Talk:Attack Attack! (American band)/Archives/2014 1

ALSO KNOWN AS?
On Andrew Wetzel's formspring, he says Attack Attack! was originally called Ambiance. That should go on the page i think. http://www.formspring.me/WetzelAA/q/189459600766964167

Untitled
See Deletion review/Log/2009 March 6 Chillum  22:05, 6 March 2009 (UTC)

The Clean up
As you can see i've tired to make a clean up on the Attack Attack!, but it seems i've made and error myself. if someone could please help me with this it would mean very much thank you. Skateremorocker (talk) 16:44, 7 March 2009 (UTC) they are not electronic thry are just dancecore —Preceding unsigned comment added by 68.162.253.219 (talk) 16:00, 1 February 2010 (UTC)

Auto-Tune
I don't think this is purely Auto-Tune, to me it sounds like auto-tuned vocals going into some kind of vocoder. Maybe a specialist or a citation can help here. --87.179.161.231 (talk) 19:00, 10 March 2009 (UTC)

The citation [14] doesn't state vocals won't be auto-tuned. It clearly says that they won't have the effect (ie be obviously manipulated). —Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.78.204.27 (talk) 07:25, 28 May 2010 (UTC)

Metalcore
If you actually listen, you can hear the metalcore all over it! Its not emo rock with screams, which is what post-hardcore genereally is! Simmo mania —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.242.123.208 (talk) 20:34, 14 April 2009 (UTC)


 * Can you find verifiable and reliable sources to confirm this? tedder (talk) 20:37, 14 April 2009 (UTC)

They are not post-hardcore in anyway. Bands nowadays will use that term in an attempt to make them sound edgy, it's become nothing but a misnomer. Post-hardcore is also closer to experimental rock than it is "screamo."

I agree, it's Metalcorish but with electronica thing... -darksluke23 —Preceding unsigned comment added by Darksluke23 (talk • contribs) 13:56, 15 September 2009 (UTC)

Hmm...its not any of these genres, it's a whole new genre called 'Crabcore"! :D —Preceding unsigned comment added by Oohlookatthat (talk • contribs) 06:06, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

it's called ELECTROCORE!!! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.231.158.3 (talk) 19:29, 20 February 2010 (UTC)


 * *Electronicore. Salamibears58 (talk) 16:45, 21 August 2011 (UTC)Salamibears58

I Think it is a kind of Crunkcore also if there isn't parts of rap. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.24.74.233 (talk) 13:44, 4 August 2011 (UTC)

Crabcore
If you actually watch, you can see that this band is pioneering the Crabcore genre
 * http://www.guardian.co.uk/music/musicblog/2009/jun/23/scene-and-heard-crabcore <--- Cited proof. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.84.99.80 (talk) 04:26, 4 July 2009 (UTC)

Discussed Crabcore and that it needs to be added under genres with +fetchcomms in the Wikipedia IRC. Added under genres 1810 EDT 20 January, 2010. —Preceding unsigned comment added by GinsuChikara (talk • contribs) 23:12, 20 January 2010 (UTC)

Christian Metalcore?
After listening to and reading the lyrics to some of their songs, I would argue that Christian Metalcore could be added to the Genres section of this band. Here is my main reason for this argument, a quote from Attack Attack!'s single "Stick Stickly"

"We live for what He's worth, And that's more than you'll know. He died for what He loved, And what he loved was you."

This part is obviously talking about the Chrisitan belief that Jesus died for man's sin. --Fbifriday (talk) 19:08, 20 June 2009 (UTC)


 * Wikipedia is built upon reliably sourced content. Can you find verifiable and reliable sources to confirm this? tedder (talk) 23:52, 20 June 2009 (UTC)

Not all members of this band are Christian. Some are, and it affects the lyrics. Look at the blog on their myspace. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.198.30.128 (talk) 21:44, 1 July 2009 (UTC)

The band has also claimed they were Christian and dedicated each show to Jesus... that is until they signed to Rise and got huge. Now they are kind of just sell outs. Oh well... 205.133.193.10 (talk) 05:42, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

I think they should be considered christian. They're bio on itunes say that they follow "Strict christian Principals" DCcomicslover (talk) 22:54, 6 November 2010 (UTC)DCcomicslover

Genre clean up
Using Billboard 200, we can clearly exchange the generic Alternative Pop, Pop-Punk, and Rock genre listings for the more defined 2nd Wave Screamo, Metalcore, and Post-Hardcore genres. http://www.billboard.com/bbcom/bio/index.jsp?JSESSIONID=0K3hKNRWWJPBLMg3lJWFm01LxTQStSQnnh31w6vHqT0Kjg46twTg!-1906239168&pid=1041042&aid=1191424 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.84.99.80 (talk) 20:00, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
 * The link you gave (to the Billboard 200) went to the "artist biography", which was an syndicated copy of the Allmusic paragraph about them- it didn't say anything about genres other than calling them "a screamo/metalcore outfit"; can you give a link to the more accurate genre description? tedder (talk) 20:16, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
 * There's also the Alternative Press news bulletin of their signing to Rise Records (http://www.altpress.com/news/4175.htm) stating them as metalcore, the Alternative Press Recommends section (http://www.altpress.com/recommends/225.htm) stating them as Post-Hardcore, Trancecore (Electronica-infused metalcore), Pop-punk, and screamo, the AbsolutePunk review (http://www.absolutepunk.net/showthread.php?t=686402) stated them as being Synth-core (the same thing as trancecore, Electronica-infused metalcore), etc., etc. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.84.99.80 (talk) 04:24, 4 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Also, citation 6 on the main article page (The citation from The Guardian) states then as emo, metalcore, electronica, and post-hardcore. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.84.99.80 (talk) 04:31, 4 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Trancecore and Synthcore are way different. Synthcore: Core with Electronic Elements.  Trancecore: Core with elements of a specific type of electronic music called Trance music.  Salamibears58 (talk) 16:47, 21 August 2011 (UTC)Salamibears58

They are playing on the Altec Lansing stage for warped tour 2010 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.133.51.136 (talk) 01:00, 24 May 2010 (UTC)

Metalcore sources
Well I saw the sources you put for metalcore and I dont think they are reliable because of their use for the metalcore term in them, i mean, in the allmusic page they just use it in one phrase, and I dont think is for stating the gengre exactly (i dunno if im explaining myself right, sorry) and in the styles section they're isn't listed as a metalcore act and that part I think is the one it matters the most (specially if we are talking about allmusic) and in the other source there is just one part that says something about metalcore but it looked like it was just put it there for saying anything, I mean, it says exactly "emo/post-hardcore/electronica/metalcrabcore/shit beat combo from the US state of Ohio, have been stunning the world" and at least for me it doesnt sound very, let's say, "professional" if you know what I mean, it sounded like just some random magazine-like comment to just "spice-up" the article, so im going to delete that from the gengre list if you dont mind.

And after hearing this band, it doesnt sound very metalcore to me, it sounds more like some kind of "electro screamo" (or "electro post-hardcore", whatever term you like the best, it doesnt matter) but anyways that last comment was 100% personal opinion so if you want, pay no attention to it.--201.208.37.93 (talk) 07:04, 18 September 2009 (UTC)


 * See WP:V; Wikipedia is based on verifiable, reliable sources. That means if you want to say they are "foo genre", you need to find sources indicating so. tedder (talk) 14:16, 18 September 2009 (UTC)


 * Also, knowing the differences between genres is very helpful, even with sources: saying "electro screamo" when a reference says "electro post-hardcore" is completely wrong. Either way, references are still needed (I honestly prefer "synthcore" for the new brand of electronic hardcore music, but nobody reputable seems to agree) -Violask81976 02:02, 23 October 2009 (UTC)

Comment Above Me
Screamo and post hardcore are very different, So its not which term you like best. Electro Post Hardcore might be somewhat accurate but Electro Screamo is not at all. And as for the crabcore tag, Don't make a genre tag for a genre that only fits one band. Especially when the genre does not have a page. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.3.144.90 (talk) 23:05, 13 October 2009 (UTC)

2010: Shazam! and future tours
The group is currently working on their second studio album, entitled "Shazam!". They currently have one song from the album released on their Myspace called "Sexual Man Chocolate".

Starting in March, Attack Attack! will embark on the Artery Foundation's "Across the Nation Tour" with Breathe Carolina, I See Stars, Asking Alexandria, and Bury Tomorrow. They will also be participating in the 2010 Warped Tour. —Preceding unsigned comment added by SilverxPacker (talk • contribs) 01:28, 26 January 2010 (UTC)

Why is there no article for Bury Tomorrow? Somebody should get started on this! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.178.194.68 (talk) 19:51, 20 January 2011 (UTC)

Crabcore
Anything to do with the term "crabcore" is off this article entirely until at least an appropriate section can be made for Andrew Whiting's signature guitar-playing stance. Overall there are not even reliable sources to back-up this claim, nor does it even belong in the lead and it certainly isn't a genre due to the fact that having a certain stance while playing your instrument doesn't involve anything musically. • GunMetal Angel  08:57, 7 February 2010 (UTC)

Category removal
They said they aren't a Christian band, so I'm pretty sure the category should be removed (Odd, I'm probably not the only person to realize they used to dedicate their shows to Jesus and all that cheezy stuff, but whatever). 98.198.83.12 (talk) 03:27, 10 April 2010 (UTC)

Is it just me, or is the sentence "Although the band's songs contain Christian-based lyrics, not all members of Attack Attack! subscribe to the religion, as such do not consider themselves a Christian band"... no one SUBSCRIBES to a religion, you believe in it or you're a member of it. Someone change it to a better word. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 204.237.12.174 (talk) 17:03, 22 April 2010 (UTC)


 * from "subscribe to" --> "follow." -- ҚЯĀŽΨÇÉV  13  19:02, 22 April 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from Peacaca432, 5 August 2010
Peacaca432 (talk) 21:49, 5 August 2010 (UTC)


 * Red question icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please be more specific about what needs to be changed. --Stickee (talk)  23:36, 5 August 2010 (UTC)

Edit request from Alvarez7978, 23 November 2010
edit semi-protected

The original members of the band at its formation were Austin Carlile, Johnny Franck, Andrew Whiting, Dustin May, and Nick White. In the article it states that the original members were Austin Carlile, Ricky Lortz, Andrew Whiting, Nick White, and Andrew Wetzel which is not correct.

Alvarez7978 (talk) 03:16, 23 November 2010 (UTC)
 * Red information icon with gradient background.svg Not done: please provide reliable sources that support the change you want to be made. —  Jeff G.  ツ  04:38, 23 November 2010 (UTC)

Behind the Music
There's a rumor going on that Attack Attack! may be premiering on their own Behind the Music episode in the coming year. Anyone have updates for this? - GunMetal Angel  20:04, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Deathcore
I changed the genre to deathcore because there is obvious death metal influence in their music from bands such as Decicide, Atheist and Hatebreed. I also did this on all of their albums. — Preceding unsigned comment added by SomedayCameSuddenly (talk • contribs) 01:41, 31 August 2011 (UTC)
 * You're a great comedy act. Bravo. • GunMetal Angel  02:22, 31 August 2011 (UTC)

Associated Acts
Shouldn't Beartooth be in associated acts because it's Caleb's new music projects? And shouldn't Addictions be there too because it's Nick Barham's new band? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.90.61.167 (talk) 16:14, 27 December 2012 (UTC)

Djent?
Instead of saying that This Means War era is "groove metal", wouldn't it be more apt to go with djent? The style on that record is hugely influenced by djent. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.4.40.30 (talk) 21:42, 9 May 2013 (UTC)

Article title
Some time ago I moved this page to a more distinguishable title, that being "Attack Attack! (American band)" however this has been reverted due to a disagreement in the title, to me and probably to many other people out there a simple exclamation point isn't enough to distinguish this article from that of the welsh band of a very similar name, the difference being an exclamation point being next to both words, instead of the single point at the end. I would move it back but I fear this would only cause an edit war so I think it would be best to leave it to a vote, so obviously in my case I Support moving this article to ''Attack Attack! (American band) and moving the Welsh Band's article to Attack! Attack! (Welsh band)'' since this properly distinguishes between the two. 00:37, 19 July 2014 (UTC)


 * Personally, I think this is a case of WP:PRECISION supporting that the exclamation is enough, but I'm open to moving the page back if that's what the majority decides. Sock   ( tock talk)  01:10, 28 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Sorry, I was in a hurry with my last message. I forgot to mention that I think the hatnotes would cover anyone who went to the wrong page. Seeing as the exclamation mark pages would likely redirect to the right spot anyway, I think the dabs are unneeded. Sock   ( tock talk)  01:54, 28 August 2014 (UTC)

Requested moves

 * The following discussion is an archived discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was: no consensus. Jenks24 (talk) 14:48, 10 September 2014 (UTC)

– I disagree with the use of a mere "!" to be used to distinguish between the two bands, I think a more obvious title should be used to make it easier to distinguish between the two articles rather than reading one article to realise it's the wrong one. SilentDan (talk) 12:19, 28 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Attack Attack! → Attack Attack! (American band)
 * Attack! Attack! → Attack! Attack! (Welsh band)
 * Oppose. Disambiguation is a technical necessity, not a stylistic feature. We use disambiguation if two articles would otherwise have to occupy the same article name.  As nothing would cause these articles to occupy the same name, disambiguation isn't appropriate.  Their similarity calls only for the articles to refer to each other using hatnotes ("For the Welsh band, see..."). —chaos5023 (talk) 12:57, 28 August 2014 (UTC)


 * Oppose. These moves aren't necessary per Chaos' rationale above.  Calidum  Talk To Me 14:25, 28 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Support. Whereas there may be guidelines which permit these two bands to be disambiguated by a solitary exclamation mark, commonsense tells us that a little help for a casual reader will be fully appreciated. --Richhoncho (talk) 14:35, 28 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Support. Readers with only passing familiarity with these bands will find the names confusingly similar. As both bands are relatively obscure, there is no discernable primary topic between them, and both current titles should lead to a disambiguation page. bd2412  T 15:27, 28 August 2014 (UTC)
 * I didn't even think of a Disambiguation page, that would be beneficial indeed! SilentDan (talk) 15:34, 28 August 2014 (UTC)


 * Support: Such a small difference in punctuation is inadequate for disambiguation – especially since music is primarily perceived with ears rather than in print, and punctuation is not pronounced. It also seems likely that sources that discuss the topics do not always consistently apply the small difference in punctuation. —BarrelProof (talk) 16:31, 28 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Support it's difficult to argue a ! is sufficient disambiguation in any circumstances, to claim the above difference passes WP:CRITERIA on WP:PRECISION and WP:RECOGNIZABILITY is one of the most highly stretched examples ever to pass via RM. In ictu oculi (talk) 18:09, 28 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Suggest, Attack Attack! (US metal band) and Attack! Attack! (Welsh rock band). Gregkaye (talk) 23:01, 28 August 2014 (UTC)
 * personally I for one have a lot of sympathy with such a suggestion, since once disambiguated by brackets then adding genre harms no-one. Unfortunately it's not going to fly, the convention is to add nationality first and only add genre if essential, presumably because the genre is much more subjective and genres change. So basically you need to support/oppose the move proposal as proposed. But as I said, your suggestion to my mind is a good one. In ictu oculi (talk) 01:11, 29 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Weak Oppose, Ample clarity is provided by hatnotes.


 * Attack Attack! has: "This article is about the American band. For the Welsh band, see Attack! Attack!" and
 * Attack! Attack! has: "This article is about the Welsh band. For the American band, see Attack Attack!"
 * Attack Attack lists:
 * Attack Attack!, an American band (with one exclamation mark)
 * Attack! Attack!, a Welsh band (with two exclamation marks)
 * and
 * Attack Attack! (album), the American band's second studio album released in 2010
 * Attack! Attack! (album), the Welsh band's 2008 debut album, released in USA as Attack! Attack! UK
 * this topic isn't doing my blood pressure much good :)
 * a Google search on: Attack Attack lists both Wikipedia entries inclusive of the first lines of the article content. I did not see any other point in the Google listings where the words American, Welsh or band appeared.  Clear information is provided at every significant point.
 * Its POV but I have a general dislike for nationalism (with preference for Citizenship or Origins). See: Template_talk:Infobox_person
 * Gregkaye (talk) 04:27, 29 August 2014 (UTC)


 * Support per RichHondo. these titles should redirect to the disambiguation page Attack Attack -- 65.94.169.222 (talk) 06:18, 29 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Oppose. The two band names differ from one another. The note at the top of the page indicates the reader well enough whether he is at the correct page.--Retrohead (talk) 12:29, 30 August 2014 (UTC)
 * Oppose per WP:TWODABS and . Each is the primary topic of one of the two spellings, and the other can be listed via a "not to be confused with" hatnote at the top respectively.  --В²C ☎ 07:36, 8 September 2014 (UTC)
 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.