Talk:Bend, Oregon/Archive 1

Copy and paste
The paragraphs added by 208.5.145.146 are a copy/paste job from the Bend website's About Bend page, which may be copyrighted. --Mattmcc 16:27, 26 August 2005 (UTC)

More images?
Great image of the Tower Theater, but anybody know where to locate a pic of the downtown area, to give more of an impression of the city? An old school friend lives there, and I'd be curious. --Coryma 02:19, 1 August 2006 (UTC)


 * I added a reqphotoin template, I hope that helps. 04:19, 1 August 2006 (UTC)


 * There is much more to bend than the tower theater. Who has some good photos? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 66.220.114.251 (talk • contribs) 21:54, May 13, 2007

What pics would people want of this area? And other random musings
Tower Theatre is kind of blase, so I agree with the people saying new pics are needed. I thought of adding one of Bachelor, but it's become something of a sore spot with the locals ever since Powder Corp took it over.

I also think this article needs something mentioned about all the golf courses we have out here. This place is golf heaven, yet doesn't really get mentioned in the article. It's basically our trademark, for crying out loud.

Lastly, someone needs to take a stab at writing up articles for Jimmy Torres and Chance Daniels. Both of these dudes are highly active in the area and some of the most well-known people who live here full time. Eeeeeeeverybody knows Jimmy and Chance. I tried writing an article for each of them, but for some reason they didn't "conform" to Wiki standards or some such nonsense. Jimmy is probably a pretty easy article to write up on since he has his own web site and there's a lot of documentation about him floating out there. Chance is going to be a bit tougher to write one up on because the guy is so opposed to publicity/self-promotion and refuses to sign the pro circuit contract so they can use his pictures/stats for some strange reason. Someone needs to corner him at one of the local poker tournaments to find out what the deal there is. —Preceding unsigned comment added by BendFreak (talk • contribs) 02:44, 16 January 2008 (UTC)
 * About writing the bios, make sure they are sourced and conform to WP:BIO for notability. Notability is not the local guy everyone knows, its notable by Wikipedia standards. As to Bachelor, I didn't know that was in Bend. I always though bend was about an hour away. Hopefully you get the subtle point, keep the Bend article about Bend. Golf courses and ski resorts in the area can be covered at Central Oregon. People who live in Redmond or La Pine go into those articles.
 * As to improvements to get this to B class from the current start class:
 * Improve the lead with some expansion
 * Expand the sources to full citations
 * Convert the stray inline references all into footnotes for consistency
 * That's it for B class, needs expansion and copy editing after that for GA. Aboutmovies (talk) 01:54, 22 January 2008 (UTC)

Notability, Bachelor, etc.
You contradict yourself, Aboutmovies. For one thing, not only is Bachelor not an hour away from Bend (not sure if it's in the city limits or not) but the entire article is full of things "not IN Bend". T-Mobile, for example, is in Redmond. Les Schwab is based in Prineville. Phil Knight lives in Redmond. I could go on, but you get the point. The region is so small that it's simply more efficient to just attribute them all to Bend.

As to notability: Jimmy's band in the 60's produced a number of solid hits. He's toured with some of the biggest acts of the time period. Some of his written songs have cracked Billboard in big ways. Chance has a World Series of Poker bracelet. I know he has one, because I've seen it. They did a full feature on him in the Bulletin (our local paper--and without his agreeing to do any interview) where Chris Ferguson called him the "Phil Ivey of cash games". The guy's accomplished more than a lot of pros that are Wiki'd, he just doesn't seek out the attention like they do. I'm pretty sure that qualifies them as notable. BendFreak (talk) 3:30, 22 January 2008 (UTC)
 * How exactly did I contradict myself? I said Mt. Bachelor is not in Bend (its 20 miles away so in winter it could take close to an hour) and things not in Bend should not be in the Bend article. Period. Since I didn't write the Bend article, I did not contradict myself. So if there are non-Bend items there, the main point of my post, then they need to be moved to the respective article that the entity is actually located in. Bend is a municipal corporation incorporated by the state legislature and has defined boundaries and powers, and this article covers that corporation, thus the listing of the mayor/city government who have no legal authority outside of Bend. Now, you can start "Bend metro area" since it is a census defined metro area to cover the metro area, expand the Central Oregon article, or if something is just outside Bend (like a mile or two outside the actual city limits and the address says Bend) and no other community is closer then listing in this article would be fine. As to the region being small, well the whole state is a little small (3.7 million or so people out of 6 billion is a small percentage), but we don't just attribute everything here to Portland, the only big city.
 * With notability, read WP:BIO and write the article, then watch as it is likely deleted. Sorry, but a WSOP bracelet does not confer notability (again see WP:BIO) nor does a cover story in the Bend newspaper. As to touring with notables or being in a notable band, notability is not inherited, so unless people wrote stories about Jimmy, no notability there. In a nutshell, only cited, reliable sources that have substantial coverage of Jimmy or Chance will demonstrate notability. As to other articles existing, see WP:OTHERSTUFF. Aboutmovies (talk) 02:07, 23 January 2008 (UTC)
 * You contradict yourself because you claim a picture of Bachelor--which is the key of the Bend skyline--isn't "in" Bend, but on the same token turn a blind eye to other things that aren't "in" Bend. I'm not going to argue with you back and forth on notability.  The beauty of Wiki is...you?  Are not my boss, and are not the boss of other people from the area that have taken an interest in this article.  You have this strange contention that Jimmy's band is notable (there is an article on them), but Jimmy himself is not.  You have this even stranger contention that poker players you see on TV who have never won a bracelet are notable, but a guy who refuses to agree to let his likeness be shown on TV or his hard statistical data be shown on the Circuit web site is not, even though he not only has a bracelet, but has won millions playing poker.  Your problem, sir, is that you think you have more power and control over others than you actually do (you've actually been the topic of discussion on the web forum of locals for the area that adopted a thread regarding this article--apparently you like to make hollow threats of banning people from editing and exerting your will on others).  You really should get over that.  Anyhow, this is getting off topic.  Still taking suggestions on what pics people would like to see of the area.  The consensus on the forum seems to be a shot off the top of Pilot Butte of the city as a whole, but I don't want to hike up the mountain.   BendFreak (talk) 08:57, 23 January 2008 (UTC)
 * Very interesting. Apparently you need some assistance in following what I've said. First, where above here have I threatened to ban someone? I must have missed that. Contradiction, again, no. I said, don't put things not in Bend in the article (ski resorts and golf courses not in Bend). Anyone (that's the real beauty of Wikipedia) is free to remove them, including you. I would actually hope local Bend people would, as by Wikipedia standards this is a poor article. Now, a picture of Bend with the mountain in the background would be good, but don't place the Mountain (i.e. the article about the mountain) or the ski resort (again the article about the ski resort) in the Bend article as if it is actually in the city. That's the point. Mention it, link it, but make it clear it is not in the city. Mention there are many golf courses in the area, but don't make a list of "Bend" golf courses and list every golf course within 60 miles of city hall.
 * As to strange contentions and notability, no these are actually the views of the Wikipedia community as determined by consensus, not my own invention. You would know that if you read this article I keep linking to so you will read it. It is a Wikipedia guideline and why your previous attempts at writing the articles were deleted (not by me though). And please note, I've never said they were not notable. They may very well be, but just saying they are does not make them notable. Again, read the WP:BIO and you will see how to assert the notability. I thought I covered this about a week ago on your talk page? But going off of only what you have said, they do not pass the test. If you can find more articles on them, then one or both might pass the test. Again, its not up to me, but the Wikipedia community (not some off Wiki web forum), and they already decided once that Jimmy and Chance were not worthy of inclusion. So good luck with that. Aboutmovies (talk) 10:31, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

Pictures of Bend
I think the pic off the top of the Butte is a good idea. If you don't want to hike up the Butte, maybe McMinnamens? Whatever pic you take, I think you should take it soon. This city is gorgeous when it's covered in the white shroud.

I saw the articles on Jimmy and Chance and yes they are both very notable. Jimmy's article was deleted because it was a copy/paste job off his web site and fell under some sort of copyright thing. Chance's was deleted because there weren't any external links in the article. Both of them are notable, the articles themselves just weren't finished and they were killed before anybody had a chance to go in and fine tune them. My only question to the community on this is since Chance is so private and against fame - which is absolutely true, I know him personally and he hates attention - why do you want to make an article about him? Pretty obvious it's not something he would want. Before you go making an article about him, shouldn't you at least approach him at one of the local tourneys he goofs off at from time to time and ask permission first? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 140.211.24.87 (talk) 21:08, 23 January 2008 (UTC)

Notable Residents
Doesn't Rachel Scdoris live here? If so someone should add her to the list. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 72.0.175.144 (talk) 17:03, 5 March 2008 (UTC)

I heard Thomas Beatie, the pregnant man, lives in Bend. Maybe someone should add him. --92.227.190.71 (talk) 12:19, 19 December 2008 (UTC)

Regional employers
Just a couple thoughts on the "stuff that isn't in Bend that is in this article" discussion. Note that the Major employers heading says: "As of 2005, the top 20 regional employers (EDCO, 2005)" (emphasis mine). Putting the regional employment versus local makes sense to me and apparently made sense to whoever added that info (I haven't checked the page diffs to find out). Distilling the list to "only those businesses within Bend city limits" is possible. If you follow the EDCO link used as a reference, you will find updated figures for regional (and possibly local) employers for 2007. I've attempted to keep the integrity of the 2005 data by reverting name changes (Columbia/Cessna, etc.) and various insertions, but haven't had the time to update the info. The citation is citing exactly what it says it is: The top regional employers as of 2005. If it gets changed, the citation doesn't have integrity anymore. There is no agenda on my part except making sure the citations back up the facts. If folks would really like to improve this article, be "pro-Bend" or whatever (though mind the soapbox), that would be a really useful change for this article, more so than adding various notables, no offense to them personally. When I get a couple minutes I will post a list of featured city articles that would be a great model for improving this article. You want to promote Bend? Follow the guidelines and work to get this article up to featured article status. Katr67 (talk) 15:56, 23 January 2008 (UTC)
 * This isn't an article about the region. This is an article about Bend, Oregon. It's an unspoken fact, that Bend doesn't have much in the way of major employers. Let's keep reality in check here. I understand people commute, but when people want to move to Bend, they aren't interested in finding a job a half hour away or more. And that's kind of what this Bend article is about. I would argue it helps out tourists the most or prospective future residents at least. Leitmotiv (talk) 18:27, 2 July 2009 (UTC)


 * Ya know what my friend, go forth and be WP:BOLD. Change whatever you want, 'cos I obviously have no idea what I'm talking about. I will point out that Wikipedia isn't here to help tourists or future residents however. Good luck with the wiki and have a great day! Katr67 (talk) 23:19, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
 * Not sure why you are taking this personally. Is it because I responded to you? When people talk about regions, it's a very vague notion at best. Regions generally though are understood to be very large areas (larger than certain cities that have articles about them). When in the context of continents, regions could take up entire chunks, as in 1/3rds, 1/4ths, depending on the continent. When used in relation to a state or province, it would be almost equivelant to watersheds and usually bigger. I didn't think Wikipedia was to help out tourists or future residents, but most of the attention Bend, in particular, receives is from those two main sources. At least before the economy belly flopped. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Leitmotiv (talk • contribs) 03:33, 3 July 2009 (UTC)

Newberry Volcano National Monument
Newberry is included in Sites of Interest, but in reality it is far to the south of Bend (twenty miles or more to the main access, ten or so to Lava Butte). Newberry is better kept in the Deschute County wikipedia page, is it not? This page is about the city of Bend, not what is near it, or adjacent to it right? Leitmotiv (talk) 18:11, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

Bend, Oeeergon, David Lynch reference
I'm pretty sure David Lynch made a reference to Bend, Oregon in one of his films or tv series. I believe it was the tv series Twin Peaks, but I'm not positive about that. "Bend, Oregon" was mentioned in the episode/film with a slight slur on it, perhaps to suggest it as "Bend, Over-gon." This could be one of the many examples of where Bend got its infamous nickname. Leitmotiv (talk) 18:14, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

Major Economies
Since the economy hit Bend hard, I would suggest removing Cessna as an employer. Also, Black Butte Ranch, and Kahneeta? They're not even in Bend. Kahneeta is past Madras! Black Butte Ranch is on the other side of Sisters. When I, as a Bend resident read this, I think of inclusions like this as overreaching. Can we be more realistic? T-Mobile is in Redmond. Why don't we save that for the Redmond article. Eagle Crest? Redmond, safe to say its closer to Redmond than Bend. Sunriver Resort? Give me a break. I know people commute to Sunriver from Bend, but hey, while we're at it, why don't we include everything within Deschutes County! Sounds ridiculous, because it is. Maybe a list like the one present on Bend, Oregon is better made for the Deschutes County article, but even that would still keep off Kahneeta, and nearly Black Butte Ranch. Leitmotiv (talk) 18:22, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I'd be more willing to discuss the history of this section if you'd be a bit more civil. You still need to work on assuming good faith. Katr67 (talk) 20:59, 2 July 2009 (UTC)
 * I agree I could work on assuming good faith more, if you assume I thought the contributors to this particular article acted in "bad fashion." But I think they were normal random contributors, perhaps. I don't agree with you though when you say I was uncivil. I know words like "ridiculous" may and could offend someone, but that's just because they take it personally. You by chance? I think in this case, the word "ridiculous" adequately describes certain portions of the article on Bend. And that is just my opinion, but to any person paying attention, most would probably agree with me, as it looks like you have prior to me posting these discussions. Leitmotiv (talk) 22:06, 2 July 2009 (UTC)

Sister city -=- Fujioka japan
I left the citation needed for Fujioka, since I'm not happy with the references that I could find for it. If someone else feels that they are sufficient. feel free to remove the citation needed template. *Cnbdragon (talk) 08:26, 7 August 2009 (UTC)

Assessment of Article
Please see the following for more detailed information on submitting this article for GA, A or FA status. A formal review process is not where you just remove the class from the template. C. Williams (talk) 16:06, 8 November 2009 (UTC)

Quality scale
The quality "class" an article receives should follow Wikipedia's regular guidelines for quality found below.
 * Articles which have not been formerly evaluated, or which have failed a good article review, should not be assigned a quality rating higher than B class. Above that an article needs to go through a formal review process.


 * See Good article candidates
 * See Featured article review


 * I don't agree with the B assessment, though it's not at all out of reach. Two things jump out at me: (1) there needn't be 2 nearly identical photos of Pilot Butte; and (2) the citations, while rather extensive, need a lot of neatening up and formatting. Also, there's a tag calling for more citations; without a closer reading, I don't know if it stil applies (as 45 is a good number of citations, if they're high-quality and cover most of the article).


 * These things need to be addressed before considering a higher assessment; in my view, they probably knock it down to C class, but I'll leave things be for the moment in case somebody wants to work on the article. -Pete (talk) 20:51, 12 November 2009 (UTC)