Talk:Airbus A340/Archive 1

Hull loss accidents
On 20 January 1994 an Air France A340-211 (F-GNIA) was lost to fire during servicing at CDG. Another A340-312 of SriLankan Airlines was destroyed on the ground by Tamil Tigers on July 24, 2001 at Colombo-Bandaranayake IAP along with 2 A330s and a squadron of military aircrafts.


 * I found this very interesting


 * An A340-313X of Emirates ran off the runway when trying to take off from Johannesburg International Airport on 9 April 2004. The Vr calculated was much too low, so when the pilots tried taking off, the fly by wire system wouldn't allow it. The aircraft soon got airborne after damaging its tyres, brakes and flaps as well as some of the runway lights. It landed safely and all 216 passengers left unhurt.

Now, would this have prevented the Being 747 that crashed in Canada early this year. I think it was carrying goods and crashed for taking off without the necessarly take off speed.

list of operators
I don't see why we can't merge the list of operators into the aircraft's articles. I see no reason to have a seperate list, many pages have lists that are longer. PPGMD
 * It used to be a section in the main article, "List of images," except it was just a series of Wiki links to those airlines. People would come along and add their pet airline occasionally. In the case of certain articles (Boeing 737, etc.) it was beginning to become quite large. Since in most of these cases, the list of actual operators is lengthy, it made more sense to split it off. Thus, while the list is currently short, it can grow tremendously. In fact, 150 seconds after you posted your remark, some anonymous user came along and increased the length of the list by a factor of six. -Joseph (Talk) 23:59, 2004 Oct 28 (UTC)

Well compare it to a article like Navy, it's still fairly small. I think with exception to the 737 list it's hardly going to get bigger than the Navy page. We could always organize it, US, European, and other operators, to make it more organized and readable. PPGMD
 * The difference to the Navy article is it's largely just a short overview and then a list of units and a partial list of ships (the article then does link to several separate lists). In this case, the articles about the aircraft go into detail about the airframe. Why cloud that with a big list at the end? IMHO, inline lists are ugly, anyhow. -Joseph (Talk) 00:09, 2004 Oct 29 (UTC)

modification
Is there any website with a close up picture where one can view modifications that rectified the flapping problem due to the weight of the outer engines on the wings?

I made a revision and addition to the section regarding the 500 model. -Amit

Image:Pala343.jpg
It has been suggested that Image:Pala343.jpg may be a copyrighted image not available for use on Wikipedia. Please refrain from reinserting the image until the copyright status of the image has been determined. If you know that the image is not a copyright violation, please present your evidence at Image talk:Pala343.jpg. -- Essjay ·  Talk 15:00, July 10, 2005 (UTC)

Slow RoC?
I've removed "There has been criticism about the very slow climb rate of the A343, compared to other aircraft, leaving the airports to impose a longer wait period for take off or landing after an A343." from the article because this sounds very dubious to me. Does the A343 have a markedly inferior RoC to other similar airliners? And how could a slow RoC possibly require longer delays after take-off? And just where is the source for the statement? --Jumbo 12:26, 27 December 2005 (UTC)


 * Though it's quite true that the Airbus A340-300 has a slower rate of climb then aircraft that fly similar routes, I don't think it's that big of a deal unless you are forced to lower your rate of climb below it. Perhaps a section on common jokes about the A340 (ie the only aircraft to get a bird strike from behind, and other cracks on the A340?)PPGMD 14:23, 27 December 2005 (UTC)


 * I hadn't heard the bird strike one, but it appeals to my SoH. Thanks. If it's a significant factor in airline/airport operations, then it's worth a mention, but to my mind it's one of a continuing series of subtle and not so subtle digs at Airbus from "Boeing-boosters" and vice versa. I guess when the airliner industry has somehow boiled down to just two major manufacturers, it's inevitable that there be some sort of snide rivalry, especially when the two firms come from different areas of the globe. But I'd very much prefer that our articles be factual and objective rather than consisting of one-eyed digs and jabs. --Jumbo 21:40, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

A340-313X of Emirates
In this section of other incidents, what is "Vr?"


 * Vr is Velocity of rotation, one of a series of key speeds during takeoff during which various actions or decisions are taken. These speeds vary according to factors such as takeoff weight, runway, length, temperature, wind speed and so on, and must be worked out in advance, otherwise things can go wrong. "Rotation" occurs when the nose is lifted off the ground so that the aircraft assumes a nose high attitude while continuing to roll on its main gear and the tail consequently comes closer to the ground. The bottom rear of most airliners is "cut away" to facilitate rotation without the tail striking the ground, although this occurs from time to time. Immediately after rotation the aircraft will rise smoothly from the runway and commence climbing out. The Takeoff article goes into more detail. --Jumbo 23:09, 27 December 2005 (UTC)

A340 Road
Ok, it may be an article, but should it really be linked to at the top of the A340 Aircraft page? Reedy Boy 12:12, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
 * I suggest you look around at various other Wikipedia articles. This nomenclature is normal. Since A340 redirects to Airbus A340, there needs to be a way for people who type "A340" looking for the road can find it. &mdash;Joseph/N328KF (Talk) 13:48, 30 May 2006 (UTC)

The longest airplane in the world
is Antonov_An-225, 84 m long, 6 meters longer than A340-600. 216.239.87.115 02:43, 22 June 2006 (UTC)


 * http://www.airbus.com/en/aircraftfamilies/a330a340/a340-600/ --Denniss 19:36, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

Competition
The article seems to rely too much on some supposed competition with Boeing. Certainly there is competition, but the A340 was clearly developed as a continuing expansion of Airbus capablilities, as we have seen throughout the whole Airbus story, culminating in the A380, which goes beyond anything Boeing has done. Building an ETOPS-immune airliner was a logical next step for Airbus. --Jumbo 09:41, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Supposed competition? Tell that to Airbus now. While McDD was part of the equation at the time of the A340's introduction, today's realities reflect the fact that Airbus and Boeing are fighting each other tooth and nail in all areas except safety and logistical standards (which, amazingly enough, are developed jointly by both companies.) &mdash;Joseph/N328KF (Talk) 14:24, 17 July 2006 (UTC)
 * Well, yeah, but there's a lot of unsourced supposition in all the "this model competes with that model" stuff in the articles. To my mind it is obvious that Airbus has worked steadily to expand its range and capabilities. The A340 was a logical next step - the objective was to overcome ETOPS limitations, not to compete with any specific Boeing model. This process is taken one step further with the A380, which has NO direct Boeing equivalent. The A380 builds directly on the work done on the A340 - notably the difficult problem of how to put four engines on a wing without the thing developing unwanted flutters - and introduces its own technical innovations.
 * This continued expansion and development is something that would have ocurred whether there was none, one or a dozen companies competing for airliner business. While it is fun to line up the various models and say that this one is a competitor for that one, I think we should be very careful about stating that this is why they were developed unless we have a good source. Besides which, I get really sick of Airbus or Boeing fans trying to stick in their own little poison pills here and there. This isn't a sporting competition, where we pick a team and root for it, this is an encyclopaedia, and we are supposed to be presenting factual unbiased information.
 * I'd like to see an article on how the airline market works as a whole, and that would be a good place for competition discussions and comparisons, but these airliner articles should focus on the subject of the article, not on the development of other aircraft. --Jumbo 19:40, 17 July 2006 (UTC)

Airbus developed the A340 as an ETOPS immune plane that was targeted at killing the DC-10, MD-11, and L-1011 that were out there, as well as having more range than anything else out there. By the time the 777 showed up, the A340 had mostly killed the MD-11, which had program problems anyway. Early on, the 777 had a range that could not hold a candle to the early 340's, it was the later 777-200ER that slightly outdid the A343. When the A346 came out, it competed with the lower end of the 747 capacity and was more efficient. Again, Boeing brought out the 773ER afterward with a slight fuel burn advantage. The A345 went for a then-empty segment, and was trumped by the 772LR. The point was not that Airbus tried competing with Boeing, Boeing followed Airbus and built comparable products that ensure healthy competition. Mgw89 (talk) 20:45, 27 December 2007 (UTC)

Note to anyone intending on splitting off a section
This page has been processed by N-Bot, which, for browsing convenience, changes links to redirects to lists to links to the relevant list sections: e.g. Airbus A340-500 is changed to Airbus A340-500.

As a result, anyone who intends to split a section out of this page should be aware that, as of 14 August 2006, the following sections were linked to from the following pages:

N-Bot (t/c) 11:34, 14 August 2006 (UTC)
 * A340-200 series : South African Airways, Sabena, List of civil aircraft, List of aircraft (A-B)
 * A340-600 series : Virgin Atlantic Airways, Lufthansa, South African Airways, Thai Airways International, China Eastern Airlines, List of aircraft (A-B), Virgin Atlantic destinations, Emirates Airline
 * A340-500 series : Thai Airways International, List of civil aircraft, List of aircraft (A-B), Air Canada, Singapore Airlines, Thai Airways International
 * A340-300 series : Virgin Atlantic Airways, Lufthansa, South African Airways, Sabena, Airbus A340, List of airlines, Air Namibia, Olympic Airlines, Jet Airways, BWIA West Indies Airways, Etobicoke Creek, List of aircraft (A-B), China Southwest Airlines, Toronto Pearson International Airport, Air Madrid, Air transports of Heads of State, 9Y-TJN, Canada 3000, Austrian Airlines, 9Y-TJN

Fuel consumption?
Look at the article about the Boeing 747. There you can see the total fuel consumption per km. How come that type data isn't on the stats table of the A340??


 * Are you referring to where it's saying '18.7l/km' on the 747-100 column? Because as far as I can tell they just divided maximum range by the maximum fuel load. I think it's a silly row on the table and is not indicative of fuel consumption per km at all. Consumption is based on many factors including configuration of aircraft, load (both pax and cargo), weather, runways, etc. Please also sign your comments. skyskraper 05:44, 29 March 2007 (UTC)

aircraft assessments
The template itself says that when assessing an article reasons and suggestions are to be given. I am simply reverting an unreasoned and unconstructive assessment. Paul Beardsell 03:46, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

Anonymous comment on 747-8
"(but the longest airliner record will be surpassed by the newer 747-8 [freighter version])." Sorry, but you can`t view in the future. I do not think, that this frase fits in an encyclopedia.

Please stop revert-cycling!
I can see there are a group of editors having an edit war over the rating at the top of this page. Please stop. &mdash;Joseph/N328KF (Talk) 03:48, 18 November 2006 (UTC)


 * Why not comment on the issue? 03:50, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

Because I don't care about the issue itself, but revert-cycling is wasteful and futile, and it was nearing 3RR. &mdash;Joseph/N328KF (Talk) 03:59, 18 November 2006 (UTC)


 * They had to draw the limit somewhere - they chose 3. Paul Beardsell 04:00, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

If you want to know why it was rated that, it's best to ask the user that rated it, and he will get back to you. But it's very common for the raters not to leave a comment. Though I disagree with this pratice it's just the way that things go. Getting into a revert war over it is pointless. PPGMD 07:02, 18 November 2006 (UTC)

Emirates A340-600HGW Order
I have amended the wording of this paragraph because the order has yet to be confirmed as canceled - the Airbus O&D spreadsheet shows firmed orders for 18 -600s for Emirates as of the 4th June 2007. 82.152.52.97 21:02, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

Virgin replacement claim
Where's the proof for this section, particularly the latter part about replacement aircraft: "The initial seven A340-600 aircraft were delivered with overweight wings. After the A340-600 launch customer, Virgin Atlantic, elected to receive replacement aircraft, these airframes were delivered at a reduced price to Iberia Airlines and Cathay Pacific. Cathay Pacific uses the plane on its nonstop service between Hong Kong and New York City (JFK)."

Primary users
Why Cathay Pacific was not the pimary users of the A340s? It has 18 A340s. —Preceding unsigned comment added by David1993923 (talk • contribs) 06:51, 18 October 2007 (UTC)

Takeoff Field Length
On the spec sheet it says that the -500 has a shorter takeoff run than the -600 at MTOW (3050 vs. 3100m). How can this be when the -500 has less thrust (Trent 553 v 556 or 556 v 560 in the HGW's) but weighs the same or more? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mgw89 (talk • contribs) 00:20, 26 November 2007 (UTC)

History section rewrite
I'm going to try and remove repeat information from this section and clean it up a bit. I plan on using some cues from the 747 page as a role model, as well as incorporating more development info. If you guys have any good ideas, pitch 'em out there. Mgw89 (talk) 05:19, 10 December 2007 (UTC)

Non-notable incident
I've removed the following item as being non-notable:


 * December 14 2007 - A Cathay Pacific Airbus A340-300 had to make an emergency landing at Vancouver International Airport after the indicator light for the wing flaps had come on enroute to Hong Kong. After dumping fuel the A340 with 290 people onboard made a safe landing. The problem was later attributed to a faulty indicator light, and not the wing flap itself.

I can't see how a safe emergency landing caused by a faulty light is notable. - BillCJ (talk) 09:23, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
 * I can't see the point either. 哦，是吗？ (review O) 01:24, 17 December 2007 (GMT)

Competition Section
What do you guys think of a section devoted to the competition between the A340 and other aircraft, like the MD-11 and 777? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mgw89 (talk • contribs) 21:15, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

A340-400
I read on the German Wikipedia that Airbus had planned a stretch of the -300 to 70m, using the same wing of the -300 and the CFM56 engines. They realized the engine was too weak, and the wing loading was too high, which would have reduced range to about 6,000 nmi, so they scrapped the idea and eventually built the 75m A340-600. Does anybody have a good reference for this model? Mgw89 (talk) 23:10, 28 December 2007 (UTC)

Pylons, links
I've noticed a few pages which link to the pylons page when referring to engine pylons, but this links to an article that primarily concerns electricity pylons. The closest alternative I could find was hardpoint. Is it worth modifying these links? Jddriessen (talk) 21:57, 8 January 2008 (UTC)

Seeing as their is no engine pylon page, we might be able to redirect it to nacelle or jet turbine. I'll look into that. Mgw89 (talk) 06:14, 9 January 2008 (UTC)

Range With Maximum Payload?
In Boeing 777 article, there are two different range values for each sub - type: Maximum range, which is most probably done by filling the fuel tanks to their maximum and taking no payload to the aircraft; and then maximum payload range, that is, as the name implies, the range possible with maximum payload on - board. But in Airbus A340 article, only maximum payload range (range fully loaded) is given. And the values for it seem to be too high; as well as leading to contradictory information. Look at this: "the A340-500 was the world's longest-range commercial airliner until the introduction of the Boeing 777-200LR in February 2006." The maximum - payload range for 772LR = 13890 km and for A345 = 16700 km. I think there is a mistake, the figures for maximum - payload range may actually be maximum range for an empty flight. Any ideas? Gokaydince (talk) 21:56, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

The 777 numbers are both for range at MTOW, one the max payload, as you said, the other max fuel+as much other stuff to get to MTOW. This is the same as range fully loaded in the A340 article, and should make the cmparisons easier to understand. Mgw89 (talk) 18:36, 22 June 2009 (UTC)

Effects Of Competition And Fuel Prices
This section has to be rewritten now that oil prices have dropped to last year's levels. Q43 (talk) 10:43, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

2007 Etihad accident
I've added a photo to the Etihad Airways article. If it is felt desirable to add it to this article a new non-free use rationale will need to be added to the picture. Mjroots (talk) 07:44, 13 December 2008 (UTC)
 * More pictures of this 'accident' are available now online with no one claiming ownership (ground crew)120.22.58.63 (talk) 10:32, 6 September 2010 (UTC)

AIRBUS A340-500 INCIDENT AT MELBOURNE: MARCH 20, 2009
Somone keeps deleting my UPDATING on the status of this aircraft. An Emirates Airline Senior VP with whom I do business has confirmed to me directly that this aircraft WILL BE REPAIRED AND RETURN TO SERVICE. When I update the article, this commenter keeps deleting my update and changing it back to "the status of the aircraft is unclear..." What do I have to do to keep him from continuing to delete my update?


 * Someone telling you something privately is not a "verifiable source" as required by Wikipedia. ShondaLear (talk) 22:57, 23 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Nobody formally confirmed to the person who posted the current text--and who keeps changing it back to his own version--that "the status is unclear", either. That is his own conclusion, and my update is a lot more accurate than his.  Stop splitting hairs, please.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by DonPevsner (talk • contribs) 12:49, 24 May 2009 (UTC)


 * You are still not a "verifiable source" as required by Wikipedia policy. I'll assume good faith for the time being,and let it stand with a cn tag for a few days until something official is released. However, another editor may remove your item again. Please note that I left out the other user's addition, as it was unsourced too, as you pointed out. BillCJ (talk) 13:51, 24 May 2009 (UTC)


 * I have addded the information back along with a reliable reference.-- PremKudva    Talk   03:23, 30 June 2009 (UTC)

Wrong photo - does not show A340
The picture on the right, captioned "Aerolineas Argentinas Airbus A340-300 seen departing El Prat" does not show an A340. Please remove or replace.

It is in fact an A340, there's two ways to tell. If you click the pics you can see two distinct sets of CFM-56s, although at a casual glance they can be confused with the A330's Trent 772s. Second is the outboard flap guide coming off the #4 engine pylon, which is not present on the A330. Mgw89 (talk) 23:16, 25 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Ah, well thanks. Now I can see it too - and withdraw my plea for replacement!

1000 Kilometres per hour..wtf??
How can an A343 (Airbus A340-300) can go up to 1000 Km/h? On a flight, I read the ground speed and it said 1053 Kmh (654 mph).

How is that possible with just CFM56-5 series engines? 154.20.29.198 (talk) 04:30, 16 November 2009 (UTC)
 * Ever heard of Jetstream ? --Denniss (talk) 17:49, 16 November 2009 (UTC)

What's wrong with the CFM56? Mgw89 (talk) 23:28, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

A340-600HGW
There hasn't been much talk about the A340-600HGW variant. How many have actually been delivered? Looks like Qatar has a few and Lufthansa has a few. Seems like this a/c has been a commercial flop though, since its capability is quite similar to the 777-ER, but with four engines it takes a significant hit in fuel efficiency. Can anyone find some #s on who has taken deliveries of this a/c and how many there are? I can't find it anywhere... 208.65.175.197 (talk) 21:02, 9 December 2009 (UTC)