Talk:Battle of Nikuštak

KFOR
GermanManFromFrankfurt, they were detained in Kosovo. Gorno Zkoklucanje is close to the border with Kosovo. Here's an English report about it too. On top of that, they were not engaged in combat. What KFOR does in its territory does not make them involved. While there was a decision to deploy NATO troops, they were actually deployed in late August during Operation Essential Harvest after the Ohrid Framework Agreement. So neither NATO or KFOR were involved in the battle. NATO was only involved in the evacuation of the rebels from Aracinovo. If you don't believe me, you can ask for outside opinion. StephenMacky1 (talk) 10:59, 1 August 2023 (UTC)


 * Thank you for providing the source, it helped clarify the info. If you want, you can remove NATO from the Belligerents part. GermanManFromFrankfurt (talk) 05:24, 5 August 2023 (UTC)
 * Hello. The "factual dispute" tag did not call the battle into question (and I never called it into question either), but was simply about factual errors. I'd like to return to the previous version, since it also contains some corrections I made. StephenMacky1 (talk) 08:15, 5 August 2023 (UTC)

NLA casualties
Someone added 4 dead to the NLA casualties and used a source, which appears to only mention the fallen NLA soldiers who had their origins in Nikuštak, and not those that died during the Battle.


 * 1) Harun Aliu, died in 2010 during the Raduša shootout, not during the Battle of Nikuštak. https://www.radiokosovaelire.com/harun-aliu-20-5-1971-12-5-2010/
 * 2) Jetulla Miftari, died during the Battle of Matejče, not during the Battle of Nikuštak. https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=239736673768529
 * 3) Qemal Shaqiri, died during the Brest attack in the village Malino, not during the Battle of Nikuštak. https://pashtriku.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/deshmoret-e-UCK-monografi.pdf
 * 4) Abaz Beqiri, died during the Skopje raid, not during the Battle of Nikuštak. https://fol.mk/beqiri-pushka-e-trimit-dhe-sofra-e-gjumertit-asnjehere-nuk-mbesin-te-zbrazura/
 * 5) Muzafer Agushi, died during the Ljuboten incident, not during the Battle of Nikuštak. https://pashtriku.org/wp-content/uploads/2014/02/deshmoret-e-UCK-monografi.pdf

GermanManFromFrankfurt (talk) 20:14, 9 August 2023 (UTC)


 * Well, I don't wanna start another thread for this, since it's about casualties anyway. I checked The Irish Times source and it does not claim that the Macedonian soldier and another were killed and wounded in the village, but that it happened near Tanuševci. StephenMacky1 (talk) 15:57, 10 August 2023 (UTC)

Result
Kluche, I think there's a difference between this battle and the Aračinovo crisis. The difference is that in the latter case, the Macedonian forces were able to re-establish control over Aračinovo as a result of the ceasefire, which doesn't appear to be the case here. The village Nikuštak was still under NLA control even in August, based on the new sources I added. I would say it was inconclusive too if it wasn't for the sources. It also appears that the Macedonian police was only able to establish control over the village only in December, when the insurgency was already over, so I don't think the OSCE part should be included as part of the result. StephenMacky1 (talk) 15:13, 11 August 2023 (UTC)


 * I've failed to find any other mention of the return in December, and the source presented is some NGO, so it is of questionable reliability in my opinion. If the return did happen in December, then I do agree that the OSCE part should be removed. Best regards. Kluche (talk) 17:51, 11 August 2023 (UTC)
 * NGOs are WP:RS too. That's why we also include information from the Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch. The article in question was written by a Macedonian journalist with a good reputation based on what I saw. However if you have doubts about the source, you can inquire at WP:RSN. There is no source that disputes the information though. StephenMacky1 (talk) 18:13, 11 August 2023 (UTC)
 * I did a little more digging and found a source which disputes the exact date of the return, from December 19th to December 13th - https://www.upi.com/Defense-News/2001/12/13/Macedonian-police-return-to-rebel-villages/28441008299379/. By the looks of things other editors are also fine for the result to be "Ceasefire", which I am inclied to agree with. Regards. Kluche (talk) 18:23, 11 August 2023 (UTC)
 * I was just about to mention that source. The return was definitely in December though. To be honest, I mistakenly assumed that the return was on 19th December based on the article's publication date. I'll correct this. StephenMacky1 (talk) 18:29, 11 August 2023 (UTC)

Questions
Hello all, I did a copy edit on this and I've got a few questions/concerns. Several of the commanders and units involved on both sides are missing citations. They are only mentioned in the infobox, so they either need to be cited there or ideally they are added to the main article text with citation.

The infobox should be either "X victory" or "inconclusive". Keeping it simple avoids bias. I am unclear if this is NLA victory as they retained territory for the time being, please feel free to correct.

Thanks! Annwfwn (talk) 21:05, 7 December 2023 (UTC)


 * If they're unsourced, they can be removed. The result is reasonable, despite the consensus about the result before. StephenMacky1 (talk) 23:16, 7 December 2023 (UTC)
 * Oh man, I just read the previous talk. Shame on me! Thanks for chiming in! Annwfwn (talk) 00:00, 8 December 2023 (UTC)