Talk:Ben Wa balls

Link check request
can someone check the link for goodvibe. it is not working
 * lol I wonder why that guy didnt sign? I dont think I will coz im paranoid
 * There's still logged IPs... About the article: there's no estimation when they were invented? Were they historically used exlusively by courtesans or prostitutes or did wives also use them? Were they for pleasure or medical conditions (ref: bladder control)? And as I seem to be a clueless female: how could they be used to enlarge penis size? --Sumiko 23:41, 14 November 2006 (UTC)

Everything You Always Wanted to Know about Sex: But Were Afraid to Ask By David R. Reuben

By David R. Reuben Published 1971 Bantam Books 433 pages ISBN:0553104365

67.166.123.190 (talk) 19:27, 9 May 2008 (UTC) N Coppin

Re-writing
The section describing use in lesbian sex should probably use more appropriate (less "slangy") language

The accuracy of this article should be checked against reputable sources. It should be noted that they are the same as Baoding Balls which were originally created to help medical hand and wrist problems such as arthritis or carpal tunnel syndrome. The accurate history is in the Baoding Balls section of Wiki. The information here is western mythology perpetuating racist stereotyping of asian culture as exotic and sexual.DFZ (talk) 12:49, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Ben-Wa in Everything you Always...
To clear things up... This is page 201 of the paperback edition of Everything You Always Wanted to Know About Sex* (*But Were Afraid to Ask). It has no ISBN, as it was printed in July 1970, as far as I can tell. Any typos are mine.

What's a ben-wa?

Japanese automated masturbation. Hundreds of years ago, clever Japanese women, possibly driven by desperation, developed a technique for masturbating that to this day remains unexcelled. When a Japanese lady wants to relieve her sexual tensions she reaches into a little plus-lined case and takes out two small, shiny metal balls. Though they may vary in size according to the effect desired, in the average ben-wa set, each ball is about the size of an apricot. Expensive sets are made of silver or even gold--the everyday variety is polished steel and these days, of course, plastic. One ball is hollow, the other is partially filled with mercury. The empty ball is inserted well into the vagina, the globe with mercury follows. The woman then lies down, or better yet, rocks in a chair. As she gently rolls her hips, the mercury slides back and forth in the other ball, constantly nudging the inner ball against the cervix. The vibrations are transmitted outward to the entire vagina, clitoris, labia, and inward to the uterus itself. Sometimes Japanese women continue these languid movements for hours, drifting from one orgasm to another.

--Ich (talk) 06:52, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

Yet another example of racism through sexualization of asian cultures. This piece is out of disreputable sources and directly contradicts the claims in the article. —Preceding unsigned comment added by DFZ (talk • contribs) 12:48, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Care to source this information that was removed? Unfounded claims of racism in the actual article are going to be seen as vandal edits. Can you show anywhere that this was used in treatment for wrist injuries as you stated? Wildthing61476 (talk) 12:58, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Compare them to the baoding balls. They are the same. If you do a google search you will notice only american marketers selling them as sex balls. If you search for baoding balls, chinese marketers sell them as medical balls. A quick google search has this history and if you read the following discussion, people do notice this. http://surveycentral.org/survey/26402.html. Of course, better sources will be needed, but I do not have the time right now to find them. As for the racism part, read the article on Stereotypes of East and Southeast Asians in the United States. Go look at the hypersexualization of asian women. DFZ (talk) 13:05, 27 March 2008 (UTC)


 * These are not the same thing however. Nowhere in the Baoding Balls article does it make any mention of this, and I'd add that the link you sent is to a Survey site and it no way a reliable source to verify this. The information you've placed in the article also violation the NPOV policy with the claims of racism by the editors of this article. I am removing this unsourced, unverified, POV edit and would suggest dispute resolution as a way of sorting this out. Wildthing61476 (talk) 13:18, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

Of course it's not a reliable source. I said it wasn't a reliable source and a better one needs to be found. At the very least it should be written that they should not be confused with the baoding balls, which they often are. Also, the sources in the article are hardly reputable themselves. DFZ (talk) 13:30, 27 March 2008 (UTC)


 * That last edit works a lot better, I just moved the location of the edit to make it easier to read. Wildthing61476 (talk) 13:37, 27 March 2008 (UTC)
 * With respect, Dfz, if yu think the source is bad, find one that contraverts it and bring it here (simply inserting it isn't going to help keep it in place until you explain why its a better source). I tend to think that the above source is incredibly unsourced, and since the Japanese aren't particularly as restrained as Westerners when it comes to ideas about sex (no Pilgrim guilt), there should be a fair amount of material to be found. - Arcayne   (cast a spell)  18:36, 27 March 2008 (UTC)

First, my initial issue with this article was that it is entirely based on disreputable sources that violate Wikipedia's policies for publication. See Verifiability. The sources cited are from sites such as self-published sex shop marketing schemes and a youtube video. Second, it's impossible to find sources to argue against something made up in an illegitimate source. For instance, if someone self-publishes a website claiming that ancient Europeans used to masturbate using sticks, there is no way that someone would be able to find a legitimate source to disprove that. Even if it spread and lots of people started saying it, it does not make it any more true (e.g. urban legends). Third, unless you can find a legitimate source to support your claim that "the Japanese aren't particularly as restrained as Westerners...", then that statement is simply another bad stereotype; once again supporting Stereotypes of East and Southeast Asians in the United States. Furthermore, one can hardly argue that the vast majority of Westerners are still under the power of "Pilgrim guilt." Fourth, I was pointing out that the above contention that the ben wa balls originated in Japan directly contradicted the article which claimed that the ben wa balls originated in China. Once again, a problem of everyone using illegitimate sources. Finally, unless someone can come up with a legitimate source to show that ben wa balls did originate in China, Japan, or wherever it might be, it's best not to have it in the article at all because readers will absorb the false information which will (1) lead to confusion since baoding medical balls are often mistakenly perceived to be/sold/used as ben wa balls and (2) support offensive negative stereotypes of "exotic, hypersexual orientals."DFZ (talk) 04:55, 28 March 2008 (UTC)

I read the "Everything you always wanted to know..." book in college, and then later lived in Japan for ten years. What I learned is that no one in Japan had ever heard of the word "ben-wa". In fact, "ben wa?" in Japanese sounds like "How's your excrement?" Not a very sexually stimulating comment (at least not for most people). This is like Chinese fortune cookies, Benihana restaurants, and Mongolian BBQ, things that Americans made up about Asia, but don't exist in Asia itself. I think it would be good for the article to reference this aspect of the term "ben wa balls", and perhaps find the real history of the term, if it can be found. --Westwind273 (talk) 05:27, 16 February 2013 (UTC)

Removal of Confusion sections and links to commercial sites that sells them
These sections are nothing but spam and should be removed for that purposes. JasonHockeyGuy (talk) 14:46, 13 August 2008 (UTC)

The IP ending in 116 was my edit - I simply forgot to login. (Hate how cookies work)JasonHockeyGuy (talk) 02:40, 14 August 2008 (UTC)

Marked as Spam
Because according to a google search I did, theres no real references that can qualify as reliable or backup the claims of other users that used this item.

Valuable citations can be taken from Havelock Ellis's discussion of "rin-no-tama" balls beginning on page 168 in "The evolution of modesty, the phenomena of sexual periodicity, auto-erotism (1910)" https://archive.org/details/cu31924013991686 — Preceding unsigned comment added by Jatlast (talk • contribs) 15:12, 23 January 2014 (UTC)

Maybe if we found something later, it would be encyclopedic.

Maybe we need to offer information about it in the Sex Toy article and not create an article about Ben Wa Balls itself. JasonHockeyGuy (talk) 09:46, 28 August 2008 (UTC)
 * There are two non-internet sources listed in the article--the Tannahill book and the Reuben book. WP:RS doesn't mean internet or nothing. Movingboxes (talk) 09:50, 28 August 2008 (UTC)

Thanks Movingboxes, BTW I didnt place the advert tag. How would i go about getting the article into a re-review of its content? Seems most of my edits removed the spam but cant be too sure. JasonHockeyGuy (talk) 09:56, 28 August 2008 (UTC)
 * I'm not quite sure what you mean--do you mean an official review of the content, because I don't really think that is necessary. It looks like all the spam is gone (I'm still checking through it).  The main problem with researching this article on the internet is that sex is so commercialized online--anything valid is going to get buried in the spam.  I got several Google book results that looked promising, but I couldn't get a look at the book.  I'm going to the library on Friday--can we agree to wait and see what I can find in print?  I'll add whatever I find Friday-Sunday.  I understand it is hard to wait when you're looking at a not-good article, but I really do think this is an encyclopedic subject buried in a wall of internet spam. Movingboxes (talk) 10:01, 28 August 2008 (UTC)

Oh I can wait :) Youre right about the subject though, its one of those more hidden things buried in spam :)

Some things I do know about it. A disambiguation could be in place because theres a song by Blink 182 called Ben Wah Balls (http://www.mtv.com/lyrics/blink_182/ben_wah_balls/232377/lyrics.jhtml)

Also theres an entry on the Urban Dictionary Site:

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=ben+wah+balls JasonHockeyGuy (talk) 17:33, 28 August 2008 (UTC)


 * someone has to add the blink-182 reference from their album Cheshire cat, track 14 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cheshire_Cat_(album) —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.78.36.15 (talk) 04:45, 24 April 2009 (UTC)

Merge proposal
Since most of what applies here can also be applied to anal beads and vice versa I propose that everything be moved over there and to consolidate any resources there to support both. There's really no need for duplication when both are often used interchangeably in practice. Maybe both should be merged into a more general beads article. Biofase flame | stalk 15:08, 8 July 2009 (UTC)

Tighten = reduce elasticity?
The change at 22:34, 22 September 2009 by 140.103.194.159 changed
 * They are also used in the postnatal period, in order to tighten the vagina again.

to
 * They are also used in the postnatal period, in order to reduce the elasticity of the vagina.

Was this a good change? "Tighten" implies improving muscle strength, which seems to be a feature of youth, while "reduce the elasticity" implies an aging process. Even if "tighten the vagina again" is not the most elegant way of describing it, "reduce the elasticity of the vagina" isn't particularly elegant either.

Meaning of "Ben Wa"?
What language is the name "Ben Wa" taken from, and what is it supposed to mean? Phonemically it sounds like Mandarin, but it does not seem to mean anything (at least, not that I can puzzle out).118.165.205.90 (talk) 10:08, 1 September 2010 (UTC)
 * Yeah, how dare Wikipedia not give the origin of the words! Jidanni (talk) 00:22, 12 July 2012 (UTC)
 * Please look it up and report back what you can find in reliable sources so it can be added to the article. DMacks (talk) 01:44, 12 July 2012 (UTC)
 * ☻ Jidanni (talk) 14:15, 12 July 2012 (UTC)
 * I don't think the etymology has been established. Maybe someone just invented the name. Ben Wa certainly doesn't mean anything in Mandarin, as the first user suspected. 98.115.255.240 (talk) 21:16, 22 November 2023 (UTC)

Ralph Fitch
At the end of the sixteenth century, Ralph Fitch, an English traveller, encountered them in the Shan States of Myanmar. He described their use there by men. Less than a dozen years later, the Florentine merchant Francesco Carletti also reported their use in Thailand, where they were used to enlarge the penis.
 * Removed as irrelevant. This regards the Fitch reference to "men weare bunches or little round balles in their privy members" ; it's a different practice, subcutaneous penis inserts, not Ben Wa balls held (removably) in an orifice. Gordonofcartoon (talk) 17:39, 24 March 2014 (UTC)

Pic of muscles involved in Kegel exercise
The first illustration is of muscles involved in a Kegel exercise. However, Ben Wa balls appear to be related to Kegel only superficially. My suggestion would be to remove this picture. Викидим (talk) 00:26, 25 October 2023 (UTC)


 * No objections for a month, removed. Викидим (talk) 23:06, 22 November 2023 (UTC)