Talk:Aerith Gainsborough/Archive 2

Goddess?
Popular theory is that Aerith became a goddess of the planet in Advent Children. She was able to physically touch and interact with teh living children in Advent Children...and it is debated that she revived Cloud when he died. Though that would be sad is they killed Cloud like that. Just figured that should be added.

And just to let you know, since I keep seeing this whole "reviveal of Aerith stuff", Aerith was planned on being a summon once they decided to kill her off but that got cut due to time. Also, you can glitch the game and see Aeris speak to you in disk 3 at North Crater with no Tifa. She was originally meant to live but Nomura decided that he didn't like Aeris's design. So instead of just giving Aeris Tifa's design...he made an entirly new character and changed the plot....thus leading to many of these confusing plot points in the game.
 * Um... any chance you have anything you can cite to back that up? Bladestorm 00:27, 23 March 2007 (UTC)

The glitch takes Action replay to use. And check some old interviews for the Nomura thing...although he changed his story to "honoring someone's momwho died during production" later. I doubt the old interviews are even around still. I'll check but I doubt I'll find anything (meaning chances of getting edit in...slim)

Maiden who Travels the Planet
anyone mind giving a bit more info on this one? We really have really half a paragraph and judging by that it seems like a more detailed description of the plot would really clear up a lot of things. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.94.57.184 (talk) 19:08, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

Cloud's Onimaslash
suppossibly that attack spells out "I love Aerith." Does anyone have the game still and can test that out. It would likly be in Kanji or something. But if it is true, then we can probably end the debate on her relation with Cloud...or at least lessen the number of things people argue about.

Aerith's Theme
Aerith's Theme is also featured during the end credits of the movie.

I thought the ending theme song was "World Crisis," also known as "End Credits" for the Advent Children version. Does Aerith's Theme also play during the credits? I think this info is incorrect. Chibi Gohan 20:42, 2 October 2006 (UTC)
 * …no. "World Crisis" and "End Credits" are two different pieces, albeit both being medleys.  It's quite correct information.—ウルタプ 22:42, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

You know, I think the confusion stemmed from the Reminisence of Final Fantasy VII, which used the song during the ending scene (where World Crisis plays during the actual game). Nevertheless, End Credits and Aerith's Theme are two totally different songs, so am I confused about something? Because that's the only song that plays during the credits of the movie. In fact, I think that's the song that you can play on Tifa's piano in the game, is it not? Chibi Gohan 23:00, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Never mind that. I managed to listen to the song and found that a portion of the song is indeed played during the ending credits. I thought the above quote was implying that the entire theme was played during the credits (like how most movies have an assortment of songs during their credits instead of one). Sorry for the confusion. Chibi Gohan 23:09, 2 October 2006 (UTC)

Characteristics?

 * You're referring to Protofox's revert, correct? That question is best to be directed to the user himself, and I see no reason to attack Aerith's article which contains perfectly legimitate information because someone made an edit you didn't like an another article. If you have comments regarding information in Tifa's article, please address it there and keep this article out of it. However, I will assume good faith according to Wikipedia's policy and refrain from further comments (unless necessary) on that subject.


 * It's important to note that characteristics doesn't have to be limited to a character's personality. (The only reason why the characteristics section is limited to her personality is because no one has taken the liberty to add other qualities of Aerith in, or perhaps somebody has not seen the need to, since that particular information is dispersed throughout the article.) According to the Merriam-Webster's Dictionary, a characteristic can be "a distinguishing trait, quality, or property."  This means that a characteristic can also apply to the character's design, appearances, etc., which brings me to my next point.


 * If a character's personality is "fairly obvious" and therefore not worthy of mention, then wouldn't the same idea apply to a character's design, as that is a part of a character's characteristics. In this version, you were not opposed to the design section in Tifa's article and yet that is even more obvious than Aerith's personality. Even a reader who has no idea of FFVII would be able to tell that she has, to quote an excerpt of the sentence you inserted, "black hair, red eyes, and (of course) large breasts" just by looking at Tifa's image placed in the infobox.


 * Aerith's personality may be obvious to those who've played the game; however, this article isn't for gamers who are familiar with the game. Wikipedia is a general interest encyclopedia.  Those of us who are familiar with the game may know, but an average reader is most likely unfamiliar with the subject.  The style the encyclopedia should be written is for the editors to assume that the reader does not know anything.  If you have a problem or criticism regarding this policy/guideline, you are certainly welcome to bring up your case at the Village Pump, where you will find plenty of editors who will be happy to discuss it over with you.


 * In conclusion, the current format is align with fictional character featured articles such as Jabba the Hutt or Padmé Amidala or Wario, so the section is perfectly encyclopedic and does not violate any policy or guidelines of Wikipedia. — Mir  l   e   n   22:55, 25 October 2006 (UTC)

Question from User:75.81.9.133
"I know this is kind of a silly question, but how do you pronounce Aerith? If you know please write it under my question."


 * Aerith is pronounced the same way you pronounce Aeris - "Air-iss".


 * Aerith is pronounced as you see it, as something of a fusion of the words "air" and "with" (albeit without the "w-"). The Japanese pronunciation has an "s" sound at the end due to their language lacking a character for a "-th" sound (similar to their lack of "v" being replaced by "b"). Given that her name, when written in Japanese, is written with a character set used for words of non-Japanese origin, the "-th" is implied to be the most correct pronunciation. (T.J. Fuller, Jr. 12:21, 8 February 2007 (UTC))

Death
Any REAL explanation from Square about why can't anyone just Phoenix Down her back to life? I know the 'dead' status is only fainted, but why every unfainting suff is called Phoenix and so on? C'mon, her death was just plain stupid, wasn't it? 200.230.213.152 16:55, 12 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Not only did you answer your own question, but it's called a plot device. DanPMK 03:28, 13 November 2006 (UTC)
 * I know but... It was stupid... I though maybe Square had an better official explanation. 200.230.213.152 00:47, 18 November 2006 (UTC)
 * Do not seek deep consistency from your popular entertainment, and you will be a happier person. If you want to feel better, imagine that Sephiroth has the special power to kill people Extra Dead, when he puts his mind to it. JoshuaRodman 05:08, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

I remember reading this sometime in the game that the people that Sephiroth kills with his sword stay dead...forever. I'm not sure if this is accurate... I also read on some walkthrough that the way you react to certain characters during the game give them relationship points and determine what happens in parts of the game, such as the gold saucer event where Cloud and someone(who is determined by the points) go to the play. Another part of the game is where Aeris gets killed. If you do the reactions correctly during the first portion of the game, where you care more about Aeris more than Tifa, supposedly Tifa was to jump in front of Aeris right before she is supposed to die so Tifa gets killed instead. I also don't know if this is accurate. The game just takes so long to play and I am just to lazy to find out myself. Hopefully, someone will come to my rescue. Ippy 21:04, 2 February 2007 (UTC)
 * ...if what you're saying is true, why are we only hearing of it ten years after the game came out?—ウルタプ 05:28, 3 February 2007 (UTC)
 * It's clearly not. It's been stated time and time again that Aeris is dead is dead is dead.  There are no alternate endings, you can't get 100 kerchiefs and bring her back, you can't beat Emerald and Ruby weapon in 5 minutes to get an Ultra Down, you cant do ANYTHING to bring her back.  It's set in stone and there's no way to change it.  It's important to the plot so she died and stayed dead. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 63.117.246.184 (talk) 08:39, 10 February 2007 (UTC).

Romantic section
Should it be noted that Aeris (forgive my choice of spelling, but this is merely the talk page) is seen in Advent Children alongside Zack at the end, when she leaves? Onikage725 14:36, 24 January 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't see why it should, considering there's nothing romantic about the fact that they left the church together. It should be noted somewhere, however, like in a specific section for Advent Children. While it does have some standing it the story, it's not romantic. --KyrieSanctus 05:11, 30 January 2007 (UTC)

Should we mention the planet?
I mean, seriously. She has her own planet now! :)--87.42.205.55 14:33, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

Please elaborate on that. Plebmonk 16:56, 6 February 2007 (UTC)

i think they mean that because she controlled the planet at the end of vii and advent children, she owns it Jammi568 18:52, 5 March 2007 (UTC)

I actually meant Eris but that's a good point Jammi--86.43.64.115 16:58, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

ahhh, okay, but still, i think i've come up with a good alternative Jammi568 11:19, 14 March 2007 (UTC)

The Maiden who Travels the Planet
The above is the correct name of the short story included with FF7:AC. Note that "who" is NOT capitalized. This is significant because the Feb 7 edit of the article to capitalize all instances of "who" broke links in other articles, notably the one on the main Final Fantasy 7 page. I'd revert the changes myself and also upload a picture of the story's "logo", but new members cannot edit this article. Just thought I'd note the problem here so someone with access privileges can make the change. Xeno8 15:29, 23 February 2007 (UTC)
 * Heh. Despite it prbably staying as this, I've had trouble in the "Weird Al" pages when it comes to his tracks names, which all (save "eBay") have capitalized first letters of all words therein.  According to the "rules" of Wikipedia, artistic license be damned in light of capitalizing that "who". T.J. Fuller, Jr. 08:58, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

Bad Chef
I read Vol 2 of the KH Manga, and it shows that Leon hates her lemonade because she puts salt in it (Leon quote: "I'd drink it..If only Areith would stop putting salt in it."

Also, she mixes Soda and milk "Soda tastes great with milk!"-Areith "NO IT DOESNT!!!"- Leon

Maybe this is worth putting in. -InvaderSora
 * Not really...it's an omake (bonus, unimportant short) from Shiro Amano's technically non-canon Kingdom Hearts manga...>>—ウルタプ 04:36, 28 February 2007 (UTC)

Still, it might be worth adding into the Trivia.


 * Not really. It's not canon to the Final Fantasy storyline, so it shouldn't really be mentioned. It's a cute factoid, make no mistake, but it's not really encyclopedic. Nique talk 11:53, 3 March 2007 (UTC)

Still, its rather interesting and might be worth adding as a little note or something. Can i have some fishy crackers? 03:08, 7 March 2007 (UTC)


 * Interesting, but not important, it doesn't tell you anything canon about the character. If people want to know that kind of thing, well, that's what fansites are for. This is an encyclopedia. Nique talk 03:36, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

"Aerith's Theme"
"Interestingly enough, Aerith's theme contains a similar leitmotif to Final Fantasy VI's (formerly III in North America) theme for Celes Chere, another heroine whose love story is central to the game's plot."

Celes' so-called love story is hardly a love story, and it's definitely not a central part of the game's plot; it's actually quite irrelevant to FFVI's story. Since I've never done big corrections on Wikipedia, I'd like someone to help me on this one.

Also, I really don't see that much of a similarity between the Aria di Mezzo Carattere and Aerith's Theme, besides a few notes at the beginning (which is to say, unless an expert corrects me, I think the statement of this "similarity" is quite subjective). Is this comparison to Celes really necessary? Faethin 01:11, 29 April 2007 (UTC)


 * I told my guitar-playing friend about that note here on Wikipedia, and he proceeded to play the beginnings of both songs, noting that only the first few notes were the same. T.J. Fuller, Jr. 18:49, 30 April 2007 (UTC)


 * So the comparison to Celes is really no quite objective. How can I remove it? (Meaning in which style should I correct the text)Faethin 01:14, 2 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Actually there IS a point on all of this, both themes are the same, which make the songs either in the same key or in transposition. The characters are though very different, but Uematsu always re-used themes throughout the FF titles. nihil 11:52, 25 September 2007 (UTC)

Aerith in Tales of Symphonia
I was wondering if this could be considered a cameo, even though she wasn't named in the game Tales of Symphonia. When the player goes to the slums in Meltokio and talks to a soldier in the back the soldier says he heard there was a cute flower girl around there, but gets disappointed when he realizes that it must have been only a rumor. It was said that the developers threw that in because they were fans of the original Final Fantasy VII game. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Lilium6242 (talk • contribs) 06:17, 16 May 2007 (UTC).
 * I don't think that really counts given that it is SO very vague. It's only a rumor, and therefore not Wiki standard. It's interesting to know, but not worth adding to the article. 74.70.7.38 03:12, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

"Backstory"
This information should be put under appearances, since we don't want in-universe writing in this kind of article. Judgesurreal777 05:22, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

Delisted
This article is too in-universe at the moment, and it contains an unsatisfactory amount of real world info. Most of that information is speculative or pure OR. There is also that huge OR section that needs to be cut. This needs to be trimmed down, cleaned up, sourced, and it should have a good chunk of real world info before this is nominated again. TTN 15:14, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

I say the article's improved a lot since its delisting. All it needs is a few more references and we might just be able to make it a Good Article again. Cat&#39;s Tuxedo 18:55, 14 October 2007 (UTC)

Going for GA
This article is pretty close to GA quality. Here's a small list of ideas I think could be done to improve the article for GAN. I think once these issues have been addressed, this article can be nominated for GA. Anybody else have any other ideas/suggestions? (Guyinblack25 talk 20:42, 16 October 2007 (UTC))
 * The "Musical theme" section is missing references. Does anyone know of possible places to look for sources? If not then the whole section may have to be removed.
 * A fresh set of eyes to do some general copy editing.
 * I'm not sure if the plot information is too lengthy or not. But if it is no longer too long, then the plot tag can be removed from the "Appearances" section.


 * The Advent Children bit of the Theme section can be covered with this page. This page mentions RIKKI's song Pure Heart and says it's a cover of Aerith's Theme. As for the piano and orchestra versions, they're available on the various soundtrack releases of the game already listed here so do we really need to find a citation for that? One only needs to look at a the track list to figure out that Aerith's Theme is available as both an orchestrated version on The Reunion Tracks and as a piano version on the piano collections CD. Davhorn 21:14, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks, that helps a lot. I added some references so the only major thing left is to trim down the FFVII plot info in the "Appearances" sections. (Guyinblack25 talk 21:52, 17 October 2007 (UTC))
 * I don't think they're too long for being plot synopses from several games. I noticed there's a mixture of Aerith and Aeris used, particularly in the Other Appearances section. I realize this is what she was called in the different games, but it could be a bit confusing or just seem wrong to people not familiar with the games. Davhorn 22:55, 17 October 2007 (UTC)
 * As far as I can tell, that was the compromise between the users that wanted to use "Aeris" and those that wanted to use "Aerith". It should be that she's referred to as "Aeris" in FFVII and FFT, and as "Aerith" in all later appearances. I trimmed a bit here and there too, but if it looks good now we should nominate it for WP:GAN. I've already got one on there, could you nominate it. I'll be around to help deal with any issues that come up. Thanks again for helping to get this ready. (Guyinblack25 talk 00:05, 18 October 2007 (UTC))
 * Nominated. :) Davhorn 00:15, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

GA review
Overall, this article deserves GA status. However one point.
 * You should explain more clearly about Aerith and her death. I think its important that readers know that her death is important to players and that it is an iconic scene. I'm sure you have a reference to support this.
 * Remember to stick with Aerith throughout the entire article. Good friend100 22:15, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Consensus has been to use Aeris for FFVII and FFT portions. Is there a reason this is bad? ♫ Melodia Chaconne ♫ 22:22, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Its probably better to be consistent. This article title is Aerith, so Aerith should be used unless otherwise noted in the article. Good friend100 22:24, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
 * The use of "Aeris" is briefly mentioned in the lead. Also, could you elaborate more on what you mean by "explain more clearly about Aerith and her death". Are you referring to the information about her actual death in the game or the player reaction? (Guyinblack25 talk 22:28, 5 November 2007 (UTC))

Yeah both about her death and the player reaction. I read the section and I don't think it fully covers player reaction and its importance among FF fans. Yes...I know enough about FF7 to know how important some stuff may be =) Good friend100 22:56, 5 November 2007 (UTC)
 * The most direct comments we could find was "Players commented on message boards and blogs about the emotional impact the scene held" and EGM's comment, "Aerith wouldn’t have died, and gamers wouldn’t have learned how to cry." Everything else found that was by players didn't qualify as a reliable source per WP:SOURCES. Doesn't the reception from the various gaming news media convey the over reaction to her death? Also, the description of the event of her death was trimmed down to satisfy WP:FICT. (Guyinblack25 talk 23:05, 5 November 2007 (UTC))

Is this article going to pass GA or what? The Prince (talk) 17:59, 23 November 2007 (UTC)
 * That's a good point, I believe that enough time has passed to review and evaluate an article of this size. (Guyinblack25 talk 18:04, 26 November 2007 (UTC))

Alright, more than enough time has passed for this to be re-reviewed...several times over. I'm going to go ahead and pass it- I don't have a problem with the naming is done, and I think the reception section is fine. --PresN (talk) 05:54, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

The novels
The novels need to be mentioned in the appearances section. Espicially since she was revived in one. The code to use Aerith after disc 1 should rly be mentioned as well. YVNP (talk) 19:21, 21 November 2007 (UTC)
 * The "Related Final Fantasy VII appearances" section mentions the novelization and the code is not that notable compared to the rest of the content. (Guyinblack25 talk 01:51, 22 November 2007 (UTC))
 * The code is notable enough to mention. It doesn't have to have it's own section or something like that. I just think it should get a small mention.YVNP (talk) 17:54, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
 * If a reliable gaming news source like GameSpot, IGN, GameInformer, or something on par with them mentioned it in an article, then I guess there's not major problem. If they felt it was notable enough to mention, then it is notable. However it can't be a game faq or walkthrough, it has to be an article of some kind to count as a reliable source. If you find a suitable source, I can copy edit it to fit into the appropriate section. (Guyinblack25 talk 18:01, 26 November 2007 (UTC))
 * It MIGHT deserve a passing mention in the Final Fantasy VII article, but it really isn't relevant to the character article. ♫ Melodia Chaconne ♫ (talk) 18:07, 26 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Depending on the mention in any article found, a passing mention is what I had in mind here too. Simply stating the availability of the character via a code without stating the code. But I think that all depends on what the article states if one is found. (Guyinblack25 talk) —Preceding comment was added at 18:14, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

bug existed
In the international version, if you change the disc in the middle of the game when you are changing maps, 2 certain disc(naming Saga Frontier and Chocobo dungeon 2 Japanese versions, since they have the extra candy data in them) can render the map characters being able to penatrate all landscapes(but of course it will look all wierd), and thus if you use this bug at the correct time (and correct method, since it will crash if you encounter a monster, you'll have to be on a chocobo when the disc is changed and have to change it back after you arrive at the final location and have to save), you can trepass the events of Aerith's death and keep her in your team until the end of the game. No events telling about her death(but of course all of the events after her death are not reasonable) but she can be in the team just like using game shark or proaction replay, etc. Should this be mentioned? MythSearchertalk 08:49, 5 December 2007 (UTC)