Talk:Amazon Kindle/Archive 3

Other Wikis
I've heard (and seen confirmed here) that Kindle has access to wikipedia. Q1: Does it have access to non-English wikipedias, or to wikitravel, wiktionary, other wikis part of the wikipedia project? Q2: Is there a list somewhere of all the sites/domains Kindle has access to? Q3: This access is free, same as the store access? Identity0 (talk) 23:59, 16 October 2009 (UTC)


 * The Kindle 2 (and presumably the original Kindle) has free access to the internet in general; however, some sites (e.g., YouTube) will not display normally due to the technical limitations of the Kindle. Mario777Zelda (talk) 04:19, 10 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Not true. Only free in general in the US. 81.153.204.18 (talk) 21:33, 12 July 2010 (UTC)


 * Is Kindle's 3G internet access really free? For the limited purpose of browsing Amazon's eBook store, clearly yes, but Amazon charges fees for certain other uses of their 3G network (for instance $.15 per MB downloaded). Here's an excerpt from their 3G terms of service: Amazon provides wireless connectivity free of charge to you for certain content shopping and downloading services on your Device. You may be charged a fee for wireless connectivity for your use of other wireless services on your Device, such as Web browsing and downloading of personal files, should you elect to use those services. We will maintain a list of current fees for such services in the Kindle Store. Amazon reserves the right to discontinue wireless connectivity at any time or to otherwise change the terms for wireless connectivity at any time, including, but not limited to (a) limiting the number and size of data files that may be transferred using wireless connectivity and (b) changing the amount and terms applicable for wireless connectivity charges. (Copied from http://www.amazon.com/gp/help/customer/display.html?nodeId=200399690&#wireless) SEppley (talk) 18:49, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

2nd and 3rd generation Kindle DX
According to Amazon, there is a 2nd generation DX that came out in January 2010. Does anyone know how this differs with the 1st generation DX? Not to be confused with the 3rd gen DX (Slate). Green Cardamom (talk) 16:52, 16 July 2010 (UTC)

Kindle's Synthetic Voice
May I suggest a section that discusses the pros and cons of the synthetic voices available on the Kindle as highlighted in a recent article in CNN. Described as an "experimental" feature, it has surprisingly good command of nuance and inflection, but some people are voicing concerns. Today, synthetic voices are showing dramatic improvements, spurred on by better hardware and competition in not one but many markets. Davidciccarelli (talk) 19:48, 17 July 2010 (UTC)

New Kindle 3 Graphite announced
This should be added to the article. The Kindle has now entered its 3rd generation as of 7/28/10 EST, and is offered in graphite 6". —Preceding unsigned comment added by Karljioos (talk • contribs) 03:32, 29 July 2010 (UTC)
 * A note on this, Amazon doesn't call this the Kindle 3, however this is what some Wikipedia articles are calling it while using Amazon as a reference. Ponydepression (talk) 22:16, 1 August 2010 (UTC)

Models and History sections redundant
The 'Models' section basically reiterates the 'History' section. This really needs to be fixed. —Preceding unsigned comment added by KariIjoos (talk • contribs) 09:39, 31 July 2010 (UTC)

New Table
I'd like to see a table integrated into the page as a quick overview to compare different models. It would include data such as the dates when different versions were sold, the introductory prices, the connectivity, the memory, screen sizes, etc. It probably makes sense to list the models down the lefthand column, and the data across the top. Before we implement this, what else does it make sense to include? samwaltz (talk) 16:03, 2 August 2010 (UTC)
 * great idea Daniel32708 (talk) 05:59, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

Kindle as web browser
Can the Kindle be used as a web browser? Are there any limitations other than the obvious monochrome display? - Bevo (talk) 02:38, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

- Yes the Kindle has featured an 'experimental' web browser since the introduction of the second generation Kindle in February 2010. It connects to the internet via free 3G. There are no limitations besides video and flash. It works well with mobile-optimized sites, such as m.gmail.com or m.cnn.com. The new 3rd generation Kindle has a browser built on the Webkit platform. —Preceding unsigned comment added by KariIjoos (talk • contribs) 05:52, 4 August 2010 (UTC)


 * Amazon's terms of service do not say that browsing the internet using their 3G network is free. It's free for browsing Amazon's ebook store. Other uses may incur fees. See my comment above (different section of this discussion page). SEppley (talk) 18:53, 10 August 2010 (UTC)


 * It's not "Amazon's" network. In the USA, it's handled by AT&T; in other countries, it's handled by other various companies. At least in the USA, there is no surcharge for web access over 3G on the Kindle. &mdash;  The Hand That Feeds You :Bite 21:35, 10 August 2010 (UTC)


 * When I went overseas, I received a message on my Kindle the first time I turned on the wireless signal. Additional fees can be incurred to receive regular periodical subscriptions and to wirelessly email documents to the Kindle when roaming abroad. No additional fees to download single periodicals, books, or to access the internet through the browser. —Preceding unsigned comment added by KariIjoos (talk • contribs) 04:32, 11 August 2010 (UTC)

Topaz file format: Detailed Info
Detailed info on the Topaz file format used for some Kindle books is provided by the developer of the format in this blog posting and the subsequent comments:

http://beesbuzz.biz/blog/e/2010/01/07-interesting_topaz_drm_development.php

This would make a great source for a detailed section on the Topaz format; and as the info at the above link is a bit scattered, it would benefit from being collected neatly in one place. 98.236.44.8 (talk) 17:31, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

Let's get a graphite Kindle picture up
I think it's due time for a picture of the latest Kindle in graphite color be uploaded. Perhaps someone with better familiarity with the copyright issues of uploading pictures can take the initiative on this one? —Preceding unsigned comment added by KariIjoos (talk • contribs) 19:08, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

Kindle "location numbers"
I think it would be interesting for the article to cover Kindle "location numbers", which are Kindle's sort-of analogue to page numbers. On two fronts, though, I don't really know enough to write very definitively:

First, is there any kind of definition of what exactly a location "is"? In the book I'm skimming now with my OS X Kindle application, there are somewhere between maybe 1 and 10 "locations" per screen of text. It appears that locations do not map one-to-one to anything "normal", e.g. "screen of text", "word", or "sentence". My guess is that locations are invisible tokens that are located at particular word or perhaps character offsets. But what system is used to determine where, exactly, these tokens are inserted?

Second, what is the general story about whether it's possible to map Kindle "locations" to normal book page numbers, for the purpose of making or looking up citations? Here are a couple of articles that are at least related:


 * http://www.edukindle.com/2008/08/page-number-versus-position-on-kindle/
 * http://blog.apastyle.org/apastyle/2009/09/how-do-i-cite-a-kindle.html —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.165.82.38 (talk) 06:32, 22 November 2010 (UTC)


 * Thanks for the link to the page number article and discussion. The article, and the comments that follow it, highlight three issues this article needs to explore: the price and accessibility of this new medium, and its implications.


 * One might add a fourth question: How to cite a Kindle. The question in my mind is not how to cite a Kindle, but whether to do so.  Which is to say, in this instance there is the added dimension of the implications of the Kindle for Wikipedia.


 * I suppose the phenomenon is so new, and the growth so explosive in this field, that these implications may not yet be known. I do not see a detailed, authoritative work on this subject.  Nevertheless, it seems important.


 * Aquib (talk) 16:50, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

British Library deal
Does anyone want to add some material on the deal done between Amazon and the British Library allowing for (presumably out-of-copyright) Victorian texts to be distributed on the Kindle platform?

Also, I have the Kindle app installed on my iPad and iPod touch. Should I put up screenshots on Commons of something out-of-copyright? –Tom Morris (talk) 21:14, 29 November 2010 (UTC)

Amzn.to
Wikipedia avoids using URL shorteners because of the possibility of WP:Linkrot and spamming; see WP:EL. If this problem with the anon adding Amzn.to links doesn't resolve itself in the next day or two, would someone please leave a note at User talk:XLinkBot to request that Amzn.to be added to the list? Thanks, WhatamIdoing (talk) 02:23, 30 November 2010 (UTC)
 * The article has been protected now for 1 week, that should stop the additions of the shortened links, at least for now. --Funandtrvl (talk) 02:31, 30 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Yes, why is this still semi-protected? The amzn.to links, while not desirable, are fine. amzn.to is now Amazon's official short URL and they will not link rot or get redirected somewhere else. Links that were restored are not the ideal links and also appear to contain a -20 referral code. For example, the following URL is given for the DX: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0015TCML0/ML0-20, while the preferred URL for this product is http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0015TCML0 or http://amzn.com/B0015T963C
 * I have fixed this (I prefer the latter form, but used the former so people wouldn't think it was an external link shortener). RoyLeban (talk) 09:29, 2 December 2010 (UTC)
 * amzn.to is owned by bit.ly. Amazon owns the short domain amzn.com. White 720 (talk) 17:19, 2 December 2010 (UTC)

Topics related to the Kindle and rights to digital material; interoperability and common standards
Kindle ebooks may not be resold []

The question of borrowing or checking ebooks out of a library and how these relate to the Kindle. Although I did not completely grasp the implications for the Kindle (the article is a year old and I have seen some pdf files work on my Kindle), this article had some ominous overtones. []

Another older article on library borrowing etc []

-Aquib (talk) 00:00, 3 December 2010 (UTC)


 * There is also the input side of things since Amazon expects you to format stuff up for their tool before submitting the books. Hcobb (talk) 00:11, 3 December 2010 (UTC)

Let's add a section discussing some user modifications
Many of us have jailbroken or hacked our kindles for things like:

- more fonts

- different screensavers

- faster page loads

How about a section on this? It is a valid part of the kindle experience.

See here for more info on what can be done: http://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?t=88004 —Preceding unsigned comment added by RedHab (talk • contribs) 10:54, 2 December 2010 (UTC)


 * Yes, that's interesting Aquib (talk) 13:22, 3 December 2010 (UTC)


 * Definitely. I cam here looking for that information Wassname (talk) 20:57, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

Section for additional capabilities?
Each Kindle model has capabilities beyond book reading that are significant to note, especially when you group them together and see the evolution of the device. For example, the Kindle 1 had (unsupported) GPS and SD cards, while the Kindle 3 sports a full web browser, mp3 player, and an (as-yet-unsupported) microphone. Bikeduckquack (talk) 05:12, 3 January 2011 (UTC)

Kindle Development Kit
This section talks in the future tense about events planned for February 2010. Did these events eventually occur? Leonard of Vince (talk) 04:26, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

Privacy, rights concerns
Amazon gathers a lot of information from users Kindles, such as your location, and what you are reading http://www.mobileread.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51371. Perhaps we should have a section about this. And perhaps remote content removal could be included (it is currently in the Business model section), as the core issue is your rights/privacy not how it effects Amazons business model. Wassname (talk) 21:01, 29 January 2011 (UTC)

Environmental impact
It would be interesting to add info about the environmental benefits of using Kindle over printed books and magazines. There is a preliminary report from Cleantech Group that is disputed. This article seems to have interesting facts. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 129.125.135.199 (talk) 10:11, 9 February 2011 (UTC)

Book template?
Should this or any other ebook reader have the book template? I think so, but perhaps other editors will think differently. --DThomsen8 (talk) 16:43, 11 February 2011 (UTC)


 * Obviously not. A Kindle is no more a book than a record player is an album. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward) - talk 09:43, 27 June 2011 (UTC)

"More precisely" in the lede
I don't think the changes introduced with this edit (and expanded later) are a good idea: they muddy the waters of exactly what the article covers unnecessarily. While the support network Amazon has for its reader also carries the "Kindle" name, it's analogous to what iTunes does for the iPod; we don't refer to the iPod as a music ecosystem. Far better that the support network is left to later paragraphs of the introduction, as it is strictly ancillary to the device itself. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward: not at work) - talk 20:08, 26 April 2011 (UTC)


 * I've now made this change. Chris Cunningham (user:thumperward: not at work) - talk 15:45, 8 May 2011 (UTC)

remote content removal
This section is informative, but lacks any discussion of why Amazon remotely removed the Orwell titles mentioned. It also does not say how the works of Selena Kitt violated Amazon's publication guidelines. In other words, Amazon's actions are described and criticized, but not explained. Could someone more knowledgeable than I update the article to explain why Amazon acted as it did? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 0nullbinary0 (talk • contribs) 03:31, 19 June 2011 (UTC)

"and remotely deleted these titles from purchasers' devices after discovering that the publisher lacked rights to publish the titles in question."

They didn't own the rights. That's makes them bootlegs/pirated copies.184.12.177.253 (talk) 16:45, 8 September 2011 (UTC)

RAM for kindle 1, 2, and DX
I have posted the RAM for Kindle 3 but I don't have it for 1, 2 and DX. Does anyone have it? Hum richard (talk) 01:08, 20 June 2011 (UTC)

New Addition
I am not sure what version it is, but I heard they are making a new kindle with color, a touch screen, a gmae and app market. Seems to me that they won the competition against nook and they are now going against IPad.KF5LLG (talk) 18:51, 8 October 2011 (UTC)
 * The new kindle is Version/Generation 4. They will be released on 15 November 2011. They are NOT colour. They're touch-capable. The colour unit is a tablet, fire, and is covered briefly in the article. Lostinlodos (talk) 20:59, 9 October 2011 (UTC)

K4's display quality debated
Some customers/reviewers regard the display of the new Kindle (2011) of lesser quality, e.g., ,. Is this worth mentioning as a possible difference in the respective paragraph comparing K4 with K3? 178.24.190.171 (talk) 21:59, 10 October 2011 (UTC)

Split or reorganise
I suppose I should bring this up - is there much of a case to split the article, and use this to present the history..?

The main issue is that the infobox is presenting the info for the "Kindle Keyboard" (and mks 1 and 2) whilst the article as a whole is covering every type (althought the Kindle Fire has a separate article). Maybe the article should just have a couple of split infoboxes for each major revision.

Anyone see what I'm getting at here? Shouldn't be a lot of work - but needs some consensus on what is best..Imgaril (talk) 23:34, 28 September 2011 (UTC)


 * I think does need to start being spilt up - maybe the amazon e-ink devices in one article and the overall history and content here. Every iphone has it's own articles so I'm not sure why we are organising this article differently? --Cameron Scott (talk) 08:41, 29 September 2011 (UTC)


 * Problem with splitting this to "Kindle Touch" is that the Kindle 4 (fourth generation) includes both touch screen and non- touch screen units. I believe four infoboxes covering the variants in specific detail is probably best. Lostinlodos (talk) 23:26, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

Digital media is vague
The paragraph that reads
 * "The Amazon Kindle is an e-book reader developed by Amazon.com subsidiary Lab126 which uses wireless connectivity to enable users to shop for, download, browse, and read e-books, newspapers, magazines, blogs, and other digital media"

is vague, the term digital media incorprates many formats, including ones the kindle can not use such as video and games a better sentence would be
 * "The Amazon Kindle is an e-book reader developed by Amazon.com subsidiary Lab126 which uses wireless connectivity to enable users to shop for, download, browse, and read e-books, newspapers, magazines, blogs, and some other forms digital media"

But what do other people think? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.100.149.235 (talk) 12:37, 21 October 2011 (UTC)

Uncertainty about 3g and web browsing.
All Kindle models offer wi-fi access to both the Amazon store and the web generally, but those that advertise 'wi-fi + 3g' generally offer web access only through wi-fi, but not through 3g. My understanding is that there is one Kindle that offers web access through 3g, and I believe that it is an earlier, not current, version of the Kindle Keyboard. I'm personally concerned with this because I want to order one of these myself as soon as I am sure I'm getting the right one, but I can't find any references other than the claims of sellers on eBay regarding this matter.

If anybody can find quotable authority on this matter, it would be a valuable addition to this page, presumably to the section on the Kindle Keyboard, which presently doesn't mention any differences between the earlier and later versions in this regard. Aarons510 (talk) 10:54, 27 November 2011 (UTC)
 * You may find useful. The previous "Kindle 3" (keyboard) offered a similar facility - access to Wikipedia from anywhere in the world that they had coverage, but no 3G access to other parts of the internet except in the US. My experience with this model is that it did indeed work with Wikipedia in the two countries I tried it in (New Zealand and Argentina) but blocked all other websites. With Kindle touch 3G, they appear to no longer allow broader access in the US either.- gadfium  23:52, 27 November 2011 (UTC)
 * You can google and wikipedia from the kindle on 3G, but you can not do much else. And I own a kindle, so I know for a fact. Lex Martin (talk) 01:04, 3 January 2012 (UTC)

Messed Up Template
The current template Amazon Kindle models seems quite messed up. I'm proposing this alternative version on the template talk page which has several corrections. Suggestions and objections are welcome. If there are no objections, I will change to my proposal in a few days. -- ADTCTalk Ctrb. 04:32, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

Kindle versions
A recent edit has added a "Kindle 5th Generation" section to describe the Kindle Touch, and broken out the "Kindle Fire" into it's own section. The Amazon Kindle models info box hasn't been updated, however.

I'm not sure that there's enough justification for the "Kindle 5th Generation" section, although it seems clear that the Kindle Fire does represent a new hardware model. The only evidence for the 5th Generation is from the editor who changed the page, who has undertaken original research that found this variation - based upon the claimed existence of "Kindle OS5". There doesn't appear to be any citable source for this, unfortunately. Furthermore, I don't know what criteria Wikipedia wants to use to distinguish product lines for this product.

If anyone has some thoughts, please make them. I'm loathe to impose any view I have without discussion, but I think we'd need to revert the "Kindle 5th Generation" change without something more than one person's original research - no matter how 'correct' it may be. Kesmet 02:55, 11 December 2011 (UTC) — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kesmet (talk • contribs)
 * I have updated the Amazon Kindle models info box and split it into E Ink devices and Android devices. I did this in anticipation that Amazon will continue its Android or tablet line with more models in the future, which could be mentioned separately from their E Ink models. My question is, whether the "Devices" section in the main article should also be split into two sections, "E Ink devices" and "Android devices" so that it matches the info box. -- ADTCTalk Ctrb. 22:49, 16 December 2011 (UTC)

Kindle for Android bug.
Since the version where line spacing and margin size settings, and PDF support were added, Kindle For Android has been incapable of properly opening books in the old Mobipocket format. What you get is no cover image shown in the list, no row of size/progress dots in the list and when you open the book the screen is blank and it says it's at position -1 of 1. It's been like that in every revision since, 4 or 5 updates with the bug. Amazon has received a lot of reports about this and apparently they have no plans to fix it. Bizzybody (talk) 10:53, 20 February 2012 (UTC)

Kindle Data Tracking?
http://www.npr.org/blogs/alltechconsidered/2013/01/28/170296373/e-readers-track-how-we-read-but-is-the-data-useful-to-authors — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.252.201.11 (talk) 12:28, 29 January 2013 (UTC) This article, which it only mentions briefly, notes that Amazon uses Kindles for data tracking about users' reading habits. I didn't see any of info about this in the wiki page, could anyone independently verify the claim about tracking, and should it be added to the article? (Or is this not really noteworthy of modern electronic devices?) — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.252.201.11 (talk) 12:26, 29 January 2013 (UTC)

Old format support dropped?
Has support for some file formats been dropped, either by software updates or by not being supported on a newer Kindle? Support for the original Mobipocket format and PalmDoc was dropped from the Android app when PDF support was added. The app would still show the books and would open them but would not display the content of Mobi files. Those would show a location -1 of 1. PalmDoc files would either show location -1 of 1 or would display a few pages then scrambled text, sometimes freezing the device/phone or crashing the app. Books in the newer Mobi format, released around the time Amazon bought Mobipocket and generated by the last version of the Mobipocket software for Windows (and programs such as Calibre) still work with the Kindle Android app. Bizzybody (talk) 16:19, 12 May 2013 (UTC)