Talk:Andre the Giant Has a Posse

(Kruger/Fairey)
Is it worth while mentioning the possible influence of Barbara Kruger's work on the OBEY posters/stencils? This article here http://www.loudpapermag.com/article.php?id=10 mentions her influence on Fairey.--Bumhoolery 06:14, August 18, 2005 (UTC)

(WTHell?)
I still don't get what the entire "Andre the Giant Has a Posse" is all about. Someone please give me a satisfying answer. Why did they choose Andre for this pop culture Icon? Because he was a giant? What do they mean by posse? Where they fans of the Wrestler?

I find it frustrating that this icon has become so popular yet no one can explain what the hell it even has to do with any foundation in logic. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.99.204.99 (talk) 21:36, 9 September 2005‎ --222.152.103.40 06:55 & Graphia 06:58, 17 November 2005 (UTC)Graphia effectively claimed the IP edit 3 minutes later, in adding a word; IMO contrary scenarios would be paranoid! Sbrawner 02:40, 3 December 2007 (UTC) --LMNO Goldfish (talk) 19:56, 1 June 2012 (UTC) LMNO Goldfish 03:15, 01 June 2012 (UTC)
 * I agree, I'm going to put up a cleanup - confusion - tag and ask that someone who knows to edit this article so that it is actually clear just what it's about. It's very frustrating to read an article and by the end still have no idea what's going on
 * Hi. Having known Shepard, Blaze, Brian, the Shank twins, the Drex (gawd what a crappy ramp they had) and many more in Charleston (actually Summerville) in '86, I can tell you that the 'Andre' thing came about because the real Andre was performing locally and there was an ad in the paper. He drew it for no other reason than bored teenagers doodle and goof around.  Then he xeroxed it till it was almost illegible, made sticker sheets and it just sorta rolled from there. I have a few original paper stickers and some of the first vinyl ones somewhere around.  I hate to tell you but there is NO LOGIC, NO MEANING behind it.  I think that's the best part, some people get so worked up BECAUSE it doesn't mean anything and they either feel that it should or they innately NEED it to mean something, otherwise I suppose it fucks up their little worldview.  Anyways, that's the story.
 * I'm confused by the year 1989 being cited in the main article. The article cites Fairey's 2008 interview with Format magazine as if it were an accurate presentation of the facts.  Fairey's story there doesn't seem to ring true, though.  Sbrawner's recollection above matches my own in that the stickers came about in 1986 while Fairey was still in the Charleston area.  I am quite certain that the stickers were in the skater community in the Columbia, SC, area in 1986 or 1987.  There are plenty of other websites that claim that it originated in 1986.
 * Thanks, I came to "talk" puzzled about this. At the college I went to in MN someone slipped OBEY stickers under doors in our dorm. I remember specifically because some people were rather upset by it. I graduated in 1986, so I don't see how a creation date of 1988 is possible. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.188.89.180 (talk) 01:39, 25 June 2015 (UTC)

(Batman)
The Batman factoid bothers me because the film came out in 1989, the same year cited in the creation of the meme. I've also reviewed the Batplane scene and saw no Giant faces on any buildings. I'm not deleting the mention of Batman in the entry because I might be missing something, but it is very unlikely that the meme would be in a blockbuster film shot in England the same year it was created by students in Rhode Island. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 147.226.205.83 (talk) 22:11, 19 September 2005‎


 * I agree, I'm changing the movie reference to Batman Forever, based on a a few mentions on the internet. Could somebody who has Batman Forever on DVD please confirm? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Theinfo (talk) 04:32, 20 September 2005

(Why; No on CU)
The 2 following blue-box enclosed 'graphs were originally placed by their creator at the top of the page, and this rule (sense 4) or line:

_______

separated them from the (then) following (but earlier-contributed), signed, single-'graph contrib for which i've now retrofitted the section heading "(Kruger/Fairey)". A colleague, presumably hoping to clean up, had ditched that rule and moved those 'graphs below the 'graph (but above the (until then accurate) sig provided by User:Bumhoolery. For the benefit of anyone who may have taken it at face value when they last looked at this talk page, i struck thru, but left in place, the misleading instance of that sig (in addition to putting a "clean" one back following the contrib it really applies to).

While the indentation of 199x's whole first 'graph may reflect their misunderstanding of wiki formatting, i have, for what it may be worth, preserved their markup and its effect, as follows:

WWF / WWE / Titan Sports / WWFE
Titan Sports (formerly Capitol Sports, now WWFE) is the former WWF's parent company and legal entity, whereas "WWF" is a product name or brand. Titan Sports'/WWFE's "WWF" could no more sue someone than Ford's "Taurus" could. Additionally, "WWF" is its own entity, being the World Wildlife Foundation. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.131.202.198 (talk) 20:16, 8 October 2005

List of cities
Someone include a list of cities where this is found? — Preceding unsigned comment added by VarunRajendran (talk • contribs) 09:47, 31 October 2005 222.152.103.40 06:55, 17 November 2005 (UTC)
 * The main problem with that is it is found in most cities around the US, and hundres more around the world.

reason for Andre the Giant
"I realized that a lot of people didn't know what it was about," he explains later, during an interview at Black Market Design, the successful graphic arts firm he co-owns in San Diego. "But they liked it because they knew that the conservative people hated it. Initially, I wanted to elevate Andre out of the wrestling subculture to be on par with more mainstream cultural icons. That was the coup -- to raise Andre out of a subculture he should be embedded in."

"Even my very first print ad in 1992 was a picture of Elvis with 'Big' underneath and then a picture of Andre with the word 'Giant.' So it was saying that Andre is bigger than Elvis. I also did a shirt called 'The Famous Dead People Shirt,' which was a grid of nine people with Marilyn Monroe, James Dean, Jim Morrison, Bob Marley, Sid Vicious and Andre the last one in the corner."

source: http://www.salon.com/people/feature/2000/06/22/fairey/

Message from one of the "co-founders"
Seeing as how I am regularly listed on this page, I check back on it now and again. I am blown away by the little things that people know about this, that I thought only I knew. (And the stuff that I have to correct, but that's no surprise.)

Anyhow, Barbara Kruger should get proper credit for her influence on Shepard's work, post-'93. The original OBEY sticker is a direct nod to her work, and Kruger's work is so influential with so few people realizing it, that it deserves credit here. I seem to remember an interview where he comes out and gives her due credit.

Yep, here it is.

http://www.tlchicken.com/view_story.php?ARTid=640

"I also remember going to New York in 1990, a year after I started making the original Andre stickers, and seeing all the graffiti on the freeways, and what lengths people were going to, to get up some impressive pieces. That's one of the things that made me want to do bigger stuff. Barbara Kruger, also. Her really bold, powerful combination of images and type heavily influenced me. The idea of maximizing your communication in something you can look at for a split second."

added meaning section, removed confusing tag
I've added a meaning section. It's funny how the act of trying to explain something gives you an insight you didn't have before, but I don't have any inside information. I invite somebody who does to confirm my thoughts. Theinfo 04:44, 5 January 2006 (UTC)

POSSE?
What does "POSSE" means


 * Group of people, or perhaps more accurately a following. Mathmo 10:39, 6 May 2006 (UTC)

OBEY
Shouldn't the main article here be the OBEY campaign and "Andre the giant has a posse" just part of that... I mean these days, Obey is a much bigger thing...

I completely agree. Obey Giant is so much more than this one image. Shepard Fairey has created over 380 prints for the Obey Giant campaign. It is after all obeygiant.com. If we moved this to Obey Giant, or Obey, we could include so much more, including toys, clothing, prints, gallery /fine art and more.

Appearances in pop culture
This area is a little absurd. There are just too many. If we want to keep this, I think we should keep the major ones. This is taking up valuable space that could be used for real information. This article covers less than 1% of what Obey Giant is today.
 * I've created a subpage of this talk page so we can re-organize and cut down that section before fixing it in the article. Please help me out at Talk:André the Giant Has a Posse/Pop Culture References Rewrite. Thanks. Stale Fries taste better 04:29, 21 March 2007 (UTC)
 * As a start, I suggest removing all references to bands/people/etcetera that are red links. I assume those are not as notable. In fact, I'll do it now. Stale Fries taste better 04:31, 21 March 2007 (UTC)

Split?
If we want to keep this article titled "André the Giant Has a Posse", I think we need to make an new article called "Obey Giant". Obey Giant is so much more than this now. Personally I think we need to move this to "Obey Giant" and start putting information in here that covers more than just andre.

split off appearances
definitely overdue for a split Theinfo 04:14, 21 July 2006 (UTC)

Lee Harvey Oswald was a Patsy
I have always read that the Andre the Giant Has a Posse sticker was an original design, and not necessarily a spoof of anything; however, ever since I first saw it I knew it was a coy reference to something, although I couldn't put two and two together.

Then I came across this old flyer from the 60's about Lee Harvey Oswald. I am almost certain that this was the source of the campaign, but I can't seem to find any information about the Oswald flyer. I placed a graphic of it on the main page but I would like to know if anyone can pinpoint the source of the Oswald flyer, and if the artist behind Obey Giant has ever referred to it. I suspect it's relatively obscure and the 60's were before my time so maybe an older contributer can help me out here. Thanks.

— Preceding unsigned comment added by Publicradio (talk • contribs) 03:17, 25 July 2006


 * - In Response: The "flyer" you posted here does use a modified version of Lee Harvey Oswald's mug shot (which can be seen unedited here), but I'm 99% sure that the text was added to mimic the Andre the Giant Has a Posse sticker. Take away that text and you're left with little to compare. This Lee Harvey Oswald poster does seem to fit the style of the many Andre/Posse spin-offs and parodies. It seems to work more in that direction than the other way around. That is to say, it would be a better fit if this image you've found were a parody of the Andre/Posse poster rather than an inspiration for it. If the latter were true, then the Andre/Posse poster would bear a much more obvious resemblance. The original Lee Harvey Oswald mugshot was of better quality, as one can see in the link above or by simply checking the Lee Harvey Oswald article; the "patsy" version seems to have deliberately been degrated in quality to more closely resemble the original Andre/Posse image.


 * Of course, this is all deduction, I know not if the poster you put on here actually did exist some 40 years ago. I think it's less likely that it was a decades-old inspiration and far more likely that it's one of many, many parodies that surfaced after the original Andre campaign took flight. -'tero — Preceding unsigned comment added by 207.200.116.7 (talk) 11:40, 20 November 2006

lee harvey oswald sticker moved here
I'm moving the Lee Harvey Oswald photo here, since it just seems to be just speculation that it's an inspiration. Perhaps it's just a coincidence. It's certainly an interesting find. Anyone who knows more, please chime in. --Theinfo 14:19, 26 July 2006 (UTC)

possible vandalism?
What is this? It's not written in coherent English, and appears to have nothing to do with the content of the article. It looks like some sort of weird vandalistic attempt at self promotion.

"In Hamburg Germany the artist pop.ac formerly known as Art Collart invented 1987 art with stickers and called it Art Collé. 1999 he changed his name into pop.ac - pop.ac is also website and mantra. -"

Added a photo, but can't seem to get the thumbnail to display
Added a "Make Art Not War" example to the "Meaning" section, but despite the "thumb" parameter, only the large version appears. A little help anyone? (fixed--it was the "frame" attribute) Marsh 13:51, 29 August 2006 (UTC)

"tattoo schema"
I've never heard of a tattoo schema. What is it? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 216.114.134.137 (talk) 03:11, 6 November 2006

Little Miss Sunshine
In the 2006 movie "Little Miss Sunshine", Dwayne DOES NOT wear an Obey shirt. It is actually big brother's face from the 1956 film "1984". 86.211.8.97 18:50 -:54 (5 edits), 28 February 2007 (UTC)mar2 Stale Fries taste better 04:34 & :36, 21 March 2007 (UTC) --72.195.138.162 20:23, 21 March 2007 (UTC) 4.244.120.144 21:04, 26 April 2007 (UTC) ** The link from "enlarge[ment]" is at domain thegiant.org but purports to be property of Fox and have its availability to us "strictly prohibited". --Jerzy•t 10:01, 3 September 2012 (UTC)
 * ''The above IP-user saved 5 versions of that 'graph in 4 minutes and a few seconds:
 * consistent with having coded " ~mar2 " as the final line.
 * added the current secn heading as an afterthot, but rem'd the entire odd sig line;
 * added a new final line consistent with using markup identical to the original final line;
 * unlk'd the LMS article;
 * removed the new final line.
 * I've restored the LMS lk, and added a boldface patch into the original version of the final line, to reflect the multiple edits and aid anyone considering checking my reconstruction.''--Jerzy•t 10:01, 3 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Actually he is wearing one. Dwayne with the shirt on.* The print it is based off of. --72.195.138.162 13:39 -:41 (3 edits), 10 March 2007 (UTC)Rd cmt mkup ifUcare --Jerzy•t 10:01, 3 September 2012 (UTC)
 * * The above editor's link to pic of Dwayne is now a  undefined . --Jerzy•t 10:01, 3 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Actually, you're wrong :). That picture you linked is definitely not OBEY, and it definitely looks more like Big Brother.
 * Again... I hate to do this. But you must no be looking at the pic, or your brighness is up too high. There is even an obey star (with andre's face in it) on his forehead (in the shirt). If you cant see it, take it in photoshop and change the levels. It is there 100%.
 * It definitely is an Obey shirt. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Clckdth (talk • contribs) 22:39, 24 March 2007‎
 * Ok, man, that is definitely a Big Brother shirt. it looks NOTHING like Andre the Giant. I'm erasing the fact in the article.
 * It is 100% guaranteed, Ill put my money where my mouth is, an Obey Giant Shirt. The print is called Big Brother 2. Shepard Fairey did it in 2001. Here is a link.* Trust me on this one. I have even enhanced the image in photoshop, and enlarged it so you can see. ** --Noverflow 13:37, 20 May 2007 (UTC)
 * * The above editor's link from "Here is a link" now displays a mere "Image hosted by..." graphic.

Mongonikol (talk) 05:38, 13 February 2008 (UTC)
 * Actually, Shepard lifted it from the original 1984's film's Big Brother poster. Here is a clip.* He did it in 1998. I was there. He did the design at his office in San Diego, and the prints at his home studio. FYI.
 * * The above editor's link to "clip" is now a  undefined . --Jerzy•t 10:01, 3 September 2012 (UTC)
 * Well. Amidst the heat, there has been some light; and this section's existence on a WP talk page will be less of a travesty if heat, light, etc. are sorted out one from another:
 * Heat: "You're stupid, pathetic, and evil." No one was that frank, but the level of discourse approached Proof by blatant assertion, and far too little effort was given to discerning why one's allies' arguments had failed to be convince those not so allied.
 * Light: The subject matter is intrinsically elusive, bcz of the esthetic of (the best i can follow) exploring the power of blurring the distinction between creation and being influenced. Bottom line is that AtGHaP (or AtG in pop art? or...) is nowhere near being independent of BBcirca1956, and it took a year (less 2 weeks) for that fundamental point to become accessible.
 * Editing: We're on this talk page to dope out what to do with the accompanying article. The fraud or prank of hoking up fake evidence is not implausible, but i assume that Dwayne's shirt is a Giant or Obey ref of some kind. Still, it says, just below the pane i am typing markup into, "Encyclopedic content must be verifiable." and that is a different standard from the things that i am willing to assume. What's been presented above is IMO reason to look for reliable sources stating at least that the shirt is a Giant or Obey ref of some kind. And also for reliable sources stating what kind of Giant or Obey ref the shirt is. Or at least for plausible claims by the verifiable creator about what they were trying to refer to.


 * --Jerzy•t 23:43, 3 September 2012 (UTC)

Charles Darwin has a Posse too!
http://www.swarthmore.edu/NatSci/cpurrin1/evolk12/posse/chazhasaposse.htm?ID=76

If I knew how to upload the image, I'd add it to the article. I see these stickers from time to time in Los Angeles and have even seen them in San Diego.LiPollis 10:40, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

Trivia
See All your base are belong to us for an acceptable (short, sourced) trivia / pop culture section.  Dei z  talk 14:01, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

Accent mark
Shouldn't this article just be "Andre the Giant..." not "André"? There's no accent on the stickers. --AW 15:51, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

I agree. I should have changed this years ago. Theinfo 18:05, 19 June 2007 (UTC)


 * Ok. I'll move it now. --AW 15:46, 20 June 2007 (UTC)


 * That's simply because Andre is in capital letters, and an accent is not normally used in typography unless it's lower case. "André the Giant..." is correct 91.85.32.166 (talk) 14:23, 9 December 2012 (UTC)

Counter-Strike
Is it worth mentioning that computer game Counter-Strike has this image selectable as one of default sprayable images? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 84.250.45.172 (talk) 20:53, 23 June 2007‎

--65.78.107.132 (talk) 23:58, 28 June 2008 (UTC)
 * This image, parodies, and variants have made innumerable appearances in pop culture. It's not worth listing them. 20:53, 23 June 2007‎ 84.250.45.172

This page is awful!
I dont know what happened, but it looks like someone tried to clean up the page by deleting a lot of stuff. All this is left of the appearances in culture is one thing. Why have it at all?

This article has been and still is horrible. I can understand having this article as it is.

But what about
 * all 500 of the different obey giant posters. Most of them having nothing to do with andre or the posse
 * obey clothing which is not done by shepard any more
 * obey as a company
 * obey giant as a street art campaign

This auricle either needs to assume the role of all of these things, OR needs to step aside and let other articles be made, and stop redirecting all the information to this one all exclusive article.

Personally, I think we need a few articles:
 * Andre the Giant Has a Posse (talk about the phenomenology and what it became)
 * Obey / Obey Giant (what it is now)
 * Obey Clothing (what it split off into)

I know I cant just start this on y own as someone will just come back and revert it, so can someone else start this? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.195.138.162 (talk) 15:25, 22 July 2007‎


 * Wikipedia is not a guide to popular culture. Information must be sourced, must be verifiable and must be important. I fear your dream ATGHAP and other OBEY articles will not fit WP criteria. As it is, this article is still in need of cleanup and verification. Sorry if this is disappointing.  Dei z  talk 23:22, 22 July 2007 (UTC)


 * Yet we have an article for the nintendo virtual boy when they could all be lumped into nintendo hand held game systems. What I am saying is these things are NOT the same thing anymore. Shepard fairey doesn't even do the art for. If you want to talk standards, either lump other related info, or split this article. The sad thing that is happening here is that all the articles have their own cartel now and you cant do anything without some reverting your work.
 * And if you want sources. I have them. We have a book on this, I run a website that has direct contact with him. Numerous interviews, videos. I run an entire wiki based on obeygiant alone. Do you want legitimate information, or do you just want some random stuff here and there. Personally I vote for an entire reworking of this article. It is junk and does not explain anything to anyone who does not know what it is. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.195.138.162 (talk) 13:12, 4 August 2007


 * Rest assured, I am entirely neutral in all this. Feel free to edit the article as you see fit. If you include references, rather than claim to have them, this will help, assuming they fit with WP:RS. If you want to merge articles together, there are tags you can place on the articles which will invite debates with the objective of reaching consensus on the matter. FYI, your comparison with Nintendo is not relevant - individual articles stand on their own merits, and are never compared in this respect to any other article, regardless of perceived similarities in content, importance or style. You have to verifiy that all of this is significant in the context of an encyclopedia - again, WP is not the great big guide to pop culture.  Dei z  talk 14:17, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

I think it should be Obey Giant, and talk about how it started as Andre... and what it is now. --72.195.138.162 01:03, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
 * I agree that WP should not be the guide to pulp culture, but that is a really hard argument to make when there is an article on every console video game made, along with an attempt to include every album released. I think we need to consider if this article needs a name change. OR, is the article going to be mainly about this sticker, and not about obey giant.

Lawsuit
"Threat of a lawsuit from Titan Sports, Inc. in 1993 spurred Fairey to stop using the trademarked name André the Giant..."

Is there a source for this alleged lawsuit? A cease & desist letter for example, or a recollection in an interview/article? I haven't been able to find anything about this – only recycled versions of the Wikipedia article. In Supply & Demand, Fairey's self-penned monologue, there isn't any mention of it; only that he was tiring of the posse sticker and wanted a more 'streamlined graphic approach' similar to that of the Constructivists. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.86.18.55 (talk) 15:53, 11 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Unfortunately the cited article added by 209.30.19.80 refers to neither the year nor claimant of the lawsuit mentioned. A quote from the article cited, published in 2006: "Over the next 15 years, image and message simplified—in part because of a lawsuit from the deceased wrestler's family—into a blunt, black-and-white icon of a brutal face with the words "Obey Giant" emblazoned beneath."
 * The reference to a lawsuit from the wrestler's estate is mentioned in an interview for International Tattoo Magazine in 1999. "I finally got a notification from his estate that I couldn't use the phrase "Andre the Giant" in any images or use his face in anything. [...] It took them nine years to figure it out."
 * I'm merely curious where the reference to the Titan Sports lawsuit has come from – it seems to have appeared out of thin air. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 78.86.18.55 (talk) 00:42, 14 January 2008 (UTC)

This happened, too. It was '93. I was at Berkeley putting up GIANT in the SF Bay Area, Shepard and Blais and Alfred were all still in Rhode Island, lots was still being done by hand, and all the superfluous AG imagery was done away with. Everything moved to OBEY/DISOBEY. The only thing that stayed was the Original Giant (OG) sticker. What I don't know about is Titan Sports. The letter was from whoever who owned the WWF. Mongonikol (talk) 05:47, 13 February 2008 (UTC)

1990s in San Diego w/Andre & Gary
Was pretty funny from 1994 til about 1998, 1999, or so, seeing Gary (http://www.garykarp.com) stickers, as much or more than Andre ones in San Diego, popping up everywhere.

In that period, Gary was photographed & left as stickers in many cities/states/countries, on all continents (yes, even Antarctica). Got to the point people thought Gary was out of the Andre camp. Big props to Andre and all that, but Gary was its own little big thing, that sprouted w/no prior knowledge of Andre.

Funny story: working at MTV Movie Awards, circa 1995. many A-list celebs, from Nirvana guys to Adam Sandler, to you name it, left with a Gary sticker subtly slapped on their back.

Anyway, good to see Andre's posse still going strong!

Cool that Gary still is hanging out, too, 14 years later (http://www.myspace.com/garykarp)

Illiteral (talk) 08:15, 13 June 2008 (UTC)

"Appearances in North American pop culture" deleted
I don't mean to step on anyone's toes, but Obey Giant has appeared many, many times in North American popular culture. A list with three examples including a Family Guy reference seems unfitting. (Family Guy parodies so many different aspects of pop culture, it's hardly noteworthy that Obey Giant is referenced.) Therefore, I'm deleting that section. I'd also like to see the parodies section cleaned up. I remember years ago looking at the obey site and seeing at least a few dozen different parody images. They have since been removed. --Catch153 (talk) 00:08, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

"Philosophy of Obey"
1. As many editors have noted, notable among them is July 2008 Tyrenius, "This book needs to be mentioned...")

2. This book is about the Andre, Obey, Shepard Fairey and its complete history!

3. This book has been praised by Fairey himself...see note

4. Please do not delete again...let WIKI consensus rule. "Deletion is not a WIKI policy."

Thank you --Baby fu baby (talk) 18:13, 16 September 2008 (UTC)
 * Umm, ignoring the somewhat incoherent nonsense above, the only suitable place for this to be mentioned would be in a "Further reading" section after its notability has been verified. It is never appropriate to simply dump a spammy reference to a book of unknown notability and its ISBN number into an article. I appreciate you are not fully conversant with Wikipedia practice and policies, but your continued readdition of this without wondering why experienced editors are removing it is becoming disruptive. Perhaps you could read WP:NB and give a rationale as to how the book meets WP notability criteria? You could also read the Conflict of Interest guidelines and be honest about whether anything there would prevent you from editing in connection with this book. A glance at your editing history shows your account to be a single purpose account, yet another reason why you should tread very carefully.  Dei z  talk 06:48, 17 September 2008 (UTC)

Thank you for your comments.

1. The experienced art editor I consulted was Tyrenius -- a WIKI editor steeped in art editing.: (cur) (last) 00:29, 16 July 2008 Tyrenius (Talk | contribs) (10,633 bytes) (this book needs to be mentioned) (undo)

2. I love your comment about further reading...


 * 1) . With all due respect to your self-proclaimed self-importance and demonstrable dim handling of the facts of deserved article addition, 'Spammy' is howlingly absurd given the importance of the book, the merit given by an experienced wiki 'art' editor, the books incredible notablility towards Andre the Giant scholarship, the poignant accolades by Shepard Fairey, its books expansive and historic content to Andre the Giant scholarship. In black and white the book is: The History of the Philosphy of Andre the Giant.

Again, you lack of arts experience and careless handling of the subject and addition is evident in your claim of the books ISBN number link: there has NEVER been an ISBN link.

Thank you again for your time. I look forward to applying your additional comment and look forward to hearing more learned comments from experienced editor knowledgable on this topic -- rather than one who can only 'delete' which is NOT a wiki policy.

--Baby fu baby (talk) 18:06, 20 September 2008 (UTC)
 * I appreciate you are a single-purpose account and inexperienced with Wikipedia, e.g. notability and verifiability requirements, article formatting, understanding of various policies and guidelines etc. etc., but there is such a thing as refusal to get the point. Why not spend your energy creating a WP:NB compliant article for this book, rather than spouting utter nonsense on talk pages?  Dei z  talk 03:54, 23 September 2008 (UTC)

Thank you for your comments. 1. Your "Further Reading" comment was very useful. Thank you. 2. Please give me the direct link to where it states what a Wiki account user can or cannot direct his or her attention to? 3. Please give me the direct link to where it states in Wiki where one should put ones energies? 4. As for my utter nonsense, omg, I am presuming you mean the 'notability' and 'verifiablity' links from the greatest authority on this Wiki Article, Andre the Giant: namely, Shepard Fairey, hello! Not only did I supply that direct link, but I also linked to the excellent "OBEY" wiki link. Maybe your cursor was frozen?

However, I can assure you that 'deletion' is not a wiki policy. Let me quote you Wiki policy, "If the page can be improved, this should be solved through regular editing, rather than deletion." In other words, get off your meaningless platitudes and find a subject you might know something about. For starters, you might learn something about 'nonsense', which, again, it appears you know nothing about but love to spout meaninglessly about.

I will edit the sentence and reinsert it the next chance I get. I look forword to your valued edits -- not deletion of the "History" of Andre the Giant.

--Baby fu baby (talk) 17:42, 23 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Just to clarify: my comments on the book related to the main Shepard Fairey article, where its mention seemed valid as Fairey had praised it on his site. Whether it's relevant in this article or not, I don't know.  Ty  01:23, 7 October 2008 (UTC)

A section or snippet on the Barack Obama versions?
Shepard Fairey endorses Barack Obama and has worked on his campaign. Ever since he announced his candidacy for president I've been seeing Obama stencils based on the Obey Giant springing up everywhere. I'm not sure where it would fit, since it's not a parody like the Tattoo or Palin ones because it's straight from Fairey himself. Should we have a mention of this in the article? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.107.80.74 (talk) 13:12, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

Change title to Obey Giant
I think we should change the title of this article to "Obey Giant." That is in fact the name that Shepard has chosen, as in http://www.obeygiant.com Iconic D (talk) 05:44, 23 December 2008 (UTC)

Contested speedy delete of sticker image
Apologies if I dorked up adding the hangon tag. Couldn't see an explanation on here as to why the image should be deleted, and as the image is of the sticker that started the reason for this article, I'd think there should be an awfully good reason for deleting it. BrianDeacon (talk) 05:44, 16 January 2009 (UTC)

Not everyone is happy with this artist/phenomenon
I believe the article is not balanced. Many believe that the art is plagiarized. Please read this page for an example http://www.art-for-a-change.com/Obey/index.htm You don't even need to read it, just browse the images. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Ciper (talk • contribs) 07:37, 20 January 2009 (UTC)
 * Agreed. More to the point, though, the entire article is subjective as it is, and incredibly biased.  It goes to great lengths to absolve the phenomenon's creator of any wrongdoing, and transparently attempts to refute against any and all criticism without offering any real counter-argument.WildlifeAnalysis (talk) 02:52, 11 February 2009 (UTC)

Some notes
Reviewing ATGHAP page after hearing I had been "buffed", not only did I put it back, I cleaned up some other stuff. Mostly little. But one of the things that sort of irritated me is the presence BOBEY sticker. It IS indicative of the parody stuff, but there are better known parodies. What bugged me most was in reviewing the changes when it appeared, it looks as if someone was is just getting their stuff "up" by tagging the page.

Which in itself is cool but the bite itself is kind of lame. Like I said, I think there are better examples, ones that are less obscure.

Another thing that caught my eye is that the page seems looser and less informative then it had been previously. Maybe I'm mistaken but a lot of the quotes from "critics" [sic] come across as derivative and inconsequential.

People get hung up on OBEY GIANT vs ATGHAP so maybe there should be another, separate OBEY page, and one which outlines the present status of the project/experiment (ie OBEY).

Lastly, the plagiarism accusations are something that is not new per se to the work, but now that Shepard has got all this attention it seems to have picked up steam. It is one of those things that come along with all the other stuff: Fame, notoriety, longevity, perhaps even relevancy (?). In any case, since FSH is doing all the stuff by hand (exacto on rubylith of imagery; silk-screened), the accusation can certainly to be argued. My point however is that while noteworthy, it seems out of place as the lead-off for the article's main body.

Also, and possibly worthy of addition, is that the phrase, "Andre the Giant has a posse" was inspired by the Sir Mix-A-Lot track, "My Posse's On Broadway" and the idea of rap "posses" at the time (1988-89). FSH was doing a piss-take on it all, very true to his punk rock/skate rat roots in this sense. But worth recalling is that in 1989 sampling was a VERY BIG DEAL. Nearly all hip-hop artists were being accused of...plagiarism. Worth noting. Mongonikol (talk) 20:53, 15 October 2009 (UTC)

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A Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the. —Community Tech bot (talk) 11:21, 11 August 2018 (UTC)
 * TATTOO the MIDGET has a bigger POSSE.jpg

Obey?
I cannot find how the change into "OBEY" went ('stylistically and semantically'). Can someone add that to the article? -DePiep (talk) 21:06, 8 March 2020 (UTC)

1990 Buddy Cianci Campaign billboard ad defacement
I did not see any reference to the 1990 Buddy Cianci Billboard ad Defacement. According to a September 2019 article in obeygiant.com Shepard pasted the face of Andre The Giant over Buddy Cianci's face and replaced the word 'Cianci' with 'Andre'. This sparked media attention as Buddy Cianci was running for Mayor for a second time after being forced to step down after he was found guilty of Assault on his ex-wife's lover years earlier. Cianci still was very well liked amongst Providence residents and this caused a bit of controversy towards Shepard. 

What Appropriation?
I understand that some argue that this artist appropriates other work: but the section on appropriation has no examples of this at all. Instead it consists of a lawsuit claiming that another artist appropriated *his* work, followed by a vague paragraph with no evidence whatsoever. Surely someone can come up with something concrete: otherwise I would strongly urge that this section be deleted.