Talk:Battle of Pákozd

Untitled
Ummm...I don't know anything about this battle or I'd edit it myself, but "Austrian tyrants" is DEFINITELY not NPOV! John


 * Yeah, it was written from overtly pro-Hungarian point of view. I've cleaned up most of it, but it still needs more dates and facts rather than pontification. --Shallot 12:26, 10 Jun 2004 (UTC)

What I red about this battle is that Jelacic was halted by a message from Vienna.


 * We (User:Monkap and I) are translating the article now from HU:WP and these criticisms, five years later, probably no longer apply. We've tried to avoid, in this series of articles we're translating, the slight Hungarian bias that creeps in in HU:WP, more in wording (e.g. "the enemy") than in actual distortion of facts. Si Trew (talk) 08:24, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

Background politics immediately before the battle
I don't know wether reference to another wikipedia article counts as a valid reference, but I found a few interesting things in the Hungarian Wikipedia-article of the battle:

-First, the Hungarian government wanted to avoid any military confrontaion with the Habsburgs. The military had sworn both to the king of Hungary (emperor of Austria) and the Hungarian consitution. The only cause of attack was provided by the Hungarian refusal of the demands of ethnic minorities. The Austrian court saw an opportunity in that and started secret (financial and other) support of Croatian and Serbian forces.

-When Jellacic entered Hungary the situation became very complicated for the military officers of the Hungarian army. They had sworn to the king AND the Hungarian constitution. The court gave no direct orders to the officers. The Hungarian government named Archduke Stephen, Palatine of Hungary (member of the Habsburg family!) as the leader of the Hungarian forces. The archduke tried to meet Jellacic personally, but the ban didn't appear at the meeting. After that the archduke left Hungary (the government thought he escaped, but in reality he was ordered to Vienna by the court).

-The fact that Jellacic never showed an official document which supported that he acts to the order of the emperor (king) just increased confusion. The officers of the Hungarian army were undecided about what orders to follow and many escaped to the army of Jellacic (before the battle).

-At Pákozd basically former comrades of the same army stood on both sides as officers. As an illustration, two names from the Hungarian side: Joseph von Milpökh and Franz Holtsche - none of them ancient Hungarian names :)

-Also, the battle - though it was a smaller one - was considered a major success by the Hungarians, as they succeeded to force Jellacic's army out of the country (After asking for a ceasefire, the ban left to Austria leaving back his backup units which was later defeated by Hungarian insurgents).

Unfortunately all of the references for the above is only the Hungarian article about the battle, so I'm undecided if I should include it. The references at the end of the article are also Hungarian books, articles and links.

And to the present content of the article: all rights that the Hungary fought for was to be only for them and none more nation in the Empire It's true that the Hungarian government refused the idea of independent self-governments of the ethnic minorities but the above statement suggests that other improvements of the revolution (ie. liberating peasants, the central government elected by the people, ending the taxfree status of the nobilitys) were not to be applied to the ethnic inhabitants, which is not true. I suggest writing "...because the Hungarian government refused the ethnic minorities' demand for self-government". —Preceding unsigned comment added by Nyuzuge (talk • contribs) 00:04, 18 November 2007 (UTC)


 * We're translating the article from the Hungarian and this is now substantially changed. Hopefully it is NPOV. Some references are in English, but in the end, a reference is a reference. Si Trew (talk) 08:31, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

External links modified
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Orphaned references in Battle of Pákozd
I check pages listed in Category:Pages with incorrect ref formatting to try to fix reference errors. One of the things I do is look for content for orphaned references in wikilinked articles. I have found content for some of Battle of Pákozd's orphans, the problem is that I found more than one version. I can't determine which (if any) is correct for this article, so I am asking for a sentient editor to look it over and copy the correct ref content into this article.

Reference named "acta.bibl.u-szeged.hu": From Battle of Pered: Kemény, Krisztián: [http://acta.bibl.u-szeged.hu/57258/1/aetas_2018_003_037-068.pdf „Tüntetés” a fővezér ellen? Görgei Artúr, Asbóth Lajos és a II. hadtest tisztikarának nyilatkozata. 1849. június 22.] Aetas, 2018/3, pp. 64-66 From Battle of Zsigárd: Kemény, Krisztián: [http://acta.bibl.u-szeged.hu/57258/1/aetas_2018_003_037-068.pdf „Tüntetés” a fővezér ellen? Görgei Artúr, Asbóth Lajos és a II. hadtest tisztikarának nyilatkozata. 1849. június 22.] Aetas, 2018/3, pp. 67 

I apologize if any of the above are effectively identical; I am just a simple computer program, so I can't determine whether minor differences are significant or not. AnomieBOT ⚡ 17:54, 4 February 2023 (UTC)

A Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion
The following Wikimedia Commons file used on this page or its Wikidata item has been nominated for deletion: Participate in the deletion discussion at the. —Community Tech bot (talk) 17:23, 27 March 2023 (UTC)
 * Hungarian artillery in the battle of Pákozd by Imre Domonkos.jpg