Talk:Birrana

Birrana Racing
I would like to move this article to Birrana Racing, in order to attach broader associated issues which probably do not justify separate articles, for example, the 1990s revival of Birrana Racing as purely a racing team utilising Reynard chassis. They of course won multiple Gold Stars with Paul Stokell, Jason Bright, Simon Wills (racing driver) and Rick Kelly, as well as supporting drivers like Mark Webber, Todd Kelly and Brenton Ramsay. Also an opportunity to include their touring car efforts in the 1970s (with the V8 Kingswood) and in the 2000s (in partnership with Team Dynamik). --Falcadore (talk) 03:49, 13 April 2011 (UTC)
 * Starting the process here. --Falcadore (talk) 09:10, 13 June 2011 (UTC)
 * I can see a need for Birrana Racing to be covered by an article but I believe it would be better to keep it separate from this one. I don't think "Biranna Racing" was even around when the Biranna cars were being built. GTHO (talk) 03:21, 14 June 2011 (UTC)
 * They weren't, but the same people were involved. The fact that different functions were performed I do not believe to be reason enough to seperate. That having been said the original few Birrana cars were built for Ramsay's personal motor sport career, so in effect Birrana the racing team pre-dated Birrana the constructor, as it presently written Birrana the constructor was not formalised until the third car. So the difference is the factory racing team paused for a while the racing activity resumed in Formula Holden, then stopped again, then started up again as a V8 Supercar team which eventually became Team Dynamik.
 * It is similar in many respect to RenaultF1, it could be displayed as three separate organisations but there is sufficient common ground and commonality of purpose that separating them would make it a more difficult read. You wouldn't consider Elfin's racing program a separate article to Elfin Sports Cars yet they are in similar in many respects, performing different functions at different times. Birrana has an even stronger case then Elfin because there have been three distinct ownership periods during which Elfin was a distinctly different operation. With the exception of the John Goss Formula Ford, Birrana has directly involved Malcolm Ramsay throughout its history. --Falcadore (talk) 03:54, 14 June 2011 (UTC)
 * If I can make the additional comment, the article currently as written more closely resembles a chassis registry than an encyclopedic article. It explains more about the ownership history of the cars than explains what they are for. Noting that a particular car was owned by Peter Brock and Leo Geoghegan is less important to an encyclopedia than describing the car itself. For example explaining Microsoft writes and produces electronic software is more important than noting it is owned by Bill Gates. --Falcadore (talk) 04:41, 14 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Whilst accepting the critisim of the existing article, the content of which was limited by the verifiable information available, I fail to see how extending the article to cover the efforts of a Formula Brabham/Formula Holden team some 20 years after the demise of Biranna the constructor will add to the readers understanding of the cars produced by that constructor. Re the Elfin comparison, it must be said that the major difference is that the Elfin team only ran Elfins, whereas Birrana Racing never ran Birranas. GTHO (talk) 10:38, 15 June 2011 (UTC)
 * Don't see how it would harm either. Separating the articles would also require a fair degree of common ground between both articles. Correctly written it could cover all three iterations of Birrana without any major problems. --Falcadore (talk) 11:40, 15 June 2011 (UTC)

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