question for the talk page, but it may be interesting info to add. there are mentions of home-schooled students being able to take the tests, and the courses aren't required to take the tests, but can you be older or younger than high school age? they mention that you'll put in your home high school code onto the test forms, what if you don't have one? they've thought of this for the home-schooled and have a code for them, but what of pre-adolescents or post-grads? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 151.201.55.169 (talk) 00:03, 27 January 2009 (UTC)


 * Interesting question. Students who haven't taken an AP class can still take the test, so it's possible that the College Board would allow an eighth-grader to take the test. However, I don't think high-school graduates (a post-grad is someone completing a second degree in a field after getting a college degree. Different thing) would be allowed to take the test. It's specifically to get college credit before college. When you apply for college, your AP courses and test scores are listed on your transcript. Once you graduate high school, your transcript is final--unless you go back and repeat a year. Colleges only look at your transcript once: when you apply. After that, taking an AP course and/or test is pointless, because the college you're attending won't look at the score. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.32.90.247 (talk) 23:41, 16 April 2010 (UTC)


 * I think that you can only take the exams during the high school years. The pre-administration presentations and forms require that you list your high school grade level. As far as I can remember, there are no other options that 9-12th grades. Jf1357 (talk) 23:47, 21 July 2011 (UTC)

Reference issue.
The sentence, 'According to the Good Schools Guide International, it is "usually much more rigorous than the general course offerings. Advanced Placement classes are graded differently than other classes offered. A 88.50% and higher is rounded to an A unlike regular classes,"' has a reference linked to here. This is supposed to be a direct quote; however, the webpage says nothing about AP courses being graded differently (believe me, they're not. I should know, I'm taking several). I'm gonna go ahead and fix it. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.32.90.247 (talk) 23:30, 16 April 2010 (UTC)


 * I agree that the grading systems are not as lenient as suggested by this quote. At my high school (where I have taken 5 AP exams), you must have a 91.5% or higher to earn an A. However, each category is weighted differently than in non-AP courses ('A's count for 5 points towards your GPA, etc.). However, some classes are even more stringent. My AP Spanish class (which I had to take online) counted anything less than an 80% as an 'F'. Jf1357 (talk) 23:50, 21 July 2011 (UTC)

Makes no sense
"AP tests are scored on a 1 to 6 scale as follows:[15] 7 - Perfectly qualified 6 - Extremely well qualified 5 - Well qualified 4 - Qualified 3 - Possibly qualified 2 - No recommendation 1 - NEVER will get in"

First, a 1-6 scale rarely starts with 7, unless Nigel Tufnel is involved. Second, I doubt very seriously that a score of 1 is termed "NEVER will get in." Get in to what? A college? Nonsense. Colleges choose at what score level to award any credits to incoming students, and it's usually around 4 or 5. (I have also never heard of 6 on the scoring scale for the AP tests, but I can't back that up with a citation, just personal experience.)

Colleges decide what they want to do with AP scores, and it varies from college credit being awarded to a student, to allowing students to test out of certain entry-level classes (English 101, for example), to a "how nice for you, but you still have to take all our classes" attitude (Harvard). — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kayrom1 (talk • contribs) 02:44, 7 October 2011 (UTC)

Can we get a source for the subsidizing?
Because right now it states that the Hawaii Department of Education subsidizes math and science exams, but I'm in the HDE, and they don't. My school, and three others, are recipients of a NMSI grant and have half of our exams paid for through NMSI, which may be cause for confusion. HDE schools, however, are not having math and science subsidized, just a few of them through a private company. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.88.181.171 (talk) 01:40, 13 November 2011 (UTC)

Unrelated "island" sentence in 2nd paragraph of history
The sentence about Harlan Hanson interrupts the flow of the 2nd paragraph. The sentence is not elaborated upon, making it useless as well as irrelevant.

Reproduction of history 2nd paragraph:
"The College Board, a non-profit organization[5] based in New York City, has run the AP program since 1955.[6] From 1965 to 1989, Harlan Hanson was the director of the Advanced Placement Program.[7] It develops and maintains guidelines for the teaching of higher level courses in various subject areas."--Trumpeteerx (talk) 06:29, 13 July 2012 (UTC)

Global View
This article refers only to the United States program, even though it is certainly not only American. Can we get some information on the Canadian program please? FrigidNinja (talk) 20:51, 19 January 2013 (UTC)

College Board vs. The College Board
As far as I know, College Board should not have "the" before its name. For example, you do not call the car company "The Toyota," you call it "Toyota." Shouldn't "the" be removed from most or all instances of College Board on this page? Piguy101 (talk) 01:09, 15 March 2014 (UTC)


 * Easiest place to check is on the organization's own "About Us" webpage: https://www.collegeboard.org/about . Other than the organization's logo, they seem to consistently use "The College Board"; in the absence of a reason not to, I'd just as soon mimic their style. --Hebisddave (talk) 15:45, 17 March 2014 (UTC)


 * Okay, you're right. Piguy101 (talk) 20:18, 18 March 2014 (UTC)


 * I changed this. "The College Board" is logically incorrect, and a nuisance. If College Board staff act pretentiously, why should we play along? -lifeform (talk) 01:22, 11 October 2014 (UTC)

Cost shifting
Criticism should include these are college courses for which the community is billed by their high school taxes. The whole premise of offering advanced placement classes at local high schools. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 64.223.109.97 (talk) 15:00, 23 March 2014 (UTC)

CLEP and AP
Is there any good reason for separating CLEP subject tests and AP exams? AP includes some more advanced subjects than CLEP, which seems restricting to those eligible for CLEP. Can anyone eligible for CLEP take AP exams? --lifeform (talk) 01:33, 11 October 2014 (UTC)


 * Are you asking this in terms of editing the article, or just a general query? Because this might not be the best place to ask about the actual details of AP programs.Wikignometry (talk) 00:19, 21 October 2020 (UTC)

External links modified
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Grade distribution among different articles
Hey all, I have noticed that the grade distribution charts are not the same on different test pages. For example, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AP_Calculus and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AP_English_Language_and_Composition, the different pages have different chart styles. Some are left aligned text, some are center. We need to decide how the charts are going to look and then standerdize them

Jakevossen5 (talk) 21:53, 24 October 2017 (UTC)jakevossen5

If you can provide us the sources coming from the college board, then you can change the information but be sure to leave the link as your source otherwise some admin will revert saying: unsourced. Iamthemostwanted2015 (talk) 01:51, 30 November 2017 (UTC)Iamthemostwanted2015


 * If somebody wants to standardize them, another thing to fix is that they should be called "score distributions", rather than "grade distributions". This terminology is used by CollegeBoard to distinguish AP exam scores from grades in AP classes and this wording is reflected on their website. Tessaamble (talk) 06:46, 11 February 2018 (UTC)

Proposed Child Article
I think the criticism section on this article is relatively small and it would be worth it to add an article about equity and Advanced Placement tests, because there is a lot of literature about inequity perpetuated by these tests. An example of a source that would contribute to this page is the article "Advanced Placement Exams, Incentive Programs, and Cost Effectiveness: A Lack of Equity and Excellence for Black Students in Texas, New York, and Florida” from The Journal of Negro Education by Carolyn A. McBride Davis.

I'd be happy to hear any input on this proposal.

--Hoopsf (talk) 18:25, 5 September 2018 (UTC)

Merging
The information in the article Advanced Placement Exams seems to exist almost entirely within this article. Should that page be merged into this page?

05:29, 14 August 2019 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Hifear267 (talk • contribs)


 * I agree. The content seems very similar to each other. Wikignometry (talk) 00:22, 21 October 2020 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 09:21, 16 March 2021 (UTC)
 * CB-AP-logo-RGB-160926.png

John M. Kemper
I just started an article on John M. Kemper, whose NY Times obituary was 51 years ago today. Was fascinated to learn that he, as headmaster of Andover, is the person who pushed Exeter and Lawrenceville to join with Harvard, Yale, and Princeton, to set up the AP program. May be worth working a mention of him into the history section? Milowent • hasspoken 22:11, 6 December 2022 (UTC)

AP African American Studies?
When did CB add this? Is it new? 50.4.132.185 (talk) 03:14, 20 January 2023 (UTC)

Seminar and Research?
This article is missing AP seminar and AP research in the courses section, even though they are both AP courses that CB offers 2601:88:8001:D8D0:50E3:B86A:2A1:BF58 (talk) 03:08, 15 November 2023 (UTC)