Talk:Arabic alphabet/from the French Wikipedia/discuss this page

A few help
I tried to translate a paragraph but my linguistic knowledge is too poor so I can't even understand the French sentence. If a native english speaker could have a look to provide a better formulation, it could help!

Cheers PY 12:32, Mar 2, 2004 (UTC)

And the layed out talk page on arabic alphabet is not 'up to date' I did a partial translation of the Voyelles paragraphs (the first still in French)

French/English linguistics dictionary
While struggling with some of the French linguistic terminology in this article, I came across: http://www.sil.org/linguistics/glossary_fe/ which may well prove useful for figuring out some of the more esoteric stuff. Bill 16:07, 9 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Glossaire typographique et linguistique
A French language typography/linguistic glossary has been helpful too: http://alis.isoc.org/glossaire/

Moteur de rendu
About "moteur de rendu": I've used "rendering engine" to translate this phrase. There is a difference between a browser and a rendering engine. All Web browsers use a "rendering engine" to process the received, encoded HTML and present the results on a users computer display screen. -- Bill 13:04, 10 Aug 2003 (UTC)
 * That's the right translation : cf. http://www.yoyodesign.org/doc/w3c/lexique_fr_en.html#m. The rendering engine may be independant from the browser : in Windows systems, it is mainly the Uniscribe files which process the data. Its version depends on the Windows OS. It means that, giving that you use the same browser, let's say Opera 7, you won't necessary get the same results if your OS is Windows98 or XP, because of Uniscribe limitations in Windows98. I hope It's clear... Vincent Ramos 12:53, 15 Sep 2003 (UTC)

Article title
About the article title: I suspect the use of a foward slash in the title is what's causing the anomaly at the top of the Talk page. Should be move the article to "Arabic alphabet from the French Wikipedia"? Bill 13:06, 10 Aug 2003 (UTC)


 * No, it's deliberately made as a temporary "subpage" of Arabic alphabet. Even though this is a no-no for normal article titles, it's acceptable usage for things like "Article name/Temp", and it's that meaning that I intend here: the idea is that the finished product will replace or be merged with the current article. -- The Anome 13:17, 10 Aug 2003 (UTC)


 * OK. -- Bill 13:37, 10 Aug 2003 (UTC)

Liants
I'm stuck on "liants". A "liant" is an invisible character which influences the behavior of neighboring characters. A "liant avec chasse" forces two characters to abut one-another. A "liant sans chasse" inhibits this behavior. All well and good, but I dont' know the English for these. Can anyone help? -- Bill 13:39, 10 Aug 2003 (UTC)


 * Combining marks? Non-combining marks? -- The Anome


 * Trouble is, since they're "invisible", it's a bit odd to call them "marks"; I'm pretty sure there's an exact English expression for this; I just don't know what it is. -- Bill 14:50, 10 Aug 2003 (UTC)


 * OK, I found this: "zero width non-joiner" and "zero width joiner", documented at: http://www.htmlhelp.org/reference/html40/entities/special.html. I'm not very happy with it, but let's use it as a space holder until something better comes along. -- Bill 15:23, 10 Aug 2003 (UTC)


 * That's it : liant sans chasse is the French translation of the Unicode bidirectional control character zero width joiner. Vincent Ramos 12:38, 15 Sep 2003 (UTC)

Peer review
My French is not too bad and I have a slight familiarity with linguistics, but I think the result of our translation should be reviewed by someone with linguistic training, and preferably with a knowledge of Arabic. At least if there's any way to get this to happen. Bill 13:12, 10 Aug 2003 (UTC)

About "support" (for the hamza)
French support is the equivalent of English carrier, a silent letter whose function is to bear another character. Hamza often needs a carrier, which may be, according to complexe rules, &#1571;, &#1572; or &#1574;. In this case, the alif, waaw or yaa are mute letter : only hamza is pronounced. Vincent Ramos 12:45, 15 Sep 2003 (UTC)