Talk:Bolinas, California

Notable residents
This needs to have some legitimate source backup. While I know that many of those listed in that section did indeed live/own property in Bolinas (I attended grade school with Walter Murch's daughter, for instance,) there are several people included in that list that seem erroneous. Proper reference is needed, or they should be removed. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Athryn (talk • contribs).
 * Some of these are also linked deceptively. Deletion seems called for. UniversalSnip 21:21, 26 December 2006 (UTC)
 * I am in favor of a "major" revision to the "Notable People" section of the article. The list contains people of little real importance to the Bolinas community, and I think that might distort the article. Also it takes up about 1/3 of the page and I think that that is inane. I recently went to the trouble of creating a "List of notable people from Bolinas" page, and gave a Redirect to it within the article. This edit was undone, but the "deleted" list page still exists. :>:3 Thaavatar (talk) 18:48, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
 * You're talking to the wall. ;) These two users haven't been here for five years. Remember, that what is not important to you may not be consistent with what is important to others. We cannot assert changes to the article based on our preferences. The guidelines call for including all notable persons in the article, if there are reliable sources that link them to the geographical area, i.e., born in or resided in the area. This is not based on personal preference. Best regards,  Cind.   amuse  (Cindy) 16:17, 20 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Basically every article about a town or city here on wp has a list of 'notable residents', it's just the way it is... The inclusion of a list of notables has been discussed since the inception of wp. If the list takes up 1/3 of the article then perhaps the other content (history, economy, etc.) is too short? -Travis Thurston+ 00:42, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Also, I'd suggest we go into each "notables" article and if Bolinas is not mentioned, remove them from the list.-Travis Thurston+ 01:30, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

Hello? Could you be more specific?
Article needs to have more factual history, and less of a negative viewpoint. If no verification of the alchohol and drug use accusations appears, I will be removing it. Athryn 12:21, 16 August 2006 (UTC)

Erroneous Information
The image map showing the location of Bolinas in the bay seems to be wrong. It points to what I think is Paradise City inside the bay, where as, other maps show Bolinas being on the Pacific Coast. The map indicates it's from the Census Bureau, not sure where to get an updated/corrected version.

Also, the GPS coordinates are wrong. When plotted on several online maps it points to a point far out in the pacific. This could be a simple typo, but I don't know where to look up its correct GPS coordinates.


 * Working on the assumption that the photo was originally uploaded incorrectly as a mirror image, I've corrected that problem. I'll try to resolve the lat/long issue, and confirm that the photo is indeed of Bolinas.  Please remember to sign your posts with ~ .  - Itsfullofstars 16:50, 24 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Update: The photo is legitimate, but was simply reversed. Various lat/long entries in the article worked OK for me, but I didn't try all of them/ - Itsfullofstars 17:34, 24 January 2007 (UTC)

That location in the image is definitely incorrect. Bolinas is on the ocean and not inside the bay. Even if the image was mirrored, bolinas would be to the northwest of the land that's indicated in the image Athryn 07:44, 25 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Everything matches up when I compare the high-altitude image with all the maps I've looked at. - Itsfullofstars 16:51, 25 January 2007 (UTC)


 * Update: The OTHER image in the article (the purported map) is way off, and shows Bolinas on the bay. That map (which I never bothered to enlarge beyond thumbnail size until now) is completely wrong.  I'm getting rid of the map, but the photo taken from 40,000 feet is correct. - Itsfullofstars 16:56, 25 January 2007 (UTC)

Ummm... You guys might want to Google "Bolinas Border Patrol" for a possible explanation of the anomolous edits you've turned up.--Hjal 01:29, 15 April 2007 (UTC)

:-/
This article was so much better before all the edits. I would push for bringing back at least some of the details about the reclusiveness, free store, sign-hiding, etc. The original incarnation of this article inspired me to drive from my flat in SF in an attempt to find Bolinas (I failed). Slugmaster 17:47, 14 May 2007 (UTC)
 * Possibly, you were trying to get there using this map, which used to appear on the page! --Shoshoni 14:20, 15 May 2007 (UTC)


 * Yeah - this could be about any town - it belongs in a CONTENT-free encyclopeda. There has to be some way to talk about what made Bolinas interesting and unusual - a history section perhaps.  It will, of course, be controversial.  Even though I grew up there, I'm not sure I would add anything.  For one thing, even if I did try to stick to the dry, factual style that seems to be evolving here on Wikipedia, I couldn't "reference" what would be, after all, personal memories.  Now if I wrote my biography and put it up as a website, then I could reference that... Zerodeconduite 12:39, 30 July 2007 (UTC)
 * FYI: About 8-9 years ago, I volunteered to install a networking system at the Bolinas elementary school so they could have inter class connectivity, Internet access, etc.  It took me about 2.5 hours to find it, after several wrong turns.  If I had known at the time that the locals enjoyed tearing the sign down, I would have turned around and headed home with the job undone without a moment's hesitation.  - Richfife 15:36, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

Demographics section is too long (for such a small town)
The Demographics section of this article is convoluted. Too many statistics and percentages are tossed around (I mean, "16%" of the town is 200 people), and I think that their presence does more to glorify the work of certain Demographers, than it does to help this article. In a nutshell, two large paragraphs are composed of nothing but reinterpretations of the data (how much is enought, right?). I am proposing a revision of this section, to delete extraneous demographic statements. Any aye's? >:3 Thaavatar (talk) 19:18, 19 December 2011 (UTC) Maybe we should add one of these fancy populations "tables" if it is worth listing anything beyond this year  's data. :>:3 Thaavatar (talk) 19:51, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Keep in mind that what is not important to you, may be important to others. For the sake of compliance and consistency, you can find the guidelines here. Best regards,  Cind.   amuse  (Cindy) 16:17, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Clean Up References!
This article's references are pretty messy. It could you use a spring-cleaning. I propose removing any irrelevant or broken "reference links". Also, perhaps more importantly, this page needs to obtain more reliable references for the material that it does have (like the sign removal, the free-box, and all that other locally-goodness). >:3 Thaavatar (talk) 19:34, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
 * References have been cleaned up. Spend some time reviewing the guidelines a on reliable sources, then feel free to add more references. Best regards,  Cind.   amuse  (Cindy) 16:17, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Added link (West Marin)
Adding a link to West Marin, I have conveniently placed it in conjunction with the Marin County link using a simple "/nowiki" script. Please note that a reference to West Marin is vital to the primer on Bolinas. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Dylthaavatar (talk • contribs) 20:22, 19 December 2011 (UTC) >:3 Thaavatar (talk) 20:23, 19 December 2011 (UTC) I have removed this link and I am trying to come up with a solution for where the link should be placed. :>:3 Thaavatar (talk) 23:37, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
 * The appropriate place would be in the "See also" section, or within the prose of the "Geography" section, explaining context within the region. Best regards,  Cind.   amuse  (Cindy) 16:17, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Redundant geographical info in primer
There is redundant information in this articles primer, which is already referenced in it's infobox. I am proposing the removal of the second sentence in the primer. Below is the permanent link to the revision to which this section applies. http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Bolinas,_California&oldid=466772926 >:3Thaavatar (talk) 23:23, 19 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Keep in mind that the lead section serves to introduce the notability of the subject and provide a summary of the article's content. Redundancy is not an issue with content located in the infobox or the lead section. Both are independent of the article content. Best regards,  Cind.   amuse  (Cindy) 16:17, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Juggville reference is unverified, perhaps irrelevant
The reference to "Juggville" in the primer is unverified. If you pursue the reference you will find a statement from a Marin IJ article, which does not include in it any evidence to back the claim that Bolinas was historically reffered to as Juggville at any time. I don't know yet if it was or wasn't. All I know is that the reference is unreliable, so I will take the liberty of removing it. Here is the line from the reference on the IJ's website: "1851: Smiley's Schooner Saloon and Hotel opens in Jugville, now Bolinas." This mention of Bolinas is one of a sparing few in the IJ article, and there is now evidence to back it even here. If in the future I stumble upon a reputable reference to Juggville I advocate for it being a reference in the History section rather than the primer. >:3 Thaavatar (talk) 23:53, 19 December 2011 (UTC) I just looked a little harder and as far as I could discern the referenced article was authored anonymously. Now I really think it should be removed. ::>:3 Thaavatar (talk) 00:25, 20 December 2011 (UTC)
 * The "Juggville" comment was added as vandalism. That said, the Jugville reference is accurate. You should replace the statement and provide a citation. A selection of reliable sources can be found here. On another note, you keep mentioning the "primer". The actual term is the lede, or lead section. Spend some time reviewing the Manual of Style to familiarize yourself with formatting guidelines and community terminology. Best regards,  Cind.   amuse  (Cindy) 16:17, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Proposed "TOC" Revision
I am proposing to reorder and add sections to the table of contents in direction with Stinson Beach's article's TOC.

>:3 Thaavatar (talk) 05:15, 20 December 2011 (UTC)
 * The Stinson Beach article needs some cleanup. Note that we don't change the table of contents, but focus on adding content and references to support the additions. The TOC is created automatically, based on our edits. The guidelines for article structure and consistency can be found here. Best regards,  Cind.   amuse  (Cindy) 16:17, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Moving alternate names to HIstory
I propose that the statement concerning alternate names for Bolinas (and it's respective reference) be moved to the History section. :>:3 Thaavatar (talk) 06:08, 20 December 2011 (UTC)
 * The guidelines call for alternate names and nicknames to be placed in the lead section. The historical names are created as redirects to this article. Some readers may only know the town for the historical name and will expect it to be in the lead section. Relocating it may be confusing to others. Best regards,  Cind.   amuse  (Cindy) 16:17, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Suggestions
This page looks like a 7th grade book report instead of a quality encyclopedic article. I'm sure we could do a little better with this one. I have been putting a TON of effort into the page so please don't rashly erase my good contributions. Let's get to work. Thank you all. :>:3 Thaavatar (talk) 06:16, 20 December 2011 (UTC)
 * Hey there, try to refrain from making derogatory remarks such as "looks like a 7th grade book report". We really need to assume good faith of others, all volunteers. Comments such as the "7th grade" can be interpreted as rather degrading and belittling. We also have a saying around here that basically says, if you see something wrong, fix it. Just make sure to review the WP:Manual of Style and structure guidelines for cities before making any wide-reaching changes. I should mention that the people that you are attempting to converse with on this talk page, haven't been here since about 2006. At this point, there are about four people watching this page. The two of us and two others (also from the Bolinas area). As a side note, remember to add all new sections at the end of the page to retain continuity. And try to use the preview button before saving any of your work, this helps you find any errors you have made, reduces edit conflicts, and prevents clogging up recent changes and the page history. Thank you. Best regards,  Cind.   amuse  (Cindy) 16:17, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

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