Talk:American University of Antigua/Archive 1

Change in wording
I request the beginning sentence: For the unaccredited medical school with a similar name disapproved by many U.S. states, see University of Health Sciences Antigua be benignantly reworded. If you really want to expose how "unaccredited" and "disapproved" UHSA is, I believe a link to UHSA Wiki page would be enough. Wouldn't it? DrGladwin 02:56, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
 * As I posted on the Administrator's noticeboard, the names "American University of Antigua College of Medicine" and "University of Health Sciences Antigua" are not similar enough to warrant disambiguation notices at the top of the articles. I have removed this notice accordingly. Mike R 17:27, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
 * As two medical schools located in Antigua, I feel that they are similar enough to warrant disambiguation. Leuko 17:42, 3 October 2007 (UTC)


 * I noticed this from WP:ANI and I'd have to agree with Mike R, those are sufficiently different names that I don't think a disambiguation in necessary. That said, if a disambiguation has consenses, it should exist without qualifiers like "unaccredited" and "disapproved"... that is better covered in the actual article text.--Isotope23 talk 17:45, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree with Isotope and Mike. First, we don't need a notice. Second, we don't need words like "unaccredited" and "disapproved" in front of names of medical schools (except only on their Wikipage). DrGladwin 18:46, 3 October 2007 (UTC)


 * Agree with Isotope on the latter point. But as I said, I really don't think a notice is needed at all. Mike R 17:49, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Actually, I recently converted article text into the dablink . This text was placed 28 June 2007  after confusion relating to which of the two schools was banned by Indiana.  As such, I would contend that the names are similar enough to easily mistake, and a dablink would be appropriate. Leuko 18:06, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I disagree. UHSA sounds completely different from AUA. Any intelligent prespective medical student can visit their websites, call the school directly, or visit 3rd party medical school forums. So, I don't feel that extra line is necessary. DrGladwin 18:50, 3 October 2007 (UTC)
 * Right, that article text wasn't even necessary. Antiguan Medical education is probably the furthest thing from my area of knowledge, but even without any kind of qualifier I can tell the difference between "American University of Antigua" and "University of Health Sciences in Antigua".

I don't think this is an University of Iowa/Iowa State University type of scenario.--Isotope23 talk 17:27, 4 October 2007 (UTC)

JzG's edits
JzG blanked out a great deal of information on this page, including all of the curriculum. I do not know why, but before I undo it I would like to open a discussion among the editors to review his undiscussed blanking. I do feel that the inclusion of the curriculum information is proper for this article. This is a medical school and a complete article would indicate its curriculum. I am curious about the thoughts of other edits who have worked hard on these articles. Bstone (talk) 15:48, 18 July 2008 (UTC)


 * coming here later, I agree completely with JzG. we certainly do normally omit this material. It belongs in the college catalog. It's overdetail here, and not encyclopedic-- just as the fee schedule was; I removed both.    DGG ( talk ) 23:57, 26 November 2009 (UTC)

COI
Due to this edit, I have placed a WP:COI tag on the article. The account has been referred to the username admin noticeboard for investigation and resolution. Basket of Puppies 22:31, 10 November 2009 (UTC)


 * A brand new editor has come along and made the identical edit. Thus, am restoring the COI tag. Basket of Puppies  17:14, 11 November 2009 (UTC)


 * And again. Is anyone available for discussion as to this section and the references? Basket of Puppies  19:13, 13 November 2009 (UTC)

Dear Basket of Puppies, I discussed this edit with you in particular on your profile page. I'm not trying to engage in an edit war with you. The user that has been posting this section keeps putting this clearly biased information on the page. My aim is it to maintain Wikipedia's neutrality code. I request that the page be locked from editing so that this user may not put this on the page again. —Preceding unsigned comment added by BedTimeForBonzo (talk • contribs) 20:38, 16 November 2009 (UTC)


 * BedTime, thank you for replying. The current situation of repeatedly adding this information and repeatedly removing it is a violation of Wikipedia guidelines. I would ask that you and the editor adding the information begin discussing the issue here and the merits the information being added. In the meantime I would ask that each of you stop your edit war as that may get you blocked from editing. Sincerely, Basket of Puppies  21:39, 16 November 2009 (UTC)

Grades especially pass/fail policies is key to any learning institution. A student's grades follow them forever and can be used in the future for job placement. Students pay for and attend a learning institution to learn the subject mat'l and expect the grades to reflect this. Hence grading policies and practices are extremely important.

The revision of the AUA student handbook I have (2007) shows that more sections talk about academics and grading than are devoted to the topics taught. These are the sections that are devoted to grades and academics: Academic Degree Programs, Academic Policies during the Pre-Medical and Basic Sciences, Academic Policies during the Clinical Sciences,Good standing and satisfactory Academic Standing, Professional conduct and ethical behavior, Grading, Degree Conferral and Graduation, Important USMLE Information, and Medical Licensure in the United States. The grading policies continue in the course syllabus. For this 5th semester program the it is section III "Evaluation and Grading".

Example 1: From page 7 "Academic Degree Programs, Breakdown of Curriculum Components and Courses, Step 1" I quote "A student takes Step 1 after completing and passing the fifth semeser."

Example 2: From page 9 "Academic Policies during the Pre-Medical and Basic Sciences, Evaluation of Academic Performance" I quote "A student who fails all courses in any semester is subject to dismissal" "A student who fails any course in any semester is placed on academic probation, repeats the failed course and can register for one more major course as directed by the Dean of Academic Affairs" (This topic continues further in this section alone.)

Example 3: Good Standing and Satisfactory Academic Progress, Satisfactory Academic Progress I quote "A student not in compliance with the standards of Satisfactory Academic Progress is subject to dismissal"

As shown by just these three examples this institution consistantly discusses grades and academic standing.

Academic standing is how a student progresses within the program.

Since the academics of this institution are discussed as much, if not more, than the program topics themselves in the student handbook the institution itself then must agrees that this is a major topic. Hence the practices of these policies is as important.

I have not made more than three revisions to any page within a 24 hour period. I was just replacing information I posted that was removed without discussion by other users. I only replaced what was removed via cut-n-paste, and only once per day when reviewed

I also do not feel that I was being bias, just posting verifiable facts concerning the grading policies of this institution.

Since other users do not like the format of my last posting and or references I have changed the title and content to show pure facts that can be either verified or denied with proof.

I am sorry if other users do not like the content sometimes the facts hurt others that have vested interests in private money making enterprises.

This is my firt text reply so please forgive me for any formatting errors.

Please stop deleting "REVERTING" my editions to this article. If you would like to discuss the topics I am here to show factual evidence of everything posted.

Please show proof of my bias. I have not shown any bias; I am posting facts.

As per the Wikipedia example of facts "The United States is the only nation that has used a nuclear weapon during wartime is a fact"

This is my article of facts. If someone can prove otherwise than please post your facts. But please do not revert my article. "AUA failed a student that earned an 80% during a 5th semester course. AUA falsified student records more by stating in note (3) “Failed Final Exam. Did take remedial and failed” and “Did not have OP rotation”. The final grades clearly show that the student earned a 95% for the Out Patient, OP rotation.

This image of the 5th Semester final grades was obtained during depositions of St Joseph Mercy Oakland hospital administration. Only the student names have been erased from the image.

AUA charged students for tests, but did not administrate the shelf exams that were scheduled during the same 5th semester course."

If you have proof that shows otherwise than please post your evidence. If you do not like my wording then I am more than willing to negotiate it with you. For example you might not like the word "falsify" for example, please let me know what word you would like me to use to describe this wrong information in student records.

Please show proof that I am editing a page more than three times in one 24 hour period. What I am doing is "self-reverting" which is not a violation.

Im sure AUA would love this article to be locked and made private. But that is against Jimmy Whales oppinions "While I continue to oppose the introduction of any advertising in Wikipedia"

"Wikipedia is free content, no one owns an article." Basket of Puppies, someone is violating the reverting rules. It is against the rules. Whomever is "throwing away" my changes this is against the rules. If you have useful proof that information is in error please post the information and hence I will do the same.

ZQPM2941 3:37, 16 November 2009 (ET) ZQPM2941 (talk) 17:26, 17 November 2009 (UTC)

I rearranged the paragraph

Does the author of this quote have the authority to make such a statement, since I think it would violate both the student handbook and the course syllabus pertaining to requirements of passing a class…. quote in question: “Students who do not fulfill AUA’s academic requirements, made at AUA’s discretion, will be removed from the program. AUA evaluates students on a holistic basis, test scores are only one of many factors when considering a student’s academic progress. Professors are encouraged to advance only the students who are able to handle the significant academic load.” What this is telling me is that AUA has the right to remove any student for any reason they want…. Is this in the new student handbook, if not I would hope the new and future students are aware of this?

ZQPM2941 (talk) 23:43, 25 November 2009 (UTC)


 * ZQPM2941, by adding a quote from the student handbook you have violated Wikipedia's copyright policy. I have removed the quote from the article. Please read WP:COPYRIGHT for more info. Basket of Puppies  03:51, 26 November 2009 (UTC)


 * I come here from the Conflict of Interest Noticeboard. I think this sort of material is drastically inappropriate. The case of an individual student in a course, unless it has received   references providing substantial coverage from     published reliable secondary sources, not just the court filing, is not appropriate content. I have removed it. If anyone proposes to reinsert it, please put the references below first.    DGG ( talk ) 00:06, 27 November 2009 (UTC)

The mat'l was referenced hence I don't see how it was a copyright infringment. Reverting is against Wikipedia rules. Please talk about issues you have before reverting. Using legal arguments is also against wikipedia rules, again please use the talk section provided to distribute facts concernting information instead of reverting and threatening legal actions. I am more than happy to "refernce" the AUA student handbook, which is an online document for public display and review at http://www.auamed.org/student-handbook-0. Issues between authors need to be talked about before reverting others factual data. Thanks ZQPM2941 (talk) 01:55, 28 November 2009 (UTC)

I would like to remind the people that keep reverting the information on this page, it's against the wiki rules. Please talk about the information. Personally I think that reverting information versus adding input is further proof of the facts. Anyway please add facts to this page and please stop reverting my facts... Thanks... 200.7.57.161 (talk) 23:23, 1 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Please provide reliable sources to back up your "facts." A self published web page is not a reliable source.  Leuko  Talk/Contribs 23:37, 1 December 2009 (UTC)

I don't know how the AUA final grades and this presentation (look at the student records in the raw data) could be more reliable. Please stop reverting my facts unless you have facts to show otherwise. Thanks ZQPM2941 (talk) 00:52, 2 December 2009 (UTC)


 * I have asked for the page to be protected from editing for 2 weeks due to the ongoing content dispute. It is disruptive to constantly be reverting the article. So, can we please discuss it here and come to a conclusion? Basket of Puppies  02:57, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

One person's perspective on any issue is by definition not neutral. I am not neutral. I work for AUA. An AUA student is not neutral. And certainly a former AUA student who has been dismissed for non-academic reasons and is currently involved in litigation against AUA is probably the best definition of non-neutrality anyone could possibly devise. As to this contributor's content, he is presenting material which no one can check. He gives his own website as the only source for this information. And if anyone wants to subject himself to the videos he has created (and I do suggest anyone does this if they wish to judge the content), you can clearly see that 1) this is a personal vendetta against AUA 2) viewers are expected to accept his interpretation of the information and 3) the information itself seems deliberatley muddled to defend against any assault against its veracity. If wikipedia strives to maintain the neutrality of its content about AUA College of Medicine, they can do much better than to allow this person to spew his bile. TiptonCarlson (talk) 15:50, 2 December 2009 (UTC)


 * TiptonCarlson, for the issues of non-neutrality are the exact reasons why both sides should refrain from editing the article. If you have suggestions regarding the content of the article then please mention them here, along with the required reliable sources to back up your desired edits. Thank you. Basket of Puppies  16:06, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

I have no desire to add information thus no new sources for such information. I would however like this one particular poster's information to be reviewed under the same policies wikpedia uses for all other information. In particular the issues of neutrality and verfiability.TiptonCarlson (talk) 16:43, 2 December 2009 (UTC)


 * If the information that is being added is verifiable and supported by reliable sources then it can be added to the article. I will have a look at the references being used in order to see if it meets these two requirements. If there the two are met then I will ensure (with the help of other neutral editors) that the text is neutral in tone. Basket of Puppies  21:45, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

Neutrality, Bias, legal threats, now proof of facts
I have never stated that any information I’ve posted is positive or negative. I’m only posting facts. Again using the wiki example “Did the US drop a bomb during war”? Yes was that good or bad? I guess that depends on the reader. I’ve been to “Peace Park” in Hiroshima (and to Dachau, Germany). My personal opinions are just that, my personal opinions based on the facts I have seen. So Neutrality I believe it depends on the readers point of view. I’m just posting facts. Wiki is NOT an advertising tool as it seems AUA would like to use it. So AUA has tried bias, legal threats, neutrality, and now proof of facts, when the material I posted is from them, they want proof, all they need to do is open their filing cabinets. But that’s not what they want to do. What’s happening, hurting business? From a medical school too, that’s what’s sad. You tell me what you want to show this is fact! I say prove it isn’t real (Basket and Tipton) Show me my grades! You have my email address and you can surely post them here!

I can show you the raw data of student records that an AUA Chancellor released to other students! I can show you the names(including mine, which is the 80%) on the Final Grades I posted, but didn’t on the request of other wiki users. As for the legality of removing the “BLUE” highlight and showing these student names, I think it might not be illegal to release, since they were evidence gained from a court deposition and may be public because of that? Do you want me to uncover the names? Do you want me to show you my grades that AUA sent me? Do you want me to show you a signed outpatient evaluation, of which also contains an official court evidence mark, that shows I earned a 95% for my OP rotation, of which AUA stated “Did not have OP rotation”? Do you want me to show you a copy of my scholar360 grades(Final Exam grades) that show I earned an 80% on the section they say I failed? Do you want me to show you emails from Dr. Yanez that state what the passing grade was? Do you want me to post the picture of my final exam grades? The email from Dr. Yanez that stated the curve for that exam was to be a 10%, but on the final grades they only gave 4%. The email from Dr. Calderone that stated that part of the exam wasn’t going to be graded only after I took it. The emails that show AUA changed the scheduled date of the exam, the over 20 semester schedule changes for that semester, including the notification of the Final Exam the Friday before?

As for the presentation, you have copies of the students real GPA’s and USMLE scores lets compare what you have with the data Dr Hrehorovich gave out and we can also notify each of those students to verify these results. Again, this is all AUA documentation, they don’t need proof, it’s theirs!

Posting my real grades might really cause you problems though since it was my grades that were used in a lawsuit, when the truth is AUA failed me out of vengeance for the letter you contrived against me and my lawsuit against AUA for it. How about we post how AUA conspired with the ECFMG to ensure I couldn’t sit for the USMLE, nearly two weeks before the notification of my dismissal.

And Bias, what about this article, AUA uses as a reference. http://www.arkansasmedicalnews.com/news.php?viewStory=758 “The American University of Antigua College of Medicine and four of its students are suing the Arkansas State Medical Board and its board members, claiming board policies unfairly and unconstitutionally exclude graduates of the school from practicing medicine in Arkansas.”

All from a medical school, sad….

What’s funny, I believe it’s the First Semester in DPS where we’re taught to tell the truth and ethical practices.

The time, energy and money I invested in AUA, for what vengeance against me by his business, for what a semester where students signed petitions against them.

Wiki this is your chance to make a difference. I hope you make the right choice! 200.7.60.59 (talk) 23:55, 2 December 2009 (UTC) ZQPM2941 (talk) 23:56, 2 December 2009 (UTC)


 * You obviously have a bone to pick. That sort of POV-pushing is not appropriate for an encyclopedia. If you have verifiable facts from a reliable source, then it can be included, but your own self-published website is not a reliable source. That is just original research, which is not allowed on WP. Leuko  Talk/Contribs 00:58, 3 December 2009 (UTC)

Protection
I thought I the page had been fully protected, which would have avoided the latest round of reverts and now a block. Was it semi'd instead? Basket of Puppies 07:12, 3 December 2009 (UTC)
 * Semi-protection. Today I blocked a user instead of going to full-protection. tedder (talk) 07:30, 3 December 2009 (UTC)

ZQPM2941 is once again publishing his own research
I don't think this is appropriate. —Preceding unsigned comment added by TiptonCarlson (talk • contribs) 21:36, 15 February 2010 (UTC)

TiptonCarlson is reverting information. I believe this is a clear demonstration of your bias intentions. You state that I am using my own research yet all the references are from a reliable resources including "Wikinews"

Please add my entire edit back in full. One of AUA's female students was Sexually Assaulted and you are covering up the truth of this information from potential students researching this institution. Another student was killed, this January.

This is the article I posted and it clearly shows there is NO original research.

Student Safety on Antigua
Below is information potential AUA students need to know about Antigua.

Antigua is an ideal location for studying; serene, secure and sustaining. Antigua provides AUA students with the most modern comforts and familiar lifestyle in the Caribbean, in a stable and safe environment.

American University of Antigua student sexually assaulted.

The student was on her way home when a man jumped into her car. She pulled over to the side of the road and stopped her vehicle, at which time Jeffers virtually pulled the lever of her car seat and jumped on top of her. He put his hands over her eyes and started to squeeze into her eyes with his fingers. Jeffers took off his clothes and threatened to kill the woman if she screamed. The young woman got a hold of the vehicle’s cigarette lighter and tried to burn Jeffers with it. He, however, managed to knock it from her hand. Jeffers then placed his penis in the woman’s face and told her to engage in oral sex. The victim pulled away her head, at which time the convicted man pulled off her blouse and panties. He held her down and as he was about to rape her, a security pickup with a number of police officers drove up. Upon seeing the lawmen, Jeffers ran from the vehicle and the area naked.

Student murdered on Antigua.

She was a 29 years old California student and she was murdered on Antigua January 19, 2010.

Female doctor and her husband killed on Antigua during their honeymoon ,

Antigua has murder rate three times higher than New York!

Antigua is known as "Death Island"!

Welcome to Antigua: Welcome to Rape, Bribes, Money-Laundering, Corruption.

Two Cruise ship lines, Start Clipper and Carnival, stop going to Antigua because of crime. ,

The Caribbean still represents the second highest region outside of Sub-Saharan Africa infected by the HIV/AIDS virus!

Please be safe and follow all safety precautions given to you during orientation.

ZQPM2941 (talk) 13:44, 16 February 2010 (UTC)

Of course I am "bias(ed)". I work for this school. As anyone with half an ounce of curiousity could figure out. Unfortunately Mr. aua-med.org, you are posting information in an encyclopedia page which has nothing to do with AUA College of Medicine. I suggest posting your ramblings on a page talking about the island of Antigua. Or even better Crime on the Island of Antigua. This info has nothing to do with AUA.TiptonCarlson 23:29, 16 February 2010 (UTC)

Tsk Tsk ZQPM2941. I know this is an all-encompassing obsession for you. But you're STILL not posting information about AUA. Might I suggest you find some information about the school? And not something you are making up?TiptonCarlson (talk) 13:54, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
 * I agree ZQPM2941's addition does not belong here but as someone who has obvious COI, you need to triple check your edits for neutrality and a promotional tone . This article is not a brochure for the school, right? -- Neil N   talk to me  15:16, 24 February 2010 (UTC)
 * Roger that. I have been trying to keep the information as "encyclopedic" as possible.TiptonCarlson (talk) 20:11, 24 February 2010 (UTC)

Since it may affect the decision to attend a school, a citation to violent crime on an island may be pertinent, although a citation and just that..

Manipal Group
It is relevant that this entry shows that the Indian Manipal Group has a large stake in the University. Avkrules (talk) 12:41, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

California Board`
Someone has been changing the California approval to disapproved... this is incorrect. I watched the meeting myself AUA is approved for California.. the school even sent out official notice for all students. Someone is doing it out of spite.. they probably didnt get into the school or got kicked out for poor grades etc. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 205.217.255.195 (talk) 16:31, 30 July 2011 (UTC)