Talk:Anime-influenced animation

Examples of anime-influenced animation
Moved "original" list here for later use. KyuuA4 19:47, 5 September 2007 (UTC)

North American animation

 * Avatar: The Last Airbender
 * Ben 10
 * The New Adventures of He-Man
 * The Boondocks
 * Jackie Chan Adventures
 * Kappa Mikey
 * Megas XLR
 * Perfect Hair Forever
 * Samurai Jack
 * Super Robot Monkey Team Hyperforce Go!
 * Teen Titans
 * Hi Hi Puffy AmiYumi
 * Invasion America
 * The Batman
 * Fantastic Four
 * Xiaolin Showdown
 * Shuriken School
 * The Spectacular Spider-Man
 * Star Wars: Clone Wars
 * Storm Hawks

European animation
*Ōban Star-Racers *Totally Spies
 * A.T.O.M.
 * Code Lyoko
 * Martin Mystery
 * Team Galaxy
 * W.I.T.C.H.
 * Winx Club

Online RPG/Flash Game

 * AdventureQuest
 * Dragon Fable
 * Neopets

Non-Japanese Asian animation

 * Pucca

Old Writing
This was formerly in the article. Moved here because it needed cleanup. KyuuA4 04:24, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

Background
However, the trend began as early as the The Transformers series. While this series was not considered anime, Japanese designer Shōhei Kohara was responsible for creating the earliest character models for the Transformers cast.

As predecessors, anime-influenced animation owes to manga-influenced comics and La nouvelle manga, due to manga influences affecting the American and Franco-Belgian comic book industries. At the same time, the increasing amount of Japanese anime series coming into the US, starting mainly with Robotech (though other Americanized anime series were broadcast as early as the 1950s) impacted a generation of writers, animators and artists. On a similar level, Japanese cinema, such as jidaigeki, also influenced directors and others. As the Japanese artforms made an impact overseas, creators outside of Japan began to emulate the styles, dynamics, and clichés of the Japanese forms.

Some American animated television series have singled out anime styling with satirical intent, for example South Park (with "Chinpokomon" and "Good Times With Weapons"). South Park has a notable drawing style, which was itself parodied in "Brittle Bullet", the fifth episode of the anime FLCL, released several months after "Chinpokomon" aired. Furthering the cycle is Teen Titans, a series that references FLCL on multiple points. 

Change Name
Come to think of it. This "phenomemon" isn't limited to animation. The same thing occurs within manga. Perhaps the article can be changed to reflect both anime and manga. KyuuA4 20:26, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

I'm not sure what the point of the article was. It said Animation but then had listings of video games and other stuff, so perhaps stuff in general? Armiga6 19:44, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

Citation on the List Items
This is by far the first Wiki article I've seen that wanted citations on listed items. KyuuA4 04:48, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

It's a requirement for anything that's subjective. Anyone could just say any show they want "looks like anime" since it means different things to different people. By actually listing a source (such as a press release by the creators) it helps cut down on crap entries. Armiga6 02:27, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Merge with Anime
Obviously, this topic has SOME relation to anime. KyuuA4 06:45, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

When?
When did this category come about? As far as I know, this category did not exist during the 1990's - considering anime itself was growing in popularity. KyuuA4 22:01, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

Avatar: The Legend of Aang
Avatar is animated in South Korea, so it is a combo of manhwa-yeonghwa and american writing. It doesn't seem to emulate anime, as it is genuingly drawn as a manhwa-yeonghwa. As this list is only for the visuals (ie animation), this show does not attempt to emulate anime, and if it does, then that makes every Korean animation to be emulating anime, which isn't true.24.218.65.219 16:38, 30 August 2006 (UTC)
 * I think the key here is "American writing" (and art direction too). You have to think about style versus content, and the fact that almost everything is animated in SK nowadays (including "American" cartoons like the Simpsons), so style is more blurry (since it tends to travel faster than cultural content, as most writers tend to write about themselves in one way or another.)  You can't say it's manhwa/yeonghwa because it was created in Korea.  I think content matters here as much as style does.  ColourBurst 01:01, 14 September 2006 (UTC)
 * But this is anime-influenced animation, not animated shows. This catagory is characterized by strictly art style. If it isn't (as you claim it to be), then shows like Winx and Witch shouldn't be on the list, as the only thing they have that is influenced by anime is the art style.Mishy dishy 01:03, 23 September 2006 (UTC)


 * No, apparently, anything that looks like anime but is not classified as anime belongs here. Also, the country of origin is not relevant.  In my opinion, this is a very odd thing to do.  It would be a lot easier to simply classify them as anime, using the Japanese definition. KyuuA4 10:27, 8 October 2006 (UTC)

For Avatar: The Airbender, this is what Sci-Fi Channel (one of the first network channels to air anime on TV) had to say: "With its long story arc, Asian-influenced designs and themes, terrific animation and zippy leaps between comedy and drama, Avatar blurs the line between anime and domestic cartoons until it becomes irrelevant. A great show is great no matter its country of origin." 

Needless to say, the line distinction between "cartoon" and "anime" is getting thinner. KyuuA4 21:45, 16 October 2006 (UTC)

Let alone, the true definition of anime, is that all cartoon are anime..."THROUGH FIRE, JUSTICE IS SERVED!" 03:06, 15 November 2006 (UTC)

Read the credits to ANY American or Japanese anime or toon & you will find that a great chunk of it was done in Korea. I'm familiar with 3 different styles of Korean anime & Avatar doesn't fall into any of them. One style is the Aeon Flux/Heavy Metal type, another is the Pucca/I Love Egg type, & the other looks like it was done in Japan; the Bastof Syndrome type. LikaLaruku 8:07, 26 November 2006.

Since the film Heavy Metal was made by 7 different studios and with 7 different art styles, all of which western by every possible definition, i've concluded that your comment is a blatant fabrication. Bloody Sacha 17:27, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

Aeon Flux: Anime or Not?
Even if Peter Chung has participated many times in projects involving japanese companies; I'm not sure Aeon flux should be mention as an example of Amerime because it wasn't done with intentions to emulate Anime but just as an unique style for an MTV animation...and it was done before Amerime became popular between companies.

Any suggestions? (remember that other Peter Chung's works such as Reign: The Conqueror (also known as "Alexander") were true Amerime because they were produced and directed in japanese companies)

I never thought of Aeon Flux as anime, it looks more like American animation and the creator is Korean so maybe there was a misconception with it being Korean animation-esque. Rabid coathangers eat da world 18:23, 14 May 2006 (UTC) Minako-Chan* 02:20, 5 May 2006 (UTC)

However - anime is full of "unique" styles. KyuuA4 19:08, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

It was made in America, thus it's not anime. It doesn't even look like anime, it looks like typical 80's/90's comic book art. --Amibite 20:14, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Aeon flux is incredibly not anime, Just because the author or artist is Asian doesn't make any material produced "influenced by anime" Jim Lee, Brandon Choi, Jim Cheung, Sean Chen, Bernard Chang and many many others have produced western art without any "anime" affects. I can't believe this is up here. Its incredibly hard to reconcile Japans hard ridged art style with western material as both schools of art are fundamentally repellent. Anyone with first hand experience would recognize it instantly. Before posting here be sure to have actually read some comic books, really its the same reason why you wouldn't talk about socket wrenches without the benefit of rudimentary engineering knowledge. Much of this article looks suspect to me. Bloody Sacha 17:14, 23 October 2007 (UTC)

Aeon Flux & Heavy Metal both look like South Korean adult anime to me. Peter Chung is Korean & he made another anime in Japan that was inacurately based on Alexander the Great, but his style was based on a non-asian painter. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.19.236.142 (talk) 10:10, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

European Animation
Totally Spies, Martin Mystery, Code Lyoko, etc. are all European, not American; I think that this article needs to be merged with anime.

No, I suggest a new article...this is something that has to be investigated to suggest a better name (if there is one) to Amerime...since Amerime is not real Anime (not made in japan), it shouldn't be merged into the Anime article, though it could be merge as an individual article linking to this main article, not as part of the whole Anime article. thank you. Minako-Chan* 04:16, 16 May 2006 (UTC)


 * I agree. I merge of this article with the anime article will be suitable.  However, at the current point, this is a debate over "what is anime" and "what is not anime".  In the anime article, I already noted the change in Western animation due to anime.  Eventually, it will become appropriate to fully merge this article with anime. KyuuA4 16:22, 5 October 2006 (UTC)


 * Um, yeah. Also, I don't see any anime influences in Winx Club. Maybe the gigantic eyes...Gladrius 19:27, 29 August 2006 (UTC)


 * Apparently, even I took a close look at Winx Club and wondered the same thing. KyuuA4 16:23, 5 October 2006 (UTC)

Hi, I say the name should be changed from amerime to animesque or psuedo-anime or animix. or "anime-nation" but DO NOT delete this article!!! this is the greatest debate on creative efforts for all the artists not working in japan. there are great things out there that are not anime but they are as great as japanimation. i say let all the japanese anime be called japanimation and everything else should be called anime. regards

dan


 * Actually, what should be done is the same thing that was done over at Amerimanga: the fact is, Amerime is the best known name for this style/genre of animation, but also note that other names (I've heard "animesque") are also used. To change the name of the article is to deny the fact that this is the term used most often to describe it.--み使い Mitsukai 14:20, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Is is really? I kinda made up the word (as I point out with a combination of chagrin and glee each time this comes up for deletion, the creation was independent but may have not been the first) and that is just so cool. I suppose we could make up another word, like "Eurome", but I can't really see it catching on. -Litefantastic 19:01, 2 June 2006 (UTC)
 * Actually, as I mentioned before, you really didn't make up the word, as I'd heard it referenced as early back as the original Robotech run. You could say that you're responsible for the usage and introduction here, but it's been in neologism for quite some time and is only gaining outright acceptance now.--み使い Mitsukai 17:29, 6 June 2006 (UTC)

We cannot suggest new names to terms already existant. Anime is the name the japanese originaly gave to their particular style of animation and Amerime is the name that aparently the american comic industry gave to their anime-styled way of animating as well as the word "japanimation" which was also given by the american industry in the 80's.

If the history of these terms (except anime, which according to the wikipedia article of Anime, it was derived from the french word for animation), please add it to this article.

About concidering european anime-styled animation part of amerime, you also have to think how the japanese see this, since probably for them; it all comes from the same place (or producer). The only way to change names is if you find information about a better name given to amerime and of course, give the link in the "external links" section of this article.

conclusion: prove that another company has given a better name to describe non japanese anime-styled cartoons and that this name is popular among viewers. Minako-Chan* 01:25, 4 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I'd love to see how they try and rationalize the origins of a word that was popularized by the WP. -Litefantastic 17:00, 6 June 2006 (UTC)


 * I agree, change the name of create other name like Pseudo-anime or western anime, since not all anime like show can come from the US.

(Danraz 04:56, 10 June 2006 (UTC)) HEY hey guys, this is not between you and us. Ok. This is about a newest growing work of art style. Tell me, have you seen "wonderful days"? it is a beautiful anime and similar to the artistic style of Ghost in the shell. But it is made in Korea. and there are countless other are coming. This field has just started to grow. and we just can't let few hundred 'japanimation' fans or American-anime fans to write off this style of animation as 'non anime'. This need to be baptized. This need to be clear and soon. Sure Japan and America are the biggest markets but it doesn't allow them to deny other artist's effort who is working in rest of the world man. Regards

About Korean Animation
I know some concider Korean animation not anime but you have to admit, it's the closest thing to anime, so it shouldn't be called inside the amerime category since they have worked in this kind of animation style for longer time that occidentals, not to mention that many games playable for the PS2/3 and Xbox(360°) were created by korean designers, a great example of this is Magna Carta, which character design was created by Hyung-tae Kim which artistic values have nothing to envy to many japanese manga-ka.

"Wonderful Days" was a great film and it shows that if you do it right, it can be concidered a great anime artwork. Occidentals have still a long road to get there but let's say they are doing right...at least they have shown that with Avatar: The Last Airbender.

Remember that amerime is a term that applies to occidental animation which is designed like anime.

Minako-Chan* 01:24, 29 June 2006 (UTC)


 * The way I see it -- this article is the "everything else" non-anime category. 75.32.34.250 21:49, 10 October 2006 (UTC)

Totaly Spies is French Canadian. LikaLaruku 8:07, 26 November 2006.

renaming article
Clearly it's not only american animators who are incorporating aspects of Japanese animation into their works. Can we rename this to "Anime-influenced animation" or something to that effect? Amerime can remain as a subsection or blurb since it seems to have some precendent among a small group of people(even though it was deleted for neologism three times over). As an article title, it's not appropriate because it only applies to a subset of the works being produced in this style. You can bet non-american artists aren't going to call their anime-influenced works amerime!--72.137.173.201 07:27, 15 July 2006 (UTC)


 * I agree, it should be moved to Anime-influenced animation. While this article was deleted several times already and the original author even admitted in the last AfD that he intentionally created it as a neologism! The subject is notable, but the term is not. As much as I dislike amerimanga, at least that actually has some factual historical basis for the term, even if it's debatable how popular it is compared to say, OEL. It seems this term amerime has spread largely because of the wikipedia page. I agree with the term also disincluding the many, many non-American works this term covers. --SevereTireDamage 23:40, 17 July 2006 (UTC)


 * Ok, since you're the one with an account, go ahead and do the move. I've edited the article accordingly. --72.137.173.201 18:04, 20 July 2006 (UTC)

Half of these shows don't even look anything like anime..
Code Lyoko? Ying Yang Yo? Xiaolin Showdown? Megas? Hi Hi Puffy AmiYumi? I'm not sure what anime you guys are watching, but I've yet to see any that look similar to these shows. --Amibite 18 November

Taking influence from anime doesn't necessarilly mean the way a series looks, but the general style; storyline, action, characterisation etc.


 * In other words, the things the series does. KyuuA4 16:29, 14 December 2006 (UTC)


 * Yes, which "complicates" things more, doesn't it? KyuuA4 16:29, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

Then explain to me how Crayon Shin-chan looks like any other anime. And agreed. The way a show looks does not categorize it as being anime - even though as much as I'd want to at least classify something like Avatar as anime. KyuuA4 16:29, 14 December 2006 (UTC)

But aside from an overall generic art-style like Teen Titan's anime expressions, there's not really anything exclusive to anime that can't be found in books, comics, or shows from anywhere in the world. Thus the only way a show can really be anime influenced is by the art (or direct references to it, like Kappa Mikey) --Amibite 09:03, 18 December 2006 (UTC)
 * I think that Japanese culture and the Japanese language are exclusive to anime in terms of animated series. Both can affect the animation style. --Squilibob 12:20, 18 December 2006 (UTC)
 * I don't see how you can say Japanese culture is exclusive only to anime, and it's kind of boarderline racism to think that the only reason any non-Japanese form of media would reference Japan is because of anime. There have been plenty of movies dating back to the 30s that reference or take place in Japan, long before anime was made.  --Amibite 01:53, 4 January 2007 (UTC)

You know, I don't see how Monev the Gale from Trigun looks anything like Venom from Spiderman, but Nightow still intended the character as an intentional refference to the infamous Spiderman villain. In other words, just because you don't see a resemblance, doesn't mean it wasn't intended. Take Code Lyoko for example, which you insist looks nothing like a Japanese animated series, yet the creators themselves admited being heavily influenced by their visual style, as shown here.--Tenka Muteki 06:36, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

Amerime & Amerimanga; WHY it looks so wrong
Look closely at Amerime & Amerimanga. AMERIME: The people who make it are copying outdated styles from the 60s, 70s, & 90s. They're trying to use the looks found in Slayers, Astro Boy, & Speed Racer. Comparing the anime character designs to it's manga counterpart reveals huge differences in style. AMERIMANGA: The reason these look so aweful is because the artists are using Anime-style character designs instead on Manga-style. I dare to call the Hellsing (Japanese) & Labyrinth mangas (chinese artist)Amerimanga. Look at those sloppy profiles & messy eyes. Just because you can draw props, hair, clothes, & landscape is no excuse for such crappy character design. LikaLaruku 8:19pm, 27 November 2006

Which brings up an interesting point, what do you call all the Japanese shows and manga that borrow elements from American stuff? Like One Piece, or Cowboy Bebop. I often see people complaining about stuff like Totally Spies, but all the anime that takes elements from American shows or comics don't ever seem to get any flak for it, or even bother mentioning it. Seems a bit hypocritical. --Amibite 20:28, 28 November 2006 (UTC)


 * There's nothing even remotely American looking about Cowboy Bebop. As for One Piece, it looks like anime from the 1960s, pre-Astro Boy. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.19.236.142 (talk) 10:13, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * The author of One Piece, Eiichiro Oda, had already made it clear that his style was influenced by Western cartoons, he personally named Tom & Jerry as a huge inspiration. He's also a fan of old Disney films. His art style is a cross between American animation and Akira Toriyama's artstyle. Speaking of Disney, the first real "anime" art style was basically just a take on Walt Disney's style, so in a way America inspired anime. Nothing in the article about that. Buuhan1 (talk) 05:14, 22 April 2009 (UTC)


 * Unfortunately, at the present time, that sentiment is a one-way street. I've taken this discussion over to Anime News Network; but in the end, it was lambasted. KyuuA4 17:00, 29 November 2006 (UTC)

Proposed for Deletion
I proposed the article for deletion due to it mostly containing original research that can't really be verified, such as the background and criticism sections. The subject is also too general to justify having an article dedicated to it rather than simply mentioning it on the individual show's pages. Otherwise, we might as well create articles such "Star Wars influenced animation" or "James Bond influenced animation" and so forth for anything that might influence something else. Also, with only a handful of series listed out of the thousands there are out there, the notability is also extremely low. Amibite 22:27, 2 April 2007 (UTC)
 * I'm going to second this. The lines are becoming blurred as to what is what and it's mostly subjective, anyway. I'll wait a couple of days. Pacific Coast Highway { talk • contribs } 02:27, 15 July 2007 (UTC)
 * I don't know about the actual article, but I think that it's at least worthwhile to have a list of anime-influenced animation. I know none of the series listed has any sources, but I've found a few and added them in. I'm planning to add more over time. Ravenwolf Zero 17:21, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
 * This article has become progressively less about the legitimate affects of anime on western animations and progressively more about divided parties desperately putting claims on "styles" for nationalistic fervor or other forms of tribalism. Naturally actual facts where the first casualties and since it will be utterly impossible to balance the perspectives of anime fans and fans of other material ae western to produce a on the level encyclopedic entry this article should be torched. Bloody Sacha (talk) 11:56, 15 April 2008 (UTC)

Resemblance to anime
Anime has LESS fluid animation than other forms of animation? WTF? -- AvatarMN 05:31, 2 June 2007 (UTC)
 * I believe it means that anime generally has a lower frame rate than American animation, so it looks a bit choppier. Ravenwolf Zero 17:22, 5 August 2007 (UTC)
 * The only thing is... it doesn't.  -- AvatarMN 22:54, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
 * This isn't subject to debate. significant western animations have always had more frames then contemporary Japanese material, compare 1983s "fire and ice" to 1984s "Nausicaa of the valley of the wind" even to the untrained eye the difference is obvious. Even later titles like Akira and Ghost in the Shell don't compare. Thats the difference "rotoscoping" makes. Bloody Sacha (talk) 16:38, 16 December 2007 (UTC)
 * ...What? Rotoscoping was sparingly used in American animation, and isn't really used any more, as it looked like it wasn't animation (which it wasn't, in LOTR) and most people didn't like it.  You're saying some Bakshi-produced film looked better and more professional than a Miyazaki masterpiece?  You're crazy, and just look at public opinion about Bakshi compared to Miyazaki in order to prove it.  Ghost in the Shell has choppier animation than Fire and Ice... Good god.  -- AvatarMN (talk) 06:57, 11 May 2008 (UTC)

Anime-Influenced List
* Avatar: The Last Airbender * Ben 10 [citation needed] * Di-Gata Defenders. * The New Adventures of He-Man [citation needed] * The Boondocks [4] * Kappa Mikey [5] * Megas XLR [6] * Perfect Hair Forever [citation needed] * Samurai Jack [citation needed] * Super Robot Monkey Team Hyperforce Go! [citation needed] * Teen Titans [7] * Hi Hi Puffy AmiYumi [citation needed] * Invasion America [citation needed] * The Batman [citation needed] * Fantastic Four [citation needed]

* The Spectacular Spider-Man [citation needed] * Star Wars: Clone Wars [citation needed] * Storm Hawks [citation needed]

European animation

* A.T.O.M. [citation needed] * Code Lyoko [citation needed] * Martin Mystery [citation needed] * Ōban Star-Racers[citation needed] * Team Galaxy [citation needed] * Totally Spies [citation needed] * W.I.T.C.H. [citation needed] * Winx Club [citation needed]

Online RPG/Flash Game

* AdventureQuest [citation needed] * Dragon Fable [citation needed] * Neopets [citation needed]

Non-Japanese Asian animation

* Pucca [citation needed]

Recovered Purged List. KyuuA4 20:05, 16 August 2007 (UTC)


 * This was the list I removed in order to remove the unverified sources tag. If anyone find a first-party source (such as a statement from the creators about a finished product) then feel free to add it to the article. Armiga6 00:07, 18 August 2007 (UTC)
 * This is to be used as a checklist. KyuuA4 20:06, 29 September 2007 (UTC)

Take Pucca off the list. All Korean webtoons (Pucca originated as a webtoon) use that style. I watched tons of them in the early 2000s, & Pucca's design is South-Korean distinct. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.19.236.142 (talk) 10:16, 26 September 2008 (UTC)

Japanese co-productions
Do shows that were half-done in Japan, such as Oban Star Racers, need to be here? For all intents and purposes, they're half-Japanese so it seems pointless to list them here. I assume that's also the reason Animatrix was removed. Armiga6 22:38, 3 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Thing is... they do not get listed as "anime". Therefore, the fact that the Japanese were involved should be more than enough to render it as "anime-influenced".  As for Animatrix, I have no idea why the individual removed it. KyuuA4 17:41, 7 September 2007 (UTC)

Boondocks
I’ve taken the liberty of reconciling this statement with reality

”· The Boondocks. Season 2 is under production by Japanese animation studio Madhouse. Production cites Cowboy Bebop and Samurai Champloo as source of inspiration.[11]”

”· The Boondocks. Season 2 is under production by Japanese animation studio Madhouse. Aaron McGruder cites Cowboy Bebop and Samurai Champloo as sources of inspiration for fight scenes.[11]”

You can verify my modification by fallowing the source the original author used. Or reading a copy here

”Aaron McGruder on the anime influences for the fight scenes: We looked at Samurai Champloo and Cowboy Bebop to make this work for black comedy and it would be a remarkable thing. We didn't get anywhere close to where we wanted on the first season, but when you see the animation in the second season, it's a big step up and that gives you the freedom to pull off sequences that have some visual impact. We went in that direction because we felt we were able to pull it off. I was impressed with some of the fight sequences of season one and knowing how much we learned, I felt like we could really push that in the second season and we did and it worked out really well.” Bloody Sacha 16:52, 23 October 2007 (UTC)


 * That'd be too much as far as the list is concerned. However, that can be used in the main body of the article. -- KyuuA4 (talk) 17:46, 16 November 2007 (UTC)

Please explain what "anime style" is
This phrase has popped up time and time again, and this article is more or less based around that. People's #1 reason for saying a show is anime-like is because of the art-style, but that implies there is an "anime-style" to begin with. If you look at the most popular cartoons in Japan, such as Crayon Shin-chan, Naruto, Doraemon, One Piece, and Detective Conan, you'll find none of them look like the others, and they all have their own style. So how can any of these shows mimic a style that doesn't exist? Unless someone can explain just what "anime style" is and what defines it to the point that this article has meaning, I really think this article should be deleted. All the points listed in this article seem to be based upon opinions rather than actual facts, which is something Wikipedia frowns upon.- Baron Armadillo 10:25, 16 November 2007 (UTC)


 * What this article needs is a complete re-write; and unlike most anime articles, there exist writings explaining this trend. This article parallels the concept as OEL manga.  Now, as for "anime style" - from what I managed to learn, Japanese animation and Western animation are two different schools of animation.  Yet, based on market trends, one will mimic the other.  In the 1950's, anime mimicked Disney at the time, simply because Disney was the most dominant form of animation.  Nowadays, that trend flipped; and we have all sorts of companies -- particularly some French companies -- trying to emulate anime. From a technical standpoint, it is possible to describe the anime style.  However, by nature of media, these descriptions have to be loose, not strict. -- KyuuA4 (talk) 17:41, 16 November 2007 (UTC)


 * However, most of these "anime traits" are simply opinions people have. It's like critiquing art where everyone will have their own opinion what it means, compared to facts or numbers that can't be disputed. One of the main things I noticed is people claim big eyes is a staple of "anime", but Osamu Tezuka took the concept of big eyes from Disney.  However, even with that, people will claim anything with big eyes looks "animeish" even if the concept is of Western origin and a lot of Japanese shows themselves don't have big eyes.  If this article is to stay, it would need to get a lot more specific, such as instead of a generalized "anime influence", it could say things such as "X was influenced by Y in the sense that X borrows a lot of art from series Y in terms of character facial structure and anatomy."  Simply saying "anime influence" implies that every Japanese cartoon is like that, and the creator of said show has seen every single Japanese cartoon ever made and is borrowing elements from all of them.- Baron Armadillo (talk) 05:18, 18 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Well, for the most part, I generally looked at "tutorials" regarding "drawing anime". There exists a specific skill-set devised for designing "anime characters".  It would be nice for that section to be written by an actual anime character designer, but I would assume that they're... rather busy. As for this article, yes.  There needs to be increased clarity towards explaining "anime influence".  For now, it's simply animation that looks like anime - but isn't considered to be anime.  Sadly, that's a very screwy description. KyuuA4 (talk) 06:08, 18 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Those "tutorial" books are pretty much just quick cash-ins to sucker kids into buying. Notice how they're all drawn by Americans.  But yes, they really don't help things by trying to get kids into thinking there's an "anime style"; unless they're also saying most Japanese cartoons aren't "anime" because they look nothing like the drawings in those books.-Baron Armadillo (talk) 01:50, 19 November 2007 (UTC)


 * Well, there are some real facts about this discussion topic:
 * 1) There exists a determinant between non-anime and anime.
 * 2) Most fans within anime reject the concept of non-Japanese developing anime.
 * 3) For every trend, someone will copy it.
 * Determining the "anime style" in a quantitative fashion is extremely difficult. In fact, an estimate is simply the best anyone can come up with as far as any kind of description is concerned.  Yet, I'm willing to assert that it is possible to come up with a description for the "anime style".  As for those tutorials, they do summarize the basic skill-set needed for anyone who wishes draw the "Japanese style". Most Japanese cartoons aren't "anime" because they look nothing like the drawings in those books. Scouting some sites, I've seen some pretty good work out there. KyuuA4 (talk) 06:58, 19 November 2007 (UTC)

Sample
Here is a sample of the "anime style" used to draw caricatures of actual people. KyuuA4 (talk) 06:58, 19 November 2007 (UTC)
 * Ironically, the drawing he says looks like Disney looks more like Ken from Powerpuff Girls Z more than anything else, to me. Just goes to show you how one animator's view can be different from another's. Baron Armadillo (talk) 03:31, 27 November 2007 (UTC)

Oban-Star Racers
I noticed someone struck out Oban claiming that it is an anime. Personally, I would not mind that. However, that would contradict its own article. First, the article does not state that it is anime. Second, it's not using an animanga infobox. So, is it anime or not? KyuuA4 (talk) 06:56, 17 November 2007 (UTC)


 * The problem with the term "anime" is that it's, in my opinion, pointless and outdated. It was created by Westerners some time in the 80s to refer to animation from Japan.  However, it's no different from calling cartoons from Canada "Crandon" or any other word you could make up.  Japan lumps all animation the same and doesn't call their animation or American animation a different word, so why should Westerners, other than to give the American otaku group a sense of distinguishment from simply saying they're 'cartoon fans'?  Since the 80s, most American cartoons are outsourced overseas to be animated.  Shows like The Simpsons were written in America, but animated in Korea, and shows like Tiny Toons were written in America and animated in Japan.  There have also been co-productions between companies from various countries.  W.I.T.C.H. is a co-production where the series was written by Americans, but animation production was done in France.  Co-production, unlike outsourcing, is where another country has a hand in production; in this case, France came up with character designs and background designs while America wrote the story.   So, in essence, Oban is "half anime" because half of its production was done in Japan and half was done in France.  However there's people who argue against that because the series was written in France, but people will also claim shows like Teen Titans is "anime" because of an art style of some kind.  The whole problem is the term "anime" has no real meaning anymore and differs from person to person.  To some, it's just cartoons from Japan, to others, it's some sort of art-style or story-telling format.  So, myself, I would disagree Oban is "influenced" because any influence would be a result of half the production being in Japan.  However, I also feel "anime influence" is a lie in itself because while a person may we influenced by a specific series or person (like the Avatar creators liking Miyazaki), to say that every single Japanese cartoon ever made influenced them is grossly inaccurate.  "Anime-influenced" is just like saying "Movie-influenced" or "Book influenced". - Baron Armadillo (talk) 05:06, 18 November 2007 (UTC)


 * So, in essence, Oban is "half anime" because half of its production was done in Japan and half was done in France. Because it is half-anime, many do not consider it to be anime.  Oddly enough, the production team lives and develops the series IN Japan.


 * However, I also feel "anime influence" is a lie in itself because while a person may we influenced by a specific series or person (like the Avatar creators liking Miyazaki), to say that every single Japanese cartoon ever made influenced them is grossly inaccurate.  I will have to agree as well.  It appears to be a "side-category" to Western animation emulating anime - by which - they'll never be considered anime on the sole reason that it was developed by non-Japanese.  KyuuA4 (talk) 06:12, 18 November 2007 (UTC)

Criteria for Anime-influenced animation
I've noticed the elimination of some listed items. For now, I'll let that go; but I did save the list into my own archive and wiped it off this article, because the criteria is unclear to begin with. In this discussion, there will be some derivation in determining what's "anime-influenced". KyuuA4 (talk) 19:34, 27 November 2007 (UTC)


 * My 2cents: Xiaolin showdown, "fusion of Eastern and Western culture" www.kidscreen.com. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.2.70.226 (talk) 23:32, 2 December 2007 (UTC)


 * However, fans (and editors) tend to separate Japan from the rest of Asia. See Manhwa and Manhua.  As opposed to manga.  Same deal happens with animation. KyuuA4 03:42, 3 December 2007 (UTC)

Here's a really good description.
Amerime it is a distinct faux manga/anime style that encorprates severly dated Japanese art designs from the 90s, lazy face art, & still has the taint of looking too much like an American comic book or cartoon in style. The end result is akward, looking neither Asian nor American.

Animation Example: Avatar, The New You Can't Do That on Television animated DVD (aka YCDToT OAV).

Comic book example: Marvel Mangaverse, The New Alice in Wonderland.

Amerime done right: Boondocks' & Teen Titans' designs look less trashy, though Marvel readers will never accept the style of the cartoon. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 24.19.236.142 (talk) 10:18, 26 September 2008 (UTC)


 * See WP:weasel. Your description is full of that stuff. KyuuA4 (Talk:キュウ) 22:25, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Tuff Puppy
If you look past the american style thick outlines, and focus on her head proportions, the character Kitty, actouly looks alot like an anime style charecter. So where would a show like Tuff puppy acutaly fit in on this? --J intela (talk) 04:32, 7 May 2012 (UTC)

Johnny Cypher in Dimension Zero
"The series was produced by Joe Oriolo for Warner/Seven (Seven Arts), in conjunction with K.Fujita, the Japanese animation studio- Studio Beez, TV Films [Terebi Doga] and Children's Corner." source:Johnny Cypher in Dimension Zero

Unambiguous use of terms such as 'American anime' outside of quotes when the article doesn't cite any consensus of using the term for anime-esque animation
I don't think the article should use terms like American anime for American animation productions that resemble anime. The consensus (with a notable minority opposition) is that anime is a term for creative animated work produced in Japan by Japanese creative teams. Television shows that are animated but not created in Japan like Batman The Animated Series, Cyber Six, Transformers G1, etc, or that resemble stereotypical Japanese animation styles or take influence from Japanese animation, such as Avatar The Last Airbender, RBYW, Castlevania, Totally Spies, etc, should be referred to simply as 'animation', 'cartoon', 'series', 'movie', etc, so that the article has a WP:NPOV on the topic of whether anything non-Japanese can be called anime.Fullmetalalch (talk) 06:30, 27 June 2021 (UTC)

Chinese and Korean animation
There are a lot of works of Chinese animation contain styles simular or even indistinguishable from typical Japanese anime, especially a lot of the newer works released digitally. To name some examples shows such as Link Click, Mo Dao Zu Shi, and The King's Avatar. I know less about Korean animation, but I am aware of older works such as Robot Taekwon V and Captain of Cosmos directly plagiarising Japanese works. Therefore, I feel a mention and a link to the Chinese and Korean animation articles would be appropriate on this article. UltraMegaZX (talk) 22:52, 16 August 2021 (UTC)

The Owl House
This show, The Owl House is clearly-inspried by anime and few anime-like North American shows, like Avatar: The Last Airbender and Legend of Korra. Just like the others in it's main page. Chad The Goatman (talk) 18:49, 17 April 2023 (UTC)