Talk:Amir Abbas Fakhravar

Untitled
Those weblogs are not Reliable sources. Continue these kind of discussions in your blogs. Check every single hyper link on template above. ‍Hessam 22:51, 21 August 2006 (UTC)

Biography
How come there is no biography of this person? There is no information here. It goes from saying he is an activist (what is his history as an activist?) and then suddenly he is in the US meeting with important officials. We should know more about this man and why he is important enough to meet with high-level American officials. Khodavand 00:09, 27 January 2007 (UTC)

At the moment the biography is almost exclusively based on one article in Front Page Magazine. I have attempted to balance that out with another article while at the same time maintaining the original content. If the newly added material is being taken out, then all material from Front Page Mag should equally be removed since it equally has a slanted and ideological perspective. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kabirat (talk • contribs) 21:10, 11 December 2012 (UTC)

A discussion about potential changes to the biography section can be found here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Biographies_of_living_persons/Noticeboard#Amir_Abbas_Fakhravar. Proposals have been given for change. Please provide your opinion so that we can reach some consensus. Kabirat (talk) 10:58, 13 December 2012 (UTC)

On Mother Jones blog an un factual article about Amir Abbas Fakhravar was written 6 years ago and some people like Kabirat are using that article several times to discredit Fakhravar's biography. Please check this article and you will see the entire article is based on rummers and Mr. Fakhravar's enemies, competitors and Islamic Republic of Iran's informants statements who wants to attack Fakhravar. You can't find any single fact for any of the accusations against Fakhravar at this article. "Has Washington found it's Iranian Chalabi?": http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2006/10/has-washington-found-its-iranian-chalabi/") In this article two so-called student activists Ahmad Batebi and Hassan Zarezadeh Ardeshir are saying Fakhravar is Islamic Republic of Iran's agent! It is interesting to now recently some facts showed both of them (Batebi and Zarezadeh) were Islamic Republic of Iran intelligence service's informant for 10 years! Please check this article: "Ahmad Batebi, an informant of Iranian Intelligence Ministry ": http://wetheiranian.blogspot.com/p/ahmad-batebi-informant-of-iranian.html/") You can see these two individual can not be a good source of information about Amir Abbas Fakhravar. Other witnesses on Mother Jones article against Fakhravar are Nasser Zaraafshan (Marxist-Stalinist) who has a deep ideological problem with Fakhravar. last one is Mohsen Sazegara the founder of Islamic Republic of Iran's Revolutionary Guards who is seeing Fakhravar as a bid competitor for himself. It is unbelievable how a journalist from Mother Jons blog chose these people which non of them are legitimate to talk about Amir Abbas Fakhravar.


 * My response to this can be found here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Biographies_of_living_persons/Noticeboard#Amir_Abbas_Fakhravar. A few problems I see with this argument.  First, there's no question there's an ideological slant and questionable reliability on the Front Page Mag article. Second, the Mother Jones article is reliable.  It's not a "blog", it's an article written by Laura Rozen, an expert and frequent commentator and journalist on Middle East affairs (http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/authors/laura-rozen).  The article is also based on a variety of eye-witnesses testimonies.  Fourth, to the extent we intend to rely upon Front Page Mag for any assertions, then there's not much of an argument to exclude the contrary position taken in the Mother Jones article. Lastly, all of the accusations listed above are unfounded and in fact sourced to one blog which, coincidentally enough, seems to idolize the subject. Kabirat (talk) 13:03, 14 December 2012 (UTC)


 * The position taken by Kabriat seems to make a lot of sense. Front Page Magazine is a questionable authority at best and shouldn't be relied upon without some other corroboration. I also question the motivations of Siavash777, which I have a suspicion is the subject himself. 91.82.187.42 (talk) 23:04, 14 December 2012 (UTC)


 * How is Front Page Magazine "questionable" but Mother Jones exempt from scrutiny? It is a typical pseudo-argument that the right-leaning forum is regarded as biased and inaccurate while the left-leaning forum is based on facts and statistics. Mother Jones is overwhelmingly biased, and the contributors have an agenda. The information on Mr. Fakhravar at Mother Jones is written by individuals with a personal vendetta against him, and they create "data" to support their personal opinions. Foster.Allison (talk) 07:54, 23 December 2012 (UTC)

It is easy to find several facts, documents, Documentary movies and videos about Amir Abbas Fakhravar's story and his fight for freedom. For Example Documentary called Forbidden Iran with PBS that says Fakhravar was arrested 17 times becaouse of his ole at Iranian Student Movement against Islamic Government in Iran. "Fakhravar's role in Iranian Student Movement": http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/stories/iran/thestory.html/") Also you will find a lot more information here ; "Iran Forbidden": http://wetheiranian.blogspot.com/p/amir-fakhravars-story-as-one-of-iranian.html/") — Preceding unsigned comment added by Siavash777 (talk • contribs) 01:15, 14 December 2012 (UTC)


 * My response to this can be found here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Biographies_of_living_persons/Noticeboard#Amir_Abbas_Fakhravar. If we can source those facts to actual and reliable information I have no problem with this. Notably, the PBS link doesn't talk about Fakhavar and the blog posting is completely unreliable. Kabirat (talk) 13:03, 14 December 2012 (UTC)
 * User Kabirat, I can't believe you couldn't see on PBS link Amir Abbas Fakhravar was mentioned six times as a "'Students Leader and a Hero! Please check again BPS link here and STOP your non-sence accusations against Fakhravar. "Fakhravar's role in Iranian Student Movement - PBS documentary Forbidden Iran''' ": http://www.pbs.org/frontlineworld/stories/iran/thestory.html/") Siavash777 (talk) 18:18, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
 * User Kabirat, You want to ignore PBS, BBC, CNN, Fox News, CBN, Washington Post, Washington Times, Daily Telegraph, Jerusalem Post, New York sun, New York Daily News, Front page magazine, VOA, Radio Farda and many other reliable news channels who are calling Amir Abbas Fakhravar a "Hero" and "One of Iranian Student Leaders" and just mention one un-reliable blog called "Mother Jons" who has ideological problem with him as a source to discredit him. This is not right. Siavash777 (talk) 18:21, 15 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Responses can be found here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Biographies_of_living_persons/Noticeboard#Amir_Abbas_Fakhravar. One thing to note, please withhold all name-calling. And if you do intend to name-call, please use proper spelling. Kabirat (talk) 21:19, 16 December 2012 (UTC)

The last paragraph of this biography is all negative propaganda against Amir Abbas Fakhravar, the subject of article. Using some names like Bina Darabzand and Najmeh bozorgmehr that no-one knows who they are to attack Mr. Fakhravar is not right. Specially at biography section! Then link to Ahmad Batebi's blog, number [21], who is known to be Mr Fakhravar's biggest enemy is against wikipedia's policy. Recently it was on the news that Ahmad Batebi was founded Islamic Republic of Iran's intelligence service informant. I am asking wikipedia admins to correct these errors and please don't let some users like Kabirat play with other people's life. Siavash777 (talk) 09:46, 15 February 2013 (UTC)
 * Bina Darabzand, a founding member of the Democratic Party of Iran (Hezb-e Demokrat-e Iran), was arrested on 17 August 2004 outside the UN offices in Tehran while demonstrating peacefully calling for better treatment of political prisoners and was sentenced to three-and-a-half years' imprisonment, five years' denial of civil rights and 50 lashes. That information can be found here: http://www.unhcr.org/refworld/topic,464db4f52,464db52c2,43fb36564,0,AMNESTY,,.html. Najmeh Bozorgmehr was and continues to be the Financial Times' Iran correspondent in Tehran (http://www.ft.com/intl/cms/s/0/db368004-0ca1-11e2-a73c-00144feabdc0.html#axzz2L3jInR9C). Their comments are all relevant since they provide additional context concerning the subject's background. As to comments by Ahmad Batebi, first there is no source to the allegation that he was Iran's intelligence service informant.  In fact that comment appears to be defamatory.  Second, Batebi was the subject's cellmate in Iran.  His opinions and observations concerning the subject in relation to their time in prison are extremely relevant. Kabirat (talk) 11:09, 16 February 2013 (UTC)

vandalisms
It is very interesting to see how many times this pages have been vandalized by anonymous users. All of them are trying to delete the criticism by Nasser Zarafshan and promote Fakhravar! Sina Kardar 15:57, 9 February 2007 (UTC)

I have edited this article from scratch, and as it’s visible from my IP address, I leave in Europe and Amir Abbas Fakhravar lives in USA. So it’s impossible that I am Amir Abbas Fakhravar. So COI tag is just another vandalism. Shahabimilad1387 (talk) 19:06, 1 January 2020 (UTC)

Iranian-American?
What exactly makes him an Iranian-American? He left the country too recently to be called an American ... and his english is not very good either!Shervink 16:42, 1 March 2007 (UTC)shervink

Nasser Zarafshan
I have removed the following from the article to here:

''Nasser Zarafshan after being released from the Evin prison, has criticized Amir Abbas Fakhravar, saying "He has been working for the police [of the Islamic Republic]" and that "In prison, everybody knows that." ''

I think it may be better to move it back when there is a "criticisms" section, at the moment it seems a bit random. --Rayis 16:53, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

i think there is a need to mention Zarafshian Story about him since is a source of information...unless there are some points which are needed to be hidden for hi " democratic activism" —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.104.175.250 (talk) 05:21, 26 October 2007 (UTC)

democracy activist?
somebody who meets with bush,cheney and perle and let them use himself, cannot be a democracy activist. the current iranian regime is undoubtly a dictatorship and having been imprisoned in evin must be a terrible experience. but you cant cure pest with malaria ore vice versa. the neocons dont care for the iranian people, they dont want to improve or assert anything there except their strategical interest. fakhravar is as much an iranian democracy activist as the nicaraguan "contra"-leaders were for nicaragua. i have deleted the category. --Severino 18:02, 1 April 2007 (UTC)


 * Sorry but that's your point of view. This is a political activist who advocates democracy. Neocons may not be your or my ideal political party but anyone who shakes hands with them does not automatically become anti-democratic. --Rayis 18:10, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

infobox update
Can

be replaced with
 * maelgwn - talk 15:00, 25 August 2007 (UTC)


 * That change makes no visible difference on the page; I'm not sure that it's necessary right now. Once the page is unprotected of course you can change it if desired and there is consensus. &mdash; Carl (CBM · talk) 17:07, 25 August 2007 (UTC)


 * Infobox Biography is soon to be depreciated and so it is being cleaned out. :: maelgwn - talk 00:23, 26 August 2007 (UTC)
 * [[Image:Yes check.svg|20px]] Done. Cheers. --MZMcBride 03:57, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

Edit war
I see that there's a bit of an edit war going on in the article. Could those involved please discuss the issues here rather than revert and re-revert in this way? Phil Bridger (talk) 19:44, 6 December 2012 (UTC)


 * The edits have been an attempt to fix the article which has predominantly been written by the subject himself and major portions of which were uncited. Those who have reverted the text back to its original form, have done so without addressing the underlying problems.  Unless those who keep reverting it back to its original form address the underlying issues, I fear this may result in an Edit War.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kabirat (talk • contribs) 20:08, 6 December 2012 (UTC)


 * I don't think that you mean the original form, as that was certainly not promotional. Phil Bridger (talk) 21:29, 6 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Most of the content on this article comes from sources that either the subject or entities very close to him have produced. You read the Bio section and it's just funny. Where in a WP bio, you see describing someone as "as a gifted student started writing at the age of eight...". And it's a mess in terms of references. Saeed (talk) 23:17, 9 December 2012 (UTC)


 * Amir Abbas Fakhravar is not an unknown person. For years he was and he is on iranian news, specially Iranian opposition figures. Attacking his page is a typical symbol of vandalism and even more. I can see clearly Kabirat attacking Amir Abbas Fakhravar, Lily Mazahery and a few other Iranian American who Kabirat is not Agree with. This is wrong and Kabirat should stop this. Siavash777 (talk) 11:07, 10 December 2012


 * User Saeed I saw in your Facebook page you are close friend with some of Fakhravar's political enemies. You are a radical leftist and you don't like Fakhravar's political views and you are attacking him here on wikipedia? It is wrong. It is better to stop these personal accusation now. Siavash777 (talk) 11:18, 10 December 2012  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Siavash777 (talk • contribs)
 * This is just hilarious. I'm friends with his political enemies? seriously? And I am a radical leftist? where did you get that from? My liked videos on Youtube? And "Personal Accusations"? who's accusing who? Why are you so hot on it? I am simply saying that this article needs a thorough revision simply because it's not neutral and references are not reliable. And for your information, that's not my taste or idea, it's what wikipedia requires for all articles. So If you really care for the truth to be told here, get to work and make it a better article instead of searching the web for user names and etc. Saeed (talk) 18:30, 11 December 2012 (UTC)

A discussion about potential changes to page can be found here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Biographies_of_living_persons/Noticeboard#Amir_Abbas_Fakhravar. Proposals have been given for change. Please provide your opinion so that we can reach some consensus. Kabirat (talk) 10:59, 13 December 2012 (UTC)

Fakhavar Trip to Israel
The original version was a copy and paste job from the following blog posting: http://wetheiranian.blogspot.com/2012/09/cis-historical-trip-to-israel-january.html Many of the sourced sentences did not accurately reflect the sourced document. The section has been revised to make it more accurate and in line with the sources. In addition, the section has been revised to reflect some controversy surrounding the trip as reported by Haaretz. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kabirat (talk • contribs) 16:50, 11 December 2012 (UTC)


 * The controversy surrounding the trip reported by Haaretz was made by Ahmad Batebi's lawyer Richard Horowitz which was not true. Batebi is Fakhravar's competitors and recently many facts and documents and a confidential phone Conversation was released on youtube that shows Batebi was iranian Intelligence Service's informant. ("Ahmad Batebi: An informant of Intelligence Ministry of Islamic Regime in Iran": http://wetheiranian.blogspot.com/2012/10/ahmad-batebi-informant-of-iranian.html/") But, Batebi's lawyer Richard Horowitz was sending several emails to Israeli Officials to convince them Amir Abbas Fakhravar is an Agent of Iranian Regime! Horowitz's argument didn't go anywhere and January 2012 Fakhravar had a successful trip to Israel and all these shows Batebi's Lawyer's controversy making on Haaretz could't have success to cancel Fakhravar's trip to Israel. Mentioning this un Factual statement base on lie and rummers is not right. ("Fakhravar's trip to Israel": http://www.iwp.edu/news_publications/detail/iwp-research-fellow-amir-fakhravar-meets-with-members-of-parliament-and-opinion-makers-in-israel/")


 * The only source you site is a blog posting of absolutely no credibility or authority. I think in light of the fact that the interview is reported in Haaretz that its important given its relationship to the underlying subject matter.  Further, nothing you state is supported by any source and appears to be all speculation and innuendo.  — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kabirat (talk • contribs) 13:01, 14 December 2012 (UTC)
 * User Kabirat, you will just discredit more and more yourself with these non-sence comments. It is hundreds of articles, interviews, photos and Videos from Amir Abbas Fakhravar's historical and influential trip to Israel January/February 2012 and you are saying it is just a blog. To remind you, you can see the stories about this trip in several following links and then STOP your non-sence accusation. ("1. Ynetnews: Livni meets Iranian opposition member:": http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4181905,00.html/") ("2. Jerusalem Post: Livni’s statement came during a meeting she and Kadima MK Nachman Shai held with Amir Abbas Fakhravar and Saghar Erica Kasraie of the Confederation of Iranian Students in Tel Aviv. http://www.jpost.com/DiplomacyAndPolitics/Article.aspx?id=255512/") ("3. Jerusalem post: Iranian student leader Amir Abbas Fakhravar: Attack will bring ayatollahs, allies, public legitimacy. http://www.jpost.com/MiddleEast/Article.aspx?id=255678/") ("Fakhravar was speaker at the Herzliya Conference Panel: IRAN: Will Sanctions Work? January 30, 2012. http://www.herzliyaconference.org/eng/_Uploads/dbsAttachedFiles/ProgramE(15).pdf/") ("4. Amir Fakhravar was keynote speaker at the Knesset Briefing hosted by MK Shai Hermesh Kadima Party, The Knesset, Jerusalem - Jan. 31, 2012. http://www.jpost.com/LandedPages/PrintArticle.aspx?id=255914/") ("5. Channel 2 TV- Jerusalem - Amir Fakhravar's Interview with Ulpan ShiShi on prime-time news. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NNWDhpOPYIY&feature=player_embedded/") Several campaigns were started on Facebook and Social media after this interview with the direct message of this interview : We (the Iranians) Love Israel. Israelis Love Iranian, Iranian Loves Israel. ("6. Meeting and Press Conference; MK Tzipi Livni, Head of the Opposition and MK Nachman Shai, Kadima and Amir Abbas Fakhravar, the Secretary General of Confederation of Iranian Students. Herods Hotel, Tel-Aviv, Israel - January 28, 2012: http://www.rasanehiran.com/vgld.o05lyt0xxa6m.2z-y2ylys.h.html/") (" 7. Official Iranian state TV covers activities of CCS research fellow Amir Fakhravar: http://www.iwp.edu/news_publications/detail/official-iranian-state-tv-covers-activities-of-ccs-research-fellow-amir-fakhravar/") In this documentary aired on the official Iranian television channel, the government accuses Amir Fakhravar, President of the Confederation of Iranian Students and Research Fellow with IWP's Center for Culture and Security, of masterminding the opposition to the Islamist regime on behalf of Israel and the United States.  While focusing on Fakhravar's high-profile meetings with major Israeli leaders, including his recent address to the Knesset and participation in a major international conference, the video also features footage from an IWP-sponsored conference held at the George Washington University in 2011. I hope these facts will be enough to STOP accusations against Amir Abbas Fakhravar. Siavash777 (talk) 03:30, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Responses can be found here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Biographies_of_living_persons/Noticeboard#Amir_Abbas_Fakhravar. To clarify, no one is trying to remove the fact that Fakhavar went to Israel and went to a conference.  But Haaretz is THE most important publication in Israel.  It's the New York Times of Israel.  And in its only article on Fakhravar, it highlights Fakhavar's controversial nature.  Thats not something to simply dismiss, but must be included in the summary. Kabirat (talk) 21:22, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Haartz is NOT the most important publication in Israel! What type of information do you have Kabirat?! Fakhravar had interview with primetime TV news show, Channel 2 in Israel the moment he arrived there. This show is like Anderson Cooper (CNN) or Charlie Rose's show in Israel. Then He was Keynote speaker at Israeli Parliament event on Iran and Speaker at the most Important Conference in Israel, Herzliya Conference and several Interview with him article about him on Jerusalem post which is like Washington Post in Israel. Kabirat, you should stop your non-sence attack on Fakhravar. Siavash777 (talk) 17:18, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
 * What is your basis for your statements. Please source your comments.  And is your point that Haaretz is not a credible publication? Kabirat (talk) 23:00, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

The part about Richard Horowitz, an unknown lawyer in NY, who said some non-sence things about Mr Fakhravar is not a reliable source. Please remove those parts witch are not correct. There are hundreds of articles, interviews, photos and Videos from Amir Abbas Fakhravar's historical and influential trip to Israel January/February 2012 and you are saying it is just a blog. To remind you, you can see the stories about this trip in several following links and then STOP your non-sence accusation. ("1. Ynetnews: Livni meets Iranian opposition member:": http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4181905,00.html/") ("2. Jerusalem Post: Livni’s statement came during a meeting she and Kadima MK Nachman Shai held with Amir Abbas Fakhravar and Saghar Erica Kasraie of the Confederation of Iranian Students in Tel Aviv. http://www.jpost.com/DiplomacyAndPolitics/Article.aspx?id=255512/") ("3. Jerusalem post: Iranian student leader Amir Abbas Fakhravar: Attack will bring ayatollahs, allies, public legitimacy. http://www.jpost.com/MiddleEast/Article.aspx?id=255678/") ("Fakhravar was speaker at the Herzliya Conference Panel: IRAN: Will Sanctions Work? January 30, 2012. http://www.herzliyaconference.org/eng/_Uploads/dbsAttachedFiles/ProgramE(15).pdf/") ("4. Amir Fakhravar was keynote speaker at the Knesset Briefing hosted by MK Shai Hermesh Kadima Party, The Knesset, Jerusalem - Jan. 31, 2012. http://www.jpost.com/LandedPages/PrintArticle.aspx?id=255914/") ("5. Channel 2 TV- Jerusalem - Amir Fakhravar's Interview with Ulpan ShiShi on prime-time news. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NNWDhpOPYIY&feature=player_embedded/") Several campaigns were started on Facebook and Social media after this interview with the direct message of this interview : We (the Iranians) Love Israel. Israelis Love Iranian, Iranian Loves Israel. ("6. Meeting and Press Conference; MK Tzipi Livni, Head of the Opposition and MK Nachman Shai, Kadima and Amir Abbas Fakhravar, the Secretary General of Confederation of Iranian Students. Herods Hotel, Tel-Aviv, Israel - January 28, 2012: http://www.rasanehiran.com/vgld.o05lyt0xxa6m.2z-y2ylys.h.html/") (" 7. Official Iranian state TV covers activities of CCS research fellow Amir Fakhravar: http://www.iwp.edu/news_publications/detail/official-iranian-state-tv-covers-activities-of-ccs-research-fellow-amir-fakhravar/") In this documentary aired on the official Iranian television channel, the government accuses Amir Fakhravar, President of the Confederation of Iranian Students and Research Fellow with IWP's Center for Culture and Security, of masterminding the opposition to the Islamist regime on behalf of Israel and the United States.  While focusing on Fakhravar's high-profile meetings with major Israeli leaders, including his recent address to the Knesset and participation in a major international conference, the video also features footage from an IWP-sponsored conference held at the George Washington University in 2011. I hope these facts will be enough to STOP accusations against Amir Abbas Fakhravar. Siavash777 (talk) 09:49, 15 February 2013 (UTC)
 * As a preliminary matter, "non-sence" is actually spelled nonsense. I prefer that you use proper spelling when resorting to ad hominem attacks.  Moving on.  Comments by Horowitz reported in Haaretz (Israel's most important newspaper) are highly relevant for providing objective context to the subject's visit to Israel.  Further, none of the citations support your contention that the subject spoke to the Knesset (which is the edit you added to the page).  All of the articles you cite specifically note that the subject spoke with some Israeli leaders, attended a conference and visited the Knesset to meet with meet with MK Shai Hermesh (Kadima).  In that sense, the article is entirely consistent with all of the sources you have noted.  As to your last comment, I am willing to agree to the inclusion of a sentence which states "Fakhravar's visit to Israel became the subject of a documentary in Iran which accused him of masterminding the opposition to the Islamist regime on behalf of Israel and the United States." Kabirat (talk) 11:16, 16 February 2013 (UTC)

A note on sourcing
Just a note to avoid primary sources when citing topics like political views, it lends to much to POV interpretation. If you can replace them with reliable third-party sources that will greatly increase the chances of the changes sticking. Similarly try to find the most reliable sources you can (mainstream newspapers are generally more desirable than political magazines, for example). Whilst having some sources is better than having none, anything that doesn't meet WP:RS will still get removed. - Rushyo  Talk  20:42, 11 December 2012 (UTC)
 * To drive this point home: Any poorly sourced material on a BLP should be removed. This is not normal policy, but it's better to have an article that has far less content than one which breaches WP:BLP. Please do not re-add content if somebody has challenged it but bring the discussion to the talk page. Wikipedia does not have a deadline and consensus wins the edit war. - Rushyo  Talk  21:03, 11 December 2012 (UTC)

2009 Green Movement
The section needs a ton of work. Most of the suggestions are unsupported by any sources. Further, much of it didn't even relate to the topic at hand. This may be because Fakhavar wasn't in Iran during the 2009 movement therefore his actual contributions are sparse. If anyone has any reliable and credible data on his contributions, please update accordingly. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Kabirat (talk • contribs) 06:20, 12 December 2012 (UTC)

United States Congressional Research Service (CRS) from December 2009 to current (December 2012) mentioned Confederation of Iranian Student led by Amir Abbas Fakhravar as the key blocks and the most important leaders of Iranian Green movement. Please check their statement on U.S. State Department's website ("Iran: U.S Concerns and Policy Responses": http://fpc.state.gov/documents/organization/158487.pdf/")and Congressional Research Service's official documents. ("Iran: U.S Concerns and Policy Responses- September 5, 2012-page 5 and 6": http://www.scribd.com/doc/105811305/Iran-U-S-Concerns-and-Policy-Responses-Sep-5-2012/") — Preceding unsigned comment added by Siavash777 (talk • contribs) 19:34, 13 December 2012 (UTC)


 * The first link you cite doesn't appear to work. The second link you provide makes no comment supporting your position. Do you have other primary sources that support your proposition? Kabirat (talk) 12:53, 14 December 2012 (UTC)
 * User Kabirat, these links are working and coming from the United States Congressional Research Service, the most trustful report from united States government. Those are pdf documments and you need to just copy and paste them and see what is inside them. These documents shows how credible, effective and influential are Mr. Fakhravar and his organization inside Iranian Green Movement! User Kabirat you should STOP these accusation ASAP? You are acting sick. Is it possible please one of Wikipedia editors send a warning to User Kabirat and ask him to stop his non-sence accusations against Amir Abbas Fakhravar. Siavash777 (talk) 03:43, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Again, the first link doesn't work. The second link does not refer to Fakhavar as a leader of the Green Movement.  It refers to him in connection with the 1999 student movements, not the 2009 Green Movement (which makes sense since Fakhavar was in the US during the Green Movement).  Do you have any other source? Kabirat (talk) 21:24, 16 December 2012 (UTC)
 * At Page 5 of this Congressional Research Service report you will see: Opposition/”Green Movement” (Rah-e-Sabz): All of the blocs and personalities below can be considered, to varying degrees, as part of the Green Movement. However, overall leadership of the movement and decision-making on protest activities is unclear, with several components competing for preeminence. Some Green supporters have left for Europe, Asia, or the United States. And then Amir Abbas Fakhravar's name and his Organization CIS listed as second block there. I hope You will get it finally. Siavash777 (talk) 17:12, 19 December 2012 (UTC)
 * Please do not attempt to manipulate facts by misquoting or mischaracterizing portions of the document. In full the passage says the following: "Groups composed of well-educated, Westernized urban youth are the backbone of the Green Movement. They are attempting, with mixed success,to gain support of older generation, labor, clerics, village-dwellers, and othersegments. Many in the Office of Consolidation of Unity, the student group thatled the 1999 riots but which has since become controlled by regime loyalists,believes that major reform of the current regime might be acceptable. An offshoot of the Office - the Confederation of Iranian Students (CIS) - believes in regime replacement and consists of pro-American, pro-free market activists. Overall CIS leader, Arzhang Davoodi, convicted in August 2012 of “war against God” which carries life sentence. CIS’ Washington, D.C. presence is led by Amir Abbas Fakhravar, who was jailed for five years for participating in July 1999 student riots." There is nothing in that statement that says Fakhavar was a leader of the Green Movement.  Its very clear in what it means and you are completely using it out of context.  So I will ask again, do you have any other sources?? Kabirat (talk) 22:58, 19 December 2012 (UTC)

POV issues
The user Siavash777 (which coincidentally bears the subject's nickname) continues to make changes to alter the objective nature of changes to alter its POV. Please stop. This is neither a forum for personal attacks or for self-promotion. I have taken significant steps to ensured there's a balanced presentation of the facts and your changes continue to revert it back to the one-sided POV of the article. Further, you continue to fail to respond to my above inquiries justifying my changes. Kabirat (talk) 14:41, 24 December 2012 (UTC)
 * I am deleting this again. I suggest editors review policy on BLPs concerning due weight and attack pages as well as WP:AVOIDVICTIM, WP:WELLKNOWN, as well as others. I will also add the Mother Jones is a highly partisan source and may not be the strongest RS to use...and it was used a great deal here, Recommend simply adding any reliably sourced claims incorporated into the relevant sections per our guidelines.--Amadscientist (talk) 10:05, 6 January 2013 (UTC)
 * If we're going to remove information from the Mother Jones article due to its partisan nature, should we apply that rule consistency. Virtually the entirety of the article is based off of a Front Page Magazine article which equally partisan issues. Further, how is the source not reliable.  Throughout the entire article the subject is boosted as a leader of student movements in Iran.  Yet other student leaders in Iran are quoted in the article as disputing that precise claim (including individuals who were housed in the same cell as the subject).  It doesn't get more reliable than that. Kabirat (talk) 12:23, 6 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Per the policy concerning BLP, I've reduced the criticism/controversy section and neutralised the language. I've maintained the core information since its important.  While Mother Jones is a partisan piece, the information being used in this section are the quotes and opinions of other prominent political opponents in Iran, many of whom shared a cell with Fakhravar.  If we wish to remove this information, then we would also need to remove all other information derived from partisan pieces, such as Front Page Magazine. Kabirat (talk) 13:22, 6 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Per BLP policy"
 * A controversy section in a BLP article is not neutral and is disproportionate space. It needs to go and any relevant content dispersed through out the article in areas if they apply.--Amadscientist (talk) 23:57, 6 January 2013 (UTC)
 * The policy doesn't suggest you can't have sections on the subject's controversial background, so your interpretation of the policy isn't correct. The section heading is broadly neutral (it says controversy without labeling the subject) and the information under that section is also neutral - it simply repeats the comments of individuals. It's also consistent with numerous other wikipedia pages I've seen which have similar sections.  Serious care has been taken to ensure that this information is structured and presented fairly.  If you have a recommendation for how to make it more fair, please make it. Kabirat (talk) 08:53, 7 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Nope. Innaccurate, and of course it doesn't suggest. It states clearly not to do it.--Amadscientist (talk) 10:34, 8 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Thats actually not true, there is nothing in the policy that excludes such sections and a variety of pages (in fact) include them. Indeed, your interpretation completely contradicts Wikipedia's policy to ensure an objective and unbiased account of the subject and to prevent a particular point of view.  There are two resolutions to this: (1) we integrate the controversial matter into other sections, which I have done; or (2) we remove the material altogether as well as any information derived from secondary sources.  If we do #2, it would result in removing nearly 90% of the current page.  I suggest (1), but if you would like to proceed with (2) let me know and I will proceed accordingly.  But please don't be biased in one direction. Kabirat (talk) 11:26, 8 January 2013 (UTC)
 * Thats actually not true, there is nothing in the policy that excludes such sections and a variety of pages (in fact) include them. Indeed, your interpretation completely contradicts Wikipedia's policy to ensure an objective and unbiased account of the subject and to prevent a particular point of view.  There are two resolutions to this: (1) we integrate the controversial matter into other sections, which I have done; or (2) we remove the material altogether as well as any information derived from secondary sources.  If we do #2, it would result in removing nearly 90% of the current page.  I suggest (1), but if you would like to proceed with (2) let me know and I will proceed accordingly.  But please don't be biased in one direction. Kabirat (talk) 11:26, 8 January 2013 (UTC)

Page Protection
This page has been protected for three weeks due to constant edit-warring. Please discuss the edits you disagree with - do not revert. m.o.p 11:28, 3 February 2013 (UTC)


 * There are three issues that appear to be at dispute between Siavash777 and myself. The first two relate to edits to Fakhravar's visit to Israel.  As reflected above, while Siavash777 keeps reverting the summary to suggest that Fakhravar gave a presentation to the Israeli Knesset, the cited to sources only suggest that he went to the Knesset to meet with MK Shai Hermesh (Kadima). To use another example, there's a difference between speaking before Congress and going to Congress to speak with one particular Congressman.  Siavash777 continues to make changes to make it appear like the former when all of the sources only refer to the latter.  The second issue is the controversial issues surrounding the Israeli visit as reported by Haaretz.  Siavash777 seeks to remove these issues by simply asserting Haaretz is not a credible publication.  That, as noted above, is an argument that must clearly be dismissed as Haaretz is the premier news organization in Israel.  The last edits in dispute are those concerning comments by other Iranian political prisoners concerning the veracity of Fakhravar's story concerning his escape from Iran and his status as a political leader in Iran.  The comments are incredibly valuable for at least two reasons. First, they are comments from individuals who were imprisoned with Fakhravar in Iran and therefore have first-hand accounts of what occurred.  Second, the comments are from recognizable leaders of the Iranian political movement.  Finally, to ensure objectivity, following the comments is a retort from Fakhravar himself accusing the commentators of being politically motivated and rejecting their allegations.  Altogether, the subject has been written in a balanced way to prevent bias one way or another.


 * Finally, and this is a separate topic all together, but there is every reason to believe Siavash777 is a nickname for the subject himself and should therefore be precluded from making additional edits to his page (or at least be viewed with serious POV concerns). "Siavash" is the subject's pseudonym and his edits contain similar tone, language and spelling/grammatical mistakes as when the Wikipedia contributor, "Aafakhravar" made a number of changes.  It also appears highly coincidental that Siavash777 only began editing the subject's pager when the contributor "Aafakhravar" was prevented.  A comparison of their IP addresses should reveal whether the two are one. Kabirat (talk) 13:06, 3 February 2013 (UTC)

Wikileaks
We can't use Wikileaks cables as a source in the article since it is primary source and is not reliable. I note that this article has multiple issues. I will try to fix them soon.Farhikht (talk) 09:24, 23 July 2013 (UTC)
 * Also Wikileaks documents could harm people.Farhikht (talk) 09:34, 23 July 2013 (UTC)

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A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for speedy deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for speedy deletion: You can see the reason for deletion at the file description page linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 22:36, 23 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Amir Fakhravar.jpg

A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the nomination page. —Community Tech bot (talk) 13:06, 25 February 2019 (UTC)
 * Amir Annie Taylor.jpg

Lack of impartiality
Some of the sources is not impartial, some paragraphs has referenced to Amir Fakhravar’s political rivals such as : Zarafshan, Nasrin Mohammadi, Akbar Mohammadi, Sazegara , Bozorgmehr, Batebi and ..., to discredit internationally reliable sources such as Amnesty international, Frontpage Mag, The New York Sun, National review and ... . References 29 - 31 are not impartial Shahabimilad1387 (talk) 07:11, 8 September 2019 (UTC)

Invalid source
Link 44 of the page is not valid. It is a personal website and the text is written by Fakhravar's rival. So I'll delete the claim in Imprisonment part. PoONeH7013 (talk) 15:26, 11 September 2019 (UTC)

Dead link
Link 45 is dead. And I couldn't find any source proving the paragraph. So I'll delete it PoONeH7013 (talk) 15:36, 11 September 2019 (UTC)

Vandalism
Links 46 and 48 are not valid. Link 47 refers to Ahmad Batebi's personal website. He is Fakhravar's rival in politics. Nasser Zarafshan is also Fakhravar's rival so his claims can't be refered to. PoONeH7013 (talk) 15:40, 11 September 2019 (UTC)

Invalid source
Invalid source PoONeH7013 (talk) 15:46, 11 September 2019 (UTC)

Reference style
References have not written in the same style. I’m Reformatting them to have same style. Shahabimilad1387 (talk) 07:45, 17 September 2019 (UTC)

NPOV
In addition to COI issues, there is an overall NPOV problem as a result of this. The article comes across as promotional and even exaggerating events that were not widely reported in Iranian media. One of the problematic contributors claims sources like Frontpage Mag are "internationally reliable," whatever that means, but such ridiculously POV and unreliable sources are unacceptable. Laval (talk) 15:44, 19 January 2020 (UTC)
 * I agree, the article is full of Wikipuffery, while Fakhravar is generally not taken seriously by the Iranian opposition, nor the regime. Pahlevun (talk) 10:47, 31 January 2020 (UTC)
 * I found these information about him, on a book co-authored by Robert Scheer and Reese Erlich, published by Routledge in 2016:

"In 2006, neoconservative and former Pentagon advisor Richard Perle offered support to a recently exiled political prisoner named Amir Abbas Fakhravar. Perle claimed that Fakhravar was a well-known student leader who escaped from the infamous Evin Prison and then secretly fled Iran to the West. Fakhravar ended up testifying on Capitol Hill and was invited to attend a meeting of Iranian exile leaders at the White House. Unlike Sazegara or former political prisoner Akbar Ganji, Fakhravar seems to echo the neoconservative views on Iran. He told Mother Jones magazine that "any movement or any action whatsoever" by the United States would "help or enhance the people to rise up". But Fakhravar's star dimmed as his connections to neoconservatives became more apparent, and the exiled community questioned his bona fides as a student leader. Several former student activists said they had never heard of him when he was supposedly leading the student movement in Iran."

—Pahlevun (talk) 12:09, 31 January 2020 (UTC)
 * The text below comes from a peer-reviewed article published by the Third World Quarterly in 2007, from researcher affiliated with the University of Oxford:

"The same message is reiterated by 'native informants' [of neo-conservatives]... new ones like Amir Abbas Fakhravar, who advocated the policy of 'regime change' in his testimony to a Senate Homeland Security Committee in July 2006. In an interview with the Sunday Telegraph in the same month, Fakhravar reverted to the other neo-conservative themes explored above, stating that the 'world has to do something whatever it takes so that Mahmoud Ahmadinejad does not become another Hitler'. Sitting safely in his office at the Foundation for the Defence of Democracies, Fakhravar even promotes military action against Iran: 'Whatever the world does against the Iranian regime', he assures us, much in the same way Iraqi exiles did in the build-up to the Iraq war, 'the Iranian people will be supportive'."

—Pahlevun (talk) 12:37, 31 January 2020 (UTC)
 * There are more sources that present another viewpoint:

These views are totally absent from the article. Pahlevun (talk) 14:50, 31 January 2020 (UTC)
 * Matthew Yglesias of The Atlantic writes that "Fakhravar seems to be a bit of a grifter, a crook, and a flim-flam man which, of course, makes him a perfect match for his newfound buddies. In short, he's the new Chalabi. Like Chalabi, there's even some sign that he's actually working with the Iranian security services".
 * Belén Fernández quoted historian Eskandar Sadeghi-Boroujerdi of Oxford University in Middle East Eye, that Fakhravar has “shown himself to be a charlatan and snake oil salesman willing to say whatever and align himself with whoever is in power to further his abject career”, placing him “amongst the most reprehensible of the dregs of a politically and morally bankrupt bunch who have hitched their wagon to the hope that the Trump administration will lead the US to a war against Iran”.
 * Laura Rozen wrote in Mother Jones that he was "virtual unknown both inside and outside Iran when he arrived in the United States" who was notorious for being "an opportunist being pushed to the fore by Iran hawks, a reputed jailhouse snitch who was locked up for nonpolitical offenses but reinvented himself as a student activist and political prisoner once behind bars". She also quotes Financial Times' Tehran correspondent that "Student circles and journalistic circles don’t recognize him as a student leader".
 * Political blog Tikun Olam posted an entry about role of Israeli Intelligence in his visit t Israel.
 * Connie Bruck of The New Yorker has wrote on his relationship with pro-Israel lobby in the united states: "Pooya Dayanim, a Jewish-Iranian democracy activist based in Los Angeles, chatted with Adelson. Recalling their conversation, Dayanim observed that Adelson was dismissive of Reza Pahlevi, the son of the former Shah, who had participated in the Prague conference, because, Adelson said, “he doesn’t want to attack Iran.” According to Dayanim, Adelson referred to another Iranian dissident at the conference, Amir Abbas Fakhravar, whom he said he would like to support, saying, “I like Fakhravar because he says that, if we attack, the Iranian people will be ecstatic.” Dayanim said that when he disputed that assumption Adelson responded, “I really don’t care what happens to Iran. I am for Israel.”"

Annie Taylor Award
The article mentions that he is a recipient of "Annie Taylor Award", and the source is a video on youtube, uploaded by an unverified account presumably belonging to David Horowitz Freedom Center. Youtube videos are per se not good sources for Wikipedia, plus there is no indication that the award is important. Pahlevun (talk) 11:42, 31 January 2020 (UTC)

Commons files used on this page or its Wikidata item have been nominated for speedy deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons files used on this page or its Wikidata item have been nominated for speedy deletion: You can see the reasons for deletion at the file description pages linked above. —Community Tech bot (talk) 09:37, 26 April 2020 (UTC)
 * Amir abbas Fakhravar 2.jpg
 * Amir abbas Fakhravar 3.jpg

Press release of Amnesty International
At this moment, two press releases from Amnesty International are cited in the article: The first is 30 March 2003, Index number: MDE 13/009/2003 and another dated 13 February 2004, Index number: MDE 13/009/2004. The first has actually not much information, but the second is being quoted word by word in the article. There is an update dated 25 March 2004, Index number: MDE 13/021/2004 which corrects a mistake in previous release, and uses a different tone about “white torture”, no more asserting it as if the allegations were a fact. Instead, the updated statement uses the word reportedly almost at every sentence, suggesting that the organization has received reports on that matter but was not able to state them as facts. This most recent statement should be reflected in the article, as it is an update on previous release. Pahlevun (talk) 19:03, 29 April 2020 (UTC)
 * I just realized that Alan Weisman has mentioned the same point on The Los Angeles Times: "Although Amnesty International lists Fakhravar among those tortured by the Tehran regime, it uses the word “reportedly” to describe his ordeal." Pahlevun (talk) 21:12, 29 April 2020 (UTC)

Controversy
Controversy is one of the important part of Mr. Fakhravar's page which has been removed with out any reason. This part has some strong and valid source that shows a different angle of Mr. Fakhravar life. In his Farsi page, this part is more complete and accurate. Also there is several souces for Controversy in farsi. Based on Wikipedia rule, controversy is unremovable from his page and I ask for help from the administrators to protect the mentioned section. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Hajiwashington (talk • contribs) 00:57, 14 July 2020 (UTC)
 * I am well aware of what you say, but on the contrary, WP:BLP prohibits using questionable sources such as 'Iran Social Forum' or personal blog of Ahmad Batebi (self-published sources). They should not be used at all. For using material mentioned by reliable sources like Der Spiegel, try to use them wherever they are applicable, instead of creating a new section for 'Controversy' (because it will be potentially prone to POV). For example, the quote by Vali Nasr can be used in this section: #Activities. Pahlevun (talk) 17:44, 28 July 2020 (UTC)