Talk:Alice Cooper/Archive 1

Name
Changing text, which previously read: "Vincent Damon Furniture (born February 4, 1948), better known as Alise Soper" ... "Furnier officially changed his own name to Alice Cooper" -- i.e., if he has legally changed his name then he is not "Vincent Furnier", better known as "Alice Cooper".
 * Is there a reference showing that his name has been legally changed? I had not heard or seen that outside of Wikipedia. -- WCFrancis 18:48, 6 May 2005 (UTC)
 * This information is confirmed (without a date or other information) on the official Alice Cooper Website. -- ROYGBIV 04:40, July 10, 2005 (UTC)
 * According to his autobiography, he did have his name legally changed to Alice Cooper. I do not recall the date. wcf Facts are stubborn. Comments? 22:34, 9 December 2008 (UTC)

Heads
"decapitated human heads" are they real heads or fake ones? what did he do with them? Jm51 08:07, 2 Jan 2005 (UTC)

They are fake decapited heads. An Alice Cooper concert, is not just a concert, but it is very theatrical. I will be an Alice fan forever!

Ancestry
Alice Cooper is of French ancestry: http://www.miquelon.org/famous/index.html
 * The entry appears to have been lifted, including typoes, directly from an entry in Yahoo movies. -- WCFrancis 18:49, 6 May 2005 (UTC)


 * Notice is name is Furnier. That would be pronounced Furni-aye. You can't say that's not French. Redwolf24 05:59, 12 July 2005 (UTC)


 * Yes, the name is French but no more than 3% of his ancestry is French. He is over 90% British (Irish/Welsh/English). His French Huguenot Fourniers settled in Maryland before the Revolution and once here, did not marry into other French families. They may have been in London before their arrival on these shores but being Protestant, certainly never touched foot in Quebec or New Orleans. Questors 04:29, 11 November 2005 (UTC)

Hall of Fame
In "2000s" the final paragraph reads: "Cooper has still not been inducted - on balance, unjustifiably, into the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame." I am a huge fan of Alice Cooper - I agree that he should be inducted. In spite of this, my opinion is that this fails to be NPOV.

Of Course he needs to be inducted. He is not only one of the moist influential rockers of all time, He stage shows introduced a new side to Rock Concerts

I also question listing awards or honors that the subject of the article has not won as being appropriate to an encyclopedia entry.
 * WCFrancis 12:35, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Need info on his movies. Monster Dog!

Wikiquote
There used to be a box to Wikiquote by Cooper, where'd it go? Also where's a picture of him that used to be here??? Redwolf24 8 July 2005 03:30 (UTC)

Photograph
Thanks to Redwolf24 for asking about the photograph. The one that is currently shown is fairly current (only a year or two old, I'd guess) but it really doesn't capture much about Cooper. I'd either go with a current one that is more engaging, or with a classic mid-70's image that captures him at his commercial peak. So who's got one with a clear copyright? -- ROYGBIV 04:45, July 10, 2005 (UTC)

Trilogy Complete
I have taken the liberty of correcting the "2000's" article to mention the completion of the "Brutal Planet" and "Dragontown" trilogy with the release of "Dirty Diamonds" earlier this month (August 2nd).

Dirty Diamonds has nothing to do with Brutal Planet or Dragontown. --EvilCheeseWedge 19:21, 23 August 2005 (UTC)

Oh, whoops. Sorry. I just assumed since it's the latest since Dragontown it was the completion of the trilogy. --SWFan00 17:07, 30 August 2005 (UTC)

Where did you find this stuff about "The Last Temptation" not being part of the trilogy? I've seen a lot of web pages, and even a Rolling Stone article, that say it is the first part of the threesome. --Alex, not a registered user 10:45 PM December 11, 2005 (Maryland's time zone, whatever that is)

Response to above comment: I believe the whole idea of "The Last Temptation" being the beginning of a trilogy actually came from a goofed up Press Release by Eagle Records when "Brutal Planet" was released. Besides, after "Dragontown" came out, there was some mention that a "Third album in the trilogy" was being planned. But of course that hasn't happened yet obviously.


 * There was a comic/graphic novel of "The Last Temptation", based on the album. It was originally released as three comics, and later as a complete graphic novel.  It was written by the wonderful Neil Gaiman.  I do believe this is why so many sources mistakenly refer to "Last Temptation" as a trilogy.SkyllaLaFey (talk) 05:24, 21 December 2007 (UTC)

Influence
Many of the bands cited as being influenced by Cooper are about the same age as him, which makes it a bit fishy. Maybe add the Beatles, Stones, Zep, Sabbath, Floyd and Madonna too to the list of his fans? I mean c'mon, KISS, UFO, Priest and Maiden Cooper fans? I don't have anything against him, but when those bands came out he was still pishing in diapers.
 * Alice Cooper has been making music since 1964. "KISS, UFO, Priest and Maiden" started AFTER Alice cooper. Please, get your facts straight before making a fool of yourself. Zanders5k 17:50, 28 September 2007 (UTC)

Response
That argument falls down when you consider artists and bands can be influenced by their peers. Lennon was influenced by Dylan and vice versa.

Most of Kiss, UFO, Priest and Maiden are younger than Alice so The Coop was hardly pissing in dipers when they came around.

Kiss though musically not in the same league as Cooper got the idea of theatrics from the master who in turn was influenced by Arthur Brown visually and The Doors and Yardbirds musically but what makes the Coop original is he fused the influences and also came up with something new. Something Madonna didn't do when she tried the electric chair.

The bands that came later that were really influenced by him were Guns n Roses and that whole LA Scene of the 1980's

Besides, it's unlikely that Madonna, Roger Waters, or the Stones are listening to him now after he insulted the anti-Bush crowd.

Born-again Christian
I heard somewhere Alice Cooper became a born-again Christian, but haven't verified it. I couldn've swore it was on Wikipedia but it isn't on here anymore. I do know that he's a member of Solid Rock (or its chair or something) and that he is indeed a Christian (verified by the interview at the bottom), but I specifically heard "born-again". Maybe I'll Google it. Эрон Кинней 10:54, 27 November 2005 (UTC)


 * He's been a Christian for a long time. He is a President and co-founder of the Solid Rock Foundation.Holford 00:51, 28 November 2005 (UTC)

There is a link to an article in the links section. Roadhockey 23:29, 23 March 2006 (UTC)

Shouldn't the article tell about Alice Cooper convertion to Born Again Christianity. I know he don't like to be a poster boy for born again Christianity because he want people to see Jesus and not him, but when Alice is a eageer born again Christian isn't it important that an article about him mentions the most importen thing in his life? 17. September 2006 01.33 modin Norway

I don't think the existing statements about his Christianity are accurate in that they portray his - Alice's - view or the point of view of one of his die-hard fans. Whether you think it is great or not he absolutely wears his religion on his sleeve and goes on about at at every available opportunity (but protests that he doesn't). This is worthy of comment, I think.71.168.143.252 18:29, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

You left this note for me:

Welcome to Wikipedia. We invite everyone to contribute constructively to our encyclopedia. Take a look at the welcome page if you would like to learn more about contributing. However, unconstructive edits are considered vandalism and are immediately reverted. If you continue in this manner you may be blocked from editing without further warning. Please stop, and consider improving rather than damaging the work of others. Thank you. 156.34.215.109 20:21, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

Stop being naughty, mister! (Or missus) ScarianTalk 21:50, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

--> I have read carefully the rules on contributing and, as you will see below, I have explained my rationale for the changes in the Alice Cooper page discussion forum (where, incidentally it has gone unanswered) - this is copied below:

I don't think the existing statements about his Christianity are accurate in that they portray his - Alice's - view or the point of view of one of his die-hard fans. Whether you think it is great or not he absolutely wears his religion on his sleeve and goes on about at at every available opportunity (but protests that he doesn't). This is worthy of comment, I think.71.168.143.252 18:29, 31 July 2007 (UTC) ENDS

Now, I'm actually a big Alice fan but the previous page text is simply opinion which, in my opinion, does not reflect the facts. The contribution I have made is not vandalism it is an improvement - or, at the very least, a reasonable contribution to the debate.

The fact that someone else disagrees appears to be an inherent part of the whole Wikipedia deal.

As my early contribution to the talk page shows I am happy to discuss the merits. I am less happy to be banned by people (page contributors and yourself) who have refused to engage on the merits of the case and simply deleted my - quite reasonable - changes.

Look forward to your reply. I'll place this text on the discussion page for Alice Cooper.71.168.143.252

How many examples of Alice bringing up his Christianity with no lead at all from the interviewer do you need to make the 'doesn't like to boast of his Christianity' point moot?
 * ?You're taking a simple referenced quote, changing the ref source to your own personal webpage(see WP:COI, WP:RS) and altering the meaning of what is really a short simple paragraph into your own personal pov. (see WP:ATT, WP:NPOV). Wikipedia isn't your personal soapbox(see WP:SOAP) There are plenty of blogs and chatrooms for you to use to argue your point. Wikipedia isn't one of them. WP:NPOV, WP:ATT and WP:CITE are all policies that must be adhered to. If you son't want to take the time to read them... your contributions aren't req'd here. 156.34.221.221 21:38, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

This isn't much of an arguement.

The article says "Although he doesn't like to boast in his religion," - this is a)not referenced, b)a clear and controversial opinion, c)blatantly untrue as evidenced by the large number of interviews where he brings it up.

So it's hard to see why disputing that - on the merits - is personal soapboxing or, in itself, a personal point of view. It isn't.

Likewise he cannot be said to be avoiding celebrity Christianity when he consistently invites attention to the fact that he is a Christian and has been healed etc.

A great example is the 'Enough Rope' interview that I referenced. He brings his religion into the interview for no reason and then goes on about it.

I can compromise on the second paragraph which is, I suppose, a POV about his career tanking when he became born again (although there are plenty of critics who agree and the case is fairly solid) but I will absoluteley return again and again to switch the plainly untrue and POV "Although he doesn't like to boast in his religion" - which frankly sounds as if it was written by someone with an agenda.

And, please, can we avoid the whole 'your input isn't req'd' rant. I think you'll agree that, on reflection, it comes across as a bit precious. It's only the internet. I'm not a Wikipedia nerd - nor do I want to be. I won't use the correct acronyms or whatever - but I will have a cogent debate on what is a reasonable description of something that is just propaganda.

Your thoughts?


 * To remove opinion from the paragraph and avoid broaching WP:ATT the paragraph would simply say:
 * Alice Cooper has confirmed in interviews that he is in fact a born again Christian. He claims to avoid "celebrity Christianity" stating: "it's really easy to focus on Alice Cooper and not on Christ. I'm a rock singer. I'm nothing more than that. I'm not a philosopher. I consider myself low on the totem pole of knowledgeable Christians. So, don't look for answers from me." 
 * If you could find an opposing view to his personal claim of "humble Christian" it could be added as an opposing view to Cooper's statements. But it has to be a cited opinion from a reliable source... not some chatroom or blog. A verifiable news report from a reputable media source... etc. It can't be editor opinion as that is original research and also vios WP:NPOV. It's an encyclopedia(or tries to be) it needs to be free of poetic adjectives and personal opinions. Just cold, boring, dull... but verifiable text.
 * Sound better? 156.34.221.221 00:06, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

chickens
Before the "Sn0wflake" yokel goes and reverts a revert, I'll take the time to point out that: (a) if linking a word in an article is "vandalism", then please tell me _right now_, with direct references to official wikipedia policy, and I'll never, ever, link again -- otherwise, I say this "Sn0wflake" dude owes me an apology (which he can place on my talk page in suitable typeface) for a baseless accusation, and (b) the reason why I link to chicken is that, despite the unfortunate consequences to the chicken, the link adds to the general hilarity of the story related in the paragraph. Anyone who has watched the famous episode "Turkey's Away" on the old WKRP series knows what I am talking about. Indeed, the similarity makes one wonder about provenance of the WKRP joke... mdf 22:34, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

politics
I have taken out the word "actually". This suggests, with no reason that I can see, that it is a surprise that Alice Cooper is a Republican.

note the "politics" section is removed. I've heard he's good friends with John McCain?

Yes but mainly because they are golfers Jprw (talk) 11:53, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

wiki-links
cleaned up a few wiki-links in the article(or tried too) Some had been sitting 'in the red' for quite some time. Until someone actually takes the next step and creates a proper bio for the individual, there's no sense in having a link for them. Also tried to have just 1 wiki-link per person. How many wiki-links does Dick Wagner actually need? He;s listed(with a link) in the main article. I removed the link in the year-by-year listings. Having second thoughts on that one though. Anybody else think it should be put back? Feel free if there's a valid reason for it. Cheers! Mr Pyles 18:38, 19 February 2006 (UTC)

Fans
I checked the Alice Cooper website, and I didn't see anything about Alice being one of Dylan's "favorite" songwriters. It says Dylan said, "I think Alice Cooper is an overlooked songwriter." I'm changing it.

Early ACG
Hi, new here. I,ve noticed no mention of early ACG venue's except the Hollywood location. I don't know how to edit the main article right now, so if someone wants to post the info, they can. I grew up in a Detroit suburb and have a wealth of info on many of the area's local one hit wonders to mega-stars since I used to sell instruments and accessories at a large music store in the area at the time. Many DSO musicians, as well as Motown, and local artists along with major stars would visit when in the area. The ACG came into our store before "I'm Eighteen" launced their careers. They were playing local venue's getting their "act" together. I was invited to see their concert/show at Aquinas High School, in Southgate, Mi. They played there a few times as well as the "Chatter Box" and other small venue's including the Michigan State Fair. Their show opened when the lights went down and Neal Smith and Dennis Dunaway took their places to start "Sun Arise" as their lighting tech Charlie would manipulate the lights in time with the beat. As Buxton, Bruce and Alice came out of the shadows and took their places, Alice came to front center stage, got on one knee with a hammer in hand, and proceeded to beat the floor with the hammer in time with the tom's. Once he brought the microphone to his mouth, the light would hit hit him and he began as well as the whole band. Actually, I prefer their earlier performances over the harsher tones adopted later as they developed. All in all though, they had a stage presence that was better than the music, eventually, as they became seasoned performers, and their material more commercialized, a blend of the old and new emerged into what they were until 1974. I still like their small venue performances better, but I had the benefit of being their up close and personal several times. Hope this helps if someone wants to fit a small sentence or paragraph into a venue section.Organizedconfusion 23:32, 10 April 2006 (UTC)Organizedconfusion

Public Service Annoucement
Alice Cooper appeared in a well made PSA some time in the 90's. He was following some guy around who was mowing his lawn. The upshot of it was that the guy should have been spending time with his son (daughter?) because (as they cut to Alice in full makeup) "you don't want the kid growing up to be some kind of freak." Anyway, I thought the spot was well made and carried a good message. I'd like to see someone, who knows the facts, write paragraph on that. Thx

-I think the commercial was banned for some reason or something. I downloaded the commercial and it was labeled as "banned alice cooper commercial"


 * Well, I found the commercial: . And judging from the narrator, it seems like it was just a commercial for a hotel. Not a PSA. Cooper has appeared in a couple of commercials over the years. MB 06:59, 15 July 2006 (UTC)

Youth center
Does anybody know anything about this Youth that he will be a part of ? All I know is that it is supposed to be at Grand Canyon University.ONEder Boy 02:41, 4 August 2006 (UTC)

Radio
On this article it says that he recently joined Philidelphia's WMGK, so I checked the site and sure enough he did: 10PM-1AM. But he's also on Tucson's KLPX from 7PM-12AM... how's that work? --Koen the Mole 03:23, 19 August 2006 (UTC)

His radio show is recorded during the day, either from his home or mor reccently is tour bus, and is syndicated all over the world at night. - Uncle Dorko

I've read that there is a fued between Alice and Gary Lewis of Gary Lewis and the Playboys. Does anyone know why? I guess its jealousy becuase Alice had to start out at pits like the Rainbow Room and The Whiskey NOT at a lounge at the Disneyland hotel. Has Alice ever played any lounge bars in the Phillipines?

infobox.
i placed a better infobox for this article. can someone plesae add all the infomation that you can to it please? thanks. dposse 18:53, 23 October 2006 (UTC)

Sheryl Cooper merge
Someone has created a page on Sheryl Cooper, but I don't see that see meets WP:BIO in her own right. This article actually already has more info on her, so a merge would basically just be a redirect. NickelShoe (Talk) 18:57, 28 December 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree. Redirect done. --Bejnar 18:09, 30 December 2006 (UTC)

Cooperstown?
Why no mention of his restaurant, Cooperstown?

Sources and references
The article appears to be very light on citations and source material. Most of what's written here seems to be based on "generally known" fan material rather than authoritative sources. -- Cain Mosni (talk||contribs) 13:30, 9 January 2007 (UTC)

Genre
Cooper's 60's and 70's music is not heavy metal. It's glam rock/shock rock. Cooper's "metal"-period began in 1986 with Constrictor. The article says that "Cooper drew equally from heavy metal, horror movies and vaudeville". Someone should fix that...
 * The genre's are well referenced and the opening lead in statement is cited as well using a reference that meets all WP:V and WP:CITE criteria. The genre is more than valid and removing it would just be incorrect/uncited POV. 156.34.142.110 17:30, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

It seems people with mullets who are not familiar with Alice Cooper keep changing it. It says garage rock in the reference, not heavy metal. They were associated with the Detroit garage rock movement and glam rock, as the original poster said. Heavy metal experimentation began in the 80s for Cooper as a solo artist and was far less significant. - Daddy Kindsoul 14:14, 21 April 2007 (UTC)


 * And there are people under the age of 15 who can't read references either? Wikipedia is not about personal POV(especially incorrect ones) Pick up any book about heavy metal... Alice Cooper is first chapter. Watch any documentary made about the subject... Alice Cooper is the prime spokeperson. Verifiability always wins out over incorrect opinion. And Alice Cooper not being heavy metal... is definitely false. 142.167.77.147 14:22, 21 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree. EagleFan 13:30, 23 April 2007 (UTC)

Yes. Cooper is heavy metal. But only in the end of 1980's. And then there are Brutal Planet and Dragontown which are industrial. VFurnier


 * Regardless of it being POV or sourced (the later being ideal), some work needs to be done as listing 8 genres is ridiculous. The point is not to show every genre that Alice Cooper has ever played, but to say IN A NUTSHELL what music genre he belonged to. If one or more albums was not of his usual genre then it should be mentioned in the page dedicated to that particular album.

—The preceding unsigned comment was added by GBobly (talk • contribs) 19:22, 29 April 2007 (UTC).
 * Agreed, superfluity removed. 156.34.218.199 20:07, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

There are five genres that has to be in the info-box. Those are hard rock, heavy metal, shock rock, glam rock and garage rock. Cooper has had a glam rock image over 40 years. And he has more glam rock-albums than shock rock-albums. In the glam rock article it is said that "However, it was Alice Cooper, also from the Detroit rock scene, who first combined the key components of glam rock in the late 1960s when they presented hard rock music with a 'transvestite' look and a provocative, theatrical stage show." Glam rock belongs there. Absolutely... VFurnier
 * Sounds OK (- the garage rock), if the original poster who requested the ext4ra crap be cleaned up wishes to add concensus it will be set in stone. 156.34.142.110 17:34, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Is it ok that I put garage rock back in the genre? I did it because the band played garage rock between 1965 and 1974. I just saw an old document of Alice Cooper, where he said something like this: "We played hard rock and garage rock with shock elements. Plus we were the first and the most hideous glam rock band ever." I put garage rock on the genre after hard rock and I put heavy metal last on the list. I did that because Cooper didn't mention that they were heavy metal band. Do you agree?


 * VFurnier is right about Cooper only playing metal in the 80s and then again on Dragontown & Brutal Planet. The most highly regarded parts of Cooper's discography (the early stuff) as other users has said is garage rock & glam rock (hense why those should be the primary genres)..... nothing to do with heavy metal. Because of the fanbase Cooper has acumilated since the 80s with his solo records though, its basically a lost cause... Alice Cooper will be written on Wikipedia as "heavy metal" (basically the period where he was considered a joke), while the critically claimed garage rock albums like Killer, Love It To Death, Billion Dollar Babies will go all but ignored here. - The Daddy 07:07, 11 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Alice Cooper is heavy metal. He's been heavy metal since the day he pitched the chicken in Toronto. Young, inexperienced and musically impaired people seem to have a hard time understanding that. Cooper is the spokeperson for the genre. He is the central figure in every book and documentary thats been done on the subject. It's a valid genre and it's verifiable. 216.21.150.44 10:25, 11 May 2007 (UTC)


 * You seem like the inexperienced one young Sir. Garage rock came long before heavy metal, as did Furnier who released his first single in 1966. Experts place the first heavy metal release at the door of Black Sabbath or Blue Cheer their first releases were put out in 1968 and 1970 respectively.... which is after the subject of the article's first ever release (yet critics don't state that Furnier started heavy metal in 1966, why? because he was a garage rock artist). He only started experimenting with heavy metal in the mid-to latter part of the 1980s.


 * Learn your music history, or don't edit music articles. They were a garage rock and glam rock band, as stated above, Vincent has voiced this in interviews and even wrote a song about the scene mentioning other garage rock and glam rock acts such as Ziggy Stardust, MC5, Iggy Pop (of the Stooges).
 * If you want to live in a fantasy world where a couple of unaclaimed albums recorded two decades into Cooper's career where he was experimenting with a style, defines him as his primary genre, then that is your perogative, but keep it out of encyclopedias. - The Daddy 19:48, 11 May 2007 (UTC)


 * I have to say this. Daddy Kindsoul is so damn right. I think that just italian, finnish and spanish wikipedia has the right genres in the infobox.

Hard rock and heavy metal belongs to the genre. But those should be last on the list because Glam rock and Shock rock are much important genres to Cooper. Shock rock should be first because Alice is best known for that. After Shock rock there should be Glam rock, Garage rock, Hard rock and Heavy metal last on the list because he has only 6 metal albums out of 24. And the new "Along came a spider" is going to be even more garage rock than The Eyes of Alice Cooper or Dirty Diamonds. - JNCooper
 * Why the hell some people started to delete New Wave from the infobox in the articles of Flush the Fashion, Special Forces, Zipper Catches Skin and DaDa? With those four releases Cooper abandoned his old shock rock style and started to find a new style. I wish that new wave would stay there because Cooper talks about those albums as "the new wave period". JNCooper —Preceding comment was added at 17:33, 7 April 2008 (UTC)

Shock rock should be first
I think that shock rock should be the first genre on the infobox, because Cooper is the inventor of that style. Everyone knows Cooper as the inventor of shock rock and thats why I think it's the most important genre of all five. Do you agree with me? - JNCooper

Yes. Good comment. Jprw (talk) 06:47, 13 May 2008 (UTC)


 * And that would be incorrect since even Alice Cooper himself has stated he was influenced by other "over-the-top" theatrical rock artists including Arthur Brown. 156.34.216.139 10:36, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

1965 or 1966?
It is said in the text that The Earwigs was formed in 1965. So that means that Cooper's career began in 1965.

Discography/Filmography Reorganization
I think that the discography section especially needs to be reorganized. Reason being that numerous concert films are being listed in there, when they should technically be posted under filmography. Additionally, I feel that such films (Strange Case of Alice Cooper, Alice Cooper: Trashes the World, etc.) should be recategorized into "#### films" or something similar instead of "#### albums" as they currently are listed as, simply because they aren't albums, nor were soundtracks for said films released on cassette/disc at any point. --Dbm11085 06:28, 19 March 2007 (UTC)

Where is Garage rock?
It's said in the reference that "Cooper drew equally from horror movie, vaudeville, heavy metal and garage rock..." In the wikipedia article it's just said "Cooper drew equally from heavy metal, horror movies and vaudeville..." Everytime I try to put Garage rock in it...somebody takes it off. Garage should be there if the reference says so...

picture
can we get a differnt picture? this one is very un-alice.I am Paranoid 01:38, 4 May 2007 (UTC)
 * There are no free-use images available at Wiki-commons and no images that meet Fair Use policy criteria. The only ones that people seem to want to upload are blatant copyvio pics from external websites and adding them is akin to vandalism and they just get reported and deleted. 156.34.226.76 02:18, 4 May 2007 (UTC)


 * http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=Alice+Cooper&l=4 I don't have time to do any harvesting now.  You can check CC-BY-SA too. gren グレン 23:55, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Deletion of Early Life info
Wondering why Anonymous (138.217.134.217) took out all the background info and family history a few days ago (right after interview on NPR's Fresh Air program)? MaterTerribilis 05:09, 19 May 2007 (UTC)

Alice Cooper Group needs its own article
Jimi Hendrix has an article for the The Jimi Hendrix Experience, so the Alice Cooper Group needs one too. This will help any confusion regarding his solo albums and what was a band. - The Daddy 08:32, 12 August 2007 (UTC)

merge proposal
Steven (Alice Cooper character) might be best placed (after clean-up) into the main article. Yes the main article is already long, but the Steven (Alice Cooper character) article could be much reduced. If not merged, Steven (Alice Cooper character) could at least be linked as a related article. Canuckle 17:07, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

THE CROW
The comic book and film character 'The Crow' created by James O' Barr has make-up very similar to that of Alice Cooper. Should that not be mentioned as an influence?Iamnotapanda 16:36, 18 September 2007 (UTC)iamnotapanda 18.9.07
 * That would be unreferenced personal opinion and original research. 156.34.142.110 17:24, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

When the band started?
Is it right that they started as The Earwigs in March 1964 like it says here? http://www.sickthingsuk.co.uk/timelines/t-pre-cooper.php If that's true we have to change in the infobox that they started in 1964. Could some talented user do it? Thanx... JNCooper

Album cover
Can someone tell me who the artist/s is/are who did the covers of The Last Temptation, Brutal Planet and Dragontown? Thanks. -Freekee 04:45, 24 September 2007 (UTC)

I'm not sure about the last two, but Dave McKean (best known for his work with Neil Gaiman) did the album cover for The Last Temptation. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 80.56.35.62 (talk) 21:53, 6 December 2007 (UTC)

Date of birth
I believe the birth date in the article (Feb. 4, 1948) is correct. There are, however, some websites that say Cooper was born on Christmas Day, 1945. Examples: If anyone knows how this incorrect date got into circulation, it might be an interesting addition to the article. JamesMLane t c 03:27, 30 December 2007 (UTC)
 * http://www.santas.net/generalchristmasfacts4.htm
 * http://www.nicesitedesign.com/feature/christmas/born/
 * I believe that Cooper himself knows when he is born. He has alwasy said that he is born in 1948. Those two websites are damn wrong. JNCooper —Preceding comment was added at 10:02, 2 January 2008 (UTC)

Steven
Would some fellow Alice Cooper fans/Wikipedians look at the Steven (Alice Cooper Character) article? I adore Alice, but cannot help but feel that the article is inappropriate for Wikipedia. It is song lyrics interspersed with personal interpretation. A lot of "It is believed...", no real references. Maybe we can help turn it into an acceptable article, or follow through with Canuckle's merge suggestion above. SkyllaLaFey (talk) 00:51, 16 January 2008 (UTC)

Was that Alice Cooper in that Superbowl commercial?
yes he was —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.219.194.147 (talk) 16:08, 18 February 2008 (UTC)

Was that Alice Cooper in that Superbowl commercial, or my imagination?? &mdash; talk § Arsenic99 01:37, 4 February 2008 (UTC)

Hello Mr. cooper it is my pleaser being able to send a famous rocker like your an e- mail My name is stacy lee turpen i'm a 42 year old whom loves rock and roll it is a pation of mine i like billion dollar baby,eighteen,scools out.Mr cooper your are an artist and i envy what you do. I love rock -n-roll and can sing extreamly well, but because of my disfunctional upbringing is south phoenix, and all the negitive surroundings my nurotic state left me unable to persue. I —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.98.122.125 (talk) 03:57, 5 February 2008 (UTC)

Alice Cooper Interview
I had an interview link on this page but due to to some well intended but but poor editing it (on my part) it was removed. Alice recalls many of the stories sighted in this article in first hand accounts. I think this interview would be very beneficial to his Bio. He talks about his Faith, His work with his charity to keep kids in school, the "chicken story" and my other biographical points. I would like to repost. How would I go about getting permission to post the interview again?Michellewho (talk) 14:07, 3 April 2008 (UTC)

How best to deal with the proseline problems which are spoiling the Alice Cooper article on Wikipedia
I have rewritten the entry for the 1990s in such a way that, in my view, does not detract from the content, but goes a considerable way to solving the proseline issue which is now at the head of the article [as of 30/04/08].

However, the section for the 2000s stands out like a sore thumb, and matters are not helped by certain contributors persisting in posting inappropriate content and exacerbating the problem with the proseline.

I suggest that responsible editors and people who genuinely care about having a good article on Alice Cooper make a concerted effort soon to deal with the problem of proseline, and, specifically, the section on the 2000s as of 30/04/2008. The Alice Cooper article has the makings of being an excellent stand-out article on Wikipedia; it is such a shame that the head of the article has to refer to the problem of a proseline, and that there are repeat offenders out there who are obviously uninterested in solving the problem.

Please message me with any suggestions.

Together we'll make it good. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jprw (talk • contribs) 09:21, 30 April 2008 (UTC)

Politics
on politics it says "Things took a dramatic turn" I am not sure that is accurate. Cooper does not believe rock stars should endorse politicians, and expressed such. Thats not really a change from his philosophy. 12.156.208.3 (talk) 21:58, 2 May 2008 (UTC)

In the context of Cooper's stance on the question of politics it was a dramatic turn - the fact that he had to make a public statement for the first time in his career shows this Jprw (talk) 06:49, 13 May 2008 (UTC)

Proseline Problem - Updates
The glaring box at the head of the Alice Cooper article continues to highlight the fact that there are serious proseline problems with the Alice Cooper article on Wikipedia. However, I have made a number of amendments to the 2000s section (which I earlier identified as sticking out like a sore thumb) today, which, I hope, go a considerable way to rectifying this. In dealing with the 2000s section, I have reclassified all the recognition/awards Cooper received into a logically suitable introduction at the beginning, deleted some portions which, frankly, are irrelevant, and moved other parts to different sections within the article. As always, any comments are gratefully received. Thanks. Jprw (talk) 10:02, 14 May 2008 (UTC)

I've cleaned up the article again a bit today, though this has mainly been grammar and style. There are still proseline issues in the article, though I believe my recent work has greatly reduced these. There is still considerable work to be done, however - and the next big step after cleaing up the proseline issues comprehensively will be to reference the first section of the article. I think I may need to get my hands on the book Golf Monster to facilitate this, though)) Jprw (talk) 08:37, 15 May 2008 (UTC)

I removed the proseline box myself on the 24th of June 2008, as I felt that it was no longer warrantedJprw (talk) 15:10, 26 June 2008 (UTC)

After it took some twenty odd years???
Newpapering and blogging cheapens Wikipedia. That type of content is OK for a teen fanpage or a school newspaper. But it looks bad here. Wiki is rampant with it. It should all be cleaned up. Libs (talk) 18:48, 19 May 2008 (UTC)
 * While I'm not keen on the content I should point out it was sourced from The Japan Times, a reliable source. -- Neil N   talk  ♦  contribs  18:56, 19 May 2008 (UTC)

I couldn't agree more. At the moment the article has repeat offenders posting news information from Japan and Australia. Without mentioning any names, I've tried reasoning with the 'editors' in question, but they just carry on regardless. The only thing responsible editors can do is remove the stuff they post, which detracts seriously from the article (which is at last starting to look good), as soon as they see it posted. Jprw (talk) 06:03, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

Well, lets see if the newest addition won't upset anyone. I see no problems with it. Isn't this about adding current informative knowledge to the reader on Wikipedia? Being ignorant to up-to-date facts is a not good thing. I had the source up there from the start. Reliable and informative information about the subject in question. Expectations are met with that, and adding a significant influence to Wikipedia new and old editors. To make this a better place. This experiance with a reliable sourced addition has opened my eyes wide on the encyclopedia's environment. Offender? I am puzzled about this whole affair. I had no idea that I was so youthful at the age of fifty. Electric Japan (talk)


 * Re-added content was still an out of place news blog. I don't think it matters how it is written. Or that it is sourced. It's just a piece of non-notable news trivia that sticks out like a sore thumb. If there were an article about that specific tour then that content would have a better fit. But stumped into an article about Cooper's long career it just doesn't look good. It's a "who cares" entry. And the article is fine without it. Fair Deal (talk) 10:13, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

Electric Japan Concedes Defeat
I'M TOSSING IN THE TOWEL.....

Alice Cooper in the Pacific Region: I can't believe that it has come to this. Someone has an angry point of view on the subject of Alice Cooper. I have to grit my teeth when it comes to having to even type this out. Making a uproar about music isn't my cup of tea. What’s the proper way to deal with information on Wikipedia when it is true? I really can't understand the issue here when I see no dIffrence from the other information already posted. I understand this is somebody with an opinion who has taken it too seriously when it comes to Alice Cooper. I call it nit-picking. I have not once discarded anyone's text. I have only complemented it with additional grammar that fits the article. I thought Cooper's career would want to be covered in every aspect on Wikipedia? I kinda got that impression when I had read all the details already covered in the article. I thought I would add some additional information that was relevant to the article. Ever since that day it has been deleted repeatedly. I can't possibly think of a good reason to make a fuss over music. Remember, I never deleated anything about the article in question. This is about self-publishing, and about the truth on the subject. I find it funny that when it comes to music on Wikipedia, its all about criticism on what to add. Arguing about music is beyond embarrassing. Childish. I am almost 50 years old and have no time to play a game about somebody's prefrences. I don't think I have anything to prove about this now. I certainly think that adding more relevant information about the topic is only accentuating the article more. What is the diffrence between my text and the text that was already there. Absoloutely nothing, except that mine is about the Pacific region. I will say that its greatly improved when there is an additional inclusion of information about the subect. Up-to-date and revised without no faulty information is all I did. What is wrong with that? How can I reinforce that anymore? Electric Japan (talk) 15:38, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

The posting is inappropriate for an encyclopedic article (which is what a Wikipedia article in fact is). The posting is, however, completely consistent with the type of material found on a 'latest news' section on a fans website. If you can understand this difference, you will see why your posting is not suitable for the Alice Cooper article. All best wishes from a fellow AC fan Jprw (talk) 11:03, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

Electric Japan, also see Wikipedia is not a blog, webspace provider, social networking, or memorial site section at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:What_Wikipedia_is_not. Good luck!

Electric Japan, quick question: Are you insane?

Do I write like I'm in the middle of a mental break-down?

I bet you're happy I am outta here now. Anyway, I have more time to learn how to play the accordion.

Electric Japan (talk) 10:11, 25 May 2008 (UTC)

Referencing
I've taken some time out today to clear up a lot of referencing inaccuracies in the article. There were lots of them.Jprw (talk) 11:05, 23 May 2008 (UTC)

The confusion over how songs, albums should be denoted in the text (it turns out that songs should be in quotation marks, and albums in italics) has now been resolved, and the article now conforms to Wiki standards on this Jprw (talk) 09:26, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

Family Religious History clarification
I see it's gone now, but this page used to say his family members were Mormons. This was part of the contradicting information I was getting when initially trying to learn about him a few months ago - Wikipedia isn't the only site to claim his family was Mormon. His book explicitly states that two references could easily be mistaken for Mormon (the name of the church, and his... grandfather's?... middle name, Maroni (sp?)), but that to his family, calling them Mormon would have been fighting words. Given that multiple sites have erroneously called his family Mormon and that this information even came onto Wikipedia, perhaps it would be good to work in an explicit statement to the contrary, with reference to the page of Golf Monster that talks about it? Kilyle (talk) 08:40, 15 June 2008 (UTC)

Yes, I agree. Golf Monster isn't actually referenced at all in the article - something that obviously needs correcting. Jprw (talk) 11:50, 20 June 2008 (UTC)

There's also something in this article about his grandfather and father being leaders in the "Church of Jesus Christ" which is one of many break-aways from the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints" - the original mormon church. I was also curious to find an actual link between Cooper and THE Mormon Church, but this looks more like a rebelious son of a way-out cult, which is a break of from a mainstream, global cult. It's not the sort of thing a lot of people are looking for. It's a bit more like Micheal jackson's rebelion from his father, who is a JW. That is NOT to say the Mormon chuch, original, or its break-aways, don't have some freaky stuff to hide, but you won't find something like a high profile, super-freak being directly involved in the Mormon Church. For more, go to something like: ||www.salamandersociety.com|| or loads of other links. lllewelll  —Preceding undated comment was added at 14:58, 15 December 2008 (UTC).

Yes, I'm also interested in the accuracy of this link. I can readily see that a "confusing us with Mormons - them's fighting words" attitude would also apply to a splinter group, but I got the impression from the book that they were completely separate from Mormons, which may mean that the link is not accurate. Does his family and the group they're from hold The Book of Mormon as holy scripture or not? I'd think this point is a rather important indicator of whether the link is correct or not. But I don't really know how to get the information without directly asking him. Kilyle (talk) 19:15, 9 January 2009 (UTC)

"He was ranked #20 on VH1's Greatest Artists of Hard Rock program"
Do we really want this in the introduction? The problem is that the ranking isn't so high, and the second problem is that Kiss are number 10 in the same list. Yet, in terms of originality, innovation, musical versiality, longevity, and quality of musical output, Kiss would, according to the vast majority of music critics, be considered inferior to Cooper in every respect. Therefore, isn't this ranking not only inaccurate, but also denigrating to Cooper? Jprw (talk) 08:10, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

Have just removed the 'offending article' Jprw (talk) 08:13, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

Bootleg albums
Here's a list, missing at least one because there's none with him singing "Goin' to the River" or "Ain't that just like a woman". My sister had (may still have) an LP with those two and other songs. http://www.sickthingsuk.co.uk/bootlegs/bootlegs.php —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bizzybody (talk • contribs) 21:56, 31 August 2008 (UTC)

Cooper's political views
The article states that Cooper has "consistently" avoided revealing his political views. However, suggests that Cooper revealed his support for Bush in the 2004 campaign. Anyone disagree? Darimoma (talk) 15:03, 17 October 2008 (UTC)


 * He recently mentioned he goes "from Democrat to Republican", but had supportive words for Sarah Palin. He also said "I'm not political at all" in another interview the past week - see The Hour 15 October 2008 (video http://www.cbc.ca/thehour or the program's YouTube channel, discussion after the 13:50 mark there) Dl2000 (talk) 00:34, 18 October 2008 (UTC)

http://www.hour.ca/music/music.aspx?iIDArticle=15739 is the correct reference. I agree that this can be worked somewhow into the Religion and politics section, but Darimona it shouldn't completely dominate the sectionJprw (talk) 17:38, 27 October 2008 (UTC)


 * How about the current revision? My problems with the old version are: 1, It claims "he has consistently kept his political views to himself" - which is unsourced, and seems to be incorrect. 2, It uses the words "treasonous morons" in quote marks, implying that Cooper himself used the phrase, but nowehere in either article does he actually put the two words together - he just accuses them of treason, and calls all rock stars morons. Darimoma (talk) 00:37, 28 October 2008 (UTC)

Arthur Brown
In the opening paragraphs the writer(s) source an article that credits Cooper with "first introduced horror imagery to rock'n'roll, and whose stagecraft and showmanship have permanently transformed the genre". This is not particularly accurate as his macabre stage presence was based on Arthur Brown, whose stage antics were several years prior to Cooper's success. I didn't know where or how to clarify this but only mentioning it as an aside here. For evidence of this, one need only reference the Top Of The Pops clip of "Fire" by Arthur Brown on YouTube. ZincOrbie (talk) 02:00, 23 December 2008 (UTC)--