Talk:Aragorn/Archive 1

aragorns other names
Wasnt Aragorn also called "wingfoot" by someone in the second book (i think, might have been the first)?
 * That would be Éomer in Two Towers. I don't believe anyone actually calls Aragorn by that name, though. It's just one reference. -[[User:Aranel|Aranel (" Sarah ")]] 15:26, 1 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Aragorn or Aragorn II?
I noticed a few edits over this. Any comments? Rich Farmbrough 12:52, 12 September 2005 (UTC)


 * He was the second Aragorn in his line, so Aragorn II is correct. However Aragorn I has maybe one sentence dedicated to him in all Tolkien's work, so the distinction is rather useless. Might as well stick to calling him Aragorn.

-- Jordi· ✆ 20:15, 12 September 2005 (UTC)


 * We should correctly label him as Aragorn II in the introduction as he is in the genologies provided by Tolkien - but leave the page here as he is the most notable Aragorn. Lachoneus 10:05, 13 September 2005 (UTC)

Languages
In the info-box thingy on the right, shouldn't there be a mention of the languages Aragorn spoke? Besides the common tongue, he spoke at least one Elvish language (and perhaps a few others - I'm not very clued up on this). I think this is important because it says a lot about his unofficial role as mediator between different groups. --Driekie 09:16, 4 October 2005 (UTC)
 * He probably spoke Westron, Quenya, Sindarin, Adûnaic (which would have been learned by the young Elrond, but an otherwise "extinct" language of the Edain by the third age which had evolved into Westron and Rohirric), and Rohirric, and at one point mentioned being familiar, at least, with Valinorean, which may or may not be another description of Quenya. --Fire Star 08:37, 1 January 2006 (UTC)

While he is the second Aragorn in the line of direct descent, and as Chieftain of the North, he would properly be labeled Aragorn II, I think that he would be crowned Aragorn, King of Gondor and Arnor, and as such, would be the first with that title to bear the name.

stuart townsend?
In the aragorn article it says he was fired, but in Stuart Townsend it says he left the production, apparantly of his own will. One of these articles is incorrect about this incident. RealmKnight 00:22, 21 October 2005 (UTC)


 * I'm certain he was fired, apart from the other sources, it says so in Sean Austin's book and the LOTR EE bonus discs. Somewhere..

Yoda921 08:46, 10 April 2007 (UTC)Yoda

Height
I'm currently reading The Lord of the Rings A Reader's Companion and in it they mention that in Tolkien's notes and letters he mentions that Aragorn II is 6' 6", as well as Boromir and Éomer both being 6' 4", and the heights of Isildur and Elendil as being 7'! This would be worthy of inclusion, do people agree? --Fire Star 08:30, 1 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Yes, it ought to be included. If you intend to update the Elendil article it should probably list both heights (7' in the text you note, but nearly 8' in another document). --CBD ☎ ✉ 14:24, 1 January 2006 (UTC)
 * The Reader's Companion, page 272, says: "In a note written c. 1969 Tolkien said that 'Aragorn, direct desendant of Elendil and his son Isildur, both of whom had been seven feet tall, must nonetheless have been a very tall man (with a great stride), probably at least 6 ft. 6; and Boromir, of high Númenórean lineage, not much shorter (say 6 ft. 4)' (Tolkien Papers, Bodleian Library, Oxford). So, I will think about how to work it in the appropriate articles. --Fire Star 17:59, 1 January 2006 (UTC)
 * See also page 229 where more of that quotation is given along with the alternate version about Elendil being nearly 8' from UT. --CBD ☎ ✉ 18:08, 1 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Right, thanks. Éomer's info is on page 367. There is little physical description in our character articles, I've noticed (while looking for a logical place to fit a physical description). If you can think of a better place to put the info in the article, I'd be happy to see it moved. --Fire Star 18:22, 1 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Placement/wording looks good to me. Nice additions. --CBD ☎ ✉ 22:31, 1 January 2006 (UTC)

Citing: Resemblance to Elendil
I found the reference needed for the text "Through his ancestor Elendil whom he had an astonishing resemblance to,[citation needed] "... I just finished reading The Silmarillion, so when I read this line it sounded very familiar. In The Silmarillion (1977), page 303, it is written "'He was Aragorn son of Arathorn, the nine and thirtieth heir in the right line from Isildur, and yet more like Elendil than any before him". I have no idea how to put it into the article — I tried to figure out the citation system but I'm still rather confused about it, so I put the reference here for someone to enter, or to explain to me exactly how citing within this article should be done. Thanks! --Yaviel 22:50, 12 May 2006 (UTC)
 * I added something in for this. That look ok? --CBDunkerson 23:22, 12 May 2006 (UTC)


 * Excellent! Thanks! --Yaviel 02:52, 13 May 2006 (UTC)

Image fair use discussion
See here for a discussion of the fair use of movie screenshots in this article. Carcharoth 10:05, 6 July 2006 (UTC)

House of Isildur/House of Elendil
In reference to the table at the bottom of the article with the titles of Aragorn, the House of Isildur is not a cadet branch of Elendil's house according to the definition of cadet branch. Isildur was Elendil's oldest son and his heir. The House of Isildur should be refered to as merely a renamed continuation of the House of Elendil. Scopper81 00:22, 7 January 2007 (UTC)

High King of the Men of Arda?
Just because the Númenoreans were "Kings of Men" doesn't mean they really ruled as overkings over all Men... right? Rohan was an independent ally. i'm removing it from the sucession box. Uthanc 14:58, 13 February 2007 (UTC)

That's right. The way i remember it ( and i don't have my books on hand), Aragorn lead Gondor to retake it's old lands and eventually retook Arnor, the North Kingdom. The Shire was an independent state, whihc no man would be allowed to enter. I took that to mean the Shire could govern it's own affairs, presumably as long as it didn't plot against the King. Rohan remained independent, but a strong ally, and Araogrn and Eomer fought together on several more campaigns against Men in the East, as is described a bit in the Appendices. Isengaurd i belive remained in the control of the Ents who turned into the Treegarth of Orthanc, restoreing the forest that was there. The kingdoms in the East, like Dale and the Lonely Mountain became allies of the kingdom but were not under it's control. DyloniusFunk 15:49, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

"High King of the Men of Arda" is not a term used in the books. High King of something is used in the books, but I can't recall exactly what. Oh, and Dale and the Lonely Mountain are to the North of Gondor, not the East. Oh, and Arda is more than what is described here. Oh, and DyloniusFunk is a nice name! :-) Carcharoth 16:50, 25 April 2007 (UTC)


 * The Ents held Isengard as wardens on behalf of the king, who still had possession of Orthanc. (Remember that Quickbeam handed the keys to Aragorn.) The Shire is better described as autonomous than independent. It was within the kingdom, but enjoyed special protections and privileges. After all, Aragorn can hardly make it illegal for Men to enter it if he didn't have the right to make laws for it. I don't recall any indication in the books that the Numenoreans ever claimed the lands in Rhovanion to the east of Mirkwood. The map at Reunited Kingdom is simply wrong. Not to mention OR.


 * Carcharoth, this is the wrong place for discussing this, but I was considering nominating it for deletion from the Commons on those grounds. What's your opinion? TCC (talk) (contribs) 21:36, 25 April 2007 (UTC)
 * The maps have been up for deletion for ages at Commons. See commons:Category:Middle Earth maps, and follow the link to commons:Deletion requests/Category:Middle Earth maps, where I and others have commented. My views haven't changed much - some sort of maps would be nice, but ultimately probably not compatible with Wikipedia. And you are right, some of the maps are speculative, and hence fail WP:NOR. Carcharoth 23:31, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

Does he ever fight two weapon style?
I thought that the two weapon fighting style of the Dungeons and Dragons Ranger class was inspired by Aragorn so i was gonna add a part about his two weapon fighting. I know the Rangers as a group were an inspiratiion but i thought there was a part of the book where Aragorn himself fights with two weapons at once. DyloniusFunk 01:52, 25 April 2007 (UTC)


 * No. That comes from a Forgotten Realms novel. The version of AD&D more directly inspired by Tolkien (i.e. 1st edition, which was the only edition back when I was playing) the Ranger did not fight with two weapons. TCC (talk) (contribs) 02:06, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, that clears it up for me. I remember there beign a descriptiion of Aragorn prepareing to elave Rivendell and how he had other weapons beside Aundril, but i wasn't sure if he ever fought with them.DyloniusFunk 15:43, 25 April 2007 (UTC)


 * In might be better for D&D references to go somewhere other than this article. ie. in a D&D article, with a link back here. It is not strictly relevant to the article here. Tricky balance, but try and think what the general reader will want to read. Carcharoth 16:52, 25 April 2007 (UTC)


 * And I don't have the book in front of me right now, but I thought it was mentioned that Aragorn had no weapon except Anduril. But I could be wrong. TCC (talk) (contribs) 21:38, 25 April 2007 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:AragornCrown.jpg
Fair use added. SkierRMH 06:46, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

Leader or member of Fellowship?
I have altered the word "lead" to "join" in the story summary that read as follows:

There [at Rivendell], Aragorn was chosen to lead the Fellowship of the Ring [...]

I don't think that Aragorn was considered to be the "leader" of the Fellowship at this stage - not until after Gandalf fell in Moria. Elrond chose the companions, but did not explicitly name a leader. The following quotes would suggest that initially Gandalf was considered the leader, if indeed there was one:


 * Elrond said of Gandalf: "this shall be his great task"
 * Aragorn says immediately after the fall of Gandalf: "Come! I will lead you now" (implying that he was not doing so previously)
 * Frodo says to Galadriel, "Gandalf was our guide"

For these reason I consider the unquestionable "join" preferable to the debatable "lead". Quackdave 23:31, 9 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Definitely wrong. Good job. I wonder where it came from as he doesn't lead the company pre-Moria in Jackson either. Uthanc 09:04, 10 June 2007 (UTC)

Trotter (The Lord of the Rings)
The article Trotter (The Lord of the Rings) was recently created by User:Inhloli. A remarkable work of reference and critisism; but I'am afraid it does not pass a number of Wikipedia policies. First of all, for those not interested in Tolkien's works this is pure fancruft, with some original research moreover. Evidently it's a matter of time before it will be tagged for deletion, so shouldn't it be merged into "Concept and creation" section of the current article? Lengtly discussions and name charts can be cropped, with notable facts and conceptions preserved. Still, no suggestions on why Tolkien decided to change the name etc. unless as a citation from Christopher Tolkien. Súrendil 09:14, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Older versions of the rhyme can be merged into All that is Gold Does Not Glitter. Súrendil 09:10, 20 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Agreed. You do mergers very well, so go ahead. Carcharoth 12:26, 25 August 2007 (UTC)
 * Provoker... I've performed the merge; the trimming of the original article is indeed quite heavy, and I hope it won't be cropped further. Súrendil 19:25, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, it's a pity you had to crop it, but you did a really good job (I wouldn't have been able to, because I was too attatched to the article and its details). Originally, I thought of including it in the Aragorn article but it was its length that prevented me.Inhloli 12:49, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

Proposed changes to infobox
See discussion here. It started as a debate on whether the infobox should be removed from Saruman after a recent GA fail, but has moved on to proposed changes to the M-e character infoboxes to make them less in-universe, as required by Wikipedia's guidelines on writing about fiction. All comments welcome. 4u1e (talk) 05:52, 29 September 2009 (UTC)