Talk:Alligatoridae

Caimans as pets?
A neighbor of mine had a pet caiman back in the late 70's. It was purchased at a pet store in Southern California. She ended up giving it to the Aligator Farm in Buena Park when it was too big to handle.

Is it legal to own a pet caiman anywhere in the U.S.? Do you need a permit?

Caiman or Cayman?
Caimen or Caymen? We should be consistent. Opinions please. Tannin
 * just to muddy the waters (LOL), my preference would be Caiman, Crocodile Jim


 * Newspaper reports on the one half a mile from my house have "caiman." I was actually looking for the animal under that name in Wikipedia. --Calieber 13:09, 7 Oct 2003 (UTC)


 * While Caiman seems to be the currently preferred spelling, I've seen Cayman, Kayman, and rarely Kaiman. Also, since the word has nothing to do with 'Man' as in Homo sapiens, the proper plural is Caimans (Note the 's'). CFLeon 00:49, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

I prefer caiman. Dora Nichov 09:29, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

The correct scientific spelling is "caiman." Cayman is often used colloquially (e.g. the Cayman Islands). However, colloquially, "caiman" or "cayman" means lots of different things. For example, in some parts of Latin America, the American crocodile is called "caiman de la costa," and the animals we call "caiman" are called "alligator." Technically, the term is derived from a Carib Indian language. The species to which it referred (if it was indeed a name for a particular species) is unknown, but, given the location, was very likely NOT am alligatorid. The term was used by the French in the early 19th century for alligatorids; it was by an misreading of this use that the term was introduced into the formal literature by Spix in 1825 (he apparently thought it was the preferred, formal term for "Alligator"), applied to the black caiman and the broad-snouted caiman. So, yeah, stick with "caiman." J. R. Wagner, UT Austin 70.113.48.142 00:00, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

Puzzling...
I just edited out a puzzling statement claiming that the Bill Haley recording See You Later Alligator allegedly "saluted the departure of the Los Angeles Alligator Farm from Los Angeles to Buena Park, California." I've been researching Bill Haley's music for 25 years and I can say with certainty that this is most definitely incorrect. Can anyone provide a source for this original statement? If so, please leave a note in my Talk area - I'm curious to find out where this came from. Thanks! 23skidoo 22:04, 18 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Separate Article
Shouldn't Caimans have a separate article from alligators? Alligators already have their own article, it seems stupid to have an Alligator article and a Alligator and Caiman article. TastyCakes 17:25, 18 May 2006 (UTC)

Agree. Dora Nichov 09:29, 26 August 2006 (UTC)

In principle, I agree, although it seems OK to me when there is very little written specifically about caimans. As this information increases, however, (or if somebody wants to write a bunch right now), then they should get there own article. In my opinion (and this is why I came to this talk page in the first place), the larger problem is that much of the information here (particularly cultural references) is specifically about alligators! (Moving that will also make it easier to see how much stuff there is specifically about caimans.) &mdash;Toby Bartels 15:06, 27 November 2006 (UTC)

Edit: Cultural references
I reworded the paragraph about sewer gator legends, as it had claimed that lack of UV radiation in the sewers made it impossible for alligators to be flushed.

Alligator, true alligator, alligatoridae
I'm confused. Alligators represented by the Caiman but they are not true alligators? --Gbleem 03:46, 10 April 2007 (UTC)
 * The family Alligatoridae is composed of two groups: caiman (=subfamily Caimaninae) and true alligators (=subfamily Diplocynodontinae). I'll give you that much of this page is written in a confusing manner, with the word "alligator" sometimes meaning "alligatoridae" and sometimes meaning "diplocynodontinae."  But, hey, this is Wikipedia, so you can fix it!  Enuja 04:09, 10 April 2007 (UTC)
 * Wait, wait. Where does diplocynodontinae come from? Is Diplocynodon a senior synonym of Alligator? By ICZN rules, if Alligator is the type of Alligatoridae, and it's the senior-most family name available, the rule of coordination comes into play--that is, it must go Alligatoroidea, Alligatoridae, Alligatorinae, Alligator. In fact, now that I look this up, Diplocynodon appears to be a member of Diplocynodontidae, a seperate family from Alligatoridae all together. I'll change this back pending an explaination... Dinoguy2 07:01, 10 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I was just going from the Wikipedia article; your skepticism is appropriate, and I have no explaination. Enuja 18:11, 10 April 2007 (UTC)

Dinoguy is correct. Diplocynodontinae does not include Alligator. Currently, extant alligatorids are grouped into Caimaninae and Alligatorinae; Diplocynodontinae was erected for a small but important group of fossils that are considered to be outside of Alligatoridae proper. In standard Linnean terms, this would mean they need a family of their own, that being Diplocynodontidae. J. R. Wagner, UT Austin 70.113.48.142 00:03, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

Is this ledgible?
This article is confusing and the language employed is poor. It looks like someone ran the text through babelfish. can someone with knowledge please correct the language? What's this nonsense about?

"Alligators proper occur in the fluvial deposits of the age of the Upper Chalk in Europe, where they did not die out until the Pliocene age."

I'm a geologist and it's got me lost.


 * You're also illiterate, Springyard. "ledgible" and "it's got" are worse.  Why don't you look up "proper" in the dictionary? -lysdexia 00:35, 31 July 2008 (UTC)  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.127.229.2 (talk)

Danger
The article makes this claim: "The Black Caiman and American Alligator are the only members of the alligator family posing the same danger to humans as the larger species of the crocodile family."

Huh? Everything I've read says American Alligators aren't nearly as dangerous as crocodiles. (I know nothing about the black caiman.) Where did this come from? Does anyone have a source? (Sources would be good everywhere in this article.) --MiguelMunoz (talk) 17:42, 24 April 2008 (UTC)

Caiman Picture
The pictures in the article are said to be of Alligators not Caimans? well, I took this picture at the caiman exhibit at the Mayaguez zoo in Puerto Rico. Maybe it can be used. They look alot smaller than alligators. There also seems to be some good caiman online articles to get info from, such as hereCaiman crocodilus well, we will see. Arsdelicata (talk) 14:43, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

adding picture

Arsdelicata (talk) 14:45, 1 January 2009 (UTC)

Alligatorinae

 * Don't merge this family article to to the subfamilyAlligatorinae, becauce this family even have the subfamily Caimaninae plus two extinct genuses.
 * Strong oppose, don't merge Alligatoridae & Alligatorinae! What, do you know better than the taxonomists??? Valerius Tygart (talk) 11:14, 1 August 2011 (UTC)

MobileReference
I have removed the footnote asserting that the list of taxa in the Taxonomy section of the article appears to have been copied from MobileReference's The Illustrated Encyclopedia of North American Reptiles and Amphibians, since the copying has almost certainly been in the opposite direction. MobileReference's encyclopedia is a fork of Wikipedia (see the licensing information on its "back cover"), as are many other of its publications. David Wilson (talk · cont) 15:53, 13 May 2011 (UTC)

Caiman sorontans
https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Alligatoridae&diff=next&oldid=52736712 I think Radetzky22 was a troll and there is no Caiman sorontans that exist. This edit was similar. https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Columbidae&diff=prev&oldid=53182286 Black-headed Pigeon, Columba nigercapitis? --Toxoplasma II. (talk) 23:08, 1 March 2015 (UTC)

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distribution
Something I looked for that in the article, not there, wished it was, didn't fix that, wrote this message to the future: if you have that information handy, please send an email, thanks cygnis insignis 21:27, 16 November 2018 (UTC)