Talk:Allison Mack/Archives/2017

Father in Preetz
Guess he was performing in the world famous Preetz opera house. I s this a bad joke? Come on guys, without a source this is just nonsense!--173.245.84.71 (talk) 20:37, 28 March 2011 (UTC)


 * Could probably do with some better citing, but the TV Guide website lists her birthplace as Preetz and identifies her father as opera singer Jonathan Mack: . Here's the Dad's bio (CV, press bio, etc.), which says he was performing in Germany in 1982: . TJRC (talk) 21:19, 28 March 2011 (UTC)


 * The opera house is in Kiel, about 20 minutes away from Preetz. --213.178.78.90 (talk) 12:12, 24 July 2017 (UTC)

Association with NXIVM
The section "Association with NXIVM" states that Mack is second in command of a secret sex cult. The only sources for this are the Daily Mail, which is not a reliable source, see WP:DAILYMAIL and a self-published website the Frank Report, written by one Frank Parlato, a non-RS per WP:SELFPUBLISH. My own search turns up only Daily Mail-type tabloids like The Sun, all sourcing from Parlato's glorified blog.

There's no way this can be sustained in a WP:BLP article without much better and clearly reliable sources than this. In principle, there's nothing wrong with a well-sourced (i..e, not from Daily Mail, The Sun, or tripe like that) that Mack had attended NVIXM sessions and credits them for her success (see NXIVM, above), but labeling her as second-in-command of a sex cult demands impeccable sourcing. TJRC (talk) 03:13, 10 November 2017 (UTC)

A user has removed material from that does not comply with our policy on the biographies of living persons. Biographical material must always be referenced from reliable sources, especially negative material. Negative material that does not comply with that must be immediately removed. Note that the removal does not imply that the information is either true or false.

Please do not reinsert this material unless you can provide reliable citations, and can ensure it is written pursuant to WP:V, WP:NPOV, and WP:NOR. Please review the relevant policies before editing in this regard. Editors should note that failure to follow this policy may result in the removal of editing privileges. -- Dlohcierekim (talk) 03:38, 10 November 2017 (UTC)
 * To elaborate on this: if you think that you have what would ordinarily be a RS, please ensure that it is not simply either reprinting from or sourcing exclusively from non-reliable sources, such as tabloid newspapers or this Parlato guy. For example, this edit re-added the material, citing news.com.au, which is apparently a usually reliable source, but the particular article being used is a reprint from The Sun tabloid.
 * Really, all we have now, is Parlato making his claims, and tabloids uncritically reprinting them. TJRC (talk) 16:13, 10 November 2017 (UTC)

Can someone with permission to edit allow the following addition, as well as the creation of a "Personal Life" subsection (I found the source in the NXIVM wiki): In 2010, it was reported that Mack had been recruited to the Vancouver wing of the controversial pyramid selling organization NXIVM along with her Smallville co-star Kristin Kreuk. Cavernousknoll (talk) 17:45, 11 November 2017 (UTC)


 * That appears to be a reliable source, but it really doesn't seem to be a critically important bit about Mack worthy of mention, and would likely never be brought up here other than the cult claims that so far remain unsubstantiated. It looks mostly like an attempt to get the NXIVM mention in. Really, if there's something to this, it will eventually be reported in legitimate sources. Let's not be in a race to publish this; that's not what Wikipedia is for. TJRC (talk) 18:11, 11 November 2017 (UTC)

OK, I've done some digging and in addition to the Maclean's reference I have added in sources from Forbes and the New York Times which all pre-date the latest tabloid narrative. I added the contextual information about NXIVM, citing that some consider it 'coaching' while others consider it 'cult-like' to add to NPOV but also so the article doesn't jump straight from: 'Mack is reportedly a member of this group' to 'the NYT reports someone said she was branded with Mack's initials.' Here's what I've found: "In 2010, it was reported that Mack had been recruited to the Vancouver chapter of the controversial organization NXIVM along with her Smallville co-star Kristin Kreuk. In a 2003 article from Forbes, advocates of NXIVM portrayed it as an organization focused on inspirational executive coaching, "like a practical M.B.A.," while detractors accused the founder Keith Raniere of running "a cult-like program aimed at breaking down his subjects psychologically." The co-founder of the Vancouver chapter reported in a 2017 The New York Times exposé that she had been branded in an initiation ceremony under the supervision of a top NXIVM official, and that she left the organization upon learning "the brand that she received contained the initials of Mack and Raniere." " Cavernousknoll (talk) 23:53, 11 November 2017 (UTC)

External links modified
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