Talk:Al Baqa

merge
This article seems to overly nearly 100% with Baqa'a Valley. Any objection to merging the two? Brad Dyer (talk) 21:17, 16 June 2014 (UTC)
 * Assuming there is nothing wrong with your eyes, please tell us what is your real reason. Even after you deleted large parts of Baqa'a Valley, their were large differences. --Wickey-nl (talk) 13:06, 17 June 2014 (UTC)
 * There's nothing wrong with my eyes. Even before I removed the parts of the Baqa'a Valley article which were not supported by the sources, the content overlapped this one by a large amount. Articles on geographical features like valleys typically discuss the geographical feature- they have detailed sections on geography, geology, climate, economy etc, ... - this one has nothing of the kind. Most of the material (more than half) in it discusses the village of Al baqa, which is why it should be merged here. Brad Dyer (talk) 15:02, 18 June 2014 (UTC)

Pre-occupation history
Long before settlers started the ethnic cleansing in the Baqa'a Valley, Palestinians already lived there. Sources about the pre-occupation history are welcome. Is there a connection with the Al Baqa'a Bedouin in Ramallah? --Wickey-nl (talk) 13:04, 22 June 2014 (UTC)


 * I can see that the place is marked on SWP (=Survey of Western Palestine) 1880s map (map 21); now linked in the article), but I cannot see it covered in the accompanying Conder and Kitchener-text. Also note: there were 2 places on map 21 with the same name; with history sources one must use great caution to be sure that we are dealing with this Al Baqa. (This is a common problem in Palestine: many of the places have the same name, and they have been mixed up even in the best of sources.)


 * One who really covered the area is Victor Guérin, I have tried to "walk in his footsteps" using maps, here: User:Huldra/Guerin. Hebron area is mostly in Judee 3. It is very difficult to do this when articles are not yet made (as they typically are not in the Hebron district), or when there are no exact co-ordinates in the article. (Which is one reason I would  really like to see fewer red-linked articles..)


 * Also; lots of these places typically changed between being mobile / being settled, look at the history of al-Ubeidiya. Depending on climate or political conditions: look at Hizma: Robinson reported in 1838 that it had been completely empty for two months, as the whole village had escaped forced conscription...while  Guerin 15 years later described it as a village of 200.


 * I´ve looked for Al Baqa  and  Al Bowereh  in the 1922, 1931 and 1945 census: neither are mentioned by name, I would assume they go  under "rural district" of Hebron. In the 1961 Jordanian census, in the Hebron district, p. 22, #6, is a place called Baqqar, with 226 inhabitants.  The Arabic spellings is not quite like Palmer´s "El Bukah", but it   "could " be this place. I would like to see a map from the Jordanian time before I decided if this is it. Cheers, Huldra (talk) 20:02, 22 June 2014 (UTC)


 * Btw, there is an "Arabic missing template" (which both this and  the Al Bowereh-article  needs) ...so that Arabic-writers would be alerted and insert the name in Arabic. Of, course, I have forgotten how it looks like; sorry,   Huldra (talk) 20:40, 22 June 2014 (UTC)

I observe that you tend to go off-topic, qua geography. It seems that Al Baqa (el Bukah) on the 1880s map is on the right place, east of Wadi al-Ghrous (Wady el Kurush). Following the road from Bani Na'im to the north, I find al-Uddeisa under the name Bir el Jeradat. Al Bowereh (or Aqabat Injeleh, wherever the name comes from), however, is absent. Though I think al this is not useful without further sourcing, it is interesting. --Wickey-nl (talk) 13:35, 23 June 2014 (UTC)
 * I have not found Al Bowereh on any map. al-Uddeisa is *not*   Bir el Jeradat; look further north, and you will find "Kh. el Addeiseh". In the 1942-43 maps it is  "Kh. al Uddeisa". (If you want to study the history, you have to study the  geography.)  Cheers, Huldra (talk) 14:51, 23 June 2014 (UTC)

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