Talk:Berliner Motor Corporation

ToDo

 * I'd like to include Berliner's notorious and highly collectible advertisements.  They had a number of memorable magazine ads with women in suggestive but also sort of weird and off-putting poses.  There was also one with a woman as a Roman charioteer with 3 Ducati motorcycles as horses.  Don't know if I can find a reliable source to versify it; you find it mentioned on discussion boards though.  Dbratland (talk) 05:37, 14 April 2009 (UTC)


 * Figure out if Berliner ever stuck to a single logo or typeface. Dbratland (talk) 05:37, 14 April 2009 (UTC)


 * Incorporate Moto Guzzi notes (below) Dbratland (talk) 18:26, 15 April 2009 (UTC)

Usage of "Berliner" and "the Berliners"
As far as I can tell, the Berliner brothers, Joseph and Michael, called all the shots at Berliner Motor Corporation, so in factual terms it hardly matters if you say the Berliners did something or Berliner Motor Corporation did something.

An exception is when Berliner Motor Corp chose to give Evel Knievel his first fleet of motorcycles, and a Berliner employee (not Joseph or Michael) who suggested Knievel's old nickname Evel would better than Bobby as a stage name.

Grammatically, it can be confusing. When in doubt, I think it is best to say Berliner Motor Corporation because even when Joseph or Michael Berliner made a big decision, in fact it was carried out by their company, not themselves personally.

If you're sure the brothers were personally involved, say "the Berliner brothers" or "Joseph and Michael Berliner", or "Joseph Berliner, President of...". I'd avoid just "Berliner" and instead say "Berliner Motor" or "Berliner Motor Corporation". BMC is sometimes used, but rarely.

Just "Berliner's" means something possessed by Berliner Motor Corporation -- it's confusing; avoid it. If you include the definite article as in "the Berliners' ", it means something possessed by the brothers -- confusing; avoid. "The Berliner's" is incorrect usage of plural possessive; best avoid it anyway. "The Berliners" can only mean the two brothers, not the company, but it's confusing and should be avoided. Better to say Berliner Motor Corporation's to mean possessed by the company, and "the Berliner brothers' " to mean possessed by the brothers, and "the Berliner brothers" to just mean the brothers, plural. Dbratland (talk) 20:00, 14 April 2009 (UTC)

Reference notes for possible use
Dbratland (talk) 22:20, 24 April 2009 (UTC)

Dbratland (talk) 19:03, 24 April 2009 (UTC)

Dbratland (talk) 19:03, 24 April 2009 (UTC)

Dbratland (talk) 18:26, 15 April 2009 (UTC) Dbratland (talk) 22:20, 24 April 2009 (UTC) Dbratland (talk) 23:04, 15 April 2009 (UTC) Dbratland (talk) 22:20, 24 April 2009 (UTC)

Dbratland (talk) 04:08, 16 April 2009 (UTC)

Dbratland (talk) 04:34, 16 April 2009 (UTC)

Dbratland (talk) 22:20, 24 April 2009 (UTC)

During the first hour at Auschwitz, 16 of Joseph Berliner's 22 immediate family members were killed, including both his parents and both his children. Joe and one of his brothers were spared because they were mechanics, and the two of them convinced the S.S. that their youngest brother, Michael, was also a mechanic. Only Michael would ultimately survive with Joseph, though after the war he was able to locate his wife who had been liberated by the Swedish Red Cross.

Dbratland (talk) 00:55, 21 April 2009 (UTC)

Dbratland (talk) 16:27, 21 April 2009 (UTC)

Dbratland (talk) 16:47, 21 April 2009 (UTC)

Hello Ed, just a small foot note to your article regarding the history of Triumph in America. Don't know if you are aware that the Berliner Brothers, Joe and Michael, were the last to own the Triumph facility in Baltimore. I was working for Berliner/Premier Motor Corporation when I traveled with Michael and other Berliner employees to Baltimore. Our job was to clean out the building Freddy and Renoand close it down. As a side bar, the Berliners were also the last owners of the Indian factory in Springfield, Massachusetts.

Michael Berliner is still with us and a wonderful source of American motorcycle history. Joe Berliner has passed on, and their sister, Rose, who worked for her brothers just passed away a few weeks ago. Just think about what the Berliners have done for Motorcycling in the USA, including the importation of Zundapp, Jawa, Sacks, Norton, Matchless, Ducati, Moto Guzzi, and Metzler and Pirelli tires. And did you know that the Berliners supplied Knievel with Nortons, and provided a Norton for the movie “Bye Bye Birdie?” Also, the Berliners gave many young riders the opportunity to ride great equipment. This included Freddy Spencer, Frank Scurria, Mike Baldwin, Jimmy Adamo and many more. Michael is not getting any younger, and I for one think it is time the Motorcycle Hall of Fame recognize what these two Hungarian emigrants did for American motorcycling. http://www.motohistory.net/news2007/news-mar07.html --Dbratland (talk) 23:40, 4 May 2009 (UTC)

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