Talk:Bonjour (software)

Now on Cisco, formally Linksys devices?
I noticed that this Bonjor apple refuse showed up on Cisco routing gear, their punishment should be more that would be tasteful to describe. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 67.40.5.197 (talk) 01:14, 12 July 2012 (UTC)

"Formerly" Rendezvous?
I can't find a single official Apple reference to "Bonjour", so this page should probably go back to being title "Apple Rendezvous" until sometime official happens. Wikipedia shouldn't be in the business of treating rumours as fact. -- Kaszeta 20:21, 17 Mar 2005 (UTC)


 * http://www.apple.com/macosx/features/bonjour/. Looks like they're rolling it out with Tiger. Personally I hate the name. It just doesn't sound right. mpiff 16:12, 12 Apr 2005 (UTC)

I can't find any mention of Rendezvous on the Apple website.


 * All references to Rendezvous have likely been changed in Bonjour. Rendezvous was the old name, but it was a trademark violation and has since been changed. – Mipadi 21:22, 4 March 2006 (UTC)

Any programs use this?
Is it a worthy edit to mention any other commercial or freeware programs that use this protocol? I know Trillian IM recently implimented it.


 * On the Mac, (among others) istumbler, Transmit and Adium support it

Bonjour for Windows
Apple's Bonjour for Windows and the open source Bonjour are two different things. The open source code provides what amounts to an example of how to build Bonjour services which can be included in services. The Bonjour for Windows code actually provides services and is not open source. --Steven Fisher 18:09:16, 2005-08-11 (UTC)

Bonjour with iTunes 5/Quicktime 7 install
I just installed iTunes 5 and my security software noted a service called Bonjour being enabled, so I assume the installer installs Bonjour. This should possibly be mentioned.

Concurrent Programming?
This may simply be my ignorance showing, but what, precisely, does Bonjour have to do with Concurrent Programming? I understand that it advertises services using multicast, and that services are concurrent running processes, but this seems to be a tenuous link at best. If there is no good reason to have the see also link, I believe it should be deleted. - JustinWick 17:23, 5 December 2005 (UTC)


 * I don't think there's any obvious link. Get rid of it. PeteVerdon 23:02, 11 April 2006 (UTC)

Fair use rationale for Image:Apple Bonjour Logo.png
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Spyware
A quick look around the web shows up many forums discussing how to remove this program. Since it comes packaged with some programs and cannot be uninstalled should this be considered spyware or a virus ? Obviously its a helpful tool, however how does one differentiate the two ? Please, intelligent responses only. Dont make me bring up Sonys recent CD rom installed spyware for an example...--202.81.18.30 04:01, 17 October 2007 (UTC)


 * It's not really spyware, because it doesn't spy on users; and it's not really a virus, because it isn't self-replicating. In most cases, it aids in the functionality required by some programs, so it's not really doing anything bad. Programs should declare that Bonjour is being installed, but that of course is up to the individual programs that use it to do so. – Mipadi 03:12, 19 October 2007 (UTC)


 * I disagree. It is spyware. Specifically, Bonjour broadcasts hardware/system information. It's a program that piggybacks itself on other legitimate software without user authorization. In Windows, it also embeds itself into several svchost containers, the printer spool service, and internet aware applications like web browsers. Our law firm has been interested in user experiences with this software, in the interest of consumer protection. If you have had problems removing this software you should call (800) 952-5210. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.104.55.3 (talk) 06:43, 27 October 2007 (UTC)
 * They are interested but only supply a phone number if you have problems uninstalling it? I am running an application that uses it for licensing and validation on the LAN.  For some reason it is also trying to reach out across the country to various IP addresses in addition to the local posts that the legit program is using.  —Preceding unsigned comment added by 76.184.241.144 (talk) 00:59, 28 November 2007 (UTC)

Ports
This is my very first of the "contribution" of any kind to Wikipedia so here goes (hope I'll be successful in posting this message when I finish typing what I want to say): And hope I got this request in the right spot: Can authors when you write articles on SOFTware please--if you could--also have a section on how to configure that software for FIREWALLS (I use ZoneAlarm FREE Edition, if you want to know) ??? SO ANYONE knows how I should CONFIGURE Bonjour in each and every of the 4 areas (ACCESS & SERVER; INTERNET & trusted) that need to be set in ZoneAlarm ????? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 71.156.44.41 (talk) 18:37, 1 April 2008 (UTC)

Unclear sentences
I was reading this article and noticed this sentence in the "Criticism" part:

"The service runs at Windows 'mDNSResponder.exe runs at start-up consuming around 0.8MB of system RAM at all times."

I think this sentence is very unclear. I personally am pretty much new to the ways I should write infotext here so if anyone could rephrase that sentence, Thanks.

--AtomicTroop (talk) 08:27, 3 May 2008 (UTC)

Security impact of Bonjour
Shall we drop these sentences? Thus, the only security impact of Bonjour is that advertised services are no longer protected by security through obscurity on the local network. If the services are protected through a means other than obscurity, they will remain protected. Security through obscurity is a poor practice. Selecting a specific poor practice and pointing out that it will not be seen in Bonjour does not clarify the security impact of Bonjour. Psource (talk) 03:55, 12 May 2008 (UTC)

Free software?
A program cannot be both "under a limited license" and free software. Assuming good faith, I must assume that someone did not bother to read what free software is, and thought it just meant cost-free. Anyways, I'm changing/removing the link.

— trlkly 17:27, 25 May 2008 (UTC)


 * the license of bounjour / mdnsresponder, see :

The majority of the source code in the mDNSResponder project is licensed under the terms of the Apache License, Version 2.0, available from: 

To accommodate license compatibility with the widest possible range of client code licenses, the shared library code, which is linked at runtime into the same address space as the client using it, is licensed under the terms of the "Three-Clause BSD License".

The Linux Name Service Switch code, contributed by National ICT Australia Ltd (NICTA) is licensed under the terms of the NICTA Public Software Licence (which is substantially similar to the "Three-Clause BSD License", with some additional language pertaining to Australian law).


 * apache license looks like free software to me... ?

--Lubosz (talk) 13:21, 18 July 2008 (UTC)

very persistent
i had to tell my firewall 12 times that i didnt want it running when i was downloading itunes, 12! should the fact that it is very persistent be noted in the article?81.108.233.59 (talk) 11:13, 31 August 2008 (UTC)

-- i agree every few days the window opens telling me i MUST install it —Preceding unsigned comment added by 81.23.56.12 (talk) 10:29, 24 January 2009 (UTC)

Criticism
The criticism section is completely unsourced and poorly written. Removing until someone can write a better section.--67.173.248.35 (talk) 22:05, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


 * It would be nice to have a criticism section, properly sourced. I've certainly heard some horror stories from friends about this program, particularly about damage done when they attempted to uninstall it. DonPMitchell (talk) 16:51, 16 February 2010 (UTC)

As this guy 67.173.248.35 has also deleted a criticism section from another Apple Product, Quicktime, citing similar reasons when the criticism was legitimate, I think we should just wish him a speedy recovery. God bless you Steve, but you don't own Wikipedia, we can say the truth about your products dude. I'd say it was a matter of importance legitimate criticism sections were re-written and put into the article. 217.41.43.35 (talk) 12:10, 13 February 2011 (UTC)
 * Agreed. This article badly needs a balanced critique of Bonjour, for various operating systems. Some quick Googling of recent online fora suggest that it is not necessary for most Windows/PC users, and should be Uninstalled and removed from many if not most of those systems. The article currently reads like an advertisement, not a balanced overview. FatTrebla (talk) 07:44, 17 April 2011 (UTC)

UPNP
How does this compare to Windows/Intel UPNP? It sounds like it's the same kind of thing? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 150.101.166.15 (talk) 07:12, 16 September 2008 (UTC)


 * Slightly dated explanation is in this O’Reilly article —Preceding unsigned comment added by 85.207.117.49 (talk) 11:41, 21 May 2009 (UTC)

Ambiguous sentence?
I had to re-read the 2nd sentence of the 2nd paragraph, "While it is freeware for clients, developers and software companies..."

At first, I parsed as the equivalent of "For clients, developers and software companies it is freeware..."

FWIW

w3steve (talk) 19:07, 18 September 2008 (UTC)

What level communication protocol is this?
There are 7 layers in the common model for computer communications. This is written in Wikipedia as a brand that is associated with a product, yet should be at least also stated that it is actually a communication protocol.-- Procrastinating@ talk2me 20:39, 4 December 2008 (UTC)

"Good day" "Good afternoon"
What idiot wrote that? The literal translation of "bonjour" is "hello". —Preceding unsigned comment added by 99.224.151.22 (talk) 05:35, 30 December 2008 (UTC)


 * Bonjour has several meanings, including "Hello", "Good Morning" and "Good Afternoon". Be more careful before calling people idiots. David T Tokyo (talk) 08:29, 22 January 2009 (UTC)


 * You may find you're not correct there. The litteral meaning is in fact "good day", and it is used to greet people "Good day", "Good morning" or "Good afternoon". You might say it is roughly the French equivalent of "Hello", but "hello" is certainly not its litteral translation. Wurdnurd (talk) 13:38, 14 March 2009 (UTC)


 * That's quite some Dunning-Kruger effect emanating from 99.224.151.22 -- 98.108.223.60 (talk) 05:46, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

Bonjour is, indeed, literally 'Good Day'. It is derived from Bon meaning Good, and Jour meaning Day. It is used as a greeting that is used in a similar way to the use of Hello but this is a translation of intent NOT a translation of literal meaning. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 12.36.123.2 (talk) 19:33, 19 August 2009 (UTC)


 * Good translations go for meaning and usage over literal translation. Translating things literally and word-for-word eventually leaves you with something looking like a Google Translate output instead of something that accurately conveys the meaning and tone. "Good day", in English, is too ostentatious and excessively-formal for everyday use; AFAIK "bonjour" and "hello" are both neutral, everyday greetings. For a meaningful translation, then, "hello" is much better because it avoids inserting connotations that aren't there in the original language. --142.25.33.55 (talk) 21:29, 31 May 2011 (UTC)

Blog as source citation
I question the use of a blog as a cited reference for Windows Bonjour versions not having an uninstaller or human-readable entry in the Windows services listing. This may well be true, but verifiability is what puts content past the threshold of inclusion. WP policy regarding self-published sources is that they are generally not acceptable for use. Instead the information needs to be published by a third-party source in order to be an acceptable source. As such, this citation is being marked as dubious. &mdash;ADavidB 02:14, 28 May 2009 (UTC)


 * Im looking at such an entry:


 * ##Id_String1.6844F930_1628_4223_B5CC_5BB94B879762##


 * so i think "no human-readable entry" is true, and i also checked that "no uninstaller" is true. Which is to beg the question as to "verifiability" even though i just verified it.
 * --JohnCaron (talk) 00:47, 8 November 2009 (UTC)


 * I, too, can verify that my iTunes installation came without a Bonjour uninstaller and that the service listing was indeed a cryptic Id_String. Here are a couple of references (though in themselves disputable):
 * http://fixexe.com/uninstall-programs-that-do-not-appear-in-the-add-or-remove/
 * http://www.computerforum.com/115601-id_string.html
 * http://www.eggheadcafe.com/software/aspnet/31459144/system-service-inspector.aspx
 * The fact alone that applications like this exist should suffice as verification. Hope this clarifies. &mdash; Stimpytalk 01:51, 9 December 2009 (UTC)


 * Just to interject with a third confirmation, I also have the same entry in my services control panel with both the "Display name" and "Description" fields set to "##Id_String1.6844F930_1628_4223_B5CC_5BB94B879762##" and "##Id_String2.6844F930_1628_4223_B5CC_5BB94B879762##" respectively, after installing Adobe Dreamweaver CS3
 * &mdash; MadManMarkAu talk 03:07, 1 January 2009 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.169.123.18 (talk)
 * I'd like to add that Bonjour reappeared with the same service name (the "Id_String2" mentioned above) after installing Safari. &mdash; Stimpytalk 18:23, 24 August 2010 (UTC)

Overview section: personal opinions should not be reflected
"Bonjour is a generaly rubbish and stupid method to discover services on a local area network". Forget about the typo (generaly). The author of that comment is expressing what seems to me a personal opinion about Bonjour. I would agree with that sentence if he/she would have provided a reference that explained why is stupid. This should be removed as soon as possible, it will harm Wikipedia's image otherwise. 87.219.205.80 (talk) 19:17, 29 August 2009 (UTC)


 * This vandalism was reverted within 6 minutes of its addition – well before you suggested its removal. —ADavidB 20:32, 29 August 2009 (UTC)


 * "rubbish and stupid" I can still see that... don't known whether it is vandalism, or not, but it should be removed or explained why is rubbish and stupid, 12:18, 30 August 2009 (UTC)


 * It was identified as vandalism because it overwrote serious wording. It's long gone. —ADavidB 12:08, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

Unfortunately, it is still there (1pm EST Canada, August 30th) and still in the Mobile version of the wiki as well.


 * The above wording may still be in cached copies via your interfaces, though it is not at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bonjour_%28software%29 as of this post, and I've fully refreshed my browser cache. —ADavidB 20:21, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

Apple Bonjour Can Kill Vista SP2's Internet Access

 * http://news.softpedia.com/news/Apple-Bonjour-Can-Kill-Vista-SP2-039-s-Internet-Access-109665.shtml Any comments please. Should this go in the article? Is this an issue for any other versions of Windows (like Windows 7?)? 120.152.12.11 (talk) 12:19, 30 November 2009 (UTC)


 * Seven months have passed since the source article was first published. Have any changes regarding this issue been instituted by Microsoft or Apple since then? If included, 'both sides' should be presented in the interest of a neutral POV. —ADavidB 13:45, 30 November 2009 (UTC)

Rendezvous
I removed the comment that Rendezvous is a French word. It certainly is not. It is an English word which is derived from the French. The French phrase for assignation is rendez-vous.

--Candy (talk) 16:26, 9 January 2010 (UTC)

Spyware ref
The citation for the statement "As such, many users initially assume it is spyware or a virus." was removed by me because the actual statement was 'a few' which has been blown up to many, and in addition it doesn't seem notable at all for entry." --Candy (talk) 19:46, 2 April 2010 (UTC)

NPOV
It seems that all criticism of Bonjour has been routinely deleted from this aricle without any attempt to cover the points raised.

Clearly there is considerable criticism that has been voiced, and to exclude and actively delete any reference to this criticism undermines the NPOV of this article. There is naturally debate about whether the criticism is valid or not, HOWEVER the fact there is a debate is NOT reason to exclude reference to it in the article. There are clearly technical arguments both for and against the "Bonjour approach" and these have been well articulated, for instance here: http://www.voipuser.org/forum_topic_2567_0_asc_45.html

This article should have a NPOV to reflect a balance in description of the product rather than only the conclusion of the editors. I note that developers using Bonjour utilise this Wiki entry as an "objective" source to backup their assertions regarding Bonjour and thereby their product. This is a corrupt cycle of information. Wiki's NPOV policy is IMO its cornerstone whereas this article's strenuous resistance of criticism sails close to making it a marketing device.

I suspect (paranoia?) this page is closely monitored and intend to place a NPOV label on the article. However I would be grateful for comments prior to actioning this for more formal resolution by Wiki. I hope Apple are contributing to Wiki's appeal. I have. If Apple contributed the same percentage of their annual income as I have then Wiki's financial appeal could close and the banner be removed.

LookingGlass (talk) 11:42, 19 November 2010 (UTC)


 * for some more criticism and removal here: http://www.geckoandfly.com/2501/how-to-remove-and-uninstall-bonjour-mdnsresponderexe-process/ and here http://www.bleepingcomputer.com/startups/mDNSResponder.exe-17254.html
 * LookingGlass (talk) 11:51, 19 November 2010 (UTC)

As noted here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Bonjour_(software)#Criticism the IP who removed the criticism originally also did the same with Quicktime's page. That in itself not enough for a ban? Clear evidence of an Applester, surely? 217.41.43.35 (talk) 12:16, 13 February 2011 (UTC)

0.0.0.0 as default gateway
Please revert change removing information about Bonjour breaking network connectivity. Thus is still an issue, and users deserve to know this. Older versions causing this problem are still available, mostly bundled to older versions of other software, i.e. Adobe. We still observe effects of this problem in our network (~9k computers). I suggest to reword first sentence to:

In 32 and 64 bit releases of Windows 7, some older but still available versions of Bonjour service can disable all network connectivity by adding an entry of 0.0.0.0 as the default gateway — Preceding unsigned comment added by 149.156.124.20 (talk) 18:20, 19 April 2012 (UTC)


 * I added the sentence back, nearly the same as you suggested. —ADavidB 00:35, 23 April 2012 (UTC)

'local' domain
Several places, including this question in stack exchange from 2008 recorded that there was a conflict between the use of .local by Bonjour, and .local by Windows. What happened to that conflict? Have Windows sysadmins stopped using .local domains, or have zeroconf devices stopped using .local? Or what? — Preceding unsigned comment added by 203.206.162.148 (talk) 06:41, 27 August 2014 (UTC)

224.0.0.251
Bonjour sends a package to the above address.

The Internet Assigned Authority. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 186.88.245.190 (talk) 22:59, 1 March 2017 (UTC)

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What, exactly, does Bonjour do?
The article lists Bonjour's capabilities using network buzzwords, such as service discovery. But it seems to lack a clear and complete statement of what Bonjour does, and how it does it.

For example. following the "service discovery" wikilink only reveals that Bonjour "discovers" devices and services offered on a (presumably local) computer network.

Does that mean that Bonjour maintains two lists, one of devices that includes name, MAC address, and IP address, and one of services, which includes computer name and Windows service name? That is what I imagine as a Windows user, but this is not stated using clear language as I just did.

Also, it is unclear when Bonjour operates. In the case of its "service discovery" functionality, when does Bonjour create its two lists and where does it store them? What pieces of Bonjour are hosted where within a local network (is all of its software and data stored on a single computer, and, if so, how is that computer chosen from among a number of computers)?

Does Bonjour send information about my local network or system to a remote server database? Is that information encrypted? Who has access to that information? These are important questions.

To my mind, this is a fairly useless article without such simple, obvious, but complete information. Someone like me, who reads this article to understand whether Bonjour can be uninstalled from a Windows computer without ill effects, is out of luck. And after reading this article, I have only a faint idea of what it does. I have no idea when or whether this "zero network configuration" is actually done by me or on my behalf. Is it part of network adapter software? Does it work both on wireless and ethernet connections or routers? Are there user-visible settings or properties or logs? I have no idea after reading this article. David Spector (talk) 14:37, 13 June 2021 (UTC)