Talk:Ar Lan y Môr

Untitled
I propose changing the reference to "Alternative words" at http://www.ligtel.com/~wales/MusicLyrics.htm#Ar%20Lan%20y%20Mor

My original referred to this as "Containing nonsense words", however this was later deleted. I think this should be replaced.

The words in question are the ones following "or" 2, Oer yw'r rhew ac oer yw'r eira Oer yw'r ty heb dân yn y gaeaf Oer yw'r eglwys heb ddim ffeirad Oer wyf innau heb fy nghariad

3. Dacw'r ty a dacw'r talcen Lle ces i nosweithiau llawen Ar y lloft uwchben y genin Gyda'r ferch a'r rhuban melyn

4. Mae gen i fuwch a dau gorn arian Me gen i fuwch sy'n godro'i hunan Mae gen fiwch sy'n llanw'r stwcau Fel mae'r môr yn llanw'r baeau

These words don't have the same line length as Ar Lan y Môr. They look like they are a completely different song. The last verse looks like some sort of nonsense or riddle song, whereas Ar Lan y Môr is a love song. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Cerddaf (talk • contribs) 23:45, 24 November 2009 (UTC)

Could not "cerrig gleision" be mussels? Nowster (talk) 20:16, 25 July 2011 (UTC)


 * I don't think so: mussels are "cregyn gleision". Peterwlane (talk) 13:20, 31 August 2023 (UTC)

Just some small but perhaps important corrections to the translation. The words are in S. Welsh, and the -e ending corresponds to Literary Welsh -au. So, "inne" = "innau"; "blode" = "blodau." It's not archaic; it's informal. So, " 'nghariad inne" = "my love and I" (and, of course, you have to adjust the verb number in English, but not in Welsh). GeckoFeet (talk) 02:04, 18 June 2013 (UTC)

Lyrics
The English lyrics given in the current version of the page are unattributed to author or source. One of two things should be done: either 1) these lyrics should be attributed via a proper verifiable citation to a public domain source, or 2) if the lyrics can't be attributed to a public domain source, they should be deleted. (I assume that on WP a third option, getting permission to use them if they are under copyright, isn't viable.) Since WP has a strict policy that "Content that violates any copyrights will be deleted" I tend to think I should just go ahead and delete these lyrics, but generally it's not good form to make major deletions without discussion. Can anyone explain why these lyrics shouldn't be deleted since their use here can't be shown not to be a copyright violation? Littlewindow (talk) 16:18, 9 May 2015 (UTC)


 * I propose replacing them by a literal translation, which will not have copyright issues, and is more appropriate anyway. Peterwlane (talk) 13:23, 31 August 2023 (UTC)

External links modified
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 * Added tag to http://www.craftsfromwales.co.uk/music/arlanymor.htm
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 * Added archive https://web.archive.org/web/20090827000206/http://www.sianjames.co.uk:80/cymraeg/geiriabed.htm to http://www.sianjames.co.uk/cymraeg/geiriabed.htm

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Proposed changes
I propose to make several changes to improve this article, which is about a song I sing and have researched carefully. Peterwlane (talk) 12:39, 31 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Replace the fifth verse (which is used by very few singers) with the one published in 'Caneuon Traddodiadol y Cymry’ (2006), which is much more mainstream.
 * Replace the English lyrics (discussed above as unattributed) by a translation. This article is not about any English songs derived from the Welsh one, so I think it inappropriate to change the meaning in order to make the English words scan and rhyme.
 * Replace the song clip by one where the singer performs it as a folk song rather than an art song (if I can work out how to do it).
 * Add text about the origin of the song, with references to the JWFSS article that published the first verse and later publications that discuss the addition of extra verses from the Hen Penillion (Old Stanzas).