Talk:Arnold Mathew/Archive 1

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I have put everything on the former page here. One side or the other is in error, but the response is too polemic to be considered an article. It's at the state of "talk" right now.

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia :
 * "Arnold Harris Matthew (1852-1919) is the origin of the many of the episcopi vagantes in the United States. He convinced the Old Catholic Archbishop of Utrecht to ordain him as a bishop, claiming he had many followers in England, though in fact he had very few at the time. Upon return to England, he founded the Old Catholic Church in America, and then proceeded to ordain as bishop a very large number of people."

(whoever wrote this original piece has Mathew confused with Vilatte, and should check their sources better. Mathew never set foot in the United States.

Archbishop Matthew was not an episcopus vagans, as he was designated Bishop for England by Utrecht, as approved by Archbishop Gul. In addition, he did not travel to the U.S. at all. This is, unfortunately, a very poor piece of information. Mathew broke from the Utrecht Union of Churches, as stated but that is no more controversial than the Church of England's split from the Roman Catholic Church, nor the East/West split between the Eastern Orthodox Churches and the Roman Catholic Church, or the split of the Oriental Orthodox Churches, and certainly makes the validity of those ordained and consecrated no less valid than any of the others, all things being equal. Licitness, in any case is no more of an issue for the Old Catholic Church Movement in the U.S. than for any other Church which split from Rome, which also, if maintaining valid lines, would be "valid but irregular". For more information go to oldcatholic.com. —Dogface 19:51, 12 Dec 2003 (UTC)


 * I have tried to edit this page as an Old catholic priest and as a keen researcher. There is more work to do. —Fr. Stuart 18:37, 25 August 2007 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Father Stuart (talk • contribs)


 * I have considerably edited and added to this article, including the provision of references and sources. I would note that any criticisms of Mathew should similarly be presented with references and quotes. —Periti 10.05.2012


 * Dogface's 2003 that more information about Mathew can be found on oldcatholic.com is outdated. In 2014, oldcatholic.com is a parked domain. The Wayback Machine archive has little verifiable content from oldcatholic.com. To me, it doesn't look like a reliable source. —BoBoMisiu (talk) 20:19, 19 March 2014 (UTC)