Talk:Alan Shields

Ratings
No ratings until draft is accepted (one had been 'Start'). David notMD (talk) 20:38, 29 March 2022 (UTC)

Table of exhibitions
I removed the long table of solo exhibits and am copying it below as a record. I selected the most important museum shows - one-person shows, retrospectives, survey shows and travelling exhibitions, and removed the redlinked lesser important shows. Every show is now sourced, and presented by a notable museum (per Wikipedia standards). Additiional citations were also added.

Netherzone (talk) 15:17, 3 April 2022 (UTC)

NYC, Shelter Island
not enough to preclude mainspace, but I think this paragraph needs some cleaning up:

Shields purchased a house on Shelter Island in 1971. He kept his studio in New York City for a year until taking up permanent residence on Shelter Island in 1972. He did not give up his SoHo loft until the mid-1980s, at which point he decided to raise his family, grow his own food, become a commercial fisherman and a licensed ferryboat captain.

So he relocated to a permanent residence in 1972ish, but had his loft for fifteen years? Was his studio not his loft? I don't think so, but can we clarify. What do you think ? Star  Mississippi  01:22, 15 May 2022 (UTC)


 * Thank you for spotting this ambiguity! It's not clear in the article. Many NYC artists have separate work studios from where they live, or multiple studios (esp. more successful artists). Some might have a studio out in the Hamptons, and another in the city. He could have bought the place on Shelter Island, and it took him a year to move his studio or perhaps renovate the Shelter Island house. He could have kept the Soho loft as a showroom for collectors and gallerists and the Shelter Island studio for messy work production. I'll have a look at what the sources actually say. What can't be sourced can be trimmed. Thanks for taking the time to review the article and for moving it to article space. Netherzone (talk) 01:32, 15 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Update - I found a searchable copy of the Space Sisters catalog to verify part of the ambiguity, but have been unable to find a searchable copy of the Common Threads book to clarify the SoHo loft until the 80s claim. @Chainsawpunk if you get this ping, and still have access to that source, could you confirm what the source says, and add a page number please? Many thanks in advance, and especially thank you for creating the article! Netherzone (talk) 02:27, 15 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Thanks. That makes total sense and I can see why it would be unclear because it may not have been relevant to document how he was using his loft space. Star   Mississippi  14:58, 15 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Hello, page 14 of the Parrish Museum of Art's publication on shields from his exhibition, Common Threads: "Despite this celebrity in the downtown art world, or perhaps because of it, Shields sought a retreat and in 1972 purchased a house on the aptly named Shelter Island, nestled between the North and South Forks of Long Island's East End. He later converted an old greenhouse into a studio adjoining the house, which was in a neighborhood near Coevles Harbor known as Eel Town, a remote spot that had a reputation as a haven for offbeat types. That suited Shields just fine. He did not give up his SoHo loft until the mid-1980s, when he moved to the East-End full-time, raising his family and savoring the opportunity to grow his own vegetables and pursue a passion for fishing."
 * Sorry if this is not exactly what you were looking for, fairly new wikipedia editor here. Chainsawpunk (talk) 14:32, 17 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Perfect! Thank you, @Chainsawpunk that clears things up. If you have other drafts that are stalled in the Articles for Creation backlog, and you'd like some help with them, I'm happy to work together with you. I see from your user page that you are interested in fiber arts, Native American arts and other fascinating subjects. Many thanks to @Star Mississippi for moving this draft to article space! Netherzone (talk) 18:15, 17 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Thank you @Star Mississippi for moving this to article space and thank you @Netherzone for helping me get my first wikipedia article published! I'm working on four other articles at the moment, some may be one pivot away from our shared interests! I will ping you on them and would love to work together if you think any are interesting! Chainsawpunk (talk) 18:28, 17 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Wonderful on all counts. Happy to help wherever I can especially in the arts space. Feel free to ping me on the draft's talk page or anywhere else convenient. Team work makes this all so much easier. Star   Mississippi  18:34, 17 May 2022 (UTC)

Question re: lead
Should he be called a painter, or a visual artist in the lead? His work was so very diverse and sculptural altho always lavishly painted. I'm wondering if visual artist is more accurate than painter. Any thoughts on this? Netherzone (talk) 04:21, 18 May 2022 (UTC)

Formating of citations
Although it's not a major issue per se, it seems a bit odd to use the British English date format for citations, while using the American English date format for the body of the article. Since MOS:DATETIES would seem to apply to article, I can't see any reason why the same logic can't be applied to the citations. However, as long as the dates are consistent per WP:DATEUNIFY for both the body and citations, it's not really a problem; it just seems odd.

Another thing to consider would be the style of capitalization used for the titles of the sources being cited. The all caps style shouldn't really be used per MOS:ALLCAPS, but either sentence case or title case are fine. Right now, it's a bit of a mix and the style should be a consistent as possible. -- Marchjuly (talk) 05:17, 18 May 2022 (UTC)

Selected public collections
Since is basically nothing more than a simple introductory sentence followed by a list of museum or gallery names, the section might actually work better in a WP:BULLETLIST format. Normally, WP:PROSE is preferred and if more information about each collection can be added, then breaking things up into paragraphs could work well. In this case, though, the section looks like a WP:SEAOFBLUE which might make reading it a bit hard. The use of MOS:SEMICOLONs could also be mitigated by a bullet list format, especially since the location of each collection marked off by commas is no longer an issue. -- Marchjuly (talk) 05:23, 18 May 2022 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the. —Community Tech bot (talk) 05:51, 18 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Alan Shields J + K 1972.jpg

The fair-use image rules at WP Commons, as well as Wikipedia are quite strict. What I have found from my own experience is that images of copyrighted works of art used in an article must be within the specifications for fair use. In a nutshell, the image must be small sized, meaning less than 10,000 total pixels (about 360 x 280 px), and must be discussed in a significant way in the article. (And the correct license must be selected during the upload process.) The reason is that copyright laws are strict, and WP could be legally responsible if we don't comply with the image use rules. If you have difficulty re-uploading the image within the size limits for fair use, let me know (ping me here or message me on my talk page) and I'll help you with it. Netherzone (talk) 17:39, 21 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Just want to clarify somethings about what you posted above. First of all, the reason the file was nominated for deletion on Commons has nothing to do with its size, but everything to do with the fact that Commons doesn't accept fair use content of any type. The photo uploaded to Commons is a photo of someone else's copyrighted work; so, not only the copyright of the photo but also the copyright of the photographed work needs to be considered. In some cases, a publically displayed work of art can be freely photographed an uploaded to Commons per c:COM:PD-ART as long as certain condtions are met, but none of those seem to apply here. This means it needs to be demonstrated that the work shown in the photo was either never eligible for copyright protection or is no longer eligible for copyright protection. Chainsawpunk or anyone else who believes this to be the case is more than welcome to post at c:Commons:Deletion requests/File:Alan Shields J + K 1972.jpg explaining why.The "size" and "significant discussion" stuff you mentioned above only matters when it comes to non-free content uploaded locally to Wikipedia. If you or Chainsawpunk want to reupload the file locally to Wikipedia as non-free content because you think its use in the article satisfies all ten non-free content use criteria, then you can give that a try. It probably does, but other might feel differently depending on how much sourced critical commentary you're able to add about the work to the article. If you do try and do this, you should make sure you provide both a non-free copyright license (e.g. Non-free 2D art) and a non-free use rationale (e.g. Non-free use rationale 2) on the file's page to avoid it being tagged for speedy deletion. The photo taken by Chainsawpunk is probably not eligible for it's own copyright independent of the work as explained in c:COM:2D copying, but Chainsawpunk can add a free license for the photo if they want. -- Marchjuly (talk) 23:14, 21 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Thank you for the clarification, @Marchjuly! @Chainsawpunk, please disregard my message above, and follow Marchjuly's lead. Netherzone (talk) 06:16, 22 May 2022 (UTC)
 * Okay! How do I delete it? Chainsawpunk (talk) 15:18, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * It will be automatically deleted, you do not have to do anything. Netherzone (talk) 18:29, 24 May 2022 (UTC)
 * I replaced the image with a fair-use image (from the Whitney Museum) of the same work. These I uploaded to WP, not Commons. A subsection was added: "Significant works" with content specifically about the work depicted. Netherzone (talk) 03:21, 26 May 2022 (UTC)

J + K or J & K
Is the correct title J + K or J & K? I have seen it both ways. Netherzone (talk) 03:26, 26 May 2022 (UTC)

Death date
The obituary written by Roberta Smith has a correction at the bottom. Confirming that the date of Shields' passing was the 13th, not the 20th. Please read to the bottom of the article before changing. Chainsawpunk (talk) 17:19, 05 Jan 2023 (UTC)
 * , thanks! I've also moved the citation to the line to make it easier for future editors to discern.  Star   Mississippi  01:46, 6 January 2023 (UTC)


 * Thanks! Chainsawpunk (talk) 19:57, 6 January 2023 (UTC)