Talk:Arrested Development/Archive 2

Steve Holt!!!
In the article brief overview of the characters, it states that Steve Holt is GOB's son. This is true, but I'm concerned about people who might be starting with the DVDs before they launch into the current season and so forth. To them this info would be a spoiler, since it is something of a twist in the second season.ProfessorFokker 08:26, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
 * I agree, I replaced that with something more general. The Job/Steve Holt connnection is discussed further on in greater detail in the plot summary section for those wanting more information. --TheMidnighters 09:48, 30 January 2006 (UTC)
 * Thanks. ProfessorFokker 05:14, 5 February 2006 (UTC)

Hot Cops theme
Does anyone know where to find it? I've been looking for it everywhere. Its the disco theme that's played on the stereo whenever the Hot Cops arrive. Its featured prominently twice in "Pier Pressure" (once when G.O.B. is in the cop uniform, the second time on the pier during the drug bust). -- Bubbachuck 09:26, 7 February 2006 (UTC)

Added Season 3 info
I added a plot summary for the final four episodes of Season 3. It makes the Season 3 summary section much longer than the first two. Perhaps someone should try their hand at condensing the Season 3 information? I like the show too much to want to cut anything out. :-) Vslashg 07:17, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

Series Finale?
Though billed as the finale for the season, the last four episodes were very much like a series finale. In addition to tying up loose ends (Maeby's adoption, what really happened to Annyong, George Senior's charges, the houses in Iraq), there was an epilogue. You don't have an epilogue in the middle of something, and it is highly unlikely that the word was used humorously. I believe this is truly the end of the show, as much as it pains me. If this isn't the end of the show, it is certainly the end of the show's run on Fox. This may be considered common knowledge already, but nothing has officially been released saying another network has picked it up. Anyway, I think something should be added mentioning this, but, without getting a go-ahead, some asshole on a power trip will likely remove it. Dudewhiterussian 08:24, 11 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Although it does seem pretty final for all the reasons you mentioned, there is still no official word yet on the possibility it could come back, whether on Fox or Showtime. So I'm pretty sure no asshole on a power trip will revert an edit noting things like plotline wrap-ups, the epilogue, etc, but going further than that (like saying it's the series finale) would be speculation/original research. --TheMidnighters 09:12, 11 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Does nobody remember the end where Ron Howard, as himself, hinted at a "movie" with Maeby and her Executive Producer? But then again, there were hints of moving to CBS. Let's hope we hear a real, solid announcement soon, and that the DVDs come out soon. I'm itching already. Dynendal 20:37, 11 February 2006 (UTC)
 * As much as this hurts me inside, I think that the last 4 episodes were indeed the "Series Finale". The "works better as a movie" remark, in my eyes, was a dig at the low ratings that have afflicted the show throughout its run. Sort of, "No.. We've seen the results of the show. It would work better as a movie." I doubt that there will actually be an "Arrested Development" movie, though there are plans for a book. WikiTruth 20:37, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
 * You're probably right. What we are left with, then, is the most brilliant five eipisode (I'm counting S.O.B.s as part of this for obvious reasons) end to a television series ever devised.  Utterly.  F*****g.  Brilliant. -  Jersyko &middot; talk  20:56, 14 February 2006 (UTC)
 * I got the new Rolling Stone a couple days ago, and just got around reading it today. They mention the four episode finale, stating it as the series finale (for anyone who reads Rolling Stone regularly, or who has a news stand that carries it, this is on page 30, number 1 on 'The Grid'). While this isn't a direct quote from Fox or Hurwitz/Howard, Rolling Stone is a reputable source for general entertainment news and therefore not original research. So, though it is still speculation, would it now be fine to mention something along the lines of what I originally intended (the finale seemed to be the series rather than the season) being that RS said the same thing?
 * Also, referring to an earlier post, I think the "movie" remark might've been aimed at the finale itself, as running a marathon of a show with a continuous storyline, especially when the marathon contains an entire story-arc, can work as a movie (WB, for example, has shown two-part episodes of Smallville back-to-back as a "Smallville Movie Event"). Thoughts on this? Dudewhiterussian 03:52, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
 * My first reaction is to demand more Arrested Development. But think about it, how could they POSSIBLY end the show more perfectly?  It pains me, but perhaps the show should end now. -  Jersyko &middot;talk 04:36, 17 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Showtime and ABC are both interested in continuing the series, but I don't think any talks have happened with either Fox or Michael Hurtiz yet.

Talk page needs cleaned up
There are several sections in this page that are irrelevant now. Ron Howard, Presented like a documentary?, character lost, question, Location of series, External links (SaveOurBluths.org), S.O.B.'s has an entire paragraph?, Disbarred, and Steve Holt!!! have all been resolved. Again, I'd like to alter this, but I don't want it reverted. Thoughts? Dudewhiterussian 08:24, 11 February 2006 (UTC)
 * It's wikipedia policy to never delete talk page discussions even after resolution. That way if the same/similar argument ever arises you can refer to past discussions. Archiving talk pages are possible but I'm not sure if this talk page is long enough to merit it yet. --TheMidnighters 09:17, 11 February 2006 (UTC)

AWB similarities removed?
Yesterday I added a shot section at the end or Topicality approaching how the AWB scandal in Australia has themes in common with AD, and I want to know why it was removed.


 * This article isn't a collecting place for every bit of information that has ever existed. It became a Featured Article, and should try to remain high quality. Letting every random user add their own random comments just destroys the Featured Article. This is what happened to Christmas. &mdash; 0918 BRIAN &bull; 2006-02-12 07:44


 * Okay. I just read the Christmas changelog and why it was removed from the Featured articles list. I understand now.

British Bombshell/For British Eyes Only
ok...I could've sworn the title of Episode 2, Season 3 was "The British Bombshell", but apparently it was changed to "For British Eyes Only" at the last minute before broadcast. My source for that is the excellent AD site, the Balboa Observer-Picayune at http://www.the-op.com. My apologies to whoever I edited over and I'll change it back now ka1iban 16:16, 14 February 2006 (UTC)

Guest apperences & Cameos
I'm not up enough on the show to fully develop this, but the sections "recurring roles" and "cameos" leaves out sizable appearances that only last one episode. I'm thinking Martin Short as Uncle Jack, and there probably be seperate catagories for any guest role (such as Dave Attell, whose role is small but still a role) as opposed to pop-ins (Marc Cherry, William Hung etc.) that last only a few seconds.

"On the next..."
There seems to be some confusion over these. The epilogue pieces are considered non-canon, only unless otherwise referenced. While the there are numerous instances of their being made canon in subsequent episodes, several defy the continuity, making the latter the rule and the former the exception. This is why Steve Holt doesn't recall the epilogue of "The Immaculate Election" when he meets GOB in Season Three, and why Annyong isn't emancipated following "Missing Kitty." Also note that while Maggie is incapable of having children in the normal continuity, this notion is false in the non-canon world of the epilogues.
 * But breaking with continuity is not limited to those segments, it's done in the normal course of the episodes as well isn't it? I'd also argue there are more, or at least equal, instances of plot developments in the segments that reaffirm and fit with continuity compared to those that contradict it (Tobias showing the kids pictures of Maeby's birth, Annyong as the mole in the walls, Michael discovering he has an older sister, all in Season 3 alone). Is there any source from the makers of the show saying that these segments are non-canon? If not, it's debatable and left up to POV and original research. --TheMidnighters 00:28, 27 February 2006 (UTC)
 * Breaking continuity is inevitable in any series, however in a special case like this, we must consider the fact that the "On the next..." segments are in and of themselves farcical. The commentary on the extended pilot touches on this to some extent, but the clear intent is that these segments are meant as a joke. Even in some cases where plot developments are revealed in the OTN, different takes (the aforementioned Tobias scene) or different scenes altogether (Steve Holt's GOB discovery) are used. If you need to understand this in terms of "equal or lesser" ratios, consider the fact that what is narrated as happening on the next episode statistically almost never does.
 * I know they're farcical, and are meant as jokes; I never argued that they weren't. But you still haven't provided any kind of source to suggest that they are "non-canon". I have no problem with the statement that they often break with continuity (because that's true), but that does not remove it from the larger work. As you said, breaking continuity is inevitable in any series, but when these instances happen they are not considered non-canon, that being not officially part of the series or inauthentic. Continuity and canonicity are different things and shouldn't be confused or mutually exchanged. Since many important events occur within these segments it is arguable that instances of breaking with continuity are, inversely, the exception. Again, my main issue is with the term "non-canon": it's subjective and creates a very general claim that isn't founded on anything concrete. --TheMidnighters 01:53, 27 February 2006 (UTC)

The end of The Immaculate Elecetion DID factor into the countinuity. Steve Holt forgot Gob in The Cabin Show because, like Gob, Steve's memory is god-awful. When Gob did the same pose he did in the photo from The Immaculate Election Steve saw, Steve says "You look familiar." The continuity is fine.
 * Henry Winkler never ended up doing prison time......--Torourkeus 21:34, 26 November 2006 (UTC)