Talk:Alien vs. Predator/Archive 1

Origin of the crossover
"The idea for such a cross-over is often thought to have originated from a supposed Xenomorph skull seen as a Predator's trophy in Predator 2, but Dark Horse Comics published their first Alien vs. Predator story in November 1989, a year before the November 1990 release of Predator 2."

Surely the making of Predator 2 took place before November 1989, if it was released in 1990. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 163.1.159.21 (talk) 02:55, 24 October 2004 (UTC)


 * Well, doesn't a comic take time to think up and draw, too? It's impossible to say when the idea of AvP was first imagined (unless the guy who thought of it tells us himself), so maybe identifying the first released product is the next best thing... Clueless 15:07, Dec 2, 2004 (UTC)


 * The behind-the-scenes documentary for the "Predator II" special edition DVD said the Xenomorph skull was a reference to the comic.SpartanGlory1983 (talk) 09:58, 15 April 2008 (UTC) SpartanGlory1983

"Fictional science fiction"
You know, fictional science fiction is pretty redundant. There's a reason I took it out before. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Mauipsyko (talk • contribs) 21:18, 2 September 2004 (UTC)

Computer game
I worked on a brief outline of a computer game aimed at the ST/Amiga market at the end of 89/beginning 90 which was based on the premise of Alien v Predator. It came to nothing however and can't remember who requested the design and if other developers were asked for submissions. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.8.248.2 (talk) 15:37, 13 July 2006 (UTC)

Plot summary
There's no plot summary. That would be a nice addition. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.37.11.229 (talk) 23:56, 4 April 2007 (UTC)

CCG
In the list of AVP works, I see no reference to the AVP CCG. Is it worth adding? 85.210.36.35 19:10, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

Article name
Shouldn't the name of this article be "Aliens vs. Predator series", as most of the AVP media go with the Alien name as singular? Funkynusayri (talk) 17:16, 25 November 2007 (UTC)

avh
i think the alien vs hunter section isnt neccecary,sure its a ripoff but this is about avp NOT avp ripoffs.Consensus anyone? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.244.81.60 (talk) 17:26, 6 February 2008 (UTC) Agreed. SpartanGlory1983 (talk) 09:59, 15 April 2008 (UTC) SpartanGlory1983

Action figures subsection
I just created a subsection in this article for action figures. Since all the subsections have a variation of "Alien vs. Predator" in the title, I'm not sure what to name the figures section. Kenner's figure line was called Aliens vs. Predator, but McFarlane's later lines were Alien vs. Predator (no "s"). Also, I'm curious if the unproduced animated series Operation: Aliens deserves its own article. Cale (talk) 20:55, 9 February 2008 (UTC)

Cube Movie Series
The moving cubes in the pyramid is a borrowing from the Cube movie series. Which means this is a cross of three not two movie franchises: Alien, Predator & Cube. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Miamidot (talk • contribs) 19:47, 28 March 2008 (UTC)


 * You'd need to be able to prove that using relaible sources, even then it would only be a minor link, although possibly worth mentioning in a "links with other franchises" section if we had any other examples. (Emperor (talk) 20:48, 28 March 2008 (UTC))

Image copyright problem with Image:AvP1.jpg
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speculation
"is often thought.." is just speculation. Whose thoughts are these? It makes no sense —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.76.60.163 (talk) 17:31, 15 November 2008 (UTC)

FA July 23
This article shouldn't be listed in that page. OboeCrack (talk) 12:26, 20 July 2009 (UTC)


 * It's not. You're thinking of Alien vs. Predator (film). --IllaZilla (talk) 20:18, 20 July 2009 (UTC)

Predator 2
In the predator 2 movie we have a scene showing Alien's skull, hinting at aliens beiing part of that movie's universe. Shouldn't it be mentioned in the article? 178.36.62.94 (talk) 19:29, 23 March 2010 (UTC)


 * It is mentioned. Read the second sentence of the "History" section. --IllaZilla (talk) 19:40, 23 March 2010 (UTC)

Article title and Proper name of the franchise
The article should be titled "Aliens vs. Predator" as that is the copyrighted, registered form of the name currently being used for this franchise by its owner, in all its released merchandise, and the one closest to the most common form of the name throughout the history of the series.

Yes a number of names have been used throughout the history of the "brand," but most of them have used Aliens in plural.

The reason for this is that the original comic book series "Aliens versus Predator" was a bringing together of the two licenses Dark Horse Comics had acquired by 1989, "Aliens" and "Predator." The reason Dark Horse titled their comics "Aliens" (plural) was because their comics were licensed sequels to the James Cameron film "Aliens" and directly continued the story from that film. Also, like the Cameron film, the content of the stories for those original comics and for most of the franchise always features multiple aliens, unlike the original Ridley Scott film 'Alien.'

So, Dark Horse brought the brands together and they brought them together as "Aliens versus Predator" and not "Alien versus Predator."

The name confusion mostly comes from the early video games. Since 1993, there have been numerous video games which have used variations on the name, even there the norm for the past 10 years has been to use Aliens (plural) in the title.

From 1993-1994 the 4 earliest video games (two arcade and two console games) did start off using the title Alien vs. Predator. And from 2004-2007, a series of 4 mobile phone games were produced as "Alien vs. Predator". But as of 1999, the video games proper for all the standard game consoles started using the comic book form of "Aliens versus Predator" for 4 video games until 2003, which then switched to conform with the AvP films which by then were at "Aliens vs. Predator: Requiem," thus the 2 "Aliens vs. Predator" video games since have included a video game adaptation and a new title in 2010.

Total tally, 8 early or ancillary games using "Alien" and 6 major games using "Aliens".

The first AVP film was titled "Alien vs. Predator." The sequel was "Aliens vs. Predator: Requiem." So that's one apiece.

In the comics, to quote the wikipedia page on the subject: "Note that the comics (and most material in the franchise) are entitled Aliens Versus Predator rather than Alien vs. Predator."

Since 1989, 16 comics series and stories have used Aliens in plural, first as "Aliens versus Predator" and recently shifted to "Aliens vs. Predator" for the AVP Three World War story. But also, as of 2008 when Dark Horse started reprinting all of the comics in collected form for their 2 Omnibus editions, all titles have been changed to the current accepted form of "Aliens vs. Predator." So that's 18 titles all using Aliens, plural form. From 1994-1999, 3 novels were also published as "Aliens vs. Predator."

So over the course of the history of the imprint, "Aliens" has been used 28 times, and "Alien" has been used 10 times. The original form was "Aliens" and the current form is "Aliens." "Alien" was only used briefly for a number of video games and one movie.

This article is about the verifiable, accurate facts about this franchise, not your own personal opinion on what it should be called. Your reasoning that using "'Alien' is easier" is a completely arbitrary judgement and doesn't enter into it.

Also, in case one notices, currently on the Dark Horse Comics AVP zone, there is currently a subtitle that uses the words in singular, which is also trademarked by Dark Horse. Dark Horse is the owner of the license and can use whatever permutation they want. But it doesn't change the fact of what this franchise has historically been called, what they have changed the title on all of their publications to, and which title the films and games now use. Anywhere you look, it's "Aliens vs. Predator."

—Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.118.211.125 (talk) 15:18, 11 July 2010 (UTC)


 * I'm not too bothered either way, but given the above I slightly favour Aliens vs. Predator over the singular form. If we decide to use this name then the article should be moved, although only an admin can perform this action (due to the editing history of Aliens vs. Predator). mgiganteus1 (talk) 08:13, 12 July 2010 (UTC)


 * My concern mainly is that 70.118.211.125's preferred opening sentence implies that the other variants (using "Alien" and "versus") are somehow fomerly the names of the franchise, and that Aliens vs. Predator is the absolute, set-in-stone official name of the franchise forevermore. That's simply not the case: Items in the crossover franchise have used numerous variations on the name since the inception of the crossover (glance at List of Alien and Predator games and you'll find a number of variations). Some of the ones that have been used include:
 * Alien vs. Predator
 * Aliens vs. Predator
 * Alien vs Predator
 * Aliens vs Predator
 * Alien versus Predator
 * Aliens versus Predator
 * Even looking at the 2 most prominent items in the franchise (the 2 feature films), one is Alien vs. Predator and the other is Aliens vs. Predator: Requiem.
 * Yes, "Aliens vs. Predator" has been the most consistently used variation, but calling the others "former" implies that they're never going to be used again. As the history of this franchise has shown us, there is little consistency to how these things are titled. I would much prefer the opening sentence to merely state "Alien vs. Predator or Aliens vs. Predator is a science fiction crossover franchise...". This is much simpler, less confusing, and makes it quite clear to readers that there are 2 major, nearly identical titles that both refer to the same topic. --IllaZilla (talk) 08:36, 12 July 2010 (UTC)

Article title
I did a requested move to put this article back as "Alien vs. Predator" rather than "Alien vs. Predator (franchise)" over the redirect. The reasoning is that this article is meant to describe the entire franchise as a whole, and serve as the parent article for everything that uses Alien vs. Predator or Aliens vs. Predator as a title ("Aliens vs. Predator" is itself a redirect to this article). In this way the article will function similar to Star Wars, with an overview of the franchise as a whole and then links to the various aspects ie. Alien vs. Predator (film). Since this article serves as the parent, no disambiguation is needed in the title. --IllaZilla (talk) 21:41, 15 April 2008 (UTC)


 * You are single-handedly interfering with the copyright owner's title of this franchise by arbitrarily deciding what will be the "proper" name for the franchise wherever it is mentioned, without any consideration for what it is actually, officially named. By putting "Alien vs. Predator" everywhere you are adding to the name confusion. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.118.211.125 (talk) 15:29, 11 July 2010 (UTC)


 * You should continue this discussion at the more recent thread below. This post is over 2 years old. --IllaZilla (talk) 19:05, 12 July 2010 (UTC)

link film franchise / Media franchise
in the opening paragraph, could somebody link "film franchise" to the appropriate page. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.174.97.122 (talk) 16:23, 1 June 2011 (UTC)

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