Talk:Balanced-arm lamp

Untitled
I want to make a page with al kind of balancing systems for arm lamps like :

counter weight balanced arm lamps.

metal spring balanced arm lamps

rubber elastic balanced arm lamps

{Formerly unsigned contribution by Stef breukel (talk ) 06:26, 04 April 2007 added by (Ping welcome) Steue (talk) 14:13, 10 October 2022 (UTC)}

Stef

Sorry, i do not understand

i have made some drawings

i want to donate it to wikipedia

{Formerly unsigned contribution by [Stef breukel] 13:33, 12 April 2007 added by Steue (talk) 13:57, 10 October 2022 (UTC)}

Images
I like the article and the great explanatory drawings. You need to ensure that if you made them yourself they are tagged as GDFL meaning you give up rights to them and they pass into the open source domain. Otherwise the images wil be deleted. Lumos3 10:32, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

Cleanup
This article is full of so much wonderful information but is one of the most poorly written and compiled articles on Wikipedia I have ever seen. There is no unity of flow, the information is difficult to explain, some parts are too technical, some grammar is terrible, and the diagrams are unclear. Everything that could have gone wrong, did. This looks like a page from a second-rate unmoderated website. Sorry for the rant. Now, who's with me?
 * &#9773; Zippanova  06:18, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

Cleanup
Hello Zippanova

Yes you[r] rant is right, we have to do something.

I am sh[ o u]re technical people will understand the images.

The function of a[n] arm lamp is simple to explain. A[n] arm system to balance a lamp in a desired position. There are a lot of technical methods to do this.

But This article does need some text to explain the working method.

I made this article not alone to explain the working of a balanced arm lamp, but about the mechanical technique in general.

I am Stef Breukel from the Netherlands, My language [is] [ d D]utch.

I will try to find some English technical people that can help me with this text in this article.

I will make a start this week,

Thank you, Stef


 * Some friendly corrections to improve your English.
 * Steue (talk) 16:45, 10 October 2022 (UTC)

Copy-edit help
Stef, I like the topic! I am happy to continue to comb through for spelling and English usage etc. If there are specific things I don't understand, I'll post questions for you here. Jlhughes 23:35, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Questions or comments
...for you, Stef:


 * 1) I would like to see a short discussion about the forces in balance before the article starts to discuss particular types of lamp.
 * 2) There is a picture towards the end of the page showing how compression vs extension springs work which is very clear, and should be nearer the top, perhaps?
 * 3) I don't understand the "en" in "Squeezing en friction rubber arm" Is it "or"?

--No "and" it is friction and Squeezing that keep this lamp balanced. --This is one of the most common Italian design lamp. --Stef


 * 1) Can you re-do the hierarchy? This is what I think it is, although I've left out a couple of types that I don't understand.


 * lamps held in place with springs


 * lamps with extension springs


 * (various)


 * lamps with compression springs


 * (various)


 * lamps with other springs


 * (torsion & spiral)


 * lamps held in place with friction


 * (various)


 * lamps held in place with counterweights


 * (various)


 * lamps held in place with mechanical coupling devices


 * (hydraulic & pneumatic)

Can you correct this list as necessary (I've not considered the types of arms (parallelogram etc.) which I'm sure is important), and then organize the lamps by type of construction?

--yes go ahead, if you want you can do every thing you think is best for the article.

--I like your work improving the article, I am not very good in writing [ en in] [E]nglish --Stef

Jlhughes 20:18, 25 June 2007 (UTC)
 * Think you’re making excellent suggestions here Jlhughes, thanks for your efforts (and of course you Stef, for your original enthusiastic contributions on the topic). Concerning the en in item 3, that’s probably meant as and (in a NL→Eng way) . --Van helsing 21:20, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

--I am glad much people like the article, This article is open source, so if you have some other lamp I do not know of please edit. --Stef

Editing space
There [are] a lot of things [I] do not understand about the Wikipedia editing system

[ way ][why] is this editing space this small, 25 rows? can [I] [ more ][make] this space bigger ?

Stef


 * You can specify the size of the edit window in: my preferences, editing tab, editbox dimensions in rows and columns. --Van helsing 11:08, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

Thank you Van helsing, this makes it [ match ][mutch] easier for me

Stef

pressure spring to compression spring
yes compression spring is more common and clear

I like how the article [ in ][is] improving

If the article is organised I have some other arm lamp systems to put on it

Stef

Collapsible tables!
Hello Stef and others

I think I've found the right solution for a graphics-heavy, text-light page such as this. I've just dropped in collapsible tables which open out at a click for each type of lamp. This means you can take in the page quite easily at a glance, but look at all the pictures as you like.

Please check my coding for the tables, as I've never used them before, and carry on if you think it's a sensible approach.

JH(emendator) 12:44, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

Hello Jlhughes and others

Yes, Looks very good

I did not know this was possible in Wikipedia.

Thank you ,

Stef


 * Terrible! At first glance, the article looks almost void of content. Some readers may not realise that content is hidden in hide/show tables (I didn't at first). It's also a hassle to have to actively click to display each table. It makes reading the article much more cumbersome than reading a wikipedia article should be or usually is. --Kvaks (talk) 18:13, 11 July 2008 (UTC)


 * I very much agree that the collapsible tables made this troublesome article nearly-unreadable, and so per yours and Tabby's unchallenged suggestions I've removed them. Walkersam (talk) 19:41, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

improving this article
The purpose of the balancing technique is very simple to explain to young people. How to balance a lamp on a desired position.

This article is not just to show how the balancing technique works, but to show mechanical technique in general.

Please help me improving this article ?

Thank you ,

Stef —Preceding unsigned comment added by World arm lamp (talk • contribs) 12:00, 9 December 2007 (UTC)

List of deleted images of other arm lamp systems
For later if there is more text to extent this page.

I hope this problem with the "Spiral spring controls a pantograph arm lamp.PNG" image is solved. I made this image and donated it to wikipedia. There is no copyright on this image.

List:

[[Image:One Pressure spring one parallelogram.PNG

-- Popular American lamp pressure spring controls a photographic arm.PNG

Popular American lamp Image:Popular American lamp.PNG

--- Spiral spring controls a pantograph arm

Image:Spiral spring controls a pantograph arm lamp.PNG

- Image:Stretch Pantographic parallel balance arm a light-weight-lamp and counter-weight.PNG

Image:Bending Pantographic parallel balance arm a light-weight-lamp and counter-weight.PNG

arm lamp.PNG

Stef  --World arm lamp (talk) 23:02, 26 January 2008 (UTC)

show/hide
A very thorough article... but

The long list of show/hides that have to be clicked just to read the page is a huge waste of the reader's time. I hope they get removed, and the images load without user intervention, as is done on 99.99% of webpages. Tabby (talk) 12:02, 19 February 2008 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Luxo L1 black 2006-08-02.jpg
Image:Luxo L1 black 2006-08-02.jpg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.

Please go to the image description page and edit it to include a fair use rationale. Using one of the templates at Fair use rationale guideline is an easy way to ensure that your image is in compliance with Wikipedia policy, but remember that you must complete the template. Do not simply insert a blank template on an image page.

If there is other fair use media, consider checking that you have specified the fair use rationale on the other images used on this page. Note that any fair use images lacking such an explanation can be deleted one week after being tagged, as described on criteria for speedy deletion. If you have any questions please ask them at the Media copyright questions page. Thank you.

BetacommandBot (talk) 13:28, 8 March 2008 (UTC)

A Thought Experiment
Suppose one were to take an excavator and replace the bucket with a floodlight. Would this be considered a valid balanced-arm lamp?

71.237.206.43 (talk) 23:54, 17 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Shure it would. Size doesn't matter. It's got a movable arm and can hold it in a position.
 * Ping welcome, Steue (talk) 17:07, 10 October 2022 (UTC)

Does this kind of lamp exist ? Please let me know

--World arm lamp (talk) 23:36, 4 April 2008 (UTC)


 * Might very well be, e.g. an excavator for nightly works (urgent repair) or for moving/loading/unloading wood at night is very likely to not only have lamps on top of the cabin but also at the arm.
 * Steue (talk) 17:26, 10 October 2022 (UTC)

Well, that rather depends on how valid you consider the "hydraulic-arm lamp" in the main article to be. Which was my point in proposing this thought experiment. 71.237.206.43 (talk) 13:05, 16 June 2008 (UTC)

Suggestion
Could the click on images of the various types of lamps be brought into the article, so they do not have to be clicked on? I have also changed references to forearm etc to read as the mechanical equivalents, which clarifies a little. Otherwise the article is OK. Chasnor15 (talk) 15:42, 27 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Meanwhile got/is done.
 * Steue (talk) 17:14, 10 October 2022 (UTC)

Images
Apparently these images were uploaded for use on this page:

~ Bigr  Tex  00:02, 4 May 2008 (UTC)

For the "parallelogram with an extended counterweight" lamp To show how this one is balanced.

Stef--86.92.132.118 (talk) 14:42, 29 June 2008 (UTC)

The headers should be "active" headers
@ Jlhughes

Within/under e.g. the header "One tension spring": the headers should be (I call them) "active" headers.

Source code of such a header:

IS:

The semicolon makes them: but they do not appear in the table of content.
 * larger than mormal text and
 * bold,

SHOULD BE: (On each side: one more "=" than the superior header), in this case 4 "="s:

Advantages:
 * these headers appear in the table of content too and
 * it is easier to edit, because one can edit a single chapter.

Ping welcome, Steue (talk) 08:01, 10 October 2022 (UTC)


 * Done, by Steue (talk) 17:32, 10 October 2022 (UTC).

Constructions using Friction
All constructions which use *friction*, also use and need *pressure*. The friction results from the pressure --- no pressure, no friction. Therefore all (the three) constructions, which use friction belong under the heading "Friction and pressure."
 * General

I shall put the Italian design under the sub heading: "Rubber between two parallel arms".
 * "Rubber between two parallel arms"

Before my changes it was under the sub header: "(5.2) #Friction" After my changes it will be under the sub header: "Friction from twisting"
 * #Friction {from twisting}

The twisting itself is not the important part. The twisting results in pressure and friction. Thus this construction uses the same two phenomena as the Italian construction with rubber between "parallel" arms.

Therefore this construction belongs under the heading of "Friction and pressure" / sub heading "Friction from twisting".

Ping welcome, Steue (talk) 10:02, 10 October 2022 (UTC)


 * Done.
 * Steue (talk) 17:31, 10 October 2022 (UTC)

Image:Pressure and expansion springs.png


Dear Stef,

For the reader to generally understand these two types of usage of a coil spring, I think, it would be better, if the image were in such a position, that the load works in the direction towards the earth, which is natural.

If, later, in the usage in a lamp, the force actually works up-wards, this is a different issue. But first comes the general understanding / the understanding of the principle.

Therefore this image should be upside down.

Ping welcome, Steue (talk) 14:41, 10 October 2022 (UTC)


 * If this is done, the description needs to be alterd in sequence.
 * Steue (talk) 15:35, 10 October 2022 (UTC)

Sash windows and Drawing boards
Sash windows (slide up windows) and Drawing boards (they slide up and down too) use counterweights for balancing. But they do not have arm(s); and they do not use their counterweights to balance their arm(s). They simply also use one of these fundamental technologies. Therefore I would not consider them to belong high within this article. But it is OK to mention these common examples of use of counterweights, where counterweights are introduced. Especially they do not belong in the list of "Other uses of balanced arms ". This article is about "balanced arms", not about the balancing technologies in general.

Ping welcome, Steue (talk) 18:04, 10 October 2022 (UTC)