Talk:Bosal

cleanup
Much of the text on this page concerns the hackamore (jáquima) bridle, and should be removed from this page. --Una Smith (talk) 22:29, 29 February 2008 (UTC)


 * Um no, it has to be in there because the bosal is an integral part of the classic hackamore. Which is not a "bridle."  Bridles have bits. Unless they are "bitless bridles" which is an entirely different discussion that doesn't need to be dragged onto this page.   Must we start this up again in yet another article?  And besides, a couple days ago, you were arguing that hackamores were halters.  I am cautioning you, as gently as I can, to please be careful what you add to articles with links to sources that don't really fit WP:CITE when you are asking other people to source every last detail with precision? I know you are sorting out a theory here, but isn't that Original research?   Montanabw (talk) 06:37, 1 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Bridles have reins. The bridle can be bitted or bitless, but without reins it is not a bridle.  The purpose of the bridle is to attach the reins to the horse's face.  The purpose of the bit is to communicate the rein cues to the horse.  To the extent that a bosal is integral to the hackamore, discussion of it belongs in the article about the hackamore;  however, the bosal is not unique to the hackamore, it has a broader scope, so this page should reflect that broader scope.  --Una Smith (talk) 20:19, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

fiador
this online catalog in Argentina shows a muzzle-style halter (bozal) with a 3-part frentera on the face and a fiador throatlatch. --Una Smith (talk) 04:21, 1 March 2008 (UTC)


 * For now, I'm OK with making that an inline link in the appropriate location. That is one unusual-looking unit, does the text explain what it does?   Montanabw (talk) 06:37, 1 March 2008 (UTC)


 * I don't understand the question. That is just an ordinary halter, Argentine style. --Una Smith (talk) 07:43, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

Scope of this page
In partial answer to [this], descriptions of the frentera and fiador belong in Bosal for two reasons:
 * 1) They are used almost exclusively with a bosal (and cousins bozal and serreta).
 * 2) They are used more often on halters than on bitless bridles, so they do not belong in an article on the hackamore (as Montanabw defines it), apart from explaining how in Montanabw's "true" hackamore tradition the fiador is dispensed with ASAP.  The frentera is not part of this "true" hackamore tradition.  The closest I have seen is a couple of Mexican hybrids between hanger and frentera, but those were halters. --Una Smith (talk) 07:43, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

A mecate is used exclusively on a hackamore (as Montanabw defines it), and has an article, so yet another description of mecate on Bosal seems unnecessary and undesirable. --Una Smith (talk) 07:43, 1 March 2008 (UTC)


 * LOL! Did you check the article "mecate" goes to?  It's the name of a rap group!


 * I am OK with keeping the stuff on fiadors, etc. in here until the spat over what to do with hackamore is settled. And maybe even then.  No harm in letting things just "cook" for a bit.  I only broke out bosal from hackamore a few months ago when the info on it was threatening to bloat the other article.


 * I also think separate sections explaining the bozal and the serreta are needed if we are going to discuss the fretera and other equipment that is added to them, as the North American, and especially California-style bosal emphasizes keeping it simple.  This could get confusing...  Montanabw (talk) 08:25, 1 March 2008 (UTC)

Having created Fiador (tack) and Frentera, details can go there. --Una Smith (talk) 19:11, 18 March 2008 (UTC)

Mecate now is a disambiguation page, Mecate (rein) redirects here. For what it is worth, though, in the US east of the Rockies a mecate more often is used on a bitted bridle than on a hackamore. --Una Smith (talk) 20:09, 12 October 2008 (UTC)
 * I wonder if we should have a separate article on the mecate or not. It is used on ring snaffles, true, so may be worth breaking out.  For what it's worth, the addition of a mecate rein to a ring snaffle is a relatively new thing that has become a fad in the natural horsemanship movement, supposedly the purpose is to have a lead rope/longe line on a horse, especially a green animal in training.  Historically this use is still derived from the bosal, however.  Montanabw (talk) 01:21, 13 October 2008 (UTC)

Bosal not knot
The article says:


 * The heel knot, the bosal in Spanish, gives the entire noseband its name.

This sentence needs fact checking. Bosal is the English spelling of the Spanish word bozal, which means "muzzle" and usually refers to the noseband, not to the heel knot on the noseband. In my experience, not all bozals have heel knots; some have rings. --Una Smith (talk) 19:27, 18 March 2008 (UTC)


 * I agree that verification is needed on that one. I am not 100% on "bozal" vs "bosal" either, though if "bozal" means "muzzle," I agree that it makes sense.-- one version in some book (that I can't find now when I need it) that was the source of the statement made some comment about "bosal" as in the knot, being derived from a word for "flower."  Given that I do not speak Spanish, I have no clue as to the accuracy of that statement, even if sourced.  Give me a bit to look it up, and if I can't verify it, I will remove it myself.   Montanabw (talk) 17:02, 19 March 2008 (UTC)


 * Removed it myself. --Una Smith (talk) 20:07, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

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