Talk:Armen Firman

Firman and Firnás
The article which is referred to does not prove anything. It gives no references whatsoever and it seems to me more likely that the author confused the two people in the sources he maight have used. Maybe it should be merged with Ibn Farnas?--Xave ri us  22:43, 7 June 2009 (UTC)  —Preceding unsigned comment added by Xaverius (talk • contribs)


 * Back on August 2008, a Wikipedia expert on arabic language shared his comments regarding both names:

BatteryIncluded asked me to comment on this controversy. I think that Abbas ibn Firnas and Armen Firman were two different people. Here's another link to that effect:. While it is true that Arabic names often get rather mangled when brought into Latin or other European languages, there is generally a correspondence between the consonants. For instance, Ibn Rushd becomes Averroes--here we see that the b became a v, the n disappeared, and the d at the end disappeared. The fact that the final d disappeared was probably due to its being hard to pronounce for Europeans. Also, the sh became s, because Latin didn't have sh. It could also be that the s was turned into a nominative case ending "es". But in the case of "Armen Firman" and "Abbas ibn Firnas", one can't really explain Abbas becoming Armen. The only similarity is the A. And normally "nas" would not turn into "man". So I think this article should be revised to take out the story of flying in 852, or to mention it as an inspiration to Abbas (as in the links). Eric Kvaalen (talk) 15:40, 17 August 2008 (UTC)


 * Since there is no source confirming that they are the same person, there is nothing notable (nor sources) about Armen Firman. I support the deletion of this article. Cheers, BatteryIncluded (talk) 15:32, 7 July 2009 (UTC)


 * The AFD closed as no consensus (there were only 2 participants), I've merged the article with Firnas. Beeblebrox (talk) 08:27, 14 July 2009 (UTC)