Talk:Big Brother Angola: Tesouro

Move discussion in progress
There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Celebrity Big Brother 1 (U.S.) which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 05:18, 28 May 2018 (UTC)

Requested move 21 June 2018

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Not moved. See general agreement in this debate not to grant this request; however, redirects from the proposed titles will be created. Have a Great Day and Happy Publishing! (nac by page mover)  Paine Ellsworth   put'r there  12:28, 13 July 2018 (UTC)

– I could not find sources to support that each season was individually numbered by the broadcaster or the production company for this edition. Starting with second season each season was given an individual subtitle. In an effort to align the naming convention guidelines of WP:BIGBRO with the established guidelines of WP:NCTV I'm proposing we move the individual season articles to the names suggested.  ♪♫Al ucard   16♫♪  06:17, 21 June 2018 (UTC) --Relisting.  bd2412  T 17:20, 3 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Big Brother Angola (season 1) → Big Brother (Angola season 1)
 * Big Brother Angola (season 2) → Big Brother (Angola season 2)
 * Big Brother Angola & Mozambique → Big Brother (Angola season 3)

Survey (21 June 2018)

 * Feel free to state your position on the renaming proposal by beginning a new line in this section with  or  , then sign your comment with  . Since polling is not a substitute for discussion, please explain your reasons, taking into account Wikipedia's policy on article titles.


 * Support: There are no reliable sources that refer to the show as Big Brother Angola; anytime that is the case for a given edition, we should follow WP:NCTV. OfficerAPC (talk) 16:10, 21 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Support as long as the title really is Big Brother and not Big Brother Angola. This "Big Brother x (Country_name_here)" stuff is just aberrant. We don't do that with any articles titles about anything, meanwhile we have a stable and site-wide TV convention of "Title_here (season X)", from which there is no reason to diverge in this case.  — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼  19:26, 21 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Right now, I'm weak oppose based on the discussion below – it sounds like the first two seasons, were in fact named Big Brother Angola. The third season is a complication – don't know how to handle it. I would suggesting creating redirects at the proposed locations however. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 20:13, 21 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Support per my original rationale.  The Doctor Who  (talk) 03:12, 22 June 2018 (UTC)
 * I think I misread this one first time round. Support first two, Oppose the third (for now): per my original rationale on the first two but the third is questionable because of the combined countries. For example: Next summer if the U.S. and Canada had a combined season would it be Big Brother United States & Canada or would it be Big Brother United States & Canada (season 21 and 7)? The article even states The third season of the Angolan version and the first of the Mozambican version which supports my statement about the season numbering. I do however, support creating a redirect for the third one. The Doctor Who  (talk) 11:03, 1 July 2018 (UTC)
 * Weak oppose per above - it seems the series was named "Big Brother Angola", and the third season was presumably named "Big Brother Angola and Mozambique". However, CREATE REDIRECTS no matter what happens. Paintspot Infez (talk) 18:07, 23 June 2018 (UTC)
 * Oppose. This is a hard one. For the first two seasons (based on images from google search and per the discussion bellow) it seems the show was called Big Brother Angola. For the 3rd season, the show changed its name to Big Brother and also changed its house mates to be from Angola and Mozambique, however RS still called it season 3. Since there isn't a season 4 that could have helped us in seeing how the naming would have continued its impossible to know if the change would have been temporary or permanent. WP:NCTV does not deal with name changes to a TV series so I'm a bit lost. --Gonnym (talk) 10:14, 1 July 2018 (UTC)
 * So does season 3 become Big Brother Angola (season 3) or do seasons 1 and 2 (and Big Brother Angola) change to the season 3 name? --Gonnym (talk) 10:17, 1 July 2018 (UTC)


 * Oppose as all the sources I can find call the show "Big Brother Angola" so "Angola" is part of the title and not a disambiguator. jamacfarlane (talk) 12:26, 9 July 2018 (UTC)

Discussion

 * Any additional comments:
 * Does somebody have a screenshot of the intertitle for this one? I'd like to know if it says just "Big Brother" on screen, or if it's actually titled "Big Brother Angola"... --IJBall (contribs • talk) 14:44, 21 June 2018 (UTC)
 * This may help, I just did some more digging here. the first season was known as Big Brother Angola: Tesouro, the second season was Big Brother Angola: Duplo Impacto . Starting with the third season according to the logo it was named Big Brother: Xtremo but the url of the official site was changed from bigbrotherangola.dstv.com to bigbrotherangolamozambique.dstv.com reflecting the overall name change to Big Brother Angola e Moçambique where Mozambique was added in the third season. I had to use Wayback Machine to get the info from the official website because it is no longer online.  ♪♫Al  ucard   16♫♪  19:05, 21 June 2018 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.

Requested move 10 November 2018

 * The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this section. 

The result of the move request was: moved to Big Brother Angola: Tesouro, Big Brother Angola: Duplo Impacto & Big Brother Angola: Xtremo (page mover nac) Flooded  with them hundreds  10:36, 18 November 2018 (UTC)

– The main reason for this move stems from the article Big Brother Angola & Mozambique doesn't confirm to any current naming convention guidelines. Because each season has a subtitle I'm proposing moving these articles to the names above using the Survivor example from WP:NCTV. Here is my reasoning for this.
 * Big Brother Angola (season 1) → Big Brother: Tesouro
 * Big Brother Angola (season 2) → Big Brother: Duplo Impacto
 * Big Brother Angola & Mozambique → Big Brother: Xtremo

Upon researching this article in depth it is in fact the third season of the series Big Brother Angola. I found a press release from the broadcaster DStv (in Portuguese) that called the third season Big Brother Angola e Moçambique during pre-production because of the decision to allow people of both Angola and Mozambique to apply to be contestants on this season. At the bottom of the press release in the section titled "About Big Brother Angola Mozambique" ("Sobre o Big Brother Angola Moçambique" in Portuguese) the broadcaster explains Angolan-only seasons are in fact considered seasons one and two. The press also considers this to be the third season of Big Brother Angola as well..

Once Big Brother Angola & Mozambique officially started airing the name was changed to Big Brother Xtremo. This can been seen in the logo on the article and on the official Twitter account. Also in an article about why the Nigerian series was being filmed in South Africa the name of this season was confirmed as Big Brother Xtremo by MultiChoice which is owned by DStv. (This is the only English language source I could find.)

Now for the first two seasons the reason I omitted "Angola" from their name as part of this move request is in the same press release from DStv about the third season when they mentioned the second season they referred to it simply as Big Brother Duplo Impacto without "Angola" as part of the name. For this reason is why I'm proposing moving the first two seasons to match the proposed name for the third season since DStv dropped "Angola" from the name of the second season in their 2016 press release.  ♪♫Al ucard   16♫♪  18:06, 10 November 2018 (UTC)


 * I actually think that it's important for the project as a whole to keep the region name in the title. So for me I think Big Brother Angola: Tesouro and Big Brother Angola:Duplo Impacto (for seasons 1 and 2) and for season 3...I think we have all bad options, but maybe the less bad is "Big Brother Angola & Mozambique: Xtremo" and noting in the lead that it is a continuation of Big Brother Angola. --Gonnym (talk) 19:48, 10 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Not gonna !vote yet, but I think a combination of Alucard 16's and Gonnym's proposals may be the way to go – e.g.:
 * Big Brother Angola: Tesouro
 * Big Brother Angola: Duplo Impacto
 * Big Brother Angola: Xtremo
 * I think this balances the competing interests of WP:CONCISE and WP:PRECISE. (Yes, #3 was officially "Big Brother Angola & Mozambique", but the name didn't "stick", and the above proposal is good enough...) As I mentioned to Alucard 16 elsewhere, the ultimate resolution here is probably going to involve the creation of a number of redirects (e.g. Big Brother Angola & Mozambique: Xtremo), but I think my above proposal best balances the issues here. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 21:47, 10 November 2018 (UTC)
 * Support as per IJBall's proposal instead seems to balance out all interests when it comes to guidelines and policy.  ♪♫Al ucard   16♫♪  16:49, 12 November 2018 (UTC)
 * OK, I'll support my own "hybrid" proposal above as well. --IJBall (contribs • talk) 18:16, 13 November 2018 (UTC)


 * Sure, support. --Gonnym (talk) 11:31, 17 November 2018 (UTC)


 * The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.