Talk:Aleksander Barkov/GA1

GA Review
The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.''

Reviewer: DannyMusicEditor (talk · contribs) 17:31, 15 August 2023 (UTC)

This is going to be out of my comfort zone article-wise, but I love hockey, so I'm gonna give it a...shot (and a goal, perhaps). One of my favorite players in the whole Eastern conference.  danny music editor  oops 17:31, 15 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Hey, just wanted to make sure you were still interested in reviewing this article. I totally understand if you're too busy or don't feel comfortable doing it! HickoryOughtShirt?4 (talk) 17:26, 29 August 2023 (UTC)
 * I will still be reviewing this, I apologize for the wait. I have a GAN of my own currently being reviewed and it's enormous, and I'm just trying to put that out of the way before we get started. I appreciate your patience.  danny music editor  oops 17:31, 29 August 2023 (UTC)
 * No worries! I know sometimes I forget about articles I'm reviewing so I just wanted to make sure . HickoryOughtShirt?4 (talk) 15:57, 30 August 2023 (UTC)
 * To my understanding, I am done with my own GAN and I will start officially reviewing this tomorrow. The review being longer than I expected, as well as a turn of fortunes with my recent job search, has occupied much of the time I had since I took this. I have one comment that's been nagging me since I took this; why does the lead seem thin to me compared to all the beautiful detail we go into in the body? I understand the lead's purpose, of course, but the proportion seems off. I'm just eyeballing this, however; my only hockey GA, ironically, is Auston Matthews, who I in turn took notes from Sidney Crosby on working with, so I only have a little bit of experience. Their leads have slightly more breadth to them. Or I could just be entirely overreacting because I'm still not over how huge my relatively new monitor is (14 months) compared to when I started editing (9 years), so what may be appropriate detail may still look to me like they take up less space than I expect. See what you can do and if there's anything you would think would be noteworthy enough to briefly mention in the lead.  danny music editor  oops 22:45, 1 September 2023 (UTC)
 * , you're absolutely right, the lead should be longer. I am just awful at writing leads . I will work on it! HickoryOughtShirt?4 (talk) 01:38, 6 September 2023 (UTC)
 * Looking at your work with Roman Josi, I'd recommend giving the body paragraphs here the same treatment. I get there's a pattern of organization, but it's too much, even for my screen. A couple of enter (or return) buttons are warranted. Full review coming in the daylight.  danny music editor  oops 04:52, 6 September 2023 (UTC)
 * My own GAN is officially done, so my focus is now here. Looking at your work so far, and the first two paragraphs are better. Let me expand on that and help you toward the direction I'd expect. A little about his early life and career in Finland is exactly the kind of thing I'm looking for. I like how you started the third paragraph about him being the youngest, but the expansion goal landmark and his rookie stats seem a little off the mark for a lead. What I would personally recommend is following a broader chronological timeline, blending the progression of the Panthers in a way that's relevant to Barkov. Something like, "although the Panthers qualified for the playoffs only once in his first six seasons, Barkov steadily improved his performance over time". (not necessarily word-for-word but feel free on the quote) Then, transition to the Panthers emerging as a contender in, and how Barkov led the team to a Presidents' Trophy win in '22 (perhaps mention career high goal total here) and an unlikely trip to the finals in '23.  danny music editor  oops 23:29, 7 September 2023 (UTC)
 * , That's a great idea! I have become a little overwhelmed with school starting again, so I'm sorry for the late response but will absolutely implement this. Glad your own GAN went well! HickoryOughtShirt?4 (talk) 03:08, 10 September 2023 (UTC)
 * , I believe I improved on the lead and fixed the headers so it is not easier to read. Looking through the article, it seems the 2014-15 section is lacking. What do you think? HickoryOughtShirt?4 (talk) 16:16, 11 September 2023 (UTC)

Checklist

 * GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)


 * 1) It is reasonably well written.
 * a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):
 * All prose suggestions outlined below, all easily correctable.
 * 1) It is factually accurate and verifiable.
 * a (reference section): b (inline citations to reliable sources):  c (OR):  d (copyvio and plagiarism):
 * Two believed factual errors, but likely accidental. Not violations of any of the individual parts by a longshot.
 * 1) It is broad in its coverage.
 * a (major aspects): b (focused):
 * It's statistically very dense, but I only listed a few things I'd prefer definitely to go. It will need more if anything beyond GA is desired.
 * 1) It follows the neutral point of view policy.
 * Fair representation without bias:
 * Don't see any reason why not.
 * 1) It is stable.
 * No edit wars, etc.:
 * No issues here.
 * 1) It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.
 * a (images are tagged and non-free content have non-free use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
 * Both images are fair use. Someone needs to get a newer Cats picture of him...
 * 1) Overall:
 * Pass/Fail:

Actual review start
Okay so tonight is going to be the night I get at least half of this actual review done. I'm sorry to make you wait. I got a new job since opening this and work ramped quickly, leaving me exhausted almost every shift. I'll answer your previous remarks and actions first.


 * Lead looks much better. A couple things, though. Remember, the first round worked differently in, and four games wasn't a sweep. There was an extra round, and games were best of five. There were no sweeps in that round, if I recall correctly. I also don't see mention of the '23 Finals, which I would expect some mention of as captaining a Cinderella team*. (not necessarily that term, but you know what I mean and we all know it's true)
 * I do like the effort on the reorganization. You don't necessarily have to keep separate headings for each and every season. My example - Matthews - might use that structure, but if you are concerned about section breadth, you could merge the first two seasons together as separate paragraphs.
 * Do you think you could find a way to break the paragraphs in the other seasons up? They're still too long as they are, though the details are appropriate.

 danny music editor  oops 00:36, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

Amateur and Liiga

 * Applies article wide: I generally find it useful and not an overlink violation to repeat a link once in the body of the article, where it first appears post-lead. So, things like Tampere, Tappara, etc. - anything you linked in the lead that is not linked in its first body mention - I would encourage linking. ✅
 * He finished the 2011–12 season with five goals and 12 assists for 17 points through 25 games. We have a possible stat mismatch and a dead link here. Wikipedia's stat table for Barkov lists this as the statline for the 2010–11 Finnish Jr. A season, not 2011–12. When I went to check which it was, the link was rotten. Fix this link and the discrepancy, please; if the source made an error please let me know and I will give a following instruction. ✅
 * Good catch, it was my mistake. Fixed! HickoryOughtShirt?4 (talk) 18:56, 21 September 2023 (UTC)
 * On that note, applies article wide: I would encourage you to run IABot on this page to double check for any other unarchived rotten links. ✅
 * Oh, there's the Tappara link. I understand that there are two divisions of the team playing in different flights, but I would prefer if you linked it the first time and made it clearer that the he was playing as a junior the previous seasons. ✅
 * Comma after "surgery" ✅
 * Saying "the final ranking" instead of "his final ranking" reads slightly awkward ✅
 * Barkov was eventually drafted second overall by the Florida Panthers...behind who? Barkov is one of those rare second overall cases where this information could potentially be relevant, and granted the reputation that player has today, I think it is warranted. ✅

Next section!  danny music editor  oops 00:59, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

Florida Panthers: starting from 2013-2015

 * Despite this, he still sat just one point off the team lead in points with 24. You're telling me the Panthers lead scorer in late January had 25 points? Damn, the Panthers really were atrocious that year. You know things are bad when Sean Bergenheim is a top line winger.
 * Interesting, was 54 how many games he had played to that point, or did he return to NHL action afterward and hit a dry spell? 8-16-24 was his statline at that point and the season's end. How many games did he play, if any, if he returned to action?
 * I ask this because Barkov suffered a second injury during the tournament that cut his NHL season to 54 games is ambiguous; am I to interpret this as he missed the rest of the season? If so, just say so instead. Sometimes it's good to just remember KISS - Keep It Simple Stupid! ✅
 * Comma after first Jussi Jokinen ✅
 * That's it for this section. Your writing is clear and concise, and this should be an easy review despite the size.

Next section!  danny music editor  oops 01:27, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

2015–16

 * If you're going to date the 17 December for a win over the Tampa Bay Lightning, you should note the date he got hurt against the Hawks. ✅
 * Give the Enter button a couple taps right before "Due to his limited penalties", and then we're gonna rework that sentence in my point below. ✅
 * "first...since" sentences like Due to his limited penalties, Barkov became the first Panthers player to be a Lady Byng Memorial Trophy finalist since Brian Campbell in 2012. are designed to impress as if a lengthy period has gone by. But it's been four years, which isn't all that long in this context. You can simplify it by saying "Barkov's few penalties and generally clean play earned him a nomination for..." you get the idea. ✅
 * "This changed the following game" comma ✅
 * What was the final score of the elimination game? (Hint: it was in overtime and John Tavares had his finest moment as an Islander here - I remember this game like it was yesterday.) ✅

2016–17

 * I would normally say to watch your overlinks on Brian Campbell, but considering I'd rather you omitted his current first mention, this is fine, just be mindful of it. ✅
 * Optional: Where was Keith Yandle signed from ("former New York Rangers defenceman"), and where did Campbell depart to ("void left by Brian Campbell, who had departed to the Chicago Blackhawks")?
 * By the way, I notice here that you usually use the spelling "defense" and "defenseman" in Barkov's article, but the European consensus on English uses a C and not an S to spell this word, and you should switch the spots it is spelled with an S to a C. ("Defensive" I am unsure about, but I believe it retains the S? Might have to ask an outside source on that one.)
 * "sparked an offensive increase" comma ✅
 * "Marchessault for the team lead in points" recommend comma ✅
 * "undisclosed injury during a 3–2 shootout loss to the Toronto Maple Leafs" according to the source, the injury did not occur during this game, but shortly before, he fought it and just gave out from it and left in Toronto. Re-write the associated material to match what actually happened per the source. ✅
 * "and had just snapped a five-game point streak" His own? I don't think that's necessary to include as it's written. If you truly do, re-write it more positively: "At the time of the injury, he had an active five-game point streak, leading the team with..." ✅
 * "ended up missed" missing? ✅
 * "An upper body in April" A what now? ✅
 * You use the phrase "cut short" a lot, shake it up: "ended Barkov's season early", I recommend. ✅

Next section!  danny music editor  oops 02:25, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

2017–18

 * I get why you would mention Huberdeau in many of the places you have, but why the opening of this section? Because he's his linemate? I don't think that reasoning flies here. ✅
 * Ya wanna talk about how the Panthers Dale Tallon was galaxy brained and let Vegas take two of Florida's best players in Marchessault and Smith for free? Or is that too far off topic? I presume it wouldn't be difficult to cite. It certainly affected the team around Barkov for the worse. ✅
 * few games with Malgin before suffering an upper-body injury against the Winnipeg Jets. ✅
 * he suffered a season-ending upper-body injury during a win over the Boston Bruins. When? Stat table says 79/82 GP and he missed a game against Colorado per an earlier source, could say with two games remaining in the season. ✅
 * Optional: Could add "With the Panthers again out of playoff contention" to the beginning of this sentence. Nevermind, they barely missed this year. I have this season and the following year mixed up.

Next section!  danny music editor  oops 03:45, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

2018–19

 * Delink the Jets in this section per my request to have them included in the previous section. ✅
 * Where was this global series game played? ✅
 * Baerkov?
 * After you talk about All Star '19, tap enter a couple times. ✅
 * "...7 February to lead the Panthers to a 3–2 overtime win..." ✅

Easy section. On to the next one!  danny music editor  oops 04:23, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

2019–20

 * Optional but recommended: Like we did in 16-17 with Yandle, where did Bobrovsky arrive from? ✅
 * Although the season was cut short due to the COVID-19 pandemic, Barkov set another franchise record with the Panthers and moved into third place on the franchise's all-time scoring list.[109] Although the season was cut short due to the COVID-19 pandemic, Barkov set another franchise record with the Panthers and moved into third place on the franchise's all-time scoring list. I feel like you can cut this one entirely, because we get to it later in the section. ✅
 * "While playing with his usual linemates on 16 January..." tap Enter a couple times immediately preceding this sentence. ✅
 * Barkov and Huberdeau were the only Panthers forwards who had more than one point in the series. Ouch. Didn't know that. Crazy to see how far they've come.

Pretty simple. Next!  danny music editor  oops 04:35, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

2020–21
The Panthers also traded Mike Matheson and Colton Sceviour...to who? ✅
 * You also spell Patric's last name correctly in the initial sentence, but the diacritic is missing in the second sentence. You've been using them elsewhere, so I'd ask that you do the same here. ✅
 * I wouldn't exactly call it appropriate to call the first Selke win in franchise history a "franchise record", but it is a milestone worth celebrating, so reword that if you wouldn't mind. ✅
 * Barkov entered the COVID-19 pandemic shortened 2020–21 season with new linemates; Anthony Duclair and Carter Verhaeghe delete that semicolon and put a comma after Verhaeghe ✅
 * The Lightning are linked in this section and should not be. ✅
 * "Near the end of February, Barkov was eventually reunited..." split the paragraph immediately preceding this sentence. ✅
 * second in blocked shots, and averaged 1:26 of shorthanded ice time per game.[140] Barkov played 236:55 of ice time with Duclair and Verhaeghe, with the Panthers leading 15–8 in goals when they were deployed.[141] I feel that these stats are excessive and should be removed. Note that there is a specific stat preceding this portion that I did not mention and I would rather you kept. ✅

On to the next one.  danny music editor  oops 05:05, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

2021–22

 * "before he could surpass Jokinen, Barkov suffered a lower-body injury" against who? The Caps? Context matters here, because you say Barkov missed "the following game", whoever that was. The first matchup is strongly encouraged, the second is optional if you desire. ✅
 * I cannot find any information on when the injury occurred and what exactly it was. Per this Head coach Andrew Brunette said he expected Barkov to be in the lineup, but his lower-body issue “flared up” before the game. HickoryOughtShirt?4 (talk) 19:53, 21 September 2023 (UTC)
 * In early April, teammate Jonathan Huberdeau tied Barkov for the Panthers single-season points record with 96[159] and then quickly surpassed it.[160] This really isn't needed for Barkov's article and can be cut.
 * The only reason I mentioned it is because otherwise the reader is left to assume that Barkov still holds that record. I can shorten it if that helps? HickoryOughtShirt?4 (talk) 14:49, 21 September 2023 (UTC)
 * How about you use an template next to where Barkov originally set the record a few sections/seasons back? You can explain how Huberdeau set a new high in 2022 and still holds this record to date. The link explains a lot more than the basics, but if you want to see a simple example I've encountered in my typical editing area, Juice Wrld's Goodbye & Good Riddance makes good use of it starting in the infobox for its fifth single.  danny music editor  oops 04:33, 22 September 2023 (UTC) ✅
 * , going through the article again, I think I can just remove this sentence because I say this later on in the article: On 20 March, during a game against the Detroit Red Wings, Barkov passed former teammate Jonathan Huberdeau to become the Florida Panthers' all-time leading scorer with 614 points. What do you think? HickoryOughtShirt?4 (talk) 02:06, 23 September 2023 (UTC) Never mind, I misread it. HickoryOughtShirt?4 (talk) 02:07, 23 September 2023 (UTC)
 * with only one assist as they were swept in four games. ✅
 * I'm really starting to pick up now that this article is a little dense in more-than-basic hockey statistics. Remember, the audience probably isn't a hockey statistician. They probably aren't looking to read on goals per 60 or anything of that nature.

One more to go.  danny music editor  oops 05:23, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

2022–23

 * Why link Huberdeau here? Might have been copied from another player. Tkachuk, perhaps. ✅
 * He also became the sixth player in franchise history to score three goals in a single period. Six is not major and I would cut this. ✅
 * an injured Auston Matthews I'd say "the injured" ✅
 * Any details on the King Clancy nomination? ✅
 * It should be pretty easy to note, with a citation of course, that the Panthers barely qualified for their lengthy playoff run. (I believe the margin was one point. No I'm not bitter what are you talking about ) ✅
 * The Maple Leafs should not be linked here. ✅
 * No mention of the opponent in the Finals?✅

That's all for his playing career. I'll be checking the remaining sections in the daylight - it's past 1:30am over here.  danny music editor  oops 05:36, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

International and personal life

 * Could possibly mention that the 2014 Olympians went to medal bronze in Barkov's absence. ✅
 * I would rather you namedropped his brother sooner rather than later like you have it now.

That's really all there is. Solid work so far, but this is the entirety of the tuneups necessary. I trust you on the sources for the most part. Good luck!  danny music editor  oops 14:22, 21 September 2023 (UTC)
 * In regards to the sources, the NHL.com just messed with their website and now it seems it might've f'd with some of the sources too. I am going through it now to fix the dead links. HickoryOughtShirt?4 (talk) 14:54, 21 September 2023 (UTC)

Final regards

 * GA review (see here for what the criteria are, and here for what they are not)


 * 1) It is reasonably well written.
 * a (prose, spelling, and grammar): b (MoS for lead, layout, word choice, fiction, and lists):
 * 1) It is factually accurate and verifiable.
 * a (reference section): b (inline citations to reliable sources):  c (OR):  d (copyvio and plagiarism):
 * 1) It is broad in its coverage.
 * a (major aspects): b (focused):
 * Still a little dense on some more advanced statistics, but not so much so that it's a problem.
 * 1) It follows the neutral point of view policy.
 * Fair representation without bias:
 * 1) It is stable.
 * No edit wars, etc.:
 * 1) It is illustrated by images and other media, where possible and appropriate.
 * a (images are tagged and non-free content have non-free use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
 * 1) Overall:
 * Pass/Fail:
 * Above and beyond. Excellent work.
 * a (images are tagged and non-free content have non-free use rationales): b (appropriate use with suitable captions):
 * 1) Overall:
 * Pass/Fail:
 * Above and beyond. Excellent work.
 * Above and beyond. Excellent work.