Talk:Behzti

MY View
My wife saw the play and I read the play script. Quite frankly the writer is more suited to writing episodes of East Enders rather than Art. The play seems to highlight a major hang up she has, namely that in real life her own Black boyfriend was not accepted by the Sikh community. The charachters in the play seem to parallel that, and therefore any Sikh characters and institutions are characterised as narrow minded and by definition evil. Maybe Ms Bhatti should have researched Sikhism further (here are images of Afro-Carribean Sikhs http://farm1.static.flickr.com/95/244540778_9a1a1592c2.jpg?v=0 and http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/6702/blacksikhxn8.jpg) and note that there are a small but very active group of Afro Carribean Sikhs in America and Africa.

Her real target should have been the conservative nature of Punjabi society which is linked to the caste system (a Hindu ideal), which promotion the notion of Aryanism and racial purity. Sikhism is actually against the caste system and notions of racial purity.

I think the way the Sikh protests were conducted were wrong, by the same token it should be noted there were no journalists actually there at the actual protests. A few minor scuffles were described as a riot in the press. The Sikhs were in error. The Sikhs condemnation should have been aimed at criticising the actually shoddily written play and how the facts did not marry up with reality. The entire premise of the play should have been to criticise "Punjabiat" (to which the Sikh community would agree with), and not the faith itself which contained many key female figures. Up until recently the head of the Sik Institutions was a women.

So what am I saying? Care should be taken in writing this article. The events that made national news were exaggerated. The play itself was awful and poorly researched. The reaction by the "Artistic" fraternity was over the top. The reaction by the Sikh community was stupid. The whole sorry incident should be consigned the the dustbin of the past.--Sikh-history (talk) 16:03, 7 November 2008 (UTC)


 * The talk page is not for expressing your views. --KnowledgeHegemonyPart2 17:22, 15 November 2008 (UTC)
 * This article is not created in good faith. Firstly, it does not satisfy WP:Notability and NPOV. Secondly, it seems to have been written to portray the response of a few individual's (whose identity is not known) as the response of entire Sikh society. The death threats against Bhatti should be investigated as the identity of these so called "death threat issuers" is not known. The British Sikh Consultative Forum (BSCF) had already issued statement at the time telling these threats against Bhatti "have no endorsement from Sikh community". How reasonable is it then to make a sweeping generalization and allege that the "Sikhs" issued death threats? ...more absurd is to create an inflated article on wikipedia alleging on entire Sikh society. On philosophical notes, it should be noted that freedom of speech and responsibility come in the same package. When [Prince Harry] wore Nazi uniform in a costume party the UK media was outraged at this and included several news items criticizing Prince Harry; the prince came out with an apology later. Daily Star called Harry "fool in the crown" (news link) and the whole world joined to criticize Harry for his "ill-judgement" (news link20. Here is what "The Gaurdian" (newspaper which went onto printing several articles potraying Bhatti as a "Sikh playwright") wrote on Prince Harry's Nazi uniform episode. Its surprising to see to that how the same media is responding to similar issue related to the Sikhs. Regards, --Road Ahead  Discuss 01:00, 10 November 2008 (UTC)
 * This article does not satisfy WP:Notability and NPOV. We need an AfD on it.--Singh6 (talk) 01:45, 10 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Hi Singh6 could you please explain as to why you think the article is not notable and violates wiki npov policies, give cogent arguements and not just allegations. LegalEagle (talk) 02:34, 15 November 2008 (UTC)
 * Yes, it would help if all editors who felt that the article was POV or described something non-notable expanded on these points. I've tried to put some nuance into the article by citing at least one person who criticised the play, but as I'm not a Sikh I wouldn't be aware of as many points nor of the debate in the Sikh community. Autarch (talk) 22:44, 18 November 2008 (UTC)
 * I read an article that if a white person had written this play then the CRE would have got involved and probably used the full force of the law to get it closed down. --Sikh-history (talk) 15:41, 13 November 2008 (UTC)


 * Go ahead, it will survive AfD. Facts don't cease to exist because orthodox Sikhs ignore them. 59.164.105.254 (talk) 16:05, 10 November 2008 (UTC)


 * I don't understand the objection of wp:notability. This was covered in the UK press, discussed by leaders of the Sikh community in the press... clearly the community leaders in Birmingham thought it was quite noteworthy... just bad.  Bad plays can still be very notable.  Negative criticism of the play was not uniform, though there is no citation on the positive review, unfortunately, an it won't survive without one.- sinneed (talk) 16:38, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

Behzti Book
I heard a new book is out, whether it sees the light of day or will be forced to remain in perpetual giftwrap remains to be seen ? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Morbid Fairy (talk • contribs) 01:38, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

Sourcing.
There are a couple of sources not used here, that do appear in Sikh extremism. An interested editor might pull them into this article.

I have done a bit of flag work, copywork, and content work on this article today, and will drop a bit more content out unless it is cited soon.- sinneed (talk) 16:34, 6 June 2009 (UTC)

Cutting to talk for possible inclusion: unsourced "Secular debate" section.
Behzti served to re-ignite the debate as to what extent it is possible to reconcile respect for religious sensibilities and the preservation of freedom of speech in the increasingly secular societies of modern Europe. At the time, the UK government was proposing the Serious Organised Crime and Police Bill, which included controversial legislation outlawing the incitement of religious hatred.

Does this belong in the article at all? If someone thinks so, it should surely have sources that show the debate in wp:RS.- sinneed (talk) 19:20, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

In 2005 Behzti won the Susan Smith Blackburn Prize for the best play written by a woman in the English language.
Hahaha. This made me laugh. Is there a prize for am woman for writing a play in every other language too? You couldn't make it up. Only our luvvie community could come up with such an absurd prize.--Sikh-history (talk) 21:51, 9 June 2009 (UTC)


 * I encourage you to redact that, see wp:talk.- sinneed (talk) 23:19, 9 June 2009 (UTC)

Five years on
Someone might want to extract something from this 2010 article. Andy Mabbett ( Pigsonthewing ); Andy's talk; Andy's edits 15:39, 27 October 2011 (UTC)

Comment from community leader
'Mohan Singh, a local Sikh community leader, said...' There's no written source for this. I think it needs to go, unless someone can provide one. Regards to all. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 2.100.247.63 (talk) 18:32, 27 May 2014 (UTC)

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