Talk:Anna Vissi/Archive 1

What neutrality?
This article still reads like an Anna Vissi fan club flyer and it's filled with exaggerations that can make someone who doesn't know what's really going on here think that she's the single most important thing that has ever happened to Greek music ever since Apollo was given a lyre by Hermes. Truth is, she's not that important and it's only the rabid fangirls and fanboys (mostly fangirls in their early teens) from her fan club that keep paying lip service to her by writing inanities in this article. Elp gr (talk) 16:54, 1 June 2008 (UTC)

Cleanup
I think the article is too long and bulky. I know that Vissi is the ultimate pop star in Greece but still, the article is overdetailed. It would be better if someone would clean it up and part the whole bulk of text into sections (one for career, one for life, and them further into 'years after karvellas', 'years after eurovision', 'present time' etc. See for example Madonna (entertainer). I would do this myself but I am not a knower. Pictureuploader 14:46, 28 January 2006 (UTC)

Biggest selling female GREEK POP singer
People crazy over Anna Vissi, should perhaps remember that Nana Mouskouri is 1) Greek and 2) the world's number one selling female artist, at least according to Wikipedia. Madonna herself will have to try for some more years to reach her sales. Vissi, the Madonna of Greek pop, is NOT the biggest selling Greek female artist, although she may be that in Greece, or in her genre. Please, remember to qualify assertions. I do respect Vissi, but one is talking about great Greek female voices they should not forget two names: Maria Callas and Nana Mouskouri.

We are talking about inside of Greece, and currently. So please do not change this. Also if you are so sure of yourself, please email ifpi as I have. I have gotten the facts straight.

Nominating for Neutrality dispute
I'm adding a template stating this may not be totally neutral; read the article and see why.

I don't know why, but someone took it off. I'm putting it back now. Anna Vissi is HORRIBLY overrated, the whole article reads like a fan magazine's rant and as for her... international carreer, well, singing to the Greeks of the diaspora is NOT an international carreer. Elp gr 13:27, 3 October 2005 (UTC)

'''Vissi needs to find/develop/invent her own style, if she wants to have a chance in international career. Immitating Madonna to the last detail creates only laughter, not fans.'''


 * Reverting, this was removed by anonymous editor (24.189.105.140 - checking his/her contributions reveals somewhat of a theme...presumably one of the fan club...!) Budgiekiller 07:53, 7 October 2005 (UTC)

I don't know about the article but just because it's someones POV that Anna is overrated doesn't mean that she is. I agree that the article has to be toned down but as far as overrated that's just personal opinion and doesn't have to do either for or against the article. Also she does have an international career. I am aware that in the US people assume if someone isn't famous here they aren't "famous" but Anna is well knowned in many spanish speaking countries as well as Europe, especially in the 90's. Just my two cents :) Mailyn 01:19, 8 October 2005 (UTC)


 * Reverting again. The last revert notice was deleted by User:Omega100, who added comment : "Anna Vissi Is the best thing to Happen to Greek Music. She started a revoloution in Greek Music. She has done what others could not. She is a Icon."  Presumably another member of the fan club.  No-one is disputing the significance of Anna Vissi, we're just after a NPOV article... Budgiekiller 09:59, 9 October 2005 (UTC)

The career section still needs to be cleaned up. Mailyn 02:54, 13 October 2005 (UTC)


 * Mailyn, keep going, you're doing a great job... Budgiekiller 06:39, 13 October 2005 (UTC)

24.189.105.140 I think we need to try and work together to make this article better. right now the career part needs some major cleanup and by removing the cleanup notice you aren't helping. also removing her greek name doesn't accomplish anything. we are trying to make this a good article so people who don't know Anna can get to know her and right now this article is a big mess, not at all what Anna deserves! so please don't delete the revisions we've been doing since all you are accomplishing is to leave the article as messy as it is. :) Mailyn 03:16, 14 October 2005 (UTC)

I've reverted the article once more, but will soon give up on this. Both the fan club users and the Vissi-haters seem hell-bent on continually ruining this entry. Good luck to those Wikipedians who are trying to make this article NPOV and useful. Budgiekiller 10:45, 15 October 2005 (UTC)

ANNA VISSI IS CONSIDERD GREEK
Hey everyone. Anna Vissi was born in Cyprus, but moved to Greece when she was young. She made her career in Greece. She is considerd GREEK. Even in all the publications it says "The GREEK beauty". So whoever keeps on changing the article stop. Ive now put "Greek-Cypriot". ALSO I will try to get the pictures back up that were once there and made the article look great. I dont know who took them off.

29-December-2005 reversion
I just reverted this article back a couple days because it was filled with uncorrected vandalism. Unfortunately, that involved removing some legitimate edits as well. If you are interested in this performer and are familiar with the facts about her, feel free to go over those edits and reinsert the good information. I'm afraid I don't know enough about her to do that myself. –Abe Dashiell (t/c) 13:48, 29 December 2005 (UTC)
 * Addendum: It looks like there may still be vandalism left in the article. –Abe Dashiell (t/c) 13:54, 29 December 2005 (UTC)

CD Sales
Who ever keeps changing the numbes of CD's Anna Vissi has sold, PLEASE STOP. I have checed all the numbers with IFPI Greece and they are right. Also since 1995 Anna Vissi has gone 24 times platinum. Add up the platinums. One more thing NYLON IS CURRENTLY platinum, but at 70,000 copies. 10,000 more copies to go til' it gets 2x platinum.

WHO IS SAYING TRAVMA SOLD 310,000 AND IS ONLY 3X PLAT, GO TO ANNA VISSI.INFO ITS SAYS 175,000!!!!!! AND KRAVGI IS 6x!!!!

Guys I'm a fan of Anna and The Live 2004 cd has turned into platinum!!!It kas reached over 50.000 copies...and Klima Tropiko has reached over 100.000.At that time these sales meant 2x platinum.so don't change these!!!

Rumor Vandalism
You are not allowed to have rumors in the article. It does not live up to the wikipedia standard. If you put the rumors back in, I will contact the Wikipedia customer service.

It is not vandalism at all. There really were such rumours and they were pretty wide spread. You can not deny that there were no such rumours. There are many such rumours in Wikipedia about celebrities. Would you explain which standard it does violate? If it is written here it does not mean that we say that it has happened, merely we are putting the fact that there were such rumours and the existence of such rumours can not be denied. Therefore, what you are doing is vandalism as you are removing a text without backing it up and I will revert it back. Thank you. --24.42.120.3 22:12, 22 January 2006 (UTC)

I contacted Wikipedia dispute center and they said that they consider it: Attention-seeking vandalism Adding insults, using offensive usernames, replacing articles with jokes etc. (see also Wikipedia:No personal attacks) Please do not put those rumors in again, or I will be forced to warn you.

Oh, please go ahead and do whatever you are forced to do. This has nothing to do with attention seeking vandalism. It was not me who has put that there in the first place. I am only reverting it because of a vandalism by you. Second, merely mentioning that a certain rumour existed is not insulting or offensive. Again I am stating my position: The article mentions a well spread rumour, rumour by its nature is far from being a fact. Just because an article mentions this rumour it does not mean that it conisders that it is fact, it merely acknowledges the existence of the said rumour. Some people may not like this to be mentioned about their favorite person, it is understandible but not a reason enough to remove and pretend that there were not such rumours. --24.42.120.3 01:23, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Wikipedia Dispute Center RULED it has vandalism!! Please do not put it in again. Everytime you do, i will just take it back out.

Oh, please, show me the ruling. Just give me a link OK? Who gave the ruling? I guess you do not know that Wikipedia does not work like that. It is not a court that you get a ruling on a certain issue ant it is binding. This issue has not been even raised in dispute resolution. So, on top of vandalising this page you are lying too. If you remove this info once more I will have to request attention for vandalism. --24.42.120.3 02:23, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

Umm...no. I emailed the dispute center, and asked them if it was considered vandalism.. They told me it is, becuase you are not alowed to post stuff, that hurts someone's reputation. And seeing as Wikipedia is an American based company, the constitution says (amendment) that you are not allowed to post something on a public database that hurts there reputation. You can get sued. If YOU put it back in there, I WILL request vandalism issue with Wikipedia.

i have posted a wikiquette alert at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Wikiquette_alerts#.28continuing_list_for_January_23.29 to get an outside opinion on this.

I have already stated my position again and again. I don't see any reason to repeat it. Anna Vissi's reputation is of no concern to Wikipedia and commerical considerations like this can not be sited as a reason to exclude certain information from an article. --24.42.120.3 17:30, 23 January 2006 (UTC)


 * I'm here from Wikiquette alerts. I've removed that rumour claim- not because of any concern for commercial considerations of any sort but because it doesn't meet the official Wikipedia policy of verifiability. You must cite sources before making claims like this. If the claims are clearly false (to be honest I haven't checked) then re-adding the content is vandalism. I also would like to remind all editors of the three-revert rule. Hope that clears things up, feel free to ask further questions here or on my talk page. Petros471 17:48, 23 January 2006 (UTC)


 * I concur with Petros471. Sources must be cited and verifiable. Adding unsubstantiated rumors is not acceptable per wikipedia policies. This is supposed to be an encyclopedia. Adding rumors of this type is irresponsible. MARussellPESE 19:14, 23 January 2006 (UTC)

This whole rumor is nothing but an urban legend, reminiscent of the "gerbiling" thing and I'm glad such ridiculous vandalisms have been removed. Now, the whole article needs to be rewritten from scratch to meet Wikipedia's standards. Elp gr (talk) 10:49, 29 May 2008 (UTC)
 * You're a little late. There are plenty of sources...well...near the end. Grk1011 (talk) 12:04, 29 May 2008 (UTC)

Why are so many LIES posted for 'Anna Vissi'?
For example: 'Paraxenes Eikones' and 'X' never sold 120,000 copies. 2 x Platinum, their official status, means 80,000 copies (Platinum = 40,000 copies in Greece), and they haven't been officially announced as selling 120,000 EVER. The same applies for 'Nylon' which stands at Platinum and no OFFICIAL announcement has been made regarding its sales, so why does somebody keep editing it as 2 P? Also 'Agapi Ypervoliki' stands at 80,000 sales. If it was 100,000, it would have been officially announced as 5 P. Officially its status is 4 P. Why does somebody keep editing it to make her sales look higher?

Neutrality
Anna Vissi has a huge fan club (the biggest I might say). They will keep lying and editing the page adding rumors etc. I suggest the page is semi-copy protected. I live in Greece and I have to say that the article is not at all neutral. --Alexignatiou 13:55, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

"Journalists and everyone that saw her shows, were astonished." Sorry, But seenig it in video I was not astonished. --Alexignatiou 14:00, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

"In 1998, she released a new Greek album called Antidoto, that sold more than 80,000 copies in just a week." I heard that 79.999 were sold at the very first day. --Alexignatiou 14:34, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

"Having sold more than 75,000 copies in just 10 short weeks..." like four days each???? --Alexignatiou 14:34, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

opening with a water screen that wowed more than 150,000 people who were present"... WOW! --Alexignatiou 14:34, 13 April 2006 (UTC)

I'm being sarcastic, just to illustrate the inaccuracy and POV of the article which is more than obvious. It's disturbing. --Alexignatiou 14:34, 13 April 2006 (UTC)


 * What you are saying is false is actually true. Just because it is written that way dosnt mean its false..  check out her official informational site at www.annavissi.info.  I have reviewed what you said, and it is true.  I am removing the tag.  Also I have reviewed the CD sales, and some appear to be false.  I am replacing them with the official totals from IFPI foound on Mad. 68.45.82.68

I would love to have the site provided to me by you, so I'm here and waiting. You have to cite the sources. See Citing sources. Oh, and When I say the site, I mean the exact page on mad.tv or ifpi. For the time being more than 50 edits on her sales (sorting out my reverts) with different numbers on each, and growing constantly doesn't make me and only concerned about the accuracy of her sales. --Alexignatiou 10:48, 18 April 2006 (UTC)


 * The page I am reffering to, is an email I sent MadTV in the past trying to find out information about her sales. No everytime I put the sales in, someone is always changing it.  I see that this is going to get no where.  How about if we just leave the record achivment up only and take out the exact number of sales?. I will do this and take off the tag again. 68.45.82.68


 * Thanks. The platinums cannot be disputed as they are official. Thank you for making the aticle more NPOV, however lots of adjectives (such as very, on a very talented composer) still need to be removed to make it better, and who knows? Mabye one day it will be a featured article! --Alexignatiou 13:35, 18 April 2006 (UTC)

I will try to work on it. I have done most of the work to this artice.68.45.82.68

Most of the information is farce, the first lines clearly say it all. Mild success in the USA, I take it then that if you go up to at least a handfull of non Greeks in the States, you have a chance of at least someone knowing her. Trust me, none of my friends in the USA have ever heard of Anna Vissi, unless Greek. Update : I notice that the author of the page, has now reverted and taken the phrase 'mild success' out, and replaced with success in the usa, thus meaning she has had many hits on the billboard charts, and I can assume be refered to as one of the greatest musicians in USA. Once again a complete farce, but if her fans need to believe and hear this falisified hype, then who am I to argue.

Help needed by Administrator.
I would prefer that this page is semi-protected, because unregistered fans keep changing the sales of Anna Vissi's Albums. Proof is the album Kravgi, which is said to be 7x Platinum with 280.000 sales. However, it is a double disc and it would have gone 14x Platinum. Please! I'm trying to keep the sales as of the version of April 10th, 2006, where the verified sales are presented. I would also love it if someone could actually clean-up the article to make it less POV --Alexignatiou 13:28, 18 April 2006 (UTC)


 * I'm not an admin, but I can suggest trying to reach a consensus. For starters, if there are multiple points of view about what the sales figures are, each point of view should have a visible reference to the source. --TuukkaH 14:22, 18 April 2006 (UTC)
 * If you really think that the page needs to be protected I would suggest to contact directly an admin that you trust. J B

Guys everything is under control. We do not need the offcial sale numbers, but only the certifications. 68.45.82.68


 * Actually, certifications are SUPPOSEDLY based on official sale numbers. Then again, it seems that in Greece even the promos are counted as sales. Elp gr (talk) 23:07, 7 June 2008 (UTC)

Anna Vissi Is Cypriot
The nationality tag in this article should remain as 'Cypriot' for the following reasons: Vissi is a Cypriot; Vissi was born in Cyprus; Vissi has Cypriot citizenship; Vissi's origin on the infobox is correctly stated Larnaca, Cyprus; 'Greek Cypriot' refers to an ethnic group (which Vissi belongs to) in Cyprus (although should not be used because ethnicities are not emphasised in the introductory paragraph in accordance with Wikipedia's manual of style); thus 'Greek' need not be placed anywhere in the opening paragraph as it is not even in her infobox (if her origin were Greece then perhaps there would be a chance of using 'Greek', but since it (rightly) is not, then we must use her nationality at the time she became notable (Cypriot)).

The only way this case resembles Elena Paparizou's is that, like Paparizou should be just 'Greek', Vissi should be just 'Cypriot'.

Cypriot stud 15:22, 18 February 2007 (UTC)


 * But you forget the fact that she moved to Greece over 30 years ago, owns a house there, got married there, raised her child there, and lives there. I know for a FACT that Vissi also hold Greek citezen ship from a person that is close to her. And also Greece does need to be placed in the opening as she is most notable in both Greece and Cyprus. In Greece her CD's go platinum in less than 24 hours. Her first 'official' CD was released in Greece, by a Greek record company. Greekboy 14:47, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

I haven't forgotten this fact at all; and please note I said 'Greek' need not be in the infobox, not 'Greece' (there is a difference between the adjective and the country).

I think you are forgetting the facts I stated. Since her origin, birth place, nationality (current and also at the time she became famous, which is what Wikipedia's guidelines advocate as the nationality tag), there is no reason to put 'Greek' as her nationality. Despite the fact she lives in Greece and has done for many years bears no significance here, just as Elena Paparizou's inhabiting (and birth in) Sweden didn't. In fact, if you want to get right down to the nitty-gritty of it, the argument favouring the putting of 'Swedish' in Paparizou's biography makes more common sense than putting 'Greek' in Vissi's. The latter's infobox does not state her origin or birth place as Greece, therefore the citizenship (country) which holds the most significance to the beginning of her career is placed - she was born in Cyprus, she is a Cypriot national, she is of Cypriot descent, her origin (meaning career debut, as per the infobox) is in Cyprus. I'm sorry but placing an ethnicity in the biographical paragraph is totally unnecessary, especially when a perfectly comprehendible citizenship equivalent is supported and available.

Cypriot stud 21:54, 19 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Anna moved to Greece at about 16 years old, and finished off her high school there too. She gained Greek citezenship around that time.  About 4 years later she released her first "official" CD with the Greek label.  Anna Vissi became most notable while in Greece, and with a Greek citezenship.  There is no denying the fact that she held Greek citezenship at that time.  According to my source that is close with her, she did infact hold Greek citezenship at the time, as she does now. Greekboy 22:48, 19 February 2007 (UTC)

Again you are ignoring what I said. I don't doubt the fact Vissi has Greek citizenship (after thirty years in Greece, which is not considered by many a foreign country to Cyprus, what do you expect). Her origin lable states 'Cyprus', for which more can be said than Greece. Yes, I know that Vissi has a very successful career, but then again, what she gains in Greece, she gains in Cyprus too (and vice-versa). All of the most famous singers in Greece most definitely share that notability in Cyprus, too. But, her origins on the tabe are Cypriot, amen.

Cypriot stud 17:03, 20 February 2007 (UTC)
 * You are the one ignoring a big fact. The origion secrion in the side table dose NOT have to correspond with the opening statement according to wiki-law.  The opening statement should contain what citizenship the singer had when they became notable, and NOT origin. Greekboy 20:57, 20 February 2007 (UTC)

No, I'm not ignoring it; that's what I've been telling you since the debate started! And of course the Wikilaw covers origin too; the nationality tag should be that of the subject when s/he became notable, which happens to be the same rule for the origin box on the infoboxes. I'm sorry, but she is a Cypriot. There is no logic behind putting an ethnicity in the opening paragraph.

Cypriot stud 21:09, 21 February 2007 (UTC)


 * This is straight from wikipedia. For the origin field in the box at Template:Infobox musical artist it says The city from which the singer or group originated (that is, the city where the group was founded; or the city where individual performers started their career, should it not match the location of their birth). which would be Cyprus since she started singing in parks and a couple of competitions according to her interview with Greek Boston.  However, this is NOT when she became notable.  That is a big differance.  She may have started singing in Cyprus, BUT she became notacable when she moved to Greece, and started started releasing CD's (while having a Greek citezenship). Now, according to Manual of Style (biographies), Nationality (In the normal case this will mean the country of which the person is a citizen or national, or was a citizen when the person became notable. Ethnicity should generally not be emphasized in the opening unless it is relevant to the subject's notability.)  Anna was a citizen of Greece when she became popular.  However, the Cypriot part should also be noted since it is relevant to her notability.  So it should be "Greek-Cypriot" following Wikipedia rules. Greekboy 22:48, 21 February 2007 (UTC)

All your points are fair; I know you mean well, however Vissi's origin box says Cyprus, which clearly states that she became notable whilst a citizen of the island. That is to day, all those things you said apply, in actual fact, for 'Cypriot' to be used, not 'Greek', εντάξει?

Cypriot stud 20:55, 22 February 2007 (UTC)
 * The only reason Cyprus is in the origin box is because she started singing in various parks (in front of kids) and acouple singing competion while she was in Cyprus. She became notable when she moved to Greece.  It should be "Greek-Cypriot" for that matter, and following wiki-rules. Greekboy 21:30, 22 February 2007 (UTC)

Maybe I wasn't clear: the nationality tag should match the origin box. Seeing as it says Cyprus, she should be Cypriot.

Cypriot stud 19:24, 24 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Have you not read any of the wikipedia articles posted. It CLEARLY states that the nationality tag DOES NOT have to match the origin box.  I think you got origin and nationality mixed up.  The origin field in the side musical artist box is where the singer started singing (which would be Cyprus).  The Nationality tag in the opening paragraph is for where the singer was a citizen when they became notable.  Anna Vissi may have started singing in parks and a singing competition in Cyprus, but she became NOTABLE when she was living in Greece, and as a Greek citezen.  The opening nationality tag should be "Greek-Cypriot". Greekboy 19:45, 24 February 2007 (UTC)


 * It seems to me that the origin section needs to actually be corrected. Although there is a valid point of her doing some singing in Cyprus, in accordance to  it says "where individual performers started their career" which seems to indicate Greece in accordance to the article and information out on the web.  A Musical career is when the singer starts to do professional singing.  The information stated seems to indicate that the singer in question started her musical career in Greece, thus the origin section should state Greece. Planecrazy22 20:09, 24 February 2007 (UTC)

OK, at least this is now cleared up. Greekboy, what I was trying to say was that, since Vissi's origin box said Cyprus, that meant that she became notable in Cyprus, thus her nationality tag needing to read just 'Cypriot'. And, actually, although it doesn't say it in words, the origin box (WHERE THE SUBJECT BECAME NOTABLE) should be the same as nationality tag (WHERE THE SUBJECT BECAME NOTABLE). I don't know how many times I have to say that to you; I'm afraid it seems you, in fact, lack the understanding of the origin field, not I.

Anyway, now we have cleared up that her origin (notability) was in Greece, which therefore gives a need of 'Greek' to be mentioned in the opening paragraph, however, sorry to be pedantic, I would suggest that 'Greek-Cypriot' change to 'Cypriot-Greek', because, firstly, she was initially a national of Cyprus, and secondly, 'Greek-Cypriot' is very easily confused with 'Greek Cypriot', referring to the ethnic group. So, to make it more clear that the 'Greek' in the nationality tag is a noun, not an adjective, I propose 'Cypriot-Greek'.

Cypriot stud 18:18, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

ORIGIN
I think that the problem is with you, Greeks and that it`s not fair for Cypriots. Virenque 21:33, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

It doesn`t matter if she has Greek citizenship now, she was born in Cyprus so that`s her origin!

contribs) 09:24, 25 February 2007 (UTC). Virenque 09:24, 25 February 2007 (UTC)


 * Before going off like that, please read the wikipedia entrys provided under the talk page I posted. The origin in the info box is reserved for where the singer started their musical career (professionally) and NOT were they were born. The birth origin is for the born section. Greekboy 06:06, 7 March 2007 (UTC)

The Origin field in a musical box on wikipedia DOES NOT refer to where the singer was born. Please see were there was a similar discussion about the origin field and was resolved by moderators. Greekboy 16:46, 25 February 2007 (UTC)

The beginning of the article
I disagree that it should be noticed on the second line where she is popular.She is famous and thats enough.Its full of articles about famous people without noticing where they are popular.In fact she is popular on the whole Balkans,Im not sure is there a balkan counry where she is not famous.So "famous mainly in Greece, and her home country Cyprus" should be removed is my opinion. --91.92.221.174 20:51, 21 June 2007 (UTC)


 * According to wikipedia opening paragraph article, it states the opening should describe the person in short leading into the article. Anna Vissi is mainly famous in Greece and Cyprus.  Those are her main markets, where she lives, where her record company is, and where the majority of her fans are. Greekboy 04:19, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Images
I have temporarily removed all non-free images from this article. Use of these images must adhere to a list of criteria, and many instances were invalidated by NFCC#1 (no free equivalent exists or may be created), #3 (minimal number of uses and minimal extent of use), and #8 (significance/only non-decorative use).

The following images were removed:


 * Image:Anna Vissi Early Years Video 1.jpg
 * Image:Anna and dalaras.jpg
 * Image:Anna & Nikos.jpg
 * Image:Anna Eurovision 1980 and 1982.jpg
 * Image:Demonescolloge.jpg
 * Image:Anna travma.jpg
 * Image:Anna vissi antidoto.jpg
 * Image:Anna Vissi still in love.jpg
 * Image:Kravgi.jpg
 * Image:Anna mala.jpg
 * Image:Anna vissi olympics.jpg
 * Image:Anna call me club.jpg
 * Image:EuroMixGreece.jpg

Together, these images constitute an excessive reliance on fair use content. Usage of several of these images, when absolutely necessary, must be backed by a rationale. Please identify the images you think are necessary and the reasons for using them. ˉˉanetode╦╩ 00:00, 17 September 2007 (UTC)


 * I believe the following images are much needed in this article and my views:


 * Image:Anna Vissi Early Years Video 1.jpg - This image was used in the article becuase it was the only image that really showed her childhood in Cyprus before leaving for Greece and pursuing a music career.
 * Image:Anna and dalaras.jpg - This image shows the collaboration in the 70's with the famous George Dalaras. It is also used in his article.  This collaboration helped start Vissi's career back then.
 * Image:Anna & Nikos.jpg - The couple is divorced and it is very difficult to find an image of them together anymore. Karvelas plays a very big part in Vissi's whole career.  This image is also used in the article Nikos Karvelas.
 * Image:Anna Eurovision 1980 and 1982.jpg - Shows Vissi in the Eurovision song contest in 1980 and 1982, an event that can not be replicated again.
 * Image:Demonescolloge.jpg - Demones was a rock musical she and her then husband Karvelas stared it. It was the first rock musical in Greece and actually changed the music industry (adding rock to Greek music).  This picture is irreplaceable because it is very difficult to find images from the musical.
 * Image:Anna vissi antidoto.jpg - This image shows the certification awards for her album Antidoto. This was a major mile stone in her career.  It was her 3rd record with "real" success that made her in to a super star in the 90's.
 * Image:Anna Vissi still in love.jpg - This image was a promotional image for her first English single "Still In love with you". I guess it can be replaced by the album cover of the English album instead.
 * Image:Anna vissi olympics.jpg - Vissi sang at the closing cermony of the 2004 Summer Olympics in Athens in front of a world wide audience. This event can not be replicated again.
 * Image:Kravgi.jpg - This album is the highest selling album in Greek history and is used in the article to describe that event. It is also used in the article Kravgi for the album.
 * Image:Anna mala.jpg - Mala was a musical written by Karvelas that Vissi star in 2002. This event was a big thing in her career  and in Greece, and the image can not be replaced I beleive because the theater show was only in production for 1 year.
 * Image:Anna vissi antidoto.jpg - This image is used to illustrate the album "atidoto" which was major for her (as well as Travma). This image actually can be deleted since it is uploaded with the correct licensing and used on the album page at Image:Antidoto greekvissi1998.jpg.
 * Image:Anna call me club.jpg - The image is from a club performance in Canada for her promotion of her English single. Don't know if it's really needed, but I could easily upload one I took myself.
 * Image:EuroMixGreece.jpg - This image shows a very very big event in Vissi's career in the 00's. She participated once again in Eurovision for Greece and this was a year that Greece was very into Eurovision and backed her.  All the polls had shown her to be the winner.  I believe this image can not be replaced since the event has already passed.


 * I hope this helps. I know that I have listed all the images, but some of them are very important and can not be replaced since it was a once in a life time thing. Greekboy 01:40, 17 September 2007 (UTC)


 * There's a very clear abuse of the fair use policy in this article. Greekboy justifies that all pictures are needed just because they illustrate a single passage in the text. With this argument we can use non-free pictures as much as we want, we just have to make up a rationale that complies with the needs of a single section or even a sigle phrase.
 * Can we admit almost 13 pictures under the fair use policy on a single article?? Dantadd 12:02, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Well no. But if you put it that way then the ones that are most needed I would say would be
 * Image:Anna Vissi Early Years Video 1.jpg
 * Image:Anna and dalaras.jpg
 * Image:Anna & Nikos.jpg - maybe
 * Image:Anna Eurovision 1980 and 1982.jpg
 * Image:Anna mala.jpg
 * Image:Anna vissi olympics.jpg
 * Image:Anna call me club.jpg - Maybe
 * Image:EuroMixGreece.jpg - Maybe


 * Those I beleive were the most major events in her career that can not really be replicated again to find a free use image. The rest I guess you could try to find a free use replacement, maybe even use the album covers to illustrate that time period.  From the mid 90's to present is when alot of stuff happened in her career that made her a big star. Greekboy 19:20, 17 September 2007 (UTC)
 * All right, now we're getting somewhere. There are a few problems that must be addressed with these images. Primarily, all need better rationales. Further:
 * Image:Anna Vissi Early Years Video 1.jpg - This image does not have a clear source and the article does not offer critical commentary on this specific concert appearance. Was this appearance significant in and of itself?
 * Image:Anna and dalaras.jpg - This image does not have a clear source. It states where you found it online, but has no information about the photographer or copyright holder. Unless these are provided, the image will be deleted.
 * Image:Anna and dalaras.jpg - Again, no source. Also, is there no possibility of procuring a free picture of these two people?
 * Image:Anna Eurovision 1980 and 1982.jpg - Source. Given a little expansion to the article, I can see how use of this image may be justified.
 * Image:Anna mala.jpg - Clear attribution of the copyright holder is necessary. Creating a collage of copyrighted works such as this is not legal. If there's some sourced commentary about her appearance in theater, then there might be basis for a rationale. As it is, the article text is non-neutral and completely uncited.
 * Image:Anna vissi olympics.jpg - Same concern: source/well-referenced critical commentary
 * Image:Anna call me club.jpg - Readily replaceable generic concert photograph.
 * Image:EuroMixGreece.jpg - Same concern as with the Mala image above.
 * If you could work on providing a source for these images and discussing individual appearances in greater detail (w/ sources), then some images may yet be salvaged. ˉˉanetode╦╩ 02:23, 18 September 2007 (UTC)

OK. Let's try for the sources:


 * Image:Anna Vissi Early Years Video 1.jpg - This image is from an old TV show on CYBC channel RIK. I would say the significance to the article is just that its a picture of her from early years before moving to Greece and all the fame.  Don't know if that counts for anything.
 * Image:Anna and dalaras.jpg - This image appears also on her official website at [www.annavissi.net] under biography.
 * Image:Anna & Nikos.jpg] - I think you meant this image instead? Well it is difficult to get a free image of them together again because they are divorced. He still plays a major role in her music, but they are not photographed together much.  This image appears to be from Karvela's official site at .  There is also another picture of them on Vissi's site.
 * Image:Anna Eurovision 1980 and 1982.jpg - The source of these images are screen shots I took from videos of her in Eurovision. I guess copyright would from EBU?  I could expand the article about her appearances.
 * Image:Anna mala.jpg - Images are from screen shots from her performance which was shown by Greek channel Mega Channel. The album cover is also used in the collage.  There is a sole image of her in Mala on her official site under biography.  Don't know if that could be used instead?
 * Image:Anna vissi olympics.jpg - Source is screen shot of the Olympic's closing ceremony. Don't know from which broadcast it was taken from, but most likely the Greek one on ERT channel.
 * Image:EuroMixGreece.jpg - Images are screen shots too and the Eurovision logo just put together. It's from a DVD rip of the event.  EBU prob. owns the rights to this too.  I guess it could be replaced with a single image again, but that image would prob. be copyrighted too.

Don't know if this helps at all. Greekboy 04:22, 18 September 2007 (UTC)
 * Thanks for following up.
 * Image:Anna Vissi Early Years Video 1.jpg - Unfortunately, do to the inexact source and arbitrary choice of this image, it does not fit with the NFCC.
 * Image:Anna and dalaras.jpg - The source website doesn't specify the photographer or copyright holder, so the source information remains insufficient.
 * Image:Anna & Nikos.jpg - From your explanation it appears that this image is indeed replaceable.
 * Image:Anna Eurovision 1980 and 1982.jpg - That's sufficient, it would be great if you could add additional critical commentary about this appearance.
 * Image:Anna_mala.jpg - The album cover would be a better alternative.
 * Image:Anna vissi olympics.jpg - Strange, the caption used stated "Anna Vissi performing in a club in the USA part of her promotional tour for Call Me." Is there an exact source for this image?
 * Image:EuroMixGreece.jpg - One image sans logo would be preferable, with critical commentary.
 * It looks like there could sufficient basis for three images, provided the above concerns are addressed: Image:Anna Eurovision 1980 and 1982.jpg; a different, single-image version of Image:EuroMixGreece.jpg; and the album cover. ˉˉanetode╦╩ 23:09, 18 September 2007 (UTC)


 * For the image Image:Anna vissi olympics.jpg, if you look back it does infact say "Anna Vissi performing at the 2004 Summer Olympics." for a comment. You can see where it came from in this video . The comment you are referring to it for image Image:Anna call me club.jpg.  As for image Image:Anna and dalaras.jpg, her official site states that all images and content are copyright by Sony BMG.  I will get to work on adding more commentary for the other images. Greekboy 00:31, 19 September 2007 (UTC)
 * You're right about the Olympics caption, I messed up. The problem with sourcing remains, however, since it didn't actually come from the Youtube video, but was probably taken by an unidentified press photographer during the event. These images are tricky, since they maintain a commercial value, and without knowing the copyright holder it is difficult to determine whether usage complies with fair use law, much less Wikipedia policy. As for the other one, I couldn't find the copyright disclaimer anywhere, could you include a link to it at the image description page? ˉˉanetode╦╩ 03:13, 19 September 2007 (UTC)


 * May I suggest using this template when explaining your fair-use rationale: Non-free use rationale El Greco (talk · contribs) 01:22, 19 September 2007 (UTC)