Talk:Bell's palsy

Removed list to separate page
I have removed the list of famous people with Bell's palsy to a separate page, List of famous people with Bell's Palsy. It was becoming too much like a trivia section. I realise that this adds one page to everyone's watchlist, but it makes it easier on the people who only really have an interest in the medical or technical aspects, and should reduce the volume on this talk page. --Slashme (talk) 05:18, 21 July 2008 (UTC)

Scott Barkman - hoax and vandalism
Scott Barkman has been verified to have Bell's Palsy. However, his listing was incorrect. He is not American, and he is not a journalist. I have corrected this, and you may move him up and down the list as you wish. 71.210.118.54 23:33, 29 October 2007 (UTC)
 * I took Scott Barkman off the list because his wiki link was dead. Digging a little deeper reveals that this entry borders vandalism.  Quoting from a thread "Scott doesn't have Bell's Palsy, and if he did, he's not famous enough to justify being added to the wikipedia page for it" (http://boards.thewiire.com/lofiversion/index.php?t24779.html), i.e. a thread on the very organization that Scott supposedly is part of.   On 5 October 2007 wiki user [Agyle] in revision history said: "Removed Scott Barkman, for 6th or so time. He's not famous, and no reliable source corroborates he has the disease."  Let's keep it that way.
 * Wondering if the "Famous persons with Bell's palsy" section should go away all together as it is such a frequent target for vandalism. Power.corrupts (talk) 11:43, 8 March 2008 (UTC)


 * A new IP address is having fun adding Scott Barkman from the Wiire to the famous people section. Let me quote more extensively from the thread on the Wiire website mentioned above.
 * (1) First the petition: "Fellow Wiire fans, we must join together to keep Scott Barkman on the Bell's Palsy page of Wikipedia! Agyle, a member of Wikipedia, has been removing Scott's name despite the fact that fans have been putting it back on again and again. We must all work together to keep his name on Wikipedia." .. etc.
 * The first response: "This is lame and childish man. Don't bug Wikipedia with this nonsense .. " etc.
 * The second and last response, apparently from a forum moderator, who then closes the thread: "... if you want to have fun like this, use Uncyclopedia. To my knowledge, Scott doesn't have Bell's Palsy, and if he did, he's not famous enough to justify being added to the wikipedia page for it - even Matt Cassamassina isn't famous enough to get on a list of that nature. " ... etc.
 * - Conclusion: This is a lame joke. Adding Scott Barkman to the list is not in good faith and borders vandalism. Power.corrupts (talk) 13:53, 9 March 2008 (UTC)

Methylcobolamin
It has been reported that mega doses of methylcobolamin will cure 80-90% of patients. The North American medical community seems to dispute this however I could not find any data or studies to support the idea that B12 does not work. Micheal Jalaludin published a study in 1995 that showed excellent success with Methylcobolamin. Ref: reference

I think this information should be added to the artical.


 * I don't. The link referenced shows one study, that as near as I can tell was not p--Reddog6363 (talk) 21:24, 27 March 2011 (UTC)eer reviewed, from 10 years ago with no corroborating studies.  Also, slightly above that there is the claim, in a paper with no authors that  the same substance will help with (and I quote):
 * Bell's palsy, cancer, diabetic neuropathy, eye function, heart rate variability, HIV, homocysteinemia, male impotence, and sleep disorders.
 * I think these claims have little credibility. Wikibofh 22:05, August 23, 2005 (UTC)


 * I highly disagree with your position. B12 does have positive benefits in all of the areas claimed.  If you do your research you will find considerable support.  Furthermore, the North American Medical community has not done any studies that I can find to dispute the finding published in KL.  B12 theapy is inexpensive and perfectly safe.  If you for instance were to become afflicted with Bell's Palsy would you for instance choose to hide your head in the sand and pursue an ineffective treatment which Steroids clearly are because of politics in the medical community?   Have you any idea at all what it is like to have 1/2 of your face paralyised?  Would you not want to know about reported effective treatments because the study happens to have been done in Malaysia?


 * I happen to know for a fact that B12 makes a difference.  What I would like to see is a North American study and to conduct one is not expensive.  Since no-one at this point is comming forth with any studies that dispute the work done in Malaysia I have to assume the reasons are primarily political.  There are actually quite a number of areas where Asian medicine is ahead of Western medicine.   One of the HUGE areas is the anti cancer properties of many edible mushrooms.  In this area slowly the active ingrediants are being identified and registered as pharmacuticals.  Yet the Asians have known this for centuries.


 * This artical should reflect more than just a North American centric viewpoint!


 * All I'm asking for is peer reviewed citations. I don't see those.  As it turns out I think that "traditional" medicine probably does miss some things that "folk" medicine knows.  One prime example would be accupuncture.  I'm not convinced that this is a similar case, and without better documentation, I think it should be left out.  Claiming something helps with "cancer, HIV, diabetes" is so wide ranging as virtually eliminate its credibility.  Wikibofh 14:01, August 24, 2005 (UTC)


 * ...as do statements such as "I happen to know for a fact that ..."
 * However I see nothing wrong with adding Vit B-12 to the discussion of treatments that may help. Sfahey 02:03, 26 August 2005 (UTC)


 * I think we should work out any wording here first. I don't have a problem with something like "claims" but something like "proven" would be problematic.  Go ahead and draft up a section and we can hammer it out and put it in.  Wikibofh 02:41, August 26, 2005 (UTC)

Contagious
Is Bell's Palsy contagious? (-unsigned)


 * There are many causes of Bell's palsy. Some are infectious, but it's not contagious in the sense that contact with someone with Bell's palsy is going to expose you to a risk of "catching" it. - Nunh-huh 00:04, 1 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Is there no evidence that Bell's palsy is caused or worsened by exposure to a draught?

Clarification
It says that people will be left with deficits, I've had Bells Palsy for 8 Months now, and it isn't getting any better, was wondering, is it possible my mouth will never move right again? Or my eye will never stop watering on a regular basis? I can live with the other things, those are just the most annoying... Myzou 17:48, 28 November 2006 (UTC)

Synkinesis complication
I have added a short decription of a complication known as synkinesis. I have personal experience with the complication and I'm intrigued by the mechanism of imperfect regrowth. --Frank.hedlund 22:47, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Wording/style
This article has a "how-to" tone and style to it, especially when it continually urges its readers to "seek a doctor's consultation" and so-forth. I think it'd be best to rewrite parts of it to keep in line with other standard encyclopedia articles.

--Giacosilontana (talk) 03:57, 31 December 2007 (UTC)

Lifetime risk
One contributor has written that Bell's palsy affects approximately 1 person in 65 during a lifetime. I consider this to be correct. But at the http://www.bellspalsy.ws site, which is otherwise quite good, I came across a completely different number 1:5,000. Due to this discrepancy I have added a "citation needed".

Details: Personally, I would compute the lifetime risk like this. If p is the annual incidence rate, (1-p) is the annual "rate" of *not* having BP. If y is the average life span, (1-p)^y is the chance of not having it over a lifetime, the lifetime risk is therefore 1-(1-p)^y. It is only valid to multiply probabilities in this manner, if the individual probs are independent. They are not, because of familial, age-related, pregnancy (gender) related, recurrence etc, etc, but these effects are quite small compared to the overall uncertainty on the incidence rate of 15-50. For a first estimate, the above method would be reasonable. For p=20/100,000, y=75, the result is 0,0149, which is one person in 67. Fairly close to 1 in 65. I approached the website about a possible error there (http://forum.bellspalsy.ws/dc/dcboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=12&topic_id=270) but sadly received no useful answer. I have searched for books on epidemiology for methods on lifetime risk calculation, mostly in vain, but they do at times apply complex actuarial methods.

For the sake of precision I would appreciate if someone more knowledgeable in epidemiology than I confirm the estimate, or provide a citation. -- Frank.hedlund (talk) 23:40, 14 January 2008 (UTC)

I've had Bell's Palsy since I was a baby. I am now 38 years old and my face still has a slight droop to it, more prominent droop in my younger days. No amount of facial exercises helped, but I still do them. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 156.34.41.173 (talk) 12:57, 22 December 2011 (UTC)

Possible alternative treatment
I don't know if there are any available citations for this, but I've seen two anecdotal cases of my father and an older friend who ate canned peaches, of all things, and then their palsy rapidly went in to remission. I doubt there is much scientific evidence for this, but anecdotely, it has been very helpful. --71.76.39.125 (talk) 18:12, 30 January 2008 (UTC)


 * Interesting, but it definitely falls under the heading of "original research". --Slashme (talk) 08:24, 31 January 2008 (UTC)
 * That or coincidence. There's a reason why scientific medicine doesn't lend weight to anecdotal evidence.  It may provide guidance toward ideas and treatments, but it is not worth anything scientifically. --Puellanivis (talk) 04:31, 22 February 2009 (UTC)

(anecdotal) I was able to receive treatment for my bells palsy through acupuncture over the course of several treatments. I tried acupuncture because our family chiropractor practiced it and we trusted his work for results. I tried prescription pills at first like the doctors suggested but they did not cure the issue in the estimated time frame the doctor gave me. 71.195.10.228 (talk) 09:07, 27 August 2011 (UTC) Nathan

Reccurence of Bells Palsy?
I would like to see something about the likelihood of reccurence of BP. Do you have any information about this please?Amwlmc (talk) 14:53, 19 March 2008 (UTC)

Now suffering from my third droop of Bells Palsy...!! I can add that in my case/ cases it is due to wind or draft that has caused it on all occasions...

The first time I was young, caught outside in very cold weather with incorrect clothing. I suffered from headaches to earache over the following days which then led to paralysis of the right side of my face, taking 2.5 to 3 months to clear itself.

On the second occasion, a window had been broken in my car resulting in a draft across my right ear, symptoms were noticeable the following day and led to the paralysis. At this point whether I am more susceptible with having it previously I couldn't say, but I do not feel that it can be viral or re-occurring. Due to the length of time the first Palsy took to clear, on this occasion I tried acupuncture, it was Christmas and I was desperate for a straight smile.. within 5 sessions the palsy had gone, probably around 2 weeks in total.

I mention this as all I have read relating to acupuncture and Bells Palsy seems indifferent and yet from my own personal understanding, I made a significant early recovery.

I unfortunately fell asleep in a draft just as the Autumn weather arrived, a cold draft on my right ear on wednesday night, by the following day I had a bad headache, toothache and with this a dull ear ache deep in the centre of my ear. Over the course of Saturday and Sunday I could then feel the knot of ache travel slightly up and then down the right hand side of my face, stopping at around shoulder level. By Monday morning paralysis had set in on tuesday, today, the right side is completely paralised apart from my eyelid which closes but without completely sealing the eye

I am due for treatment at the herbal clinic on Friday as that is the earliest they can see me. I will update to let you know, hopefully, how much quicker it clears with acupuncture..

It does seem uncanny though that the Chinese have a strong viewpoint on this and also an understanding how to treat it... Even their description is more aligned to the causes and their understanding of Bells Palsy, in my case, very fortunate. Just because we cannot explain something by our modern methods and reasoning, it does not give us the right to negate others credible answers and practices... —Preceding unsigned comment added by 77.99.195.98 (talk) 14:16, 1 September 2009 (UTC)

My first Ball's Palsy occurrence happened when I was 19, my second when I was 23. The odd thing was, I had total paralysis of the left side of my face the first time, and then the right side my second. I've never heard of it switching sides upon it's resurfacing. I talked to a few people who've had experience with the condition (either directly or by association) and no one seemed to be able to reference another case like mine. I was just wondering if anyone had any examples or even stories of this. It kind of worried me, although I made a pretty much complete recovery each time(without the aid of medication or steroids), I still was slightly disturbed since I couldn't find any other cases of both half and half Bell's Palsy, separated by years. Thanks. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.79.112.98 (talk) 03:26, 30 November 2009 (UTC)

Edits by User:Quod erat demonstrandum 3.14159 on recovery in lede
For the second time I delete this users contribution in the lede: ''Symptoms typically subside after 2-6 days and full facial function is usually returned within 2-3 weeks. Although rare, residual paralysis or dysfunction is possible and chances of this increase with age''. How did you cite your contribution from the 1966 reference? - the text from that refers specifically to imcomplete palsies. Please be specific, if you insist that the text should be retained.

Alternatively, I refer to National Institute of Neurological Disorders and Stroke's Information sheet on Bell's Palsy: With or without treatment, most individuals begin to get better within 2 weeks after the initial onset of symptoms and recover completely within 3 to 6 months. This timescale is months, not weeks. The Bell's palsy infosite likewise reads: An "average" recovery is likely to take between a few weeks and a few months. Depending on how you interpret "usually" I really see little support for your optimistic assestation that "full facial function is usually returned within 2-3 weeks", and certainly not in your quote. (To follow up on your other comment: I had not noticed the Popeye text, I would have deleted it if I had). best regards, Power.corrupts (talk) 22:35, 1 February 2009 (UTC)


 * I now realize that you may have meant the the 1982 reference the text there reads: For 85 percent of patients the first signs of remission were observed within three weeks after the outbreak; for the last 15 percent remission occurred three to six months later. This specifically refers to "the first signs of remission", my comments above still holds. Power.corrupts (talk) 22:54, 1 February 2009 (UTC)


 * That's fine you can revert it. When I had it, the doctor told me that prominent symptoms should peak and begin to subside in that amount of time, and this was the case with me; it peaked within 3 days of the first signs and symptoms.  Granted I was on the younger spectrum of patients, but this prognosis was based on more recent research, as I had it just 3 years ago.  However, I cannot find the appropriate literature at the moment, so it can be reverted.  I apologize that I did not assume good faith initially.Quod erat demonstrandum 3.14159 (talk) 06:40, 19 February 2009 (UTC)

Alternative medicine
Should this subheading be here? Having a fairly sensible article veer off into magical "vital energy" stuff seems wrong. It feels wildly out of place.
 * The fact that alternate medicine works is worth thinking about. I have been looking for proof the condition is NOT psychogenic, and I have drawn a blank.  All modern research cautions that results are "promising," but there is still no neurological test for Bell's Palsy. Neurological tests can only rule out physcial causes such as tumors or brain injury, but no neurological test can come out positive for Bell's Palsy.


 * http://kidshealth.org/teen/diseases_conditions/brain_nervous/bells_palsy.html# 71.107.88.57
 * Incidentally, one of wikipedia's editors has solemnly informed me that a psychogenic explanation for bell's palsy is at odds with years of "robust research." I looked up the meaning of robust research in regard to science, and this is what I came up with:  "▸ adjective:  strong enough to withstand intellectual challenge ("The experiment yielded robust results")."  I would like to know what research can be so certain and yet still allow Bell's Palsy to keep the synonym of "idiopathic facial paralysis."
 * Snud (talk) 06:39, 9 December 2010 (UTC)

Popular Media Reference
haha, it was mentioned in the new movie, A-Team, at the beginning of the FOB Iraq scene (min 19:25) Avkrules (talk) 15:16, 17 July 2010 (UTC)

Psychoanalysis
Is the subject of psychoanalysis forbidden in connection with Bell's Palsy? Is there any scientific evidence that it is NOT psychogenic? Snud (talk) 18:08, 7 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Hi Snud. I reverted your edits because they were not about improving the article and thus violated talk guidelines. The prevailing viewpoint from what I gather is that it is physiological and triggered by a virus. You need a reference saying that it is psychological, your personal viewpoints are original research, which is not allowed in articles. Personally I think your theory that I reverted, is misguided. You are welcome to continue the discussion if you can provide recent high quality medical sources for discussion.-- Literature geek |  T@1k?  19:22, 7 December 2010 (UTC


 * I found something interesting in an online book for you.Page 196 on might peak your interest in psychogenic facial paralysis:  http://books.google.com/books?id=hyMSAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA196&lpg=PA196&dq=hysterical+facial+paralysis&source=bl&ots=Zh9I1AeWuf&sig=3qmgNdmoKL1YbTP5NmCjuHdKnps&hl=en&ei=eh__TMrsMISosQOgs7WvCw&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=10&ved=0CC4Q6AEwCQ#v=onepage&q=hysterical%20facial%20paralysis&f=false


 * Anyway, your rigorous criteria should be applied to a neurological interpretation of the paralysis. There have never been any positive tests for Bell's palsy. The neurologist can only rule out things that can be tested for.  http://kidshealth.org/teen/diseases_conditions/brain_nervous/bells_palsy.html#Snud (talk) 06:08, 8 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I can't read the first book, no access to it. Are they talking about Bell's Palsey though? Acute anxiety can cause facial muscles to contract, which I guess might be what they are talking about; if they are not talking about Bell's Palsy then you are misusing references in in good faith. The 2nd reference says that it is caused by a viral infection, or more specifically the immune system's reaction to the virus which leads to the inflamation of the nerve endings. It seems that you don't agree with the mainstream medical viewpoint and where the evidence points to with regard to this disorder. You are welcome to express your views on a blog or personal website but wikipedia gives most weight to the dominant published scholarly views of experts on a given subject matter. Wikipedia is not the place for novel theories by individual editors.-- Literature geek  |  T@1k?  00:10, 9 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I have sent you a welcome message with links to how wikipedia works. The rules and guidelines are not my rules and guidelines but what wikipedia as a community has determined through consensus to be best pract:ice. Hopefully it will help you during your time on wikipedia and to understand how wikipedia works. :)-- Literature geek |  T@1k?  00:15, 9 December 2010 (UTC)


 * Let me point out that the term "idiopathic facial paralysis" is a medical synonym for Bell's palsy. Idiopathic means "unknown cause."  A viral etiology is an iffy theoretical construct at best. As for your objection that there is a difference between Bell's palsy and "psychogenic facial paralysis," there are no physical tests for either.  Don't forget the second link I provided you with which states *there are no biological tests for Bell's Palsy.*  In other words, neurologists have no proof it exists separately from conversion disorder. What I have been trying to present here is not a "novel theory."  It is not original research, and it is not my idea.  I would have never thought of it in a hundred years.  It was Freud's discovery. I can refer you to books, but I am trying to convince you to open a public discussion of this right now, so I am stuck with giving you internet links.  It is hard to find internet sources for it because it is strictly medical. And, as Freud said, good medicine is often dangerous, as a scalpel must be sharp in order to be efffective. The stuff they put out for the public is pablum, like entries in a medical dictionary.  I will try to find another source to make it easy on you, but the best I can find so far are forbidden to the public.  You might be able to subscribe to these, considering Wikipedia could be classified as a a professional journal though:


 * http://www.p-e-p.org/
 * ftp://ftp.lutecium.org/pub/Freud/pdf/freud_abstracts_of_standard_edition.pdf


 * Just search for "facial paralysis" or Bell's Palsy.Snud (talk) 04:09, 9 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Ok, but that link is documenting the theology of Freud, from the year 1893, this is the year 2010. Wikipedia articles in general should be using high quality reviews of research which is no older than 5 years when possible. As I explained in my first post to you, article talk pages are not for discussing the subject matter but rather for discussing the article with regard to improving it. Wikipedia is not a forum or blog to hold debates, you are in the wrong venue.-- Literature geek |  T@1k?  17:37, 9 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I finally found something under "facial hemipareisis."http://www.psychosomaticmedicine.org/cgi/content/abstract/15/5/405. Now can the subject be opened on your webpage.  The fact that you choose the term Freudian "theology" indicates bias, btw.  Psychoanalysis is a pretty strange religion though, considering Freud considered faith to be a sin and skepticism a virtue.  He said that theory is fine, just so long as one is ready to abandon it with no regret in light of evidence.  So, will you kindly allow a religion opposed to your own have a say in this?  The above study uses experiments to validate the psychogenic nature of Bell's palsy.Snud (talk) 18:12, 9 December 2010 (UTC)
 * You deleted large blocks of text which I reverted, where I explained that you are misusing wikipedia as a debating forum. It seems that you are becoming a disruptive editor who is insistant on having a debate about quack theories, despite having the rules and guidelines of wikipedia politely pointed out to you several times. Your latest reference does not mention Bell's Palsy. Lol, when I used the word theology, I was not thinking of religion, it is just my style to choose, different than usual wording when in conversation. Anyway, the evidence is clear, corticosteroids alleviate Bell's Palsy, corticosteroids, reduce inflamation due to the immune system, this has been demonstrated in well conducted placebo controlled clinical trials. Trying to undo robust medical research by replacing it with dubious theories from the 19th centuary is not going to happen and finally wikipedia is NOT a debating forum.-- Literature geek |  T@1k?  19:15, 9 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I did not mean to remove your instructions. I was just cleaning up what I considered my own stuff, and I didn't want to make your words unintelligible.  I am being peaceable.  Please just provide a small section for the possiblity that unilateral facial palsy (hemiparesis)might be psychogenic in some cases...Snud (talk) 19:27, 9 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Sorry for assuming bad faith, I just got frustrated, I accept your removal was done with good intentions. If you can find a recent reliable secondary source, per WP:MEDRS, that specifically mentions Bell's Palsy, and discusses some cases being psychosomatic in origin, you are welcome to add a small mention to the article, per WP:WEIGHT. :)-- Literature geek |  T@1k?  19:36, 9 December 2010 (UTC)

(undent) Wikipedia is based on high quality review articles. If one can be found discussing this then we may include it. Otherwise this may be more appropriate on the page about Freud and his theories. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 20:02, 9 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I am replying to both Doc and Geek in this edit because the page is running out of indentable space. First, the contention that recent medical research has demonstrated a biological cause for Bell's palsy with the use of corticosteroids is a bit of an exaggeration.  The experimenters have concluded the 4 percent improvement is not enough to be conclusive:http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15495021 and this is from people who really wanted to prove a point.


 * Also, I have been challenged to find an on-line article that demonstrates Bell's palsy is psychogenic. I did that, but it was rejected because the term "Bell's Palsy" was not used.  I would like to point out that neurologists never use the term "hysterical" and psychoanalysts never use the term "idopathic" or "functional." And yet the conditions described by those terms are exactly the same.  Likewise, psychoanalysts do not use the word "Bell's Palsy."  That is a neurological term, and it begs the question.  The assumption is that if something is called Bell's palsy, it has a biological origin.  That, however, misrepresents the situation which is this:  There is no proof that there is a physical cause for untestable facial paralysis. The neurologists assume there is, and the psychoanalysts assume there is not.  Both sides need to be presented.  I would like to respectfully suggest you contact a psychoanalyst for his or her input.  I'm strictly amateur.


 * Finally, I would like to point out that psychoanalysis isn't worthy of the scorn you are showing for it. In order to even be admitted to a psychoanalytic institute, a candidate must either be a physician already or have a Ph.D and must demonstrate he or she has contributed significantly to his field of learning.  After being admitted, the curriculum lasts five to twelve years.  These are not stupid people, and if any of them reads your comment about theology or quackery, it will make you look like a person who does not like peace.  Snud (talk) 19:15, 10 December 2010 (UTC)


 * Q Why are we using a 2004 Cochrane review when we have a 2010 Cochrane review http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20238317 ? A review article is all that I request regarding psychoanalysis. If psychoanalysts do not us the term "Bells palsy" what do they call it? Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 19:31, 10 December 2010 (UTC)


 * I'm sorry. I didn't notice the later study.  Even so, the treatment is superficial. The cure is temporary in chronic cases.  Furthermore, corticosteroids are used for treating anxiety symptoms as well as inflammation, so the study can also be used to validate the theory that Bell's palsy is psychogenic: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corticosteroid . Regarding the psychoanalytic nominclature, it's "hysterical facial hemi-paresis."  It's a form of "conversion disorder."  Btw, isn't this a "review article:" :::http://www.psychosomaticmedicine.org/cgi/content/abstract/15/5/405.  If not, I think I'm stuck with books.
 * the interesting thing about this study is that it validates classic Freudian theory. If a migraine is removed by suggestion, the symptom is replaced by facial hemiparesis. In other words, symbolically hitting oneself on the head is replaced by symbolically slapping oneself in the face.Snud (talk) 21:15, 10 December 2010 (UTC)
 * Its a 1953 paper. Please something in the last 10 years. This may be suitable in a section on history but would not support current thought. Conversion disorders are prevalent and well discussed. Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 21:22, 10 December 2010 (UTC)
 * There is this paper but it is not a review article and is still a little old. Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 21:29, 10 December 2010 (UTC)


 * LOL! The text of the paper is hidden, just like articles on psychoanalysis!  It must be quite a revelation. I think these guys must be like literate druid priests, trying to protect the innocent by keeping us ignorant.  Maybe there is a fundamental need for Yahoo Answers after all!  Like Socrates said, an unexamined life is not worth livingSnud (talk) 02:13, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
 * You have lost me... Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 02:48, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

I found something else that might qualify: http://www.bu.edu/lab/Publications/Tanaka_Albert_2007.pdf It says a guy suffering from hysterical hemiparesis has hysterical facial "paresthenia." It was obviously psychogenic, and if things like this happen, it would just be common sense to assume that severe cases would produce loss of muscle control or even complete paralysis of the face. Then how could one distinguish it from "idopathic facial paralysis?" Snud (talk) 07:56, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
 * I read the paper, and it is a case report series, not the best quality source. Anyway, it is actually case reports of people who had genuine neurological conditions which were wrongly dismissed as psychogenic in origin. The paper used the phrase pseudohysterical,,,, i.e. appeared to be psychogenic but were not. So the paper is actually arguing and raising awareness of the problem of pyschoanalysis leading to misdiagnosis by health professionals and argues for more indepth testing beyond a simple MRI, such as employing PET scans for such cases. I think that you have misinterpreted the source.-- Literature geek |  T@1k?  08:29, 11 December 2010 (UTC)
 * You are right, and I am embarrassed! I got too excited when I saw th title of the article.  Like I said before, studies about hysteria are hidden from the hoi-polloi.  Conversion is treated like something dirty and ignoble by society, in spite of Freud's insistence that all humans are necessarily neurotic to some degree as the wages of living in civilization.  Anyway, I am going to ask Dr. James to use his privilege as a physician to check his local medical library.  They have access to the PEP web and there he will find loads of information denied to the likes of you and me.Snud (talk) 19:14, 11 December 2010 (UTC)

Here are two studies that I think fit the requirement of being current and specify hysterical facial paralysis:

The first one actually uses the term "functional facial paralysis," and I think everyone agrees that "functional" is a synonym for "idiopathic," and "idiopathic facial paralysis" is Wikipedia's own synonym for "Bell's Palsy." http://jcbp.psychotherapy.ro/vol5no2/cognitive-behavioral-therapy-in-the-case-of-a-teenager-with-conversion-disorder-with-mixed-presentation-2/.

This one cited references from 1987 to 2003.

The other study was made in 1996: http://www.sciencedirect.com/science?_ob=ArticleURL&_udi=B6WGW-4JW1HGD-7&_user=10&_coverDate=04%2F30%2F1996&_rdoc=1&_fmt=high&_orig=search&_origin=search&_sort=d&_docanchor=&view=c&_searchStrId=1579285052&_rerunOrigin=google&_acct=C000050221&_version=1&_urlVersion=0&_userid=10&md5=5a474634eed634784e980a210f924aee&searchtype=a

It is a good one because it mentions that the hysterical facial paralysis was triggered by a physical trauma. This is typical of all conversion disorder. In the case of Bell's palsy, Freud said the initial trauma was a slap to the face at some period in ones life. Any subsequent facial trauma, no matter how slight--even a toothache for instance--is apt to trigger the paralysis.

Then again there is this one: http://www.psychosomaticmedicine.org/cgi/content/abstract/15/5/405 Although it was made in 1953, researchers were still citing it in 1975.

Then we have the article found by Doc James. All in all, I think this information warrants mention in the main article. Snud (talk) 18:44, 14 December 2010 (UTC)

photograph
The photograph caption states the palsy is on the person's left but the left side is wrinkled, nostril is flared and smile is visible. I think the palsy is on the peron's RIGHT side where there is absence of wrinkling of the forehead ( indicating LMN paralysis) and no smile Reddog6363 (talk) 21:24, 27 March 2011 (UTC)


 * This person is "attempting" to show his teeth. It is an example of Bell's palsy as paresis or *partial* paralysis.  This is a case of what psychoanalysis calls "hysterical hemiparesis."  See the above section on psychoanalysis.Snud (talk) 00:11, 7 April 2011 (UTC)

Idiopathic facial paralysis
"Bell's palsy, or idiopathic facial paralysis,[1] is a form of facial paralysis resulting from dysfunction cranial nerve VII (the facial nerve) that results in the inability to control facial muscles on the affected side." This is the opening line for the article. I believe that the person who added this, including the reference, may not understand what the term "idiopathic" means. It means there is no known cause. Bell's palsy, however, can have a known cause in some cases. The reference has "(idiopathic facial paralysis)" in the title because it refers to only Bell's palsy cases that are idiopathic. It does not mean the disease itself is idiopathic. Because of this, I am removing this mistake from the first line. Please edit the rest of the article to reflect this fact. - Cyborg Ninja  03:02, 15 July 2011 (UTC)
 * That is a bit of a conceit I think! Which particular cases of Bell's Palsy have been confirmed by a test of any cranial nerve?Snud (talk) 06:46, 15 January 2012 (UTC)
 * Simply put we need review articles to support text per WP:MEDRS. Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 07:39, 15 January 2012 (UTC)

First footnote, for bilateral palsy, is ad copy for a commercial site devoted to selling a 200-page eBook through Paypal.
First footnote, for bilateral palsy, is ad copy for a commercial site devoted to selling a 200-page eBook through Paypal.

Replace with noncommercial


 * ("Bilateral facial paralysis is a rare condition ... ")

and / or

PMC article http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1924702/
 * ("Bilateral simultaneous facial nerve palsy is an extremely rare clinical entity with Bell's palsy responsible for a mere 20 per cent of cases. It is, therefore, important that clinicians are aware of the differential diagnosis when evaluating a case."

If the 200 page book is any good, can be cited at the bottom of the article as a paid external source. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Ocdnctx (talk • contribs) 23:16, 21 August 2012 (UTC)

The book is excellent, extremely comprehensive and has helped over 1000 sufferers. The site itself is not "devoted" to selling an Ebook, but is a free site with good information for Bell's palsy sufferers. Most books are given away free. The couple that are purchased each month help to pay for hosting. One of the site's main benefits is that they can email for advice (particularly important for the intial scary stages of the illness) and for ongoing encouragement when the longevity of the condition becomes rather depressing. I was the contributor to initially include the statement about it being possible to occur bilaterally. I suffered bilateral Bell's palsy over 6 years ago and studied the research intensively before offering the guide. There is absolutely no pseudoscience included in the guide at all (there is even a chapter devoted to warning against pseudoscientific claims and scam (usually herbal) websites). It is just sound and helpful advice throughout. If that is all acceptable, I would like to accept the offer of a link at the bottom of the article as an external source. I shall do that now and hope that the above explains why and can be accomodated. If a contributor feels the need to class the link as a "paid" external source, then so be it, but I hope after reading the above, this will be rightfully deemed unnecessary. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Bobbytheberean (talk • contribs) 00:53, 18 October 2012 (UTC)
 * No consensus to add it. Contravenes WP:ELNO . Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) (if I write on your page reply on mine) 17:55, 28 October 2012 (UTC)

Antivirals
In meta-analysis, antivirals are ineffective irrespective of the severity of the palsy. 10.1016/j.amjmed.2014.11.033 JFW &#124; T@lk  17:24, 21 May 2015 (UTC)
 * Added Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 22:46, 21 May 2015 (UTC)

"a frigore palsy"
I am not seeing any English source that states or uses this as a synonym? Therefore moved here for discussion. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 07:36, 23 January 2016 (UTC)

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Moved
Need page numbers

"Other visual symptoms also include a distortion of the shape of regular facial expressions, such as smiling, frowning, etc., and even drooling. Because of these atypical appearances and actions that occur, Bell's Palsy has also been shown to have a large psychological effect on those who are afflicted.  Often times, victims avoid social settings and remain in the comfort of solitude due to the negative impact it has on one's self-esteem and self-confidence. "

Also why all the caps and this was already partly said above. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 18:11, 29 November 2016 (UTC)

Images
User:Benjaminginterr can you explain how these images were acquired? Best Doc James  (talk · contribs · email) 19:41, 12 March 2018 (UTC)

Same
1–4 per 10,000 is the same as 11 to 40 per 100,000 The change is thus not needed. One can paraphrase the source. Doc James (talk · contribs · email) 01:27, 31 January 2019 (UTC)